Re: [h-cost] A strange question
My first Twelfthnight costume was in 1973. I don't know what Margo was doing that long ago, I was in high school. :) I made a few costumes for school plays, and went to my first Renaissance Faire at Black Point. Most of my sewing went into my personal wardrobe, as I was attempting to rock the Janis Joplin Rich Hippie look. It was a few years later that I really started to understand what serious historical costume was supposed to look like. Kayta had a hand in that, after I met her in Golden Gate Park when her group was having a historical theme picnic in a reserved area, and my friends and I had shown up with no permit or reservation to do a Pagan ritual. The were very nice and understanding to flaky us, and I thought what they were doing looked like a whole lot of fun. So be nice to the newbies, you never know who you might be inspiring! Margo ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
On 3/27/2010 12:38 PM, Käthe Barrows wrote: There is a magic in creating something that the SCA has lost a bit of since I joined in 1979. I should have mentioned that I am a Laurel in costuming, and have been for some time. I understand the magic of trying to make something as closely as possible to the original, and I encourage it as much as is humanly possible. My preferred period is Herician/Elizabethan (lots of fitting) and do it well enough to have gotten my Laurel in it. I do the corsetry not only to smooth out the upper body, but to help my back since it supports it far better than a bra. For the Steam Punk I have a completely different corset, and use the Mature Figure gowns ( I think hour-glass as a concept was born in the Mauve Generation.) When I started, you took a wedding gown pattern and altered it and got all sorts of big eyes when it did work out. Then we learned about metal grommets. We learned about plaquets (they didn't have them). Finally wonderful people like Margo did pattern lines for anything from the body on up. As for the old chestnut about telling someone that's not period not being period. I just wish someone would enforce it by gently and humorously stopping the problem at the source rather than spreading a single occasion all over the internet as though it happened at every event constantly. If it has happened to you, I'm sorry. I tend to prefer the wide eyed really? What would you do to make it better? I still can't wear either my SCA or Steam Punk outfits to work. I don't tend to find the type of business clothing offered to us off the rack types to be beautiful and appropriate no matter how I corset myself. I still love the SCA and Steam Punk events where I can wear things with glitz or lace. I also like the concept of putting found objects together to get something else that works. I remember being told that the wonder finial on one person's tent was actually an antique toilet float, spray painted gold. The same person had another that consisted of a basket ball, a large soft ball, and a tennis ball, one atop the other all painted gold for another finial. Reworking found objects; wearing glitz and lace and meeting many other people who actually think and read and... is the thing that keeps me coming back. Certainly no one in my office, all of whom have responsible jobs as do I thinks about much besides their kids, the football/baseball, other things. Heaven help you if you slip off track and wear something different (at my age I don't give a flying leap so I occasionally show up in a Sari, or a Salwar and Camese. I have to avoid those gowns that need a hood of some type - English or French since I can't answer the phone well in that.) Fortunately I don't work in a place that has a dress code. We are fighting the old battle of the fun mavens versus the period mavens. Actually we are probably both on the same side in that there is a very happy medium as well as great joy in getting everything exactly right and feeling like you stepped out of a painting. It is the magic of making the found item work as something medieval with a little tweaking that I sometimes miss in the SCA. In Steam Punk almost anything goes and laughter is the best medicine. The feeling of Oh wow! I never thought of using X for Xy How cool is that. Regina ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I should have mentioned that I am a Laurel in costuming, and have been for some time. There must be several of us Laurels on this list. But I got my Laurel so long ago that they didn't give them specific names, so mine's generic. I understand the magic of trying to make something as closely as possible to the original, and I encourage it as much as is humanly possible. I consider this a cross between the challenge of doing something outside my usual 'box' and the magic of bringing it into three dimensions from a concept. I learn so much working to the design ethos of a different period, and then I get to see it real, not just in a painting. When I started, you took a wedding gown pattern and altered it and got all sorts of big eyes when it did work out. Then we learned about metal grommets. We learned about plaquets (they didn't have them). Finally wonderful people like Margo did pattern lines for anything from the body on up. My first Twelfthnight costume was in 1973. I don't know what Margo was doing that long ago, but I had the help of a costume historian friend of my mother's who also knew theater costume tricks. I used a corset pattern she'd gotten from her copy of Nora Waugh, and I forget which of her books had the dress pattern or if she'd just made it up. I certainly didn't have any pattern books yet, only my old copy of Davenport. We are fighting the old battle of the fun mavens versus the period mavens. Actually we are probably both on the same side in that there is a very happy medium as well as great joy in getting everything exactly right and feeling like you stepped out of a painting. The period-maven side of me does what CostumeCon calls historical recreation, and the fun-mavin side of me does what CC calls historical interpretation, plus everything else (including period and non-period embroidery). I just have to remember which costumes get worn to (and appreciated at) which venues. So I do Ren. Faire, science fiction conventions, historical re-enacting, living history events, Steampunk events, fiber art events, and occasional SCA events, to make sure I can eventually wear anything I want to make. -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows -- “The future is already here, it is just unevenly distributed.” -William Gibson -- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
LOVE DIS :) On Mar 27, 2010, at 11:39 AM, Wanda Pease wrote: Regina (SCA, Steam Punk, Ooooh Shiny!) == Marjorie Wilser =:=:=:Three Toad Press:=:=:= Learn to laugh at yourself and you will never lack for amusement. --MW http://3toad.blogspot.com/ ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I just MAKE STUFF. Some, I wear (modern, 19thC, SCA, whenever). Some, I print (antique printing press). Some, I read (bookbinding). Some, I wash with (soap). Some, I eat (canning, jams/jellies). Make more stuff. Good! Just wear the right one, don't eat the soap, and wash up after eating jelly :) == Marjorie Wilser =:=:=:Three Toad Press:=:=:= Learn to laugh at yourself and you will never lack for amusement. --MW http://3toad.blogspot.com/ On Mar 27, 2010, at 12:38 PM, Käthe Barrows wrote: There is a magic in creating something that the SCA has lost a bit of since I joined in 1979. Creating things is as close as I can get to magic without a working wand. I think that's why Laurels, and their equivalents in other groups, make things. Hey - some people have kids for that reason. Not that I let that stop me. It's just another venue to wear beautiful clothing when you have an Hour Glass or Perfect Pear shape figure. Those shapes are, of course, why corsetry was invented. I can have some form of a perfect figure, just a little bigger than the one in the fashion plate... ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
-Original Message- The running joke is Steampunk is what happens when goths discover brown. Lots of grey in there too. -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows --- hmmm...grey matter...interesting. De ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] h-cost] A strange question
Nope. It's another genre that may or may not appeal to goths - bit like emo. But steampunk is verging on mainstream now, so isn't really what it was. In a message dated 25/03/2010 02:12:45 GMT Standard Time, h-costume-requ...@indra.com writes: Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
On 3/24/2010 6:55 PM, Käthe Barrows wrote: I personally don't know how Steampunk picked up the punk part of its name. It was a spin-off of the cyberpunk science fiction movement of the 80's. Several cyberpunk writers decided that, after exploring near-future technological advancement, it might be fun to explore near-past technological advancement. It was kind of a quiet sub-genre that didn't get a lot of love until only a few years ago. And, unlike the common perception of Goths, black clothing is not universally worn by the Steampunk crowd. The running joke is Steampunk is what happens when goths discover brown. andy ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
And, unlike the common perception of Goths, black clothing is not universally worn by the Steampunk crowd. The running joke is Steampunk is what happens when goths discover brown. Lots of grey in there too. -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows -- “The future is already here, it is just unevenly distributed.” -William Gibson -- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I think you got it on the mark - Goth in Indian safari suits??? ;) I've seen that. -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows -- “The future is already here, it is just unevenly distributed.” -William Gibson -- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
yup! Bambi (To be named ater) TBNL I am made for great things by GOD and walk with Pride Walladah bint al Mustakfi c 1100ad see me dance http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7HMtOoXtMs0 From: Lavolta Press f...@lavoltapress.com To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Wed, March 24, 2010 6:15:42 PM Subject: [h-cost] A strange question Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
[h-cost] A strange question
Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
Seems that way, doesn't it? I actually saw a steampunk costume pattern at Jo-Ann last time I was there. Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 15:15:42 -0700 From: f...@lavoltapress.com To: h-cost...@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] A strange question Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I don't think goth has evolved into steampunk. At least not according to friends of mine who are goths. However, there is an overlap of people who are active in both genres just not necessarily at the same time. From: Maureen Campbell morv...@hotmail.com To: h-cost...@indra.com Sent: Wed, March 24, 2010 11:05:11 PM Subject: Re: [h-cost] A strange question Seems that way, doesn't it? I actually saw a steampunk costume pattern at Jo-Ann last time I was there. Date: Wed, 24 Mar 2010 15:15:42 -0700 From: f...@lavoltapress.com To: h-cost...@indra.com Subject: [h-cost] A strange question Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
My goth friends say no. It just seems that way. Many of them do enjoy Steampunk, but Steampunk seems to appeal to those who were not goths as well. I know I like some aspects of it, and I've never had an interest in the regular goth scene. Seems the Lolita crowd likes it, too... from what I saw on one LJ Steampunk community I was on for awhile. Kimiko Small http://www.kimiko1.com Be the change you want to see in the world. ~ Ghandi The Tudor Lady's Wardrobe pattern http://www.margospatterns.com/ - Original Message Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
My goth friends say no. It just seems that way. Many of them do enjoy Steampunk, but Steampunk seems to appeal to those who were not goths as well. I know I like some aspects of it, and I've never had an interest in the regular goth scene. Seems the Lolita crowd likes it, too... from what I saw on one LJ Steampunk community I was on for awhile. I think a major difference is that Steampunk is more of an aesthetic movement (decoration, clothing, accessories), while Goth is more of a philosophy, even if it's become more of a fashion statement now that it's moved more into mainstream. There *are* many overlapping elements in both, though. Like... Jules Verne versus Bram Stoker (notice they were writing in the same years!). ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I think a major difference is that Steampunk is more of an aesthetic movement (decoration, clothing, accessories), while Goth is more of a philosophy, To some Steampunk is a philosophy; that of making things ones self. Steampunk includes building steam engines, steam-powered motorcycles, moving houses, and so forth, in addition to making jewelry, clothing, and wearable accessories. I personally don't know how Steampunk picked up the punk part of its name. And, unlike the common perception of Goths, black clothing is not universally worn by the Steampunk crowd. But yes, there is much stylistic crossover, costume-wise. My take is that Steampunk is Goth and Neo-Hippie gone Victorian (plus some historical re-interpretations by folks like me with strong historical costume backgrounds). -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows -- “The future is already here, it is just unevenly distributed.” -William Gibson -- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
*chuckle* I remember when Goth had a DIY philosophy as well, Thanks Hot Topic! *eye roll* --- On Wed, 3/24/10, Käthe Barrows kay...@gmail.com wrote: From: Käthe Barrows kay...@gmail.com Subject: Re: [h-cost] A strange question To: Historical Costume h-cost...@indra.com Date: Wednesday, March 24, 2010, 6:55 PM I think a major difference is that Steampunk is more of an aesthetic movement (decoration, clothing, accessories), while Goth is more of a philosophy, To some Steampunk is a philosophy; that of making things ones self. Steampunk includes building steam engines, steam-powered motorcycles, moving houses, and so forth, in addition to making jewelry, clothing, and wearable accessories. I personally don't know how Steampunk picked up the punk part of its name. And, unlike the common perception of Goths, black clothing is not universally worn by the Steampunk crowd. But yes, there is much stylistic crossover, costume-wise. My take is that Steampunk is Goth and Neo-Hippie gone Victorian (plus some historical re-interpretations by folks like me with strong historical costume backgrounds). -- Carolyn Kayta Barrows -- “The future is already here, it is just unevenly distributed.” -William Gibson -- ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I asked my goth friend who says: Goth is not dead! Long live goth! Not all goths are steampunks, not all steampunks are goths. But there is blending. There is also separation.  Sylvia Rognstad Costume/clothing design construction Alterations home dec http://www.ezzyworld.com On Mar 24, 2010, at 4:15 PM, Lavolta Press wrote: Has goth (clothing and events) basically evolved into steampunk? Fran Lavolta Press http://www.lavoltapress.com ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
I remember when Goth had a DIY philosophy as well, Thanks Hot Topic! *eye roll* Still does. Goths and uh, I don't know how you call those who aren't Goth but like spooky things, but... In any case, they have the MOST interesting crafts sites and blogs! (knitting, sewing, decorating, etc. -- just type subversive knitting in Google, for example). Hot Topic is *not* Goth! Well... not what I think of as Goth, in any case ;-) Nowadays it's mostly... grungy garage style... But, they are both such a good opportunity to use those period patterns you never made because you had no historical event to take them to! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
Re: [h-cost] A strange question
From what I can see and in my laymans observation Steampunks appears to be more in the COSPLAY space... costumes based on animation.. Goth evolved more as a sub-culture with no direction from animation, maybe vampire movies had an influence (My daughter was a goth when she was younger). Victorian and Edwardian fashion appears to have inspired some costumes in goth from what I have seen but I guess as long as its black, has velvet and a long(ish) train with some lace it might fit the bill ;) Sidney On Thu, Mar 25, 2010 at 12:19 PM, Audrey Bergeron-Morin audreybmo...@gmail.com wrote: I remember when Goth had a DIY philosophy as well, Thanks Hot Topic! *eye roll* Still does. Goths and uh, I don't know how you call those who aren't Goth but like spooky things, but... In any case, they have the MOST interesting crafts sites and blogs! (knitting, sewing, decorating, etc. -- just type subversive knitting in Google, for example). Hot Topic is *not* Goth! Well... not what I think of as Goth, in any case ;-) Nowadays it's mostly... grungy garage style... But, they are both such a good opportunity to use those period patterns you never made because you had no historical event to take them to! ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume ___ h-costume mailing list h-costume@mail.indra.com http://mail.indra.com/mailman/listinfo/h-costume
