Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Gervase Markham
On 30/01/13 06:25, Prashant Shah wrote: Is there any better way to handle changes made by any derivative works rather than using the following sentence. You must cause any modified files to carry prominent notices stating that You changed the files What do you mean by handle? If you are

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread David Woolley
Gervase Markham wrote: If you are writing a license, please don't include a line like this. Depending on how you interpret it, it's either ineffective (because the next person can simply remove your notices as part of their change) or a pain in the behind (as your file fills up with notices

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 3:33 PM, Gervase Markham g...@mozilla.org wrote: The days of tracking code provenance via in-file comments are gone. And they are not missed IMO. Thats the exact problem with few licenses I know of. Apache - You must cause any modified files to carry prominent

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread David Woolley
Prashant Shah wrote: Is there any license out there that puts it in a better way ? You keep repeating the question without explaining what is wrong with the existing clauses. In the case of GPL one is it mainly meeting the minimum requirements for establishing the copyright status of

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 12:29 AM, Ben Reser b...@reser.org wrote: Still not sure what objective you are trying to serve. By saying the copyright point of view do you mean you just want to keep track of the copyright owners? I'm going to assume that is what you mean for the rest of this

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 4:07 PM, David Woolley for...@david-woolley.me.uk wrote: You keep repeating the question without explaining what is wrong with the existing clauses. For lots of small modifications made by many developers over a long period of time - it will be really hard to keep

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Gervase Markham
On 31/01/13 10:20, David Woolley wrote: The purpose of such clauses is not to track the provenance, but to maintain the purity of the official version, so that forks cannot be passed off as approved versions. This sort of protection is the domain of trademark law, not copyright law.

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Gervase Markham
On 31/01/13 10:37, David Woolley wrote: In the case of GPL one is it mainly meeting the minimum requirements for establishing the copyright status of the file when used outside of the original application. Such re-use is fundamental to the GPL concept, even if many open source developers only

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Gervase Markham
On 31/01/13 10:42, Prashant Shah wrote: Main objective is to keep track of the copyright owners / authors of modifications that are made in a work that is _redistributed_ in source form. So those who receive this new redistributed work know what and who made the modifications. Why do they

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, You keep repeating the question without explaining what is wrong with the existing clauses. I get your point. Although there is nothing wrong with it and it works when the modifications are significant. Its just hard to maintain it in source files where there are lots of minor

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 4:16 PM, Gervase Markham g...@mozilla.org wrote: Unless you collect copyright assignments, you should assume that re-licensing _anything_ will be difficult in the future, in-file comments or not. Even if you have such comments, you cannot assume they are accurate,

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread David Woolley
Gervase Markham wrote: On 31/01/13 10:37, David Woolley wrote: In the case of GPL one is it mainly meeting the minimum requirements for establishing the copyright status of the file when used outside of the original application. Such re-use is fundamental to the GPL concept, even if many open

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Gervase Markham
On 31/01/13 12:48, David Woolley wrote: Particularly with the GPL, many people don't really understand what they are doing when they use it. They may not even have the right to grant the licence. One case may be that is is actually work for hire. Another real case is that someone used source

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Ben Reser
On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 2:46 AM, Gervase Markham g...@mozilla.org wrote: On 31/01/13 10:37, David Woolley wrote: In the case of GPL one is it mainly meeting the minimum requirements for establishing the copyright status of the file when used outside of the original application. Such re-use is

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Ben Reser
On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 2:48 AM, Prashant Shah pshah.mum...@gmail.com wrote: I get your point. Although there is nothing wrong with it and it works when the modifications are significant. Its just hard to maintain it in source files where there are lots of minor modifications. (eg : linux

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Prashant Shah
Hi, I didn't mention this previously but Apache license has a clause if the work is submitted back to inclusion it has to be under the same license. Submission of Contributions. Unless You explicitly state otherwise, any Contribution intentionally submitted for inclusion in the Work by You to

Re: [License-discuss] Changes made by derivative works

2013-01-31 Thread Ben Reser
On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 9:48 PM, Prashant Shah pshah.mum...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 8:13 AM, Ben Reser b...@reser.org wrote: I didn't mention this previously but Apache license has a clause if the work is submitted back to inclusion it has to be under the same license. Yes it