On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 8:41 PM, Anthony wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Anthony wrote:
>> > Okay, so if company C makes derived database and gives it to company D,
>> > then
>> > company D creates tiles with that database, compan
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Anthony wrote:
> > Okay, so if company C makes derived database and gives it to company D,
> then
> > company D creates tiles with that database, company D has to offer the
> > database to anyone who receives th
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 6:27 PM, Anthony wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 1:08 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>>
>> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 3:37 PM, Anthony wrote:
>> > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 2:37 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> The example I described above clearly demonstrates that you ca
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 1:08 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 3:37 PM, Anthony wrote:
> > On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 2:37 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> The example I described above clearly demonstrates that you can't
> >> differentiate between company A who doesn't use
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 3:37 PM, Anthony wrote:
> On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 2:37 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> The example I described above clearly demonstrates that you can't
>> differentiate between company A who doesn't use a derived database and
>> company B who does.
>
> What if comp
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 2:37 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> The example I described above clearly demonstrates that you can't
> differentiate between company A who doesn't use a derived database and
> company B who does.
>
What if company C makes a derived database and gives it to company D?
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 7:37 AM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> It's clearly not the same difficulty. And the point of this is that it's
> going to be almost impossible to detect a derived database in use. You said
> yourself that you'd just assume that anyone processing OSM data would be
> pre
On Sun, Dec 13, 2009 at 1:07 AM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 10:45 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:20 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> >> are there easter eggs in OSM? i thought we followed the "on the
> >> ground" rule? ;-)
> >
> > The two are not mutually e
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 10:45 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:20 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>> are there easter eggs in OSM? i thought we followed the "on the
>> ground" rule? ;-)
>
> The two are not mutually exclusive. Ordnance Survey are well known for
> having very accu
Hi,
Anthony wrote:
> Where does one draw the line between a "Derivative Database", a
> "Collective Database", and a "Produced Work" anyway?
Part of the answer is, in almost salomonic fashion, here:
http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Open_Data_License/Produced_Work_-_Guideline
There's also to
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:26 PM, Anthony wrote:
> Where does one draw the line between a "Derivative Database", a "Collective
> Database", and a "Produced Work" anyway? Can a "Produced Work" also be a
> "Derivative Database"? If not, which definition overrides the other? An
> image qualifies u
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:10 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> I think we have now established that whenever you do something with OSM
> data that involves a derivative database, but just to make things
> simpler for you and not as an absolutely necessary component, then
> nobody can prove that you are
Hi,
80n wrote:
> I think you've lost the thread. Now, you are arguing that you can't
> spot a derivative database.
My original question was aiming at whether or not there are ways to
weasel yourself out of the requirement release derivative databases or
the algorithms leading to them.
I thin
Hi,
Matt Amos wrote:
> let's assume it's known that this company is definitely using OSM data
> - determining that can be difficult, depending on exactly what it is
> they're doing with the data. in general, it's very difficult to do
> anything directly from the planet file alone, so i'd suspect t
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:20 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:03 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>
>> a lack of attribution is evident, but whether they're using OSM data
> >> isn't. you have no grounds for suspicion, but y
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 9:03 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>> a lack of attribution is evident, but whether they're using OSM data
>> isn't. you have no grounds for suspicion, but you might have a gut
>> instinct. what do you do?
>>
> If you
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:44 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:20 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:09 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> >>
> >> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:30 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Matt Amos
> w
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:20 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:09 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>>
>> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:30 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>> >> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 3:43 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.c
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 8:09 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:30 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> >> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 3:43 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > What kind of duck test can you use to be sure that a
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 6:30 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
>> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 3:43 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> > What kind of duck test can you use to be sure that a derived database is
>> > involved in the process?
>>
>> if
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 4:13 PM, Matt Amos wrote:
> On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 3:43 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> > On what basis can you demand from company B that they release their
> > intermediate database? You don't know (for sure) that they have an
> > intermediate database. The ODbL d
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 3:43 PM, 80n <80n...@gmail.com> wrote:
> On what basis can you demand from company B that they release their
> intermediate database? You don't know (for sure) that they have an
> intermediate database. The ODbL doesn't give you any rights to ask company
> A to warrant tha
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> Hi,
>
> OdbL has this requirement where, if you publish a produced work
> based on a derived database, you also have to publish either
>
> (a) the derived database or
> (b) a "diff" allowing someone to arrive at the derived database if he
On Sat, Dec 12, 2009 at 12:07 PM, Frederik Ramm wrote:
> Hi,
>
>OdbL has this requirement where, if you publish a produced work
> based on a derived database, you also have to publish either
>
> (a) the derived database or
> (b) a "diff" allowing someone to arrive at the derived database if h
Hi,
OdbL has this requirement where, if you publish a produced work
based on a derived database, you also have to publish either
(a) the derived database or
(b) a "diff" allowing someone to arrive at the derived database if he
has the original, publicly available database or
(c) an algorith
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