[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #26 from Mike Kaganski mikekagan...@hotmail.com --- *** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 38093 *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Michael Meeks michael.me...@collabora.com changed: What|Removed |Added CC||michael.me...@collabora.com --- Comment #22 from Michael Meeks michael.me...@collabora.com --- Urmas - I guess you're trying to stimulate our (perfectly capable) engineers to implement this by telling them they can't do it ;-) I suspect that is unlikely to work. I'd estimate that getting a basic Outline view hacked into the layout code is going to be a couple of man months of work - the problem is as always finding someone willing to donate / pay for that :-) Cougar - many thanks for your helpful series of screenshots / pieces on this. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #23 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- Thanks for chiming in Meeks. Do you think that it would be easy to make the navigator in content mode not collapse everything after one of the entries are moved? I read in the dev mailing list on the issue last year that Chris was willing to donate towards the feature, and wondered if he had done so. http://nabble.documentfoundation.org/http-openoffice-org-bugzilla-show-bug-cgi-id-3959-Outline-view-tp2637237p4027065.html (In reply to comment #22) I suspect that is unlikely to work. I'd estimate that getting a basic Outline view hacked into the layout code is going to be a couple of man months of work - the problem is as always finding someone willing to donate / pay for that :-) As a number of users have all expressed interest in this feature, including on the AOO thread https://issues.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=3959 , and are willing to donate towards its implementation (ex. Cougar, Chris), wouldnt it be a good idea to evaluate the costs of its implementation and then ask for donations. With that, we could easily show interested individuals how much it would cost and how long it would take for its implementation. Mathias Bauer has previously mentioned that the ground work for multiple layout work has already been done https://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Outline_view . -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #24 from Michael Meeks michael.me...@collabora.com --- I read in the dev mailing list on the issue last year that Chris was willing to donate towards the feature, and wondered if he had done so. When I say two man months as a ball-park; that is around Eur 50k; most I will pay for it ! claims that I've seen over time have been of the: Eur 50 ball-park ;-) without an efficient way of aggregating 1000x of these - that's not going to produce any useful result I think. Frustrating but ... that's how it is. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #25 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- Thanks for the answer. You have to excuse me as when i read 'couple of man months' i didnt think two, i thought two or more months. :) Will add your estimates to the main bug, so people visiting it will know the details. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #19 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Okay, Jay, I will look into Kingsoft Writer. From online reviews, I can't tell if it's sufficient. I'm still using MS Office 2003, and it works, but I've been submitting comments for a long time. I remember writing to Open Office in several ways in 2001. I used to use the name Don, but I no longer use it. I wasn't Bob. I've been interested in OO and LO because I felt that Open Source is a good thing. But it frustrates me to be forced to use a non-open source tool because the developers cannot understand the needs of professional users. I've shown outliner view to many people and have demonstrated it. Once they try it, they tend to be hooked. I think it's a powerful feature that makes gives any writer the capability of having super-powers as a writer. LibreOffice will never be a super product until it has such a super-powers feature. I think that the outliner would be more frequently used on any package if it were labeled Super-Powers View. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #20 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Hi, Jay, I've installed Kingsoft, and you're right. It allows me to continue using my superpowers through outline view. It does not allow me to use my macro superpowers, which means it's also an inadequate program, but macros are, to be fair, far less valuable and powerful than outline view. I'm going away, now. I'm going to stop trying to make LO into a powerful program. Developers here simply don't care about giving their users superpowers. Until MS no longer supports Office 2003, I have everything I need. Later, I'll have to reconfigure my work routine around Kingsoft, which at least provides me with my accustomed superpowers. Maybe by that time, they'll support macros. LO. I'm giving up on you. You're likely to remain substandard forever. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #21 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- Hi Cougar, I've been doing some research about the history of outline view in OO/LO and will be adding it to bug 38262. During that reading, i see how you can achieve outline view with the navigator dialog. All you have to do is set your regular text to one of the heading styles you are not using, i chose 'Heading 10', and then in the navigator dialog, click the 'content view' and then you'd be able to drag and drop items. Let me know what you think. Its not perfect, because when you drag an item, it closes all of the open entries, but i assume that would easier to fix than creating the outline view in the document. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|REOPENED|NEEDINFO Severity|normal |enhancement CC||philip...@hotmail.com Summary|EDITING: I'm still not |EDITING: Writer missing |going to use LibreOffice, |outline feature |because it's still lacking | |my most needed feature | --- Comment #3 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- Hi Cougar, Can you send in a sample document so that i can open it up in Word and see the outline feature that you wish to be added. I think LibreOffice does have an outline feature as can be seen at http://blog.worldlabel.com/2012/outlining-in-libreoffice-writer.html . -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #4 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- This link maybe helpful as well http://askubuntu.com/questions/187814/does-libreoffice-have-an-outline-view-similar-to-microsoft-2010 . You can access the navigator dialog by pressing F5. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Urmas davian...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|NEEDINFO|RESOLVED Resolution|--- |DUPLICATE --- Comment #5 from Urmas davian...@gmail.com --- There are no developers left who are qualified enough to make this kind of code changes. If you need that feature, you have to look elsewhere. *** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 38262 *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Cor Nouws c...@nouenoff.nl changed: What|Removed |Added CC||c...@nouenoff.nl --- Comment #6 from Cor Nouws c...@nouenoff.nl --- (In reply to comment #5) There are no developers left who are qualified enough to make this kind of code changes. If you need that feature, you have to look elsewhere. For the record: the above is a quite a misguided opinion. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #7 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101945 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101945action=edit Raw brainstorms, organized alphabetically This document contains my raw brainstorms, organized alphabetically and stripped of organizing features. This is in response to Jay Phillips request. Also coming are screen shots and a final pdf. Wait for them before evaluating. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #8 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101946 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101946action=edit Raw brainstorms, organized alphabetically, screen shot. This is simply so that after playing with the doc file you can still see the original lack of organization. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #9 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101947 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101947action=edit Step 2: Created initial headings for sorting in outline view Here's step two as a screen shot. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #10 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101948 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101948action=edit Step 3 as a screen shot. Collapsing a messy outline. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #11 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101950 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101950action=edit The entire document is organized and collapsed into outline sections by drag and drop. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #12 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101951 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101951action=edit Step 5: I've begun to edit and write, one section at a time. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #13 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- Created attachment 101952 -- https://bugs.freedesktop.org/attachment.cgi?id=101952action=edit The entire docoment, written and ready for the next step. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|RESOLVED|REOPENED Resolution|DUPLICATE |--- --- Comment #14 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- I've just added the various steps along the way, including the final document as a pdf, which I produced in three hours. I'm not fast enough to do this five page document in three hours without the outliner as demonstrated in the screenshots. This is not a document that I will use. I wrote it for demonstration purposes. I have more thinking to do before turning it into an app with JS. I may be months away from that. I'm not a good enough programmer to produce device ready apps yet. What I produce can only be viewed on a computer. Here's an example of an app I wrote which uses chi energy for Conscious Evolution: http://www.grokwisdom.org/apps/boosting.php Nonetheless, this is an example of a final destination for my writing. I have so much work to do on the various elements of my project that I can't waste time trying to write stuff using LibreOffice, when I need an outliner to produce material quickly. I believe that producing the attached five page document without an outliner would have taken me six to eight hours, rather than the three I took with Word. What I need as a writer is the same as a developer asking for an IDE for efficient programming. What you offer me as a writer is the equivalent to giving me WordPad. Until you create a tool that works efficiently, and allows me to bang out a five-page doc in three hours, I consider it substandard. I can't use it for my work. I'm too busy to waste time trying to monkey around with it. For me, it's just a waste of time to use LibreOffice. Like I said, my attached pdf doc is not ready to become an app. I was still in the brainstorming, research phase while working on other things. This pdf doc was in the pipeline, but I decided to take it to this next step to provide Jay Phillips with the sample doc he wanted, as well as screen shots that show how I use an outliner to produce the final pdf in three short hours. Even if this feature request is a duplicate, I'm reopening it to provide the information that Jay requested and to emphasize that you've been marking such requests as duplicates and then ignoring them for years. This means that for me, your product IS LITERALLY UNUSABLE. DO I HAVE SOMEONE'S ATTENTION YET? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 Urmas davian...@gmail.com changed: What|Removed |Added Status|REOPENED|RESOLVED Resolution|--- |DUPLICATE --- Comment #15 from Urmas davian...@gmail.com --- I'm afraid people are not interested what apps you use (or don't use). LibreOffice is provided as-is, and if it is inadequate to your tasks, you are free to look for an alternative elsewhere. *** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 38262 *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #16 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- Hi Cougar, Thanks for the document and the sample screenshots. I was able to see how outline worked (you learn something everyday right) and tested it in Word 2013 and Kingsoft Writer. While reading over at http://askubuntu.com/questions/187814/does-libreoffice-have-an-outline-view-similar-to-microsoft-2010 , i noticed they linked to bug 68167, which was opened by someone approximately a year ago regarding the same feature and was also closed as a duplicate of bug 38262. Bug 38262 has been around for the last 3 years, since the days of LibreOffice 3.5, and unfortunately nothing has happened on it as yet. I would encourage you to visit that bug report and mention that this feature is important to you as a writer and i hope that one of these days it will be looked into. LibreOffice functions on donations and volunteers, so unfortunately it cant please everyone's needs. I am a volunteer myself and have spent over 10 hours each day for the last month to help improve LibreOffice. I hope that you will consider donating to LibreOffice, as only with money being spent on developers to work on LibreOffice, can more features be constantly added to it. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #17 from Cougar Brenneman couga...@gmail.com --- I actually have mentioned my needs on both of those other feature requests, and my typical experience is that developers are so uninterested in what I need as a writer that they don't even read. Urmas' reply indicates that thinks I was writing about apps I use, rather than apps I write. He clearly didn't pay attention. Of course he's going to dismiss everything I write before even reading it. He made a wrong judgment about me, and there's no communication in a situation like that. I've explained in detail how an outliner facilitates writing in all three feature requests that you mentioned, and how it's not something that can be used in addition to the word processor one uses. It has to be part of the word processor, or the word processor is useless. NO, I will not donate to a product that I CAN'T use for my writing. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
[Libreoffice-bugs] [Bug 80640] EDITING: Writer missing outline feature
https://bugs.freedesktop.org/show_bug.cgi?id=80640 --- Comment #18 from Jay Philips philip...@hotmail.com --- I looked through the list of comments in bug 38262, but didnt see any in your name or are you 'Bob' of comment 12. Well if you want a freeware word processor that has this feature, you can try out Kingsoft Writer. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are the assignee for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-bugs mailing list Libreoffice-bugs@lists.freedesktop.org http://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-bugs
