[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 Heiko Tietze changed: What|Removed |Added Keywords|needsUXEval | CC|libreoffice-ux-advise@lists |tietze.he...@gmail.com |.freedesktop.org| --- Comment #56 from Heiko Tietze --- Paul's comment 55 sounds like the best compromise here. Everything that is a style is taken from the template and gets updated when the template changes. All other features such as fields, shapes, or images are ignored. Sounds very much like the experimental document theme and why should both do the same? -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #55 from Paul --- Hi guys, This is an important feature for me. IIUC, there seems to be some controversy over what changing the underlying document template should do. The current LO scheme, of asking to update Styles only, is to my mind the correct one. Content built into a template is never written over an existing document, only styles are. So then, what's the need of changing the underlying template? So that a document's styles can stay synced with a template of choice. The current problem comes when a document is radically changed. For instance, I recently took a long document and changed it from a normal 8.5x11 page to a 2-up 5.5x8.5 mirrored book format, and chose an inverted color scheme for readability. Virtually all the styles were affected, and now I dare not sync that document to its original template, which it is stuck with. I want to assign a "graybook" template to it, but cannot. Any improvements I make to my graybook template cannot be carried over to any document not bearing its formal lineage. The alternative, I guess, would be to copy/paste all document contents to a blank "graybook" document and resave, but I'm not sure all content, such as foot/endnotes, would make the transition. Something that radical, IMO, should not be necessary. So the issue of changing templates, in my mind, is about Styles, and nothing more. Themes is a related but subtly different concept, whereby a document's text styles can be quickly changed, with visual feedback on the fly, without affecting page settings. We can approximate this by use of different templates, but Themes makes the function much more accessible, IME. My vote would be that this is core functionality. It could be done in several ways, but I think the most intuitive would be at the Manage Templates dialog, where an "Apply Template to Current Document" command could be added. BW -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #54 from Cor Nouws --- Thanks for your summary, Thomas, (In reply to Thomas Lendo from comment #53) > Misunderstandings > - > Second hope is that nobody closes this long-standing issue without knowing > what the extension already did and does (I assume that because of the ... In general the "I don't get this issue and don't need it, so close the issue"-rate is very low here :) > additionally: The original author has no interest in the extension anymore. ... For me it is marked as (possibly) todo. > MSO > --- > I tested MSO Word 2013 and only styles (paragraph, character, list and > table) will be imported or updated. No page content, no page (style) ... Which is logic. MsOffice doesn't have page styles (poor users), and those and content of the page styles (such as images in headers) is therefore not imported. > UI > -- > What design team should discuss at a starting point is where should the > template/style association can be edited in the GUI. (See last sentence in > comment 49 or comment 52 or last point in comment 42.) Good idea. IMO. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #53 from Thomas Lendo --- I haven't said much in the design meeting yesterday as all was said in this long bug report. I hope Stuart will read the comments and maybe test the extension so that we have another opinion. Misunderstandings - Second hope is that nobody closes this long-standing issue without knowing what the extension already did and does (I assume that because of the comments that were made) and what good help it is for current extension users. I explained the problems with the extension in comment 42. And additionally: The original author has no interest in the extension anymore. Naming/scope Third, I wouldn't attach importance to the wording "template". Template, style, document theme--nothing but smoke and mirrors. Precisely the extension is more a "styles changer" based on a specific template file. That's wanted as core feature in LO. (I don't know what the extension does, someone who can read the code should evaluate that.) MSO --- I tested MSO Word 2013 and only styles (paragraph, character, list and table) will be imported or updated. No page content, no page (style) definitions, no pictures, no frames, no objects, no fields, no header data, no footer data, no file properties (like title or company) will be changed or touched. UI -- What design team should discuss at a starting point is where should the template/style association can be edited in the GUI. (See last sentence in comment 49 or comment 52 or last point in comment 42.) -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #52 from Jon Grossart --- Most of the functionality to implement this enhancement are already present. 1. if a template is updated, LibreOffice already asks if you want to update the styles when you open a document based on it 2. there is already code to manually load/update styles. What would be needed in the GUI to allow someone to change the associated template and the code to call the exist code to update the styles (which could probably even be a force close/reopen since that code path already does that in some way). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #50 from Cor Nouws --- a template changes that does not have the ability/function to change the linked template is a bad idea. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #51 from Cor Nouws --- (In reply to Cor Nouws from comment #50) > a template changes that does not have the ability/function to change the > linked template is a bad idea. a template changes => a template changer -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #49 from Thomas Lendo --- (In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #43) > * Feature: Do we really want this workflow? Should document and template be > linked so that changes to the template become effective later? As Pierre C said in comment 45 and Patrick Smits in comment 47, the current workflow with the extension is sufficient and need not to be changed. Please test the extension and you will see. For a developer, the extension can be the reference. > * Scope: How about textboxes, containing the company address for instance? > We can start with a basic set of course. As far as I know, textboxes and other objects are not in the scope of the extension. I wouldn't extend the scope of the feature by now. It worked very well till now. > * Workflow: How do we edit the template? We could ask the user whether a > template should be opened and edited as it or applied to the current > document. Alternatively an extra command "Apply template" could be better. > The integration into the template manager is unclear. As Patrick Smits said in comment 47, nothing has to be changed in the template manager or in the workflow with linked files. You can edit a template with the template manager. Editing the template always opens the current template available in the template manager. The only new that has to be implemented is the place where the link to a template can be applied or changed or deleted (as I said in the last point in my comment 42). -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #48 from Patrick Smits --- Created attachment 139112 --> https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/attachment.cgi?id=139112&action=edit LibreOffice already asks whether styles should be updated -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #47 from Patrick Smits --- (In reply to Heiko Tietze from comment #43) > * Feature: Do we really want this workflow? Should document and template be > linked so that changes to the template become effective later? I a new file is derived from a template (via the File > Templates > Manage Templates menu of File > New > Templates menu), the file is already linked to the template. This can be checked via File > Properties > General > Template. So nothing new here. > * Scope: How about textboxes, containing the company address for instance? > We can start with a basic set of course. Templates are all about standardization, not just styles, but also headers, footers, text boxes etc. To get a good impression about what should be included, please check https://templates.office.com > * Workflow: How do we edit the template? We could ask the user whether a > template should be opened and edited as it or applied to the current > document. Alternatively an extra command "Apply template" could be better. > The integration into the template manager is unclear. Templates can be edited via Manage Templates. Click right on a template and select Edit. If a template is edited and a linked file is opened LibreOffice already asks whether styles should be updated. See attachment. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #46 from Patrick Smits --- (In reply to Thomas Lendo from comment #42) > Since "Template Changer" at LibO's extension website isn't working as > intended (because 1) it doesn't link or change the template link that is > visible in File > Properties... > General > Template, 2) you got an error > and some styles are not updated and 3) the updated extension version 1.2.7d > isn't available officially) Hi Thomas, Version 1.2.7d is available at https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=60592#c16. Today I tried to make 1.2.7c and d available at the Extensions repository, but I couldn't find a way to add it to https://extensions.libreoffice.org/extensions/template-changer. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #45 from Pierre C --- >* Feature: Do we really want this workflow? Should document and template be >linked so that changes to the template become effective later? This is the current behaviour ! If you use a template, the new document created with this template is linked to it ? each modification of the template will be propagated to your document when you open it and you answer yes when UI ask you so. Anyone want to break this feature ? 16 user folows this bug. Template changer was one of the most used extension (now its broken since LO 4) It is also a feature request for AOO (https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=52783) with 18 votes. This feature exists in M$ office for ages Yes, I think it's a "must have" for advanced users -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #44 from Heiko Tietze --- *** Bug 89286 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. *** -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 --- Comment #43 from Heiko Tietze --- To summarize the discussion: It's requested to change the document appearance beyond just styles (c35) via template for Writer and Impress (c39). Additionally, some comments request also that changing the template later should affect the document (c36). There is an extension as workaround (c14). (In reply to Thomas Lendo from comment #42) > What a solution should be able to do: > - Loading of styles that are part of a template file (can also be done with > "Styles & Formatting" sidebar > Load styles...). > - Loading of header/footer that are part of a template file (cf. > https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=94360). > - Loading of macros that are part of a template file. > - Updating the tag in meta.xml. > - Possibility to change the template via file menu and/or file properties > dialog with a simple file explorer search window. Good start, and some questions: * Feature: Do we really want this workflow? Should document and template be linked so that changes to the template become effective later? * Scope: How about textboxes, containing the company address for instance? We can start with a basic set of course. * Workflow: How do we edit the template? We could ask the user whether a template should be opened and edited as it or applied to the current document. Alternatively an extra command "Apply template" could be better. The integration into the template manager is unclear. PS: I tagged all not utterly needed comments with no-value to improve the readability of this ticket; don't take this as any valuation. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 Adolfo Jayme changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks|111990 | Referenced Bugs: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=111990 [Bug 111990] UX and enhancement issues favored by Thomas.Lendo -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 Thomas Lendo changed: What|Removed |Added Blocks||111990 Referenced Bugs: https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=111990 [Bug 111990] UX and enhancements enhancement issues favored by Thomas.Lendo -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise
[Libreoffice-ux-advise] [Bug 50699] Template Changer: Allow ability to change a document' s associated template
https://bugs.documentfoundation.org/show_bug.cgi?id=50699 Thomas Lendo changed: What|Removed |Added CC||libreoffice-ux-advise@lists ||.freedesktop.org --- Comment #42 from Thomas Lendo --- Since "Template Changer" at LibO's extension website isn't working as intended (because 1) it doesn't link or change the template link that is visible in File > Properties... > General > Template, 2) you got an error and some styles are not updated and 3) the updated extension version 1.2.7d isn't available officially), it's no argument anymore that an extension instead of a built-in solution for the need described in this bug is the right way. (That is what I hear when talking about Template Changer with others in the community.) What a solution should be able to do: - Loading of styles that are part of a template file (can also be done with "Styles & Formatting" sidebar > Load styles...). - Loading of header/footer that are part of a template file (cf. https://bz.apache.org/ooo/show_bug.cgi?id=94360). - Loading of macros that are part of a template file. - Updating the tag in meta.xml. - Possibility to change the template via file menu and/or file properties dialog with a simple file explorer search window. -- You are receiving this mail because: You are on the CC list for the bug. ___ Libreoffice-ux-advise mailing list Libreoffice-ux-advise@lists.freedesktop.org https://lists.freedesktop.org/mailman/listinfo/libreoffice-ux-advise