Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

hould fail the RDEF attempt. But some disagree. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Edward Jaffe Sent: Friday, December 30, 2011 3:13 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support On 12/27/2011

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Peter Relson wrote on 12/27/2011 4:49 AM: What PARMLIB member is it that allows>8 characters between periods? http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dgt2c190/8.6.5.1 As Paul Gilmartin posted, this is a reference to: MODIFY CATALOG,DISABLE(DSNCHECK) FWIW, I wouldn't bet tha

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On 12/30/2011 2:25 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote: Good question. How would he get the notification? But did you try: o ftp MVS user LONGUSER password quote site FILE=JES put ...? o //STEP EXEC PGM=IKJEFT01 with that owner? (possibly in the job submitted via FTP) I used FTP

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Paul Gilmartin wrote: On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:41:21 -0500, Bob Rutledge wrote: R.S. wrote: W dniu 2011-12-30 22:12, Edward Jaffe pisze: On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Jaffe Sent: Friday, December 30, 2011 3:13 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: > A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID OWNER=SYS1

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Fri, 30 Dec 2011 16:41:21 -0500, Bob Rutledge wrote: >R.S. wrote: >> W dniu 2011-12-30 22:12, Edward Jaffe pisze: >>> On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. >>> >>> USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID OW

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

R.S. wrote: W dniu 2011-12-30 22:12, Edward Jaffe pisze: On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID OWNER=SYS1 CREATED=11.364 [...] TSO INFORMATION [...] Did you try to logon

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

W dniu 2011-12-30 22:12, Edward Jaffe pisze: On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID OWNER=SYS1 CREATED=11.364 [...] TSO INFORMATION [...] Did you try to logon to TSO with t

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On 12/27/2011 12:29 PM, McKown, John wrote: A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO segment. USER=LONGUSER NAME=LONG USERID OWNER=SYS1 CREATED=11.364 DEFAULT-GROUP=DEV PASSDATE=00.000 PASS-INTERVAL=180 PHRASEDATE=N/A ATTRIBUTES=NONE REVO

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 14:29:12 -0600, McKown, John wrote: >A RACF id can be 8 characters. But, in that case, they cannot have a TSO >segment. So they cannot be used to logon to TSO. If you try, you get a message >of >some sort from the TSO logon process. They can be used for batch jobs, UNIX

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 23:36:48 +0100, R.Skorupka wrote: > >SUBMIT adds a character only if the job text does not contain JOB >statement. IMHO submitting jobs without JOB statement is "quick and >DIRTY" method. Very dirty. It can be easily changed to allow 8-char >userids (add 1 charecter OR change e

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Wed, 28 Dec 2011 10:42:16 +0100, Peter Sylvester wrote: > >I'd rather see an IPL being faster, etc. > But re-read the OP. They is contending with Company Policy. http://www.thealders.net/humour/work/wk49.html -- gil --

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Hi, As far as I remember 8 char TSO userids are available when MVS is used with VM/XMAS under an augmented universe but only if you use the Undocumented Feature Option and the System Transition Application Real Generic Access Tool Environment. Otherwise I think the chance for metric to be used

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

W dniu 2011-12-28 01:16, Paul Gilmartin pisze: On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 23:36:48 +0100, R.S. wrote: SUBMIT adds a character only if the job text does not contain JOB statement. IMHO submitting jobs without JOB statement is "quick and DIRTY" method. Very dirty. It can be easily changed to allow 8-cha

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On 12/27/2011 8:28 AM, McKown, John wrote: -Original Message- [snip] No C compiler here. John, You've mentioned this frequently. I got to wondering if you can still call the C functions from an LE-enabled Assembler program? Should work, but I'm not sure if there are some cases wher

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 23:36:48 +0100, R.S. wrote: > >SUBMIT adds a character only if the job text does not contain JOB >statement. IMHO submitting jobs without JOB statement is "quick and >DIRTY" method. Very dirty. It can be easily changed to allow 8-char >userids (add 1 charecter OR change eight ch

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

W dniu 2011-12-27 21:05, Paul Gilmartin pisze: On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 10:42:02 -0800, Donald Zeunert wrote: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support One item that has not been mentioned. The 7 char TSO userid was so that when you submit batch jobs it automatically appended 1 char to make a

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

In , on 12/27/2011 at 01:08 AM, "Robert A. Rosenberg" said: >The problem with allowing TSO to use 8 Character USERIDs is that it >makes some TSO commands fail. Jobnames are 8 characters max. Submit >(at least ISPF Automatic Submit) adds a one character suffix to the >UserID and thus breaks

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 2:05 PM, Paul Gilmartin wrote: > On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 10:42:02 -0800, Donald Zeunert wrote: > >>Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support >> >>One item that has not been mentioned.  The 7 char TSO userid was so that when >>you submit batch jo

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

some weekend in the middle of the night! Needless to say, I did not try any "funny" names after that. --Roger On Tue, Dec 27, 2011 at 11:42 AM, Donald Zeunert wrote: > Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support > > I know some sites already use TSO batch job names w/o TSOID prefix, but

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Paul Gilmartin > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 2:05 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support > > On Tue, 27 Dec 201

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 10:42:02 -0800, Donald Zeunert wrote: >Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support > >One item that has not been mentioned.  The 7 char TSO userid was so that when >you submit batch jobs it automatically appended 1 char to make a unique >jobname to execute.  If

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

; From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > > [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Donald Zeunert > > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 12:42 PM > > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > > Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support > > > > Re: Eight-character TSO User

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Donald Zeunert > Sent: Tuesday, December 27, 2011 12:42 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support > > Re: Eight-char

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support One item that has not been mentioned.  The 7 char TSO userid was so that when you submit batch jobs it automatically appended 1 char to make a unique jobname to execute.  If your TSOID is 8 then and you submitted a batch job it would either have to have

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

In , on 12/26/2011 at 10:41 AM, John Gilmore said: >that left-to-right >index-level repetitions, as in >SYS1.SYS1. . . . >are interdicted. Since when? -- Shmuel (Seymour J.) Metz, SysProg and JOAT ISO position; see We don't care.

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

> -Original Message- > I can also live without OUTPUT. SDSF is better. What's "ISPF 3.8"? > I think we're using a newer release than 3.8. ISPF option 3.8 is the OUTLIST UTILITY. It is an ISPF interface to the old "FIB" (Foreground Initiated Background) commands of CANCEL, OUTPUT, and

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 08:18:44 -0600, Paul Gilmartin wrote: >On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 07:49:31 -0500, Peter Relson wrote: > >>>What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? >>> >>http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dgt2c190/8.6.5.1 >> >>As Paul Gilmartin pos

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

ember 27, 2011 9:19 AM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu Subject: Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 07:49:31 -0500, Peter Relson wrote: >>What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? >> >http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/d

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Tue, 27 Dec 2011 07:49:31 -0500, Peter Relson wrote: >>What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? >> >http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dgt2c190/8.6.5.1 > >As Paul Gilmartin posted, this is a reference to: >MODIFY CATALOG,DISABLE(DSNCHECK) > T

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 09:00:56 -0600, Paul Gilmartin wrote: >There's a PARMLIB option that allows the use of far more than 36 >(39?) (40?) and removes the 1-8 character blocking requirement. > What option provides that flexibility? -- Walt Farrell IBM STSM, z/OS Security Design

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

>What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? > http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dgt2c190/8.6.5.1 As Paul Gilmartin posted, this is a reference to: MODIFY CATALOG,DISABLE(DSNCHECK) FWIW, I wouldn't bet that most z/OS componentry pays attention to

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

On Tue, 2011-12-27 at 01:08 -0500, Robert A. Rosenberg wrote: > At 10:21 -0800 on 12/26/2011, Edward Jaffe wrote about Re: > Eight-character TSO Userid Support:: > > >Application environments are responsible for supporting whatever the > >current architected userid l

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

At 12:15 -0600 on 12/26/2011, Paul Gilmartin wrote about Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support: Likewise, in days of yore, but no longer, one DSN was not allowed to be a prefix of another, such as: GUBBINS.WOMBATversus GUBBINS.WOMBAT.FUBAR This was due to CVOL Support

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

At 10:21 -0800 on 12/26/2011, Edward Jaffe wrote about Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:: Application environments are responsible for supporting whatever the current architected userid length is. It has been asserted that TSO is the only z/OS application environment in 2011 (soon 2012

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Got it. Thanks! Not at all what I was thinking it might be. On Mon, 2011-12-26 at 17:13 -0600, Paul Gilmartin wrote: > On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:04:01 -0600, John McKown wrote: > > >What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? I > >just can't seem to find it. > >On Mon, 2011-1

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:04:01 -0600, John McKown wrote: >What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? I >just can't seem to find it. > (more) http://publibz.boulder.ibm.com/cgi-bin/bookmgr_OS390/BOOKS/dgt2d4a0/1.1.9 When you invoke Dynamic Allocation services or direc

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 16:04:01 -0600, John McKown wrote: >What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? I >just can't seem to find it. >On Mon, 2011-12-26 at 09:00 -0600, Paul Gilmartin wrote: >> On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 08:00:17 -0600, John McKown wrote: >> >> >> There's a PARMLI

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Edward Jaffe wrote: It has been asserted that TSO is the only z/OS application environment in 2011 (soon 2012) that can't handle that fundamental requirement. I'm trying to discover if that's a true statement. I know of no other, and no one has posted another example here. I strongly suspect,

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

What PARMLIB member is it that allows >8 characters between periods? I just can't seem to find it. On Mon, 2011-12-26 at 09:00 -0600, Paul Gilmartin wrote: > On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 08:00:17 -0600, John McKown wrote: > > > There's a PARMLIB option that allows the use of far more than 36 > (39?) (40?

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

On 12/24/2011 6:45 AM, John Gilmore wrote: Considerable work will have to be done to eliminate the seven-character TSO userid maximum, and it would be a work wasted if an already obsolescent eight-character maximum replaced it. Userid architecture is the responsibility of the operating system's

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 10:41:00 -0500, John Gilmore wrote: >The combinatorial problem---How many unique, licit DSNAME values are >there?--is easy to solve; one can even get the right answer if one Thanks for expounding my perhaps-overly-subtle rhetoric. >remembers that x'7c', x'5b', x'7b'---They a

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

The combinatorial problem---How many unique, licit DSNAME values are there?--is easy to solve; one can even get the right answer if one remembers that x'7c', x'5b', x'7b'---They are '@', '#', '$' in the United States---are syntactic majuscules and that left-to-right index-level repetitions, as in

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Mon, 26 Dec 2011 08:00:17 -0600, John McKown wrote: >On Sun, 2011-12-25 at 23:17 -0500, Robert A. Rosenberg wrote: >> At 19:20 -0600 on 12/24/2011, Paul Gilmartin wrote about Re: >> Eight-character TSO Userid Support: >> >> >Hmmm. How many upper-case alphanume

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Sun, 2011-12-25 at 23:17 -0500, Robert A. Rosenberg wrote: > At 19:20 -0600 on 12/24/2011, Paul Gilmartin wrote about Re: > Eight-character TSO Userid Support: > > >Hmmm. How many upper-case alphanumeric characters would be needed > >to provide unique identifiers

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

At 19:20 -0600 on 12/24/2011, Paul Gilmartin wrote about Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support: Hmmm. How many upper-case alphanumeric characters would be needed to provide unique identifiers for all the files an enterprise would ever need? By that metric, 44(8) is more than sufficient. A

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 19:19:34 -0500, zMan wrote: >Yeah, I see the case for 8-character consistency since TSO seems to be >the weirdo here, but I'm hard-pressed (much as I'd like to see it) to >find a case for changing the other areas. It ain't broke... > Hmmm. How many upper-case alphanumeric cha

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Yeah, I see the case for 8-character consistency since TSO seems to be the weirdo here, but I'm hard-pressed (much as I'd like to see it) to find a case for changing the other areas. It ain't broke... On Sat, Dec 24, 2011 at 7:11 PM, Clark Morris wrote: > While I agree that the control block (and

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On 24 Dec 2011 14:44:22 -0800, in bit.listserv.ibm-main you wrote: >In <4ef583a2.1080...@phoenixsoftware.com>, on 12/23/2011 > at 11:47 PM, Edward Jaffe said: > >>I am curious: is TSO the only hold-out? > >For 7 character userids, probably. However, there are two related >issues that are global

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 17:25:29 -0500, Shmuel Metz (Seymour J.) wrote: > > 1. The current limit of userids to 8 characters is equally >obsolescent. > > 2. The limitation of DSN components no longer makes sense, now > that IBM has put a stake through the heart of CVOL's. > I understand from di

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support

In <4ef583a2.1080...@phoenixsoftware.com>, on 12/23/2011 at 11:47 PM, Edward Jaffe said: >I am curious: is TSO the only hold-out? For 7 character userids, probably. However, there are two related issues that are global: 1. The current limit of userids to 8 characters is equally obsolesc

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

On Sat, 24 Dec 2011 09:45:12 -0500, John Gilmore wrote: >Edward Jaffe wrote > > >Recently, the need for eight-character TSO userids made it into the >list of the highest ranked MVS SHARE requirements. Many installations, >driven by their business units, are attempting to standardize on a >single,

Re: Eight-character TSO Userid Support:

Edward Jaffe wrote Recently, the need for eight-character TSO userids made it into the list of the highest ranked MVS SHARE requirements. Many installations, driven by their business units, are attempting to standardize on a single, eight-character, cross-platform userid. These attempts are being

Eight-character TSO Userid Support

Recently, the need for eight-character TSO userids made it into the list of the highest ranked MVS SHARE requirements. Many installations, driven by their business units, are attempting to standardize on a single, eight-character, cross-platform userid. These attempts are being hampered by the a