Re: [geo] Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide | ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact

[Jonathan Marshall]

There could be an argument that when your prime political and economic system 
is capitalist, then profit is your prime guideline for any action. If it makes 
profit to pollute then you pollute. If carbon is to be removed it has to be 
profitable.


If it makes profit to do both, then you do both.

jon



From: geoengineering@googlegroups.com <geoengineering@googlegroups.com> on 
behalf of Adam Dorr <adamd...@gmail.com>
Sent: Thursday, 8 June 2017 2:10 AM
To: Andrew Lockley
Cc: geoengineering
Subject: Re: [geo] Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste 
carbon dioxide | ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact

I think the notion that "We’ve got to get the tons out of the atmosphere, and 
we’ve got to make money doing it” may be fundamentally misguided. The total 
market potential for CO2 as an industrial input is, to a first approximation, 
at least 2 orders of magnitude lower than the quantity of CO2 that needs to be 
removed from the atmosphere annually in order to withdraw 1 trillion (with a T) 
tons by 2100 (a commonly-cited target, and likely too conservative).

Unless a massive new source of demand for CO2 emerges, then the only real way 
to "make money" from carbon withdrawal at the scale necessary to restore 
atmospheric carbon to pre-industrial levels is going to be with publicly-funded 
CDR megaprojects. But I agree that market demand can serve as a driver of 
technological innovation in the nearer term.

Adam

--
Adam Dorr
PhD Candidate
University of California Los Angeles School of Public Affairs
adamd...@ucla.edu<mailto:adamd...@ucla.edu>
adamd...@gmail.com<mailto:adamd...@gmail.com>

On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:35 AM, Andrew Lockley 
<andrew.lock...@gmail.com<mailto:andrew.lock...@gmail.com>> wrote:
https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities

ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact<https://asunow.asu.edu/>

[image title]
<https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#>
 
<https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#>
  
<https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#>
  
<https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#>
  
<mailto:?subject=Team%20launches%20initiative%20to%20develop%20viable%20market%20for%20waste%20carbon%20dioxide=Here%20is%20a%20link%20to%20Team%20launches%20initiative%20to%20develop%20viable%20market%20for%20waste%20carbon%20dioxide:%20https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities>
Solutions<https://asunow.asu.edu/topics/now/solutions>
Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide
Tempe campus<https://asunow.asu.edu/topics/news/locations/tempe-campus>
<https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#><https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities#>
Can we take CO2 out of the air & make money doing it? ASU up for the challenge.
June 6, 2017
ASU partnering with Center for Carbon Removal, other research institutions to 
find economic opportunities in climate challenge

How do you create a way to take carbon out of the air and make money doing it?

It’s a wicked problem that will take decades to solve. One member of a team 
tasked with tackling it compared it to creating agriculture.

The Center for Carbon Removal, in partnership with Arizona State University and 
several other research institutions, launched an audacious initiative this week 
with the goal of developing solutions that transform waste carbon dioxide in 
the air into valuable products and services.

“Solving a problem with a solution that doesn’t exist” is how Julio Friedmann 
described it.

“We have urgency around this task,” said Friedmann, a senior fellow at the 
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory who serves as the lab’s chief expert in 
energy technologies and systems. He recently served as principal deputy 
assistant secretary for the Office of Fossil Energy at the Department of 
Energy. “I’m seeing windows of opportunity start to close. … We’ve got to get 
the tons out of the atmosphere, and we’ve got to make money doing it.”

In addition to ASU, universities involved in the initiative include Iowa State 
and Purdue, both of which have strong agricultural, forestry and economics 
programs as well as leading engineering, materials science and environmental 
science programs. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory also participated in 
the launch event for this initiative and has extensive expertise in alternative 
energy and new fuel sources.

“We are talking about nothing less than a paradigm shift,” said David Laird, 
professor of agronomy at Iowa State and an expert in the inter

Re: [geo] Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide | ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact

[Adam Dorr]

I think the notion that "We’ve got to get the tons out of the atmosphere,
and we’ve got to make money doing it” may be fundamentally misguided. The
total market potential for CO2 as an industrial input is, to a first
approximation, at least 2 orders of magnitude lower than the quantity of
CO2 that needs to be removed from the atmosphere annually in order to
withdraw 1 trillion (with a T) tons by 2100 (a commonly-cited target, and
likely too conservative).

Unless a massive new source of demand for CO2 emerges, then the only real
way to "make money" from carbon withdrawal at the scale necessary to
restore atmospheric carbon to pre-industrial levels is going to be with
publicly-funded CDR megaprojects. But I agree that market demand can serve
as a driver of technological innovation in the nearer term.

Adam

--
Adam Dorr
PhD Candidate
University of California Los Angeles School of Public Affairs
adamd...@ucla.edu
adamd...@gmail.com

On Wed, Jun 7, 2017 at 8:35 AM, Andrew Lockley 
wrote:

> https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-
> renewal-team-economic-opportunities
>
> ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact 
>
> [image: image title]
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> 
>
> https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities>
> Solutions 
> Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide
> Tempe campus 
>
> 
> 
> Can we take CO2 out of the air & make money doing it? ASU up for the
> challenge.
> June 6, 2017ASU partnering with Center for Carbon Removal, other research
> institutions to find economic opportunities in climate challenge
>
> How do you create a way to take carbon out of the air and make money doing
> it?
>
> It’s a wicked problem that will take decades to solve. One member of a
> team tasked with tackling it compared it to creating agriculture.
>
> The Center for Carbon Removal, in partnership with Arizona State
> University and several other research institutions, launched an audacious
> initiative this week with the goal of developing solutions that transform
> waste carbon dioxide in the air into valuable products and services.
>
> “Solving a problem with a solution that doesn’t exist” is how Julio
> Friedmann described it.
>
> “We have urgency around this task,” said Friedmann, a senior fellow at the
> Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory who serves as the lab’s chief expert
> in energy technologies and systems. He recently served as principal deputy
> assistant secretary for the Office of Fossil Energy at the Department of
> Energy. “I’m seeing windows of opportunity start to close. … We’ve got to
> get the tons out of the atmosphere, and we’ve got to make money doing it.”
>
> In addition to ASU, universities involved in the initiative include Iowa
> State and Purdue, both of which have strong agricultural, forestry and
> economics programs as well as leading engineering, materials science and
> environmental science programs. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory also
> participated in the launch event for this initiative and has extensive
> expertise in alternative energy and new fuel sources.
>
> “We are talking about nothing less than a paradigm shift,” said David
> Laird, professor of agronomy at Iowa State and an expert in the
> interactions between soil and biochar, charcoal used as a soil amendment.
>
> Noah Deich, executive director of the Center for Carbon Removal, said that
> this initiative for a “New Carbon Economy” is urgently needed to “develop
> new businesses and reinvent the industries that powered the last industrial
> revolution — like manufacturing, mining, agriculture and forestry — to
> create a strong, healthy and resilient economy and environment for
> communities around the globe.”
> [image: Carbon sequestration team meets]
>
> The idea for the carbon-economy initiative came from discussions between
> Noah Deich (pictured Tuesday at the team workshop in Tempe), executive
> director of the Center for Carbon Removal, and ASU President Michael Crow
> on ways to rethink the climate challenge as a new economic opportunity.
> Photo by Charlie Leight/ASU Now
>
>
>
> At the launch event, assembled partners agreed to produce a roadmap that
> will outline the specific steps for translating relevant research into
> business and 

[geo] Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide | ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact

[Andrew Lockley]

https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities

ASU Now: Access, Excellence, Impact 

[image: image title]








https://asunow.asu.edu/20170606-solutions-asu-carbon-renewal-team-economic-opportunities>
Solutions 
Team launches initiative to develop viable market for waste carbon dioxide
Tempe campus 


Can we take CO2 out of the air & make money doing it? ASU up for the
challenge.
June 6, 2017ASU partnering with Center for Carbon Removal, other research
institutions to find economic opportunities in climate challenge

How do you create a way to take carbon out of the air and make money doing
it?

It’s a wicked problem that will take decades to solve. One member of a team
tasked with tackling it compared it to creating agriculture.

The Center for Carbon Removal, in partnership with Arizona State University
and several other research institutions, launched an audacious initiative
this week with the goal of developing solutions that transform waste carbon
dioxide in the air into valuable products and services.

“Solving a problem with a solution that doesn’t exist” is how Julio
Friedmann described it.

“We have urgency around this task,” said Friedmann, a senior fellow at the
Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory who serves as the lab’s chief expert
in energy technologies and systems. He recently served as principal deputy
assistant secretary for the Office of Fossil Energy at the Department of
Energy. “I’m seeing windows of opportunity start to close. … We’ve got to
get the tons out of the atmosphere, and we’ve got to make money doing it.”

In addition to ASU, universities involved in the initiative include Iowa
State and Purdue, both of which have strong agricultural, forestry and
economics programs as well as leading engineering, materials science and
environmental science programs. Lawrence Livermore National Laboratory also
participated in the launch event for this initiative and has extensive
expertise in alternative energy and new fuel sources.

“We are talking about nothing less than a paradigm shift,” said David
Laird, professor of agronomy at Iowa State and an expert in the
interactions between soil and biochar, charcoal used as a soil amendment.

Noah Deich, executive director of the Center for Carbon Removal, said that
this initiative for a “New Carbon Economy” is urgently needed to “develop
new businesses and reinvent the industries that powered the last industrial
revolution — like manufacturing, mining, agriculture and forestry — to
create a strong, healthy and resilient economy and environment for
communities around the globe.”
[image: Carbon sequestration team meets]

The idea for the carbon-economy initiative came from discussions between
Noah Deich (pictured Tuesday at the team workshop in Tempe), executive
director of the Center for Carbon Removal, and ASU President Michael Crow
on ways to rethink the climate challenge as a new economic opportunity.
Photo by Charlie Leight/ASU Now



At the launch event, assembled partners agreed to produce a roadmap that
will outline the specific steps for translating relevant research into
business and policy action. The roadmap will consider design principles for
engaging multiple parts of the economy in capturing and concentrating
carbon dioxide, ranging from biological approaches such as agriculture and
forestry, to engineered approaches such as fuel, chemical and material
manufacturing using carbon dioxide as a feedstock.

“There are maybe 100 people in the world who can talk about a carbon
economy at the scale we’re talking about,” said Roger Aines, a senior
scientist in the Atmospheric, Earth and Energy Division at Lawrence
Livermore. “It’s a brand-new thing.”

The idea for the initiative came from discussions between Arizona State
University President Michael Crow and Deich on ways to rethink the climate
challenge as a new economic opportunity.

“Today there are a number of voices, narratives and uncertainties that
challenge us in developing a focused innovation agenda for dealing with the
growth of atmospheric carbon dioxide,” said Betsy Cantwell, ASU vice
president for research development. “Working together with the Center for
Carbon Removal, we will develop a roadmap leading to real, valuable and
lasting uses for carbon in the air. We