Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-07 Thread Simon Poole
Am 06.05.2014 21:40, schrieb Rob Myers: On 05/05/14 09:16 AM, Simon Poole wrote: We have raised the question of Dynamic Data in a dedicated guideline given that a number of things are not so clear and even while, using the example from the guideline, the occupancy of a parking lot is an

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-07 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier
On 07/05/2014 08:20, Simon Poole wrote: [..] Does it depend on how the match OSM parking lot id - proprietary parking lot id is done ? In this thread, we have seen a few mentions of the implementation as the ultimate factor in discriminating the resulting database between derivative and

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-07 Thread Luis Villa
On Tue, May 6, 2014 at 11:20 PM, Simon Poole si...@poole.ch wrote: I hope we (as in the LWG) are not creating the impression that we are trying to assemble as many loop holes as possible, it is more identifying some of the edge cases and trying to document the community consensus on the

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-06 Thread Rob Myers
On 05/05/14 09:16 AM, Simon Poole wrote: We have raised the question of Dynamic Data in a dedicated guideline given that a number of things are not so clear and even while, using the example from the guideline, the occupancy of a parking lot is an observable fact it is questionable if we

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Simon Poole
Am 05.05.2014 06:38, schrieb Rob Myers: .. But the license doesn't exist to collect data for OSM. .. True, but our immediate, admittedly egoistic, interest is that we are free to use any improvements (in a wide sense of the word) to OSM data and that derivatives of OSM remain free.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-05-05 14:05 GMT+02:00 Tobias Knerr o...@tobias-knerr.de: *And share-alike only applies to what we collect.* Let me first say that this is a brilliantly clear way to put it. I like this a lot. I believe this is somehow more limiting than what we actually might want. E.g. we don't

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier
On 05/05/2014 16:32, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: 2014-05-05 14:05 GMT+02:00 Tobias Knerr o...@tobias-knerr.de mailto:o...@tobias-knerr.de: *And share-alike only applies to what we collect.* Let me first say that this is a brilliantly clear way to put it. I like this a lot.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Frederik Ramm
Hi, On 05.05.2014 16:39, Jean-Marc Liotier wrote: I believe this is somehow more limiting than what we actually might want. E.g. we don't collect traffic data, but if there was a company which used our data as basemap and associated average speeds for time spans to our graph (e.g.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier
On 05/05/2014 16:47, Frederik Ramm wrote: the use case sketched here went far beyond simply displaying an overlay; this use case was about snapping speed recordings to OSM street data to find out which street the recording was for in the first place, thereby creating a derivative database.

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Jean-Marc Liotier
On 05/05/2014 17:26, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: no, this was not about overlaying 2 graphical layers but about joining the data into one layer (necessary I guess, in order to perform routing). [..] Usage may be different, but the data is the same: ways with an hypothetical 'speed' attribute

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Martin Koppenhoefer
2014-05-05 17:42 GMT+02:00 Jean-Marc Liotier j...@liotier.org: Usage may be different, but the data is the same: ways with an hypothetical 'speed' attribute added to them in the persistent database of your choice. Whether you use that joined data to perform Dijkstra stunts or just render it

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Simon Poole
While I think the case of the traffic data is interesting, it really very much depends on implementation details if and when a derivative DB might be created. For example if weights were calculated from the data and associated directly with OSM ways then likely you would have a derivative DB,

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-05 Thread Michal Palenik
On Mon, May 05, 2014 at 05:42:37PM +0200, Jean-Marc Liotier wrote: On 05/05/2014 17:26, Martin Koppenhoefer wrote: no, this was not about overlaying 2 graphical layers but about joining the data into one layer (necessary I guess, in order to perform routing). [..] Usage may be different, but

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-04 Thread Rob Myers
On 03/05/14 08:51 AM, Michael Collinson wrote: Geocoding: So I have to share a patient's medical record because it is geocoded against OSM? Who with? Dynamic Data: So if I use OpenStreetMap car park location data, I have to share the real-time occupancy data? Who with? Algorithmic

[OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-03 Thread Michael Collinson
I've renamed the subject because it has gone way off topic, but I wanted to come back on Tobias' comment because it struck a chord and I would like to share a personal research topic. I am curious to evolve the idea further to see if there is any positive value. Open data is a different

Re: [OSM-legal-talk] The edges of share-alike on data Re: Attribution

2014-05-03 Thread Richard Weait
On Sat, May 3, 2014 at 11:51 AM, Michael Collinson m...@ayeltd.biz wrote: Open data is a different animal to software source code and highly-creative works and I suspect it will [be] a few more years yet until we understand it all fully. Sure. Of course, we are part of why it is a big deal