Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Hunkeler Peter (KIUP 4)
>What he said, but I would do both > >/* >// While a // definitely denotes the end of the JCL for the current job, /* does not. /* terminates the current sysin dataset (note that DLM= may denote a different sequence). Why not put the data on the stack and use address TSO "submit *" from the

Re: Question - OA20749 for z/OS V1.8 and V1.9 supports page data sets up to 44.9GB in size.

2009-11-10 Thread Vernooij, CP - SPLXM
"Terri E Shaffer" wrote in message news:... > We currently have 3- 3330cyl page datasets defined per 3390-9 volumes with PAV support turned on. My question revolves around the above support and might be more of a personal opinion than technical one So is it better performance to allocate 1 p

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Itschak Mugzach
You first have to install FMID JBB772S. ITschak On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 8:42 PM, Chokalingam Thangavelu < thangavelu.chokalin...@wipro.com> wrote: > We are planning to do a assessment that requires installation of this > FMID JBB772S so that from the SMF Records we can find out how much of > ou

Re: HMC Issue

2009-11-10 Thread John Argall
Hi, Usually service status is PINK and the lpars will generally disappear off the CPC Images page. Its possible there is already some logged into the SE. The easiest way to get around this is to get the SE rebooted. This can be done from the HMC, there is an option. Or get someone to open up th

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Maarten Slegtenhorst
Chris, First of all, a small correction on my earlier post. Our distributed VIPA's have the naming convention: ab-dv1.mf.qual1.qual2 and not ab01-dv1.mf.qual1.qual2 Static and dynamic VIPA's have the same naming convention. "mf" in the domain stands for "mainframe" ;) All ip-addresses

Re: SMF 42 SUBTYPE 6: invalid value for extended ps?

2009-11-10 Thread Michael Cleary
On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 23:37:29 +0800, Johnny Luo wrote: >Hi, > >I'm parsing 42/6 SMF records to calculate number of write blocks at data set >level. Test shows that for extended format ps data sets S42AMSWB and >S42AMDWB contain invalid data. The value is extremely large and is obviously >wrong. I

Re: No mainframe dns : Was: RE: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Maarten Slegtenhorst
John wrote: > At DR, we insist that the MF continues to have the identical IP address. Nice! I wish we had that, but, alas, it is not possible in our current LAN-network. Now we have to search for those who use an ip-address instead of a dns-name, because they have to change their settings in

Re: VSAM CA Splits, still a performance problem?

2009-11-10 Thread Gene Hudders
Hi: The considerations for CI/CA splits varies with either on-line or batch processing. Here is some information from the CICS TS Performance Guide and VSAM Demystified manuals that may be useful. Free space provides a tool for deferring splits to occur. >From CICS TS 4.1 Performance Guid

Re: JES2 and Spool on MOD9

2009-11-10 Thread Lizette Koehler
All good points. Fortunately we are small. Just 6 MOD3s that are barely 20% full all the time. Not much stress here :-D We will probably go to 3 or 4 MOD9s and I think out TGNUM will be fine. Thanks all Lizette - > >Make sure you have enough TGspace available, depending on how many Mod-9

Re: CPU Uncaptured overhead

2009-11-10 Thread Larre Shiller
John - In the back of my head, I seem to remember reading something a while back that poorly-coded (e, inefficient...) SMS ACS routines can cause delays in allocation and it is difficult to pinpoint the CPU time used by the ACS routines because of where the ACS routines are running--it all

Re: JES2 and Spool on MOD9

2009-11-10 Thread Terri E Shaffer
Make sure you have enough TGspace available, depending on how many Mod-9 and/or mod-3's you plan on configuring. Thanks Ms. Terri E. Shaffer terri.e.shaf...@jpmchase.com Engineer J.P.Morgan Chase & Co. GTI DCT ECS Core Services zSoftware Group / Emerging Technologies Office: # 614-213-3467 Ce

Re: JES2 and Spool on MOD9

2009-11-10 Thread Staller, Allan
IIRC, once you go to LARGEDS format on *ANY* spool volume you cannot go back (LARGEDS=FAIL) except via a cold start. Can't think of anything else to worry about. HTH, z/OS V1.9 I am getting ready to move my spool from MOD3 to MOD9. I think the only thing I have to do is change the spooldef

JES2 and Spool on MOD9

2009-11-10 Thread Lizette Koehler
z/OS V1.9 I am getting ready to move my spool from MOD3 to MOD9. I think the only thing I have to do is change the spooldef to LARGEDS=ALLOWED or ALWAYS and then Allocate/$Snewspol/$Zoldspol Is there anything else I need to worry about or review? Lizette

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Lizette Koehler
Then you should be able to REC/APP/ACC JBB772S. The easiest way is to look up the PSP bucket for your level of z/OS and look for zIIP in the text 5694A01 ZOSV1R7JBB772S IBM zIIP Support BCPZIIP Lizette > >Hi, > >This is for Z/OS 1.7 and I have only HBB7720 in our Global Zon

FTP Problem (was FTP Issue)

2009-11-10 Thread Chris Mason
Gaur It looks like it might be a *problem* rather than an *issue* to me. Perhaps the *issue* is that you have a *problem* and you would like some help. First let me mention that this appeared in Google Groups but did *not* appear in the IBM-MAIN archive. This suggests to me that you are using a

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Chokalingam Thangavelu
Hi, This is for Z/OS 1.7 and I have only HBB7720 in our Global Zone. I found the attached list when I searched in the net for JBB772S. Regards, Chokalingam Thangavelu TWUL Mainframe Support Thames Water IS In Partnership with Wipro Technologies Mobile: +91(0)-96864 33224 -Original Message--

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Lizette Koehler
You need to receive the FMIDs for the version of software you are running. If you have HBB7730 you do not do HBB7740, HBB7750; unless you are running all those different releases of z/OS. I would just receive the JBB772S and see if it goes in. What version of z/OS will this be for??? Go look

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Chokalingam Thangavelu
Hi, I have not received the function yet. I need receive HBB7730,HBB7740,HBB7750 and JBB773J,JBB774J,JBB775J,JBB77S9 along with JBB772S . Please let me the below Syntax is correct as I have done before. SET BOUNDARY(GLOBAL). RECEIVE FORFMID(HBB7730,HBB7740,HBB7750,JBB772S,JB772S etc..) SET BOU

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Pinnacle
- Original Message - From: "Hal Merritt" Newsgroups: bit.listserv.ibm-main Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 1:38 PM Subject: Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps Add a // or /* as the last statement of the job. What he said, but I would do both /* // Regards, Tom Conley ---

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Martin Kline
> UA23218 NOT RECEIVED PTF This PTF is for FMID HBB7709. On our system, that is superceded by HBB7740. I don't know about the rest of your system levels, but if the PTFs are for related FMIDs of multiple releases, then SMPE should receive only the ones that are applicable to your system.

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Lizette Koehler
Have you REC/APP/ACC the Function JBB772S yet? If not, that is the first step in getting the PTFs for it on. Lizette -Original Message- >From: Chokalingam Thangavelu > >We are planning to do a assessment that requires installation of this >FMID JBB772S so that from the SMF Records we

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Ed Finnell
In a message dated 11/10/2009 12:40:57 P.M. Central Standard Time, john.mck...@healthmarkets.com writes: always put in a /*EOF as well. Nothing like being paranoid! >> NO GOATS, NO GLORY! Whatever happened to debugging? Write the output to a file and see what you got both ways and compar

Re: Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Mark Jacobs
Chokalingam Thangavelu wrote: > We are planning to do a assessment that requires installation of this > FMID JBB772S so that from the SMF Records we can find out how much of > our current general processor workload can be processed by specialty > processors like zIIP and zAAP. > > We have found out

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Martin Kline
>It appears that when I try to submit the second job through the INTRDR the >SYSTSIN in my REXX step of the second job gets lost. Although you have already found a work-around, I suspect you were not writing all of the lines from your REXX code. Did you also close the OUTFIL DD by including the

Receving PTFs for measuring workload that can be processed by ZIIP engine

2009-11-10 Thread Chokalingam Thangavelu
We are planning to do a assessment that requires installation of this FMID JBB772S so that from the SMF Records we can find out how much of our current general processor workload can be processed by specialty processors like zIIP and zAAP. We have found out that FMID JBB772S requires to enable tha

Re: CPU Uncaptured overhead

2009-11-10 Thread Staller, Allan
Before you do either of the below, try apar OA18452. INITIMP=E may halp Not sure about increasing the general DASD pool. HTH, Subject: CPU Uncaptured overhead We have a little z800 2066 with 350 mips and a reported uncaptured CPU overhead percent in the 15-18% range. We modified WLM to halve

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Hal Merritt > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 12:37 PM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps > > Add a // or /* as the last statement of the job.

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Hal Merritt
Add a // or /* as the last statement of the job. There used to be some issues where JES did not know if the submitted job stream was complete or not. The // or /* statement was a definitive delimiter for the job stream. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:i

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Burrell, C. Todd (CDC/OCOO/ITSO) (CTR)
Changing this to use the PARM actually seems to have fixed this issue. Although I have no idea why this wouldn't work the other way? But I'll incorporate this in the future. Thanks for the tip. C. Todd Burrell, PMP, MCP Lead z/OS Systems Programmer ITSO (404) 723-2017 (Cell) -Original M

SV: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Thomas Berg
How do MKPERM looks like ? (If the JCL is not in MKPERM but read from somewhere we need to see that file.) Regards, Thomas Berg __ Thomas Berg Specialist IT-U SWEDBANK > -Ursprungligt meddelande- > Från: IBM Mainframe Discussion

Re: Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Itschak Mugzach
Todd, In SDSF enter INPUT ON to see of the systsin is empty or not. But the best way is to enter the exec name as a parameter to IKJEFT01 (e.g. //stepx exec pgm=ikjeft01,parm=mkperm,...). ITschak On Tue, Nov 10, 2009 at 7:43 PM, Todd Burrell wrote: > I'm having a strange JCL/REXX issue that I

Weird INTRDR with REXX JCL steps

2009-11-10 Thread Todd Burrell
I'm having a strange JCL/REXX issue that I am hoping someone can help with. I am running one job that does a listcat, and then depending on the RC from the listcat, it will run the final step of the first job which is a REXX exec that submits JCL to the internal reader. Here is the JCL for th

CPU Uncaptured overhead

2009-11-10 Thread Donnelly, John P
We have a little z800 2066 with 350 mips and a reported uncaptured CPU overhead percent in the 15-18% range. We modified WLM to halve the number of services classes supported and this did not seem to reduce the overhead percent. IBM has suggested that initiator delay time SMF30ICU is due to DAS

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Chris Mason
Maarten I don't believe name servers were designed for the purposes of "keeping track" of intranet addresses. Their primary purpose - and sole purpose until I am persuaded otherwise - is to provide an indirect reference for people who need to specify destination addresses so that, if the addre

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Chris Mason
John > We don't have our mainframe in our DNS. The DNS people don't want to be bothered with it. And quite right they are too. Now *applications* would be a different matter. Chris Mason On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 07:20:11 -0600, McKown, John wrote: >> -Original Message- >> From: IBM Mainf

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Chris Mason
Srinivas A "mainframe" - by which you may mean a "Central Electronic Complex" (CEC) or "Central Processing Complex" (CPC) or, in the approximate terminology of casual conversation, a "footprint" - doesn't have a name. Neither does an individual LPAR running in the CEC/CPC. Only IP *interfaces*

Re: z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread Ted MacNEIL
>I'd read that as a replacement for the Crypto cards indicated. Not a new z >machine. A couple of weeks ago, IBM's CFO stated in a conference call that the z11 would be out in 4Q2010. - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Ted MacNEIL
>Being a small shop our naming standards are a bit freer. We use "titan"v just >as a reminder to show the squatty boxes who's boss. :-) The last shop I was in just used the 4-character system name. Since the only people who had to know were TSO users, and they had to know the system they were

Re: z/Journal magazine -- Historic Marist College Embraces Mainframe's Future

2009-11-10 Thread Ed Finnell
In a message dated 11/10/2009 9:56:16 A.M. Central Standard Time, g...@gabegold.com writes: at undergraduate and graduate levels. …" A longtime IBM mainframe flagship, the school is now a hub of worldwide mainframe education, both on campus and via distance learning. >> Location, locatio

Re: VSAM CA Splits, still a performance problem?

2009-11-10 Thread Hal Merritt
A concern? Yes. A big concern? No. Your determination of free space should include your expected (or observed) insert activity, the initial population, and the distribution of new records. That said, I wouldn't spend a lot of time on the estimates. My $0.02 -Original Message- Fro

z/Journal magazine -- Historic Marist College Embraces Mainframe's Future

2009-11-10 Thread Gabe Goldberg
Historic Marist College Embraces Mainframe's Future by Gabe Goldberg Just over a century ago, the Marist Brothers arrived in New York's Hudson River Valley to train young men to continue the brothers' vocation as great educators. What started as a seminary for training has become a leading col

Re: z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread Edward Jaffe
Pommier, Rex R. wrote: Allan, I don't read that announcement that way. I read it that the crypto express2 card is being withdrawn on Dec 31 and that will be the date the crypto express3 card will be made available. Interestingly, the announcement letter this one references said the crypto expr

SMF 42 SUBTYPE 6: invalid value for extended ps?

2009-11-10 Thread Johnny Luo
Hi, I'm parsing 42/6 SMF records to calculate number of write blocks at data set level. Test shows that for extended format ps data sets S42AMSWB and S42AMDWB contain invalid data. The value is extremely large and is obviously wrong. I also compared my program with DAF. For extended ps data set DA

Re: z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread R.S.
Staller, Allan pisze: ... A replacement product will be available on December 31, 2009. Reading between the lines is the "z/11" imminent? I checked "imminent" in my dictionary - and YES it is, ...but it is NOT mentioned in the newsletter. We only know that new type of crypto cards replaces t

Re: About plan and package

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Arun shan > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 9:14 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: About plan and package > > hai can any one help me? > > i compiled cobol-db2 program when the

About plan and package

2009-11-10 Thread Arun shan
hai can any one help me? i compiled cobol-db2 program when the execution time it gave -805 sqlcode for one stored procedure.. that stored procedure program already in the data set x.x.program and the corresponding dbrmlib in ..dbrmlib some one copied the program and compiled in d

Question - OA20749 for z/OS V1.8 and V1.9 supports page data sets up to 44.9GB in size.

2009-11-10 Thread Terri E Shaffer
We currently have 3- 3330cyl page datasets defined per 3390-9 volumes with PAV support turned on. My question revolves around the above support and might be more of a personal opinion than technical one So is it better performance to allocate 1 per volume, 3 per volume per 3390-9 and/or wha

Re: z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread Pommier, Rex R.
Allan, I don't read that announcement that way. I read it that the crypto express2 card is being withdrawn on Dec 31 and that will be the date the crypto express3 card will be made available. Interestingly, the announcement letter this one references said the crypto express3 was supposed to be a

Re: z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Staller, Allan > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:38 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: z/11 imminent? > > ... A replacement product will be available on December 31, 2009. > >

z/11 imminent?

2009-11-10 Thread Staller, Allan
... A replacement product will be available on December 31, 2009. Reading between the lines is the "z/11" imminent? http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_5852_137980_email_DYN_1IN/ffwp64 209573 http://www.ibm.com/vrm/newsletter_10577_5852_138666_email_DYN_1IN/ffwp64 209573 ---

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Pommier, Rex R.
Being a small shop our naming standards are a bit freer. We use "titan" just as a reminder to show the squatty boxes who's boss. :-) Rex > > Hi, > > We want to have a DNS Name for our new Z10 BC mainframe. Any > suggestions? > Please also share your Mainframe names. > > Regards, >

Re: VSAM CA Splits, still a performance problem?

2009-11-10 Thread Joel C. Ewing
A CI split (unless it forces a CA split) involves very little extra overhead - like typically an extra Data CI write and Index CI write. A CA split on the other hand means you have to physically move half the Data CIs in the old CA to another CA. For a 3390 cylinder CA and 4KiB Data CISIZE, that m

Re: No mainframe dns : Was: RE: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Maarten Slegtenhorst > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 8:10 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: No mainframe dns : Was: RE: Z10 BC DNS Name > > John, > > During a disaster recove

Re: SMF Image counts and physical page counts

2009-11-10 Thread Barry Merrill
These notes from my old paper on z/OS Resource Accounting have not been updated in several years, but I believe they are still correct with regard to what is counted where. Barry Merrill PRINTERS The TYPE6 record data in the PDB.PRINT data set provides the data needed to distribute the cost of

No mainframe dns : Was: RE: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Maarten Slegtenhorst
John, During a disaster recovery, we move the dns-name to the new ip-address, so nobody has to change anything. ( except maybe for a local dns-flush ) What do you do when a DR occurs? Do the users change the destination ip-address on their servers and workstations? -- Maarten -Oorspronk

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Ted MacNEIL > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 7:52 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Re: Z10 BC DNS Name > > >The DNS people don't want to be bothered with it. > > Why is it up

Re: Symbolic variables

2009-11-10 Thread Joel C. Ewing
On 11/09/2009 02:18 PM, Dibitu wrote: > On 9 nov, 06:16, jcew...@acm.org (Joel C. Ewing) wrote: ... >> The inclusion of the always-true "STEPNULL.RC= 0 AND" portion of the >> statements is irrelevant as to whether the statement is acceptable. >> JC Ewing >> >> On 11/07/2009 08:28 AM, Birger Heede

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Maarten Slegtenhorst
We used to have a lot of different names, depending on the business unit where the host originated. Most of our dns-names are nowadays something like .qual1.qual2 or .qual1.qual2 where qual1.qual2 is the common denominator. So I requested my own domain mf.qual1.qual2 and gave every host a dns-na

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Ted MacNEIL
>The DNS people don't want to be bothered with it. Why is it up to them? - Too busy driving to stop for gas! -- For IBM-MAIN subscribe / signoff / archive access instructions, send email to lists...@bama.ua.edu with the message:

Re: VSAM CA Splits, still a performance problem?

2009-11-10 Thread Ted MacNEIL
>In today's world with lots of cache in modern DASD systems, are CA splits still a concern? >Or should I just allocate KSDSs with FREESPC(00 00) and save the space? It's discussed in the RedBook "VSAM DeMystified", but the general concern is no longer applicable, even though some old-timers here

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread McKown, John
> -Original Message- > From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List > [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of SrinivasG > Sent: Tuesday, November 10, 2009 2:51 AM > To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu > Subject: Z10 BC DNS Name > > Hi, > > We want to have a DNS Name for our new Z10 BC mainframe. Any > s

VSAM CA Splits, still a performance problem?

2009-11-10 Thread Barry Jones
Hello, In the old days,CA splits were quite detrimental to performance of VSAM applications. In today's world with lots of cache in modern DASD systems, are CA splits still a concern? Or should I just allocate KSDSs with FREESPC(00 00) and save the space? All thought appreciated. Barry. --

CSM: Communications storage manager - what exactly does the IVTPRM00 parameter FIXED mean

2009-11-10 Thread Bruce Hewson
Hi folks, I am trying to get to the bottom of the Communications Storage Manager (CSM - z/OS 1.9) parameter FIXED. I understand the ECSA parameter, because I know where and how big our ECSA is. But what I don't have a clear understanding about, is the FIXED parameter. 1.Is the FIXED parame

Re: Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread Sam Siegel
Hi, We use, MVS1.xxx.net MVS5.xxx.net MVS7.xxx.net. Where xxx is company name. Keep the DNS name closely related or identical to the system name. It will make your life easier. These defined to the internal network (that is 10.x.x.x ip address) only. They are not accessible from the outside w

Re: The "why" of the newer instructions?

2009-11-10 Thread john gilmore
Responding to Benyamin Dissen's contention that "millicode should be way faster than open code", Edward Jaffe wrote | | Why? Millicode uses the same instruction pipeline, the | same execution unit, etc. | This is certainly and tritely true; but, as EJ knows very well, millicode has available

OS2 icons (semi OT)

2009-11-10 Thread R.S.
Disclaimer: This question regards 2074 device and PCOMM 3270 session icons - so it related to mainframe. Now the problem: I need to configure several PCOMM sessions on 2074 desktop (local ones). (Caution: I already configured 2074 as a "server", now I'm talking about *client* sessions). I crea

Z10 BC DNS Name

2009-11-10 Thread SrinivasG
Hi, We want to have a DNS Name for our new Z10 BC mainframe. Any suggestions? Please also share your Mainframe names. Regards, _ Srinivas G CAUTION - Disclaimer * This e-mail contains PRIVILEGED AND CONFIDE

Re: VIO Error

2009-11-10 Thread SrinivasG
Thanks to all who replied. I made space on the Master Catalog volume and the RMF Sort went through. -Original Message- From: IBM Mainframe Discussion List [mailto:ibm-m...@bama.ua.edu] On Behalf Of Vernooij, CP - SPLXM Sent: Thursday, November 05, 2009 8:19 PM To: IBM-MAIN@bama.ua.edu