Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH v3 5/5] [Build] No need to use the source tree for temporary files.

[Wayne Stambaugh]

On 9/21/2016 3:14 PM, Chris Pavlina wrote:
> On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 09:04:03PM +0200, Niki Guldbrand wrote:
>> On ons, 2016-09-21 at 20:13 +0200, jp charras wrote:
>>> Le 21/09/2016 à 19:33, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :

 On ons, 2016-09-21 at 12:32 +0200, jp charras wrote:
>
> Le 21/09/2016 à 00:21, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
>>
>>
>>
>> * Move the generated PNG and temporary files to the build tree,
>> but
>>   keep the generated c files in the source tree for easier
>>   addition/updates in tree.
>> * Syncronize .gitignore to the changes.
>>
>> Signed-off-by: Niki Guldbrand 
>> ---
>>  .gitignore | 2 --
>>  bitmaps_png/CMakeLists.txt | 5 ++---
>>  2 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
>>
>
> I agree for temporary files.
>
> I fully disagree to move generated PNG files to the build tree.
>
> As a icon maintainer and a menu/toolbar maintainer, I am very
> *happy*
> to easily find them in source
> tree, for instance when I want to create a new icon, or choose an
> existing icon for a new menu item.
>
> Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree.
>
 Well they are still available, you just have to look in the build
 tree
 instead, so in my view it's a none issue, as they will be recreated
 if
 needed.

 And you still have the source files avalible (svg), to look at.
>>>
>>> Are you joking?
>>> There are near 500 icons.
>>>
>>> Only png files can be displayed as images when exploring a folder,
>>> not svg files.
>>
>> Well I don't know what OS you normally use, but here (Linux - Arch) I
>> see the svg files when browsing folders the same way as I would if they
>> were png's or jpeg's.
> 
> I don't have too terribly much to say about this...but surely whether
> your own OS and software previews them should be your own problem to
> solve? It's not appropriate to litter the source tree used by all the
> developers because it makes it easier for you personally to look through
> previews...get a better directory viewer.

CMake is pretty capable albeit a bit unwieldy at times.  Maybe the
PNG_MAINTAINER mode could have a clean-pngs make option so everyone
wins.  Just food for thought.

> 
>>>
>>> Moreover I wrote:
>>> "Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree."
>>> Clearly, you not read me.
>>
>> Yes I did, but that doesn't mean that I have the same oppinion as you
>> do, that is the nice thing about diversity in OSS, different ideas
>> meet, and progress is made :-)
>>
 I was even considering removing the 'if( MAINTAIN_PNGS ) all
 together,
 and replace it with something that lookes if the cpp file was older
 than the svg, and in that case regenerate the cpp file and not keep
 the
 png's around.
>>>
>>> Forget it.
>>
>> Well you haven't seen my patch yet, and allready dismissing it, but see
>> my answer above.
>>
 I'm also considering moving the svg's to the resources folder,
 because
 they are resources, and not source files, but that may just be my
 view.

>>>
>>> The current tree was designed by guys who know what they are doing,
>>> not beginners.
>>> It can be modified, but with good reasons.
>>
>> I haven't said anything about the people that designed it, but still,
>> there might be people out there with other ideas, might not be the
>> best, but could be a middle ground for improvement.
>>
>> I don't know if "not beginners" is ment as an insult or what, but, I
>> don't know you, and you don't know me (and each others background for
>> that matter), so my proposal is to keep the conversation civil, and not
>> start calling each other names or something like that, and keep it
>> technical and productive.
>>
>> I know that I might have radical ideas in your and maybe others eyes,
>> but I share them, and hope that we can find a common middle ground that
>> we can agree on and that improves kicad.
>>
>>> svg files are sources, like html or .fbp files
>>
>> They are also image files, although they are not binary in nature, they
>> are XML base, but they are still a resource ( in my view).
>>
>>> Why some guys are thinking only cpp files are sources. This is false.
>>> Sources files can be written in any language (svg *is* a language)
>>
>> I don't agree with you here, as I see it svg's is a file format, and a
>> subset of XML.
>>
>> A language is in my view something where you have eg. for, if, while
>> statements, and other constructs like that.
>>
>>> Clearly you have never maintained icon files.
>>
>> No I have not, you are correct on that point.
>>
>>> Maintain is not just build file: it is most of time create, choose
>>> and edit files.
>>
>> I agree on that point too.
>>
>>> Still, I am in the impression you did not really read my previous
>>> mail.
>>
>> As I wrote further up, yes I did, but our ideas and visions are
>> 

Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH v3 5/5] [Build] No need to use the source tree for temporary files.

[Niki Guldbrand]

On ons, 2016-09-21 at 20:13 +0200, jp charras wrote:
> Le 21/09/2016 à 19:33, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
> > 
> > On ons, 2016-09-21 at 12:32 +0200, jp charras wrote:
> > > 
> > > Le 21/09/2016 à 00:21, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > * Move the generated PNG and temporary files to the build tree,
> > > > but
> > > >   keep the generated c files in the source tree for easier
> > > >   addition/updates in tree.
> > > > * Syncronize .gitignore to the changes.
> > > > 
> > > > Signed-off-by: Niki Guldbrand 
> > > > ---
> > > >  .gitignore | 2 --
> > > >  bitmaps_png/CMakeLists.txt | 5 ++---
> > > >  2 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
> > > > 
> > > 
> > > I agree for temporary files.
> > > 
> > > I fully disagree to move generated PNG files to the build tree.
> > > 
> > > As a icon maintainer and a menu/toolbar maintainer, I am very
> > > *happy*
> > > to easily find them in source
> > > tree, for instance when I want to create a new icon, or choose an
> > > existing icon for a new menu item.
> > > 
> > > Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree.
> > > 
> > Well they are still available, you just have to look in the build
> > tree
> > instead, so in my view it's a none issue, as they will be recreated
> > if
> > needed.
> > 
> > And you still have the source files avalible (svg), to look at.
> 
> Are you joking?
> There are near 500 icons.

Some one (not to name the inocent) gave me this link on IRC that gives
explorer the ability to show thumbnails of svg files, maybe you could
have a look and try it ?
Note: I have't tried this, don't have windows here, so can't say
exactly how it works.

https://svgextension.codeplex.com/

Best regards

Niki

-- 
Niki Guldbrand 

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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH v3 5/5] [Build] No need to use the source tree for temporary files.

[Chris Pavlina]

On Wed, Sep 21, 2016 at 09:04:03PM +0200, Niki Guldbrand wrote:
> On ons, 2016-09-21 at 20:13 +0200, jp charras wrote:
> > Le 21/09/2016 à 19:33, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
> > > 
> > > On ons, 2016-09-21 at 12:32 +0200, jp charras wrote:
> > > > 
> > > > Le 21/09/2016 à 00:21, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > 
> > > > > * Move the generated PNG and temporary files to the build tree,
> > > > > but
> > > > >   keep the generated c files in the source tree for easier
> > > > >   addition/updates in tree.
> > > > > * Syncronize .gitignore to the changes.
> > > > > 
> > > > > Signed-off-by: Niki Guldbrand 
> > > > > ---
> > > > >  .gitignore | 2 --
> > > > >  bitmaps_png/CMakeLists.txt | 5 ++---
> > > > >  2 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
> > > > > 
> > > > 
> > > > I agree for temporary files.
> > > > 
> > > > I fully disagree to move generated PNG files to the build tree.
> > > > 
> > > > As a icon maintainer and a menu/toolbar maintainer, I am very
> > > > *happy*
> > > > to easily find them in source
> > > > tree, for instance when I want to create a new icon, or choose an
> > > > existing icon for a new menu item.
> > > > 
> > > > Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree.
> > > > 
> > > Well they are still available, you just have to look in the build
> > > tree
> > > instead, so in my view it's a none issue, as they will be recreated
> > > if
> > > needed.
> > > 
> > > And you still have the source files avalible (svg), to look at.
> > 
> > Are you joking?
> > There are near 500 icons.
> > 
> > Only png files can be displayed as images when exploring a folder,
> > not svg files.
> 
> Well I don't know what OS you normally use, but here (Linux - Arch) I
> see the svg files when browsing folders the same way as I would if they
> were png's or jpeg's.

I don't have too terribly much to say about this...but surely whether
your own OS and software previews them should be your own problem to
solve? It's not appropriate to litter the source tree used by all the
developers because it makes it easier for you personally to look through
previews...get a better directory viewer.

> > 
> > Moreover I wrote:
> > "Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree."
> > Clearly, you not read me.
> 
> Yes I did, but that doesn't mean that I have the same oppinion as you
> do, that is the nice thing about diversity in OSS, different ideas
> meet, and progress is made :-)
> 
> > > I was even considering removing the 'if( MAINTAIN_PNGS ) all
> > > together,
> > > and replace it with something that lookes if the cpp file was older
> > > than the svg, and in that case regenerate the cpp file and not keep
> > > the
> > > png's around.
> > 
> > Forget it.
> 
> Well you haven't seen my patch yet, and allready dismissing it, but see
> my answer above.
> 
> > > I'm also considering moving the svg's to the resources folder,
> > > because
> > > they are resources, and not source files, but that may just be my
> > > view.
> > > 
> > 
> > The current tree was designed by guys who know what they are doing,
> > not beginners.
> > It can be modified, but with good reasons.
> 
> I haven't said anything about the people that designed it, but still,
> there might be people out there with other ideas, might not be the
> best, but could be a middle ground for improvement.
> 
> I don't know if "not beginners" is ment as an insult or what, but, I
> don't know you, and you don't know me (and each others background for
> that matter), so my proposal is to keep the conversation civil, and not
> start calling each other names or something like that, and keep it
> technical and productive.
> 
> I know that I might have radical ideas in your and maybe others eyes,
> but I share them, and hope that we can find a common middle ground that
> we can agree on and that improves kicad.
> 
> > svg files are sources, like html or .fbp files
> 
> They are also image files, although they are not binary in nature, they
> are XML base, but they are still a resource ( in my view).
> 
> > Why some guys are thinking only cpp files are sources. This is false.
> > Sources files can be written in any language (svg *is* a language)
> 
> I don't agree with you here, as I see it svg's is a file format, and a
> subset of XML.
> 
> A language is in my view something where you have eg. for, if, while
> statements, and other constructs like that.
> 
> > Clearly you have never maintained icon files.
> 
> No I have not, you are correct on that point.
> 
> > Maintain is not just build file: it is most of time create, choose
> > and edit files.
> 
> I agree on that point too.
> 
> > Still, I am in the impression you did not really read my previous
> > mail.
> 
> As I wrote further up, yes I did, but our ideas and visions are
> proberbly not the same.
> 
> I'm not here to derail the project, I'm here to help the project along,
> and when new people come along there is 

Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH v3 5/5] [Build] No need to use the source tree for temporary files.

[Niki Guldbrand]

On ons, 2016-09-21 at 12:32 +0200, jp charras wrote:
> Le 21/09/2016 à 00:21, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
> > 
> > 
> > * Move the generated PNG and temporary files to the build tree, but
> >   keep the generated c files in the source tree for easier
> >   addition/updates in tree.
> > * Syncronize .gitignore to the changes.
> > 
> > Signed-off-by: Niki Guldbrand 
> > ---
> >  .gitignore | 2 --
> >  bitmaps_png/CMakeLists.txt | 5 ++---
> >  2 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
> > 
> 
> I agree for temporary files.
> 
> I fully disagree to move generated PNG files to the build tree.
> 
> As a icon maintainer and a menu/toolbar maintainer, I am very *happy*
> to easily find them in source
> tree, for instance when I want to create a new icon, or choose an
> existing icon for a new menu item.
> 
> Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree.
> 
Well they are still available, you just have to look in the build tree
instead, so in my view it's a none issue, as they will be recreated if
needed.

And you still have the source files avalible (svg), to look at.
I was even considering removing the 'if( MAINTAIN_PNGS ) all together,
and replace it with something that lookes if the cpp file was older
than the svg,vand in that case regenerate the cpp file and not keep the
png's around.

I'm also considering moving the svg's to the resources folder, because
they are resources, and not source files, but that may just be my view.

-- 
Niki Guldbrand 

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Re: [Kicad-developers] [PATCH v3 5/5] [Build] No need to use the source tree for temporary files.

[Wayne Stambaugh]

JP,

Since you do most if not all of the bitmap maintenance, please apply the
patches in this patch set that make sense and discard anything that
doesn't work for you.

Thanks,

Wayne

On 9/21/2016 6:32 AM, jp charras wrote:
> Le 21/09/2016 à 00:21, Niki Guldbrand a écrit :
>>
>> * Move the generated PNG and temporary files to the build tree, but
>>   keep the generated c files in the source tree for easier
>>   addition/updates in tree.
>> * Syncronize .gitignore to the changes.
>>
>> Signed-off-by: Niki Guldbrand 
>> ---
>>  .gitignore | 2 --
>>  bitmaps_png/CMakeLists.txt | 5 ++---
>>  2 files changed, 2 insertions(+), 5 deletions(-)
>>
> 
> I agree for temporary files.
> 
> I fully disagree to move generated PNG files to the build tree.
> 
> As a icon maintainer and a menu/toolbar maintainer, I am very *happy* to 
> easily find them in source
> tree, for instance when I want to create a new icon, or choose an existing 
> icon for a new menu item.
> 
> Build tree is subject to be deleted, not files in source tree.
> 

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