Re: [Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
Hi, "Assign colorspace" and "Convert colorspace" are provided by the "icc_colorspace" plug-in. This plug-in is bundled with the Separate+. # In the future, the support of abstract/devicelink profiles will be added to this plug-in. > How is assigning or converting a *colour space* different from a > *colour profile*? The options appear to be the same as for colour > profiles. Color profiles define the detail of colorspaces. -- Yoshinori Yamakawa <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
Re: [Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
Hi Hedley, On Fri, Jul 18, 2008 at 12:06 PM, Hedley Finger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > David, Sven: > > On Thu, 2008-07-17 at 16:52 +1000, Hedley Finger wrote: > > > I know just enough about colour management to get myself into trouble. > > On Gimp 2.4.6, there are now some new options under the Image > Mode > > menu path, namely > > @ Assign to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > @ Convert to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > > @ Assign colorspace // Hmmm, should be 'Color Space' for niceness? > @ Convert colorspace // Likewise! > > > Sven replied: > > If you see four options there, then you have installed some additional > third-party plug-ins for color management that you should not need with > GIMP 2.4. It's probably best to get rid of those extra plug-in(s). > > > Yes, a respondent on another list said something similar -- the last two > options were probably inherited from a previous Gimp 2.x release, because > the Windows installer by default installs into the c:\Program > Files\Gimp-2.0\ folder created by previous installers. The first two > options actually call Little CMS to do the work. > > @ What does *assigning* an image to a colour profile do and what > effect does it have on colour management downstream? > > > It changes the meaning of the pixel values. Generally this means the > image looks different. > > > David, I see no difference when importing an image with no attached/assigned > profile. But you are saying that the pixel numbers do not change, so no > harm done if an inappropriate profile assigned -- just assign a more > appropriate one? Yes, no harm done. Images always use a color profile, even when there is none assigned. In GIMP preferences, 'RGB profile' determines the color profile used if the image has no profile assigned. By default this is set to None; None is treated as if it were sRGB. > @ How is *converting* an image to a colour profile differ from > "assigning", and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? > > > Converting, instead of assigning a different meaning to pixel values, > converts the pixel values from the previous color profile to the > profile you specify, so that the result is as close to identical as > possible to the original.. > > > So this is an irreversible step -- you may not be able to convert back to a > previous profile because the pixel values may not contain enough information > to allow this to happen? Yes. With GIMP's current limitation of 8bit/channel, some data loss is virtually guaranteed. After GIMP supports floating point images, data loss should become negligible when using floating point. David ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
Re: [Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
David, Sven: On Thu, 2008-07-17 at 16:52 +1000, Hedley Finger wrote: I know just enough about colour management to get myself into trouble. On Gimp 2.4.6, there are now some new options under the Image > Mode > menu path, namely @ Assign to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) @ Convert to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) @ Assign colorspace // Hmmm, should be 'Color Space' for niceness? @ Convert colorspace // Likewise! Sven replied: If you see four options there, then you have installed some additional third-party plug-ins for color management that you should not need with GIMP 2.4. It's probably best to get rid of those extra plug-in(s). Yes, a respondent on another list said something similar -- the last two options were probably inherited from a previous Gimp 2.x release, because the Windows installer by default installs into the c:\Program Files\Gimp-2.0\ folder created by previous installers. The first two options actually call Little CMS to do the work. @ What does *assigning* an image to a colour profile do and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? It changes the meaning of the pixel values. Generally this means the image looks different. David, I see no difference when importing an image with no attached/assigned profile. But you are saying that the pixel numbers do not change, so no harm done if an inappropriate profile assigned -- just assign a more appropriate one? @ How is *converting* an image to a colour profile differ from "assigning", and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? Converting, instead of assigning a different meaning to pixel values, converts the pixel values from the previous color profile to the profile you specify, so that the result is as close to identical as possible to the original.. So this is an irreversible step -- you may not be able to convert back to a previous profile because the pixel values may not contain enough information to allow this to happen? Regards, Hedley -- Hedley Finger 28 Regent Street Camberwell VIC 3124 Australia Tel. +61 3 9809 1229 Fax. (call phone first) Mob. (cell) +61 412 461 558 Email. "Hedley Finger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
Re: [Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
Hi, On Thu, 2008-07-17 at 16:52 +1000, Hedley Finger wrote: > > I know just enough about colour management to get myself into trouble. > > On Gimp 2.4.6, there are now some new options under the Image > Mode > > menu path, namely > > @ Assign to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > @ Convert to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > > @ Assign colorspace // Hmmm, should be 'Color Space' for niceness? > @ Convert colorspace // Likewise! If you see four options there, then you have installed some additional third-party plug-ins for color management that you should not need with GIMP 2.4. It's probably best to get rid of those extra plug-in(s). Sven ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
Re: [Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
Hi Hedley, On Thu, Jul 17, 2008 at 4:22 PM, Hedley Finger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > I know just enough about colour management to get myself into trouble. > > On Gimp 2.4.6, there are now some new options under the Image > Mode > > menu path, namely > > @ Assign to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > @ Convert to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) > > @ Assign colorspace // Hmmm, should be 'Color Space' for niceness? > @ Convert colorspace // Likewise! > > At the moment there are no Help topics nor topics on the User Manual > site for these menu options, so can some Photoshop, graphic arts, or > prepress guru assist with these queries: > > @ What does *assigning* an image to a colour profile do and what > effect does it have on colour management downstream? It changes the meaning of the pixel values. Generally this means the image looks different. > @ How is *converting* an image to a colour profile differ from > "assigning", and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? Converting, instead of assigning a different meaning to pixel values, converts the pixel values from the previous color profile to the profile you specify, so that the result is as close to identical as possible to the original.. > How is assigning or converting a *colour space* different from a > *colour profile*? The options appear to be the same as for colour > profiles. There is no difference. > > Are these two sets of lcms and Gimp dialogue alternative ways of > getting the same result on the image, or is one set changing the image > file and the other is actually doing something to the profile files > (rrgg!)? No. David ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
[Gimp-user] Color profiles & color spaces -- assignment v. conversion?
I know just enough about colour management to get myself into trouble. On Gimp 2.4.6, there are now some new options under the Image > Mode > menu path, namely @ Assign to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) @ Convert to Color Profile // Actually uses Little CMS (lcms) @ Assign colorspace // Hmmm, should be 'Color Space' for niceness? @ Convert colorspace // Likewise! At the moment there are no Help topics nor topics on the User Manual site for these menu options, so can some Photoshop, graphic arts, or prepress guru assist with these queries: @ What does *assigning* an image to a colour profile do and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? @ How is *converting* an image to a colour profile differ from "assigning", and what effect does it have on colour management downstream? How is assigning or converting a *colour space* different from a *colour profile*? The options appear to be the same as for colour profiles. Are these two sets of lcms and Gimp dialogue alternative ways of getting the same result on the image, or is one set changing the image file and the other is actually doing something to the profile files (rrgg!)? For example, the image I am looking at has these options ... *Assign ICC Color Profile */// Little CMS dialogue/ Current Color Profile: Adobe RGB (1998) Assign: [ Adobe RGB (1998) V ] /// drop-down list/ ... but ... *Assign colorspace */// //Gimp dialogue/ Current colorspace: None (use RGB workspace temporarily) New colorspace: (o) Unassign colorspace ( ) Workspace: Adobe RGB (1998) ( ) Profile: [ Not selected V ] /// drop-down list/ The conversion dialogues have these options ... *Convert to ICC Color Profile */// //Little CMS dialogue/ Current Color Profile: Adobe RGB (1998) Convert to: [ RGB workspace (Adobe RGB (1998)) V ] Rendering intent: [ Perceptual V ] [ ] Black point compensation ... and ... *Convert colorspace */// //Gimp dialogue/ Source colorspace: None (use RGB colorspace temporarily) Rendering intent: [ Perceptual V ] [ ] Use BPC compensation Destination colorspace: (o) Workspace: Adobe RGB (1998) ( ) Profile: [ not selected V ] [ ] Flatten image to preserve appearance Sure hope a developer is reading this list and can assist the puzzled and the troubled! Regards, Hedley -- Hedley Finger 28 Regent Street Camberwell VIC 3124 Australia Tel. +61 3 9809 1229 Fax. (call phone first) Mob. (cell) +61 412 461 558 Email. "Hedley Finger" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> ___ Gimp-user mailing list Gimp-user@lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU https://lists.XCF.Berkeley.EDU/mailman/listinfo/gimp-user
