Hi!
> I disagree that (as I take away from your last sentence) the current
> approach is better because it means people feel they have been properly
> heard. I can think of recent messages on the list from people saying
> that they don't feel heard.
I'm not saying we have perfect record in getti
On Tue, Aug 13, 2019 at 4:31 PM Peter Bowyer
wrote:
> Hi Stas,
>
> Thanks for replying!
>
> On Sun, 11 Aug 2019 at 04:26, Stanislav Malyshev
> wrote:
>
> > The risk here however is for the document to be seen as a means to
> > "argue less" by way of excluding certain points of view from discussi
Hi Stas,
Thanks for replying!
On Sun, 11 Aug 2019 at 04:26, Stanislav Malyshev
wrote:
> The risk here however is for the document to be seen as a means to
> "argue less" by way of excluding certain points of view from discussion.
> That would not be a good thing. This is the main concern for co
On Mon, Aug 12, 2019 at 2:56 PM Arnold Daniels
wrote:
> I've added a list of concerns to the FAQ. These are both taken from the
> discussion as well as concerns I have myself.
>
Along the lines of the 'counterpoint' to short tags, I moved the concerns
into a separate page here: http://wiki.php.
On 8/12/2019 2:06 AM, Benjamin Eberlei wrote:
What would be the plan to boost or change the reputation? How are you going
to find P++ in Google? How are users searching for things with PHP and P++?
What's the documentation going to look like for two languages that share so
much? Specifically from
I've added a list of concerns to the FAQ. These are both taken from the
discussion as well as concerns I have myself.
https://wiki.php.net/pplusplus/faq#what_are_the_general_concerns
Arnold
[Arnold Daniels - Chat @
Spike](https://www.spikenow.com/?ref=spike-organic-signature&_ts=43s7s)
On 12.08.19 г. 12:06 ч., Benjamin Eberlei wrote:
On Sun, Aug 11, 2019 at 6:32 AM Andi Gutmans wrote:
I must admit that the first time I read Zeev’s email I got anxious... but
it is frustrating that PHP has a WAY better runtime than Python and most
other dynamic languages yet is falling out of
language with the best runtime. But "starting
over" with 0 brand name and perception is much harder problem than changing
the existing brand, and its not at all technical challenge.
greetings
Benjamin
>
> Andi
>
> Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
>
>
On Sun, 11 Aug 2019 at 05:32, Andi Gutmans wrote:
> I must admit that the first time I read Zeev’s email I got anxious... but
> it is frustrating that PHP has a WAY better runtime than Python and most
> other dynamic languages yet is falling out of fashion.
In the case of Python, it seems to be
;
> From: Zeev Suraski
> Sent: Friday, August 9, 2019 12:54 PM
> To: Internals
> Subject: [PHP-DEV] P++: FAQ
>
> During the discussion of the P++ proposal (
> https://externals.io/message/106453), it became painfully clear that this
> id
think there’s
value of a different brand just because of the BS perception issues...
Andi
Get Outlook for iOS<https://aka.ms/o0ukef>
From: Zeev Suraski
Sent: Friday, August 9, 2019 12:54 PM
To: Internals
Subject: [PHP-DEV] P++: FAQ
During the discussion of
Hi!
> I started for the same reason: to help the community pull together and
> argue less, by having a codified set of values.
The risk here however is for the document to be seen as a means to
"argue less" by way of excluding certain points of view from discussion.
That would not be a good thing
Hi!
> Finally, Zeev, you mention the "PHP philosophy" of being a dynamic
> language. While that may well be your philosophy, and you have every
> right to have it, that has not been the "PHP philosophy" for years,
> as seen by all of the type "stuff" that's been successfully added to
> the langua
[List etiquette question: is it good form here to change the subject line
when starting a tangential discussion?]
On Sat, 10 Aug 2019 at 00:08, Larry Garfield wrote:
> PHP doesn't have a coherent philosophy. It is proudly directionless,
> steered by whoever happens to be writing code this week.
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 7:08 PM Larry Garfield
wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 9, 2019, at 2:54 PM, Zeev Suraski wrote:
> > During the discussion of the P++ proposal (
> > https://externals.io/message/106453), it became painfully clear that
> this
> > idea did little, so far, to bring peace to the galaxy.
>
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019, at 2:54 PM, Zeev Suraski wrote:
> During the discussion of the P++ proposal (
> https://externals.io/message/106453), it became painfully clear that this
> idea did little, so far, to bring peace to the galaxy.
>
> However, based on a lot of the feedback, both on internals@ an
On 10 Aug 2019, at 1:51, Sara Golemon mailto:poll...@php.net>>
wrote:
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 4:58 PM Zeev Suraski mailto:z...@php.net>>
wrote:
As Bob pointed out I'm rusty, but I do think that we can solve the short
tags issue in this way. At the lexer level, if we see the tag, we
set short
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 4:58 PM Zeev Suraski wrote:
> As Bob pointed out I'm rusty, but I do think that we can solve the short
> tags issue in this way. At the lexer level, if we see the tag, we
> set short tags to off for the scope of the file before moving forward. But
> more importantly, thi
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 4:30 PM Mark Randall wrote:
> On 09/08/2019 22:02, Sara Golemon wrote:
> > 2. Strict(er) typing - I'm not sure, on the surface, what future
> expansions
> > we'd plan for in this area which couldn't fit into standard PHP in a non
> > BC-breaking way.
>
> Union types and gen
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:03 AM Sara Golemon wrote:
> On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 2:54 PM Zeev Suraski wrote:
>
> > It's available here: https://wiki.php.net/pplusplus/faq
> >
> >
> It's possible I missed something while on holiday. There are certainly a
> lot of messages to page through. I dig th
I do completely agree with this and would like to be part of it. I am
really frustrated to see old developers shrug every time I talk about php.
I am enthusiastic about our language, the language I started coding with
and the language that evolved in years while I was learning it.
2 years ago, whi
On 09/08/2019 22:02, Sara Golemon wrote:
2. Strict(er) typing - I'm not sure, on the surface, what future expansions
we'd plan for in this area which couldn't fit into standard PHP in a non
BC-breaking way.
Union types and general reflection do spring to mind on this. I assume
any APIs using t
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 2:54 PM Zeev Suraski wrote:
> It's available here: https://wiki.php.net/pplusplus/faq
>
>
It's possible I missed something while on holiday. There are certainly a
lot of messages to page through. I dig the idea of resolving this
tug-of-war between progress and BC, but I'm
During the discussion of the P++ proposal (
https://externals.io/message/106453), it became painfully clear that this
idea did little, so far, to bring peace to the galaxy.
However, based on a lot of the feedback, both on internals@ and elsewhere -
it seems that a lot of people simply didn't reall
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