Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Sven Claussner]

On  10.1.2016 at 1:21 AM Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 3:11 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:


1. Negotiate a release date between mitch (GIMP maintainer), pippin
(GEGL/babl maintainer), Jernej (Win builds), and Kris (OSX builds).


Also, I think whoever is in charge of the user manual these days
should have a say here, but the problem is that I have no idea who
that person is (Julien?), and I don't think this person is ever on IRC
where most communication is taking place. It would be _amazing_ to
have stakeholders connected to the release procedure and tuned to
actual gimp development.

Alex



I fully agree to your two posts, Alex.

Greetings

Sven

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Sun, Jan 10, 2016 at 3:11 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine wrote:

> 1. Negotiate a release date between mitch (GIMP maintainer), pippin
> (GEGL/babl maintainer), Jernej (Win builds), and Kris (OSX builds).

Also, I think whoever is in charge of the user manual these days
should have a say here, but the problem is that I have no idea who
that person is (Julien?), and I don't think this person is ever on IRC
where most communication is taking place. It would be _amazing_ to
have stakeholders connected to the release procedure and tuned to
actual gimp development.

Alex
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Sven Claussner]

Hi,


On  4.1.2016 at 9:23 AM Kristian Rietveld wrote:



On 31 Dec 2015, at 14:13, scl  wrote:



And the steps after that are to automate the process


This reminds me of my attempts to integrate an OS X build slave
into the Jenkins continuous build environment. Sam Gleske or
Tobias Vogel might be able to tell you more about the current state.


We’ve been in contact with Tobias indeed.


And to which result?



- @GIMP team: I remember that at the time I was more active
new versions came out of a sudden when Mitch had time to
bump a release and the releases were made later. This has the
effect that users who read the announcement have to wait
again and thus are disappointed after a long period of waiting
for a release.
How about reorganizing the process of release builds and
version announcements by
1. negotiating a release date internally,
2. completing the release docs (NEWS, 
http://wiki.gimp.org/index.php?title=Special%3APrefixIndex=Release%3A=0)
3. bumping the version number,
4. making and testing the builds and
5. as last step announcing the release?


More coordinated releases would be a good thing to have IMHO. Releasing Windows 
& Mac binaries and perhaps Debian/Ubuntu and Fedora packages at the same time 
as a new tarball release would be great.



Lately I heard of AppImages, self-contained application packages like
apps or dmg, but for Linux.
For the Ubuntu part I think all it takes is to contact "Otto 
Kesselgulasch", the maintainer of the GIMP PPA on Ubuntu.

Perhaps staying in touch with the package maintainers of other
distros could be helpful.

Greetings

Sven




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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Mon, Jan 4, 2016 at 11:23 AM, Kristian Rietveld wrote:

>> - @GIMP team: I remember that at the time I was more active
>> new versions came out of a sudden when Mitch had time to
>> bump a release and the releases were made later. This has the
>> effect that users who read the announcement have to wait
>> again and thus are disappointed after a long period of waiting
>> for a release.
>> How about reorganizing the process of release builds and
>> version announcements by
>> 1. negotiating a release date internally,
>> 2. completing the release docs (NEWS, 
>> http://wiki.gimp.org/index.php?title=Special%3APrefixIndex=Release%3A=0)
>> 3. bumping the version number,
>> 4. making and testing the builds and
>> 5. as last step announcing the release?
>
> More coordinated releases would be a good thing to have IMHO. Releasing 
> Windows & Mac binaries and perhaps Debian/Ubuntu and Fedora packages at the 
> same time as a new tarball release would be great.

Was thinking of exact same thing lately :) But I'd take it further than that.

Not only we have lagging Win/Mac/Linux builds, we also have lagging
user manual releases.

For instance, gimp-help 2.8.0 was released as a tarball in June 2012,
a month after GIMP 2.8.0 release. The installers for Windows only
appeared in August, and we don't even have official OSX builds of the
user manual at all (the ones by Simone are outdated and only available
for a few languages).

Hence I'd like to propose the following change to the release policy,
using Sven's proposal as a basis:

1. Negotiate a release date between mitch (GIMP maintainer), pippin
(GEGL/babl maintainer), Jernej (Win builds), and Kris (OSX builds).

2. Finalize a list of changes that should be covered in the user
manual and in the docs for developers.

3. Announce a strings freeze at least a month before releasing to give
translators and docs writers do their job.

4. Complete all release related docs.

5. Bump version number for both GEGL/babl, GIMP, and gimp-help.

6. Make and test all builds for all supported systems.

7. Update the 'testing' branch of the website (download links,
announcements), update docs.gimp.org, check everything.

8. Merge all changes from the 'testing' branch into the 'master' branch of wgo.

9. Announce.

To specifically aid #2, since December, there's a changelog targeted
at user manual writers:

http://wiki.gimp.org/wiki/Release:2.10_changelog

Needless to say, it's WIP, but it's getting there.

Alex
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Kristian Rietveld]

> On 31 Dec 2015, at 14:13, scl  wrote:
> 
> 
>> And the steps after that are to automate the process
> 
> This reminds me of my attempts to integrate an OS X build slave
> into the Jenkins continuous build environment. Sam Gleske or
> Tobias Vogel might be able to tell you more about the current state.

We’ve been in contact with Tobias indeed.


> I you need somebody to test your OS X build related commits,
> I can be there.

It would be great if you could help with testing new DMG release before we 
officially release them!


> - Splitting the 2.8 and master builds in the modulesets and
> moving the master builds into the GIMP master branch.

I was thinking of doing that too.

> - @GIMP team: I remember that at the time I was more active
> new versions came out of a sudden when Mitch had time to
> bump a release and the releases were made later. This has the
> effect that users who read the announcement have to wait
> again and thus are disappointed after a long period of waiting
> for a release.
> How about reorganizing the process of release builds and
> version announcements by
> 1. negotiating a release date internally,
> 2. completing the release docs (NEWS, 
> http://wiki.gimp.org/index.php?title=Special%3APrefixIndex=Release%3A=0)
> 3. bumping the version number,
> 4. making and testing the builds and
> 5. as last step announcing the release?

More coordinated releases would be a good thing to have IMHO. Releasing Windows 
& Mac binaries and perhaps Debian/Ubuntu and Fedora packages at the same time 
as a new tarball release would be great.


regards,

-kris.

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[scl]

On  28.12.2015 at 11:01 AM Su V wrote:

On 2015-12-28 10:19 (+0100), scl wrote:

1. The GIMP build comes with the G'Mic plug-in.
Sadly it is crashing. I suddenly get the message:


The official app bundle for GIMP 2.8.16 from wgo does not include the
G'Mic plug-in.


Thanks for this hint. I checked back and indeed, the G'Mic plug-in
was a leftover from a former G'Mic test on my own system.
Sorry for the confusion.

Sven

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 12:19 PM, scl wrote:

> How about mentioning the patched and extended builds of other eager
> contributors like Partha and skl or even Gimp Paint Studio and
> CinePaint in a separate fork section of the Download page?

The general agreement in the team is that we don't feel comfortable
promoting builds whose packagers do not provide information about
changes they introduced (if any). To make this more transparent for
the community, we are preparing a document on packaging requirements
that we'd like (but don't demand) GIMP packagers to meet.

GIMP Paint Studio is currently unmaintained.

Cinepaint is an inactive project.

Alex
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[scl]

Hi

Kristian, thank you for stepping in and making an OS X build!
Especially the DMG creation command and fixing some of the
nasty Poppler and DBus problems are impressing me.

You asked for testers and here are some of my test results:

1. The GIMP build comes with the G'Mic plug-in.
Sadly it is crashing. I suddenly get the message:

"Plug-in crashed: "gmic_gimp"
(/Users/$my_user_name/Library/Application 
Support/GIMP/2.8/plug-ins/gmic_gimp)


The dying plug-in may have messed up GIMP's internal state. You may want 
to save your images and restart GIMP to be on the safe side."


Including this plug-in is well-meaning but I think it's a pitfall
for the GIMP team because users might think it would be part of
GIMP and therefore report G'Mic bugs to the GIMP team instead to
the G'Mic people.
Avoiding this was the reason I made a stock build of GIMP 2.8.14 with
no extra plug-ins.

2. Is this build with the latest dependency versions?

3. To be honest and fair it would be good to name Kristian as the
creator of the 2.8.16 build on the download page and not me anymore
for the older build.
How about mentioning the patched and extended builds of other eager
contributors like Partha and skl or even Gimp Paint Studio and
CinePaint in a separate fork section of the Download page?

If I find more I'll try to report to Bugzilla.

Anyway, I know how hard it is and how much time it takes to provide
a working OS X build - thanks for your work!

Greetings

Sven




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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[su_v]

On 2015-12-28 10:19 (+0100), scl wrote:
> 1. The GIMP build comes with the G'Mic plug-in.
> Sadly it is crashing. I suddenly get the message:

The official app bundle for GIMP 2.8.16 from wgo does not include the
G'Mic plug-in.


Regards, V
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Partha Bagchi]

Hi Alex,

While I am not against your policy, this is first I am hearing about
this agreement. Of course this may have been a verbal agreement within
the team.

Anyway, I am happy to provide any information the team needs about my builds.

Note that I provide my builds as a community service without asking
for any remuneration whatsoever in return.

Thanks,
Partha

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine
 wrote:
> On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 12:19 PM, scl wrote:
>
>> How about mentioning the patched and extended builds of other eager
>> contributors like Partha and skl or even Gimp Paint Studio and
>> CinePaint in a separate fork section of the Download page?
>
> The general agreement in the team is that we don't feel comfortable
> promoting builds whose packagers do not provide information about
> changes they introduced (if any). To make this more transparent for
> the community, we are preparing a document on packaging requirements
> that we'd like (but don't demand) GIMP packagers to meet.
>
> GIMP Paint Studio is currently unmaintained.
>
> Cinepaint is an inactive project.
>
> Alex
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Alexandre Prokoudine]

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 4:13 PM, Partha Bagchi wrote:
> Hi Alex,
>
> While I am not against your policy, this is first I am hearing about
> this agreement. Of course this may have been a verbal agreement within
> the team.

Most team discussions take place on IRC.

> Anyway, I am happy to provide any information the team needs about my builds.

Excellent :)

> Note that I provide my builds as a community service without asking
> for any remuneration whatsoever in return.

Of course :)

Alex
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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[scl]

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 5:16 AM, Alexandre Prokoudine
 wrote:

On Mon, Dec 28, 2015 at 12:19 PM, scl wrote:


How about mentioning the patched and extended builds of other eager
contributors like Partha and skl or even Gimp Paint Studio and
CinePaint in a separate fork section of the Download page?


The general agreement in the team is that we don't feel comfortable
promoting builds whose packagers do not provide information about
changes they introduced (if any). To make this more transparent for
the community, we are preparing a document on packaging requirements
that we'd like (but don't demand) GIMP packagers to meet.




On  28.12.2015 at 2:13 PM Partha Bagchi wrote:
> While I am not against your policy, this is first I am hearing about
> this agreement. Of course this may have been a verbal agreement within
> the team.

There was also a similar agreement at the LGM 2014, see
http://wiki.gimp.org/wiki/LGM2014Minutes#Malicious_and_reputation-damaging_installers_and_apps, 
3):


"3) How do we deal with GIMP builds that come with additional plug-ins, 
such as Simone Karin Lehmann’s or Partha Bagchi’s build?


Agreement to 3) 3rd party plug-ins and improvements to OS-integration 
(OS X, Windows, etc.) are ok. ? Shall they become part of the official 
build? Changing GIMP’s designed behaviour, like modifications to the 
Save-Export-behaviour must not become part of the official GIMP builds."


Neither your nor skl's builds are considered as malware. The
question came up when we discussed public GIMP builds with 
modifications. I hope this helps a bit.


Greetings

Sven


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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!,

[Kristian Rietveld]

Hi Sven,

Thanks for your feedback!

> On 28 Dec 2015, at 10:19, scl  wrote:
> 
> 2. Is this build with the latest dependency versions?

No, the first step was to reproduce a build using your instructions on my 
system. Your detailed instructions have been very helpful, thanks for that!

The next step is to upgrade dependencies and to build a WebKit-enabled GIMP so 
we can ship with a working help system.

And the steps after that are to automate the process and to look into doing 
regular 2.9.x builds.


thanks,

-kris.

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Re: [Gimp-developer] Testers requested for our new Mac OS X DMG release!

[Øyvind Kolås]

On Sun, Dec 13, 2015 at 8:57 PM, Kristian Rietveld  wrote:
> I am looking for people that would like to volunteer to test our Mac OS X DMG 
> releases. We have a freshly baked 2.8.16 DMG ready for testing now at:
>
>   http://download.gimp.org/pub/gimp/v2.8/osx/testing/gimp-2.8.16-x86_64.dmg
>
>
> It should run on a Mac OS X 10.6 and higher.

Verified to work, even opening pages from a PDF as layers on 10.6

/pippin
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