[License-discuss] License Committee Report - 2013-03-06

2013-03-06 Thread Luis Villa
[After an absence of some time, the board has asked me to resurrect
the formal license committee reports. This is the first one. Comments
and suggestions on format, content, etc. are welcome.]

This email is my report for licenses currently submitted to the OSI.
If anybody disagrees with my assessment of the list's comments or
conclusions, please say so within the next week.

CeCILL 2.1


Submission: 
http://projects.opensource.org/pipermail/license-review/2012-May/000414.html

Comments: Several clarifying questions were asked, indicating the
license had been read, but no list members challenged the OSD
compliance of the license itself.

Recommend: Approval

Thanks-
Luis
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Adaptive Public License Re: License Committee Report v2

2004-04-15 Thread Ernest Prabhakar
On Apr 14, 2004, at 11:26 PM, Russell Nelson wrote:
Unfortunately, even after two tries there have been insufficient
comments on the Adaptive Public License.  Maybe the third's the charm?
Title:  Adaptive Public License
Submission:   
http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:6913:200305: 
bogcdnbbhnfbgpdeahob
License:  http://www.mamook.net/APL.html
So, I'm curious what the OSI position is on "model licenses" like this.  
  Does having a semi-modular license like this actually simplify the  
task of OSI approval?  Or is it easier to let people modify their own  
licenses as they see fit?

I think the reason there's few opinions is that it is so darn  
complicated (even by Open Source standards!). The most complicated part  
is that I can't tell whether the license terms are *always* fixed for a  
given Initial Work.  Could the author perhaps clarify that?  It also  
might help if the author could summarize:
- which clauses are relevant to OSI certification
- which clauses are different from existing OSI licenses
- the patent philosophy (which I couldn't parse)

-- Ernie P.
IANAL, TINLA, etc. etc.
FWIW, here's some of what I see as the most relevant sections, but the  
list isn't exhaustive.

1.7. "INDEPENDENT MODULE" means a  separate module of software and/or  
data that is not a derivative work  of or copied from the Licensed Work  
or any portion thereof. In addition,  a module does not qualify as an  
Independent Module but instead forms  part of the Licensed Work if the  
module: (a) is embedded in the Licensed  Work; (b) is included by  
reference in the Licensed Work other than by  a function call or a  
class reference; or (c) must be included or contained,  in whole or in  
part, within a file directory or subdirectory actually  containing  
files making up the Licensed Work.

1.18. "SUBSEQUENT WORK" means a work  that has resulted or arises from  
changes to and/or additions to:
 (a) the Initial Work;
 (b) any other Subsequent Work; or
 (c) to any combination of the Initial Work and any such other   
Subsequent Work;

 where such changes and/or additions originate from a Subsequent  
Contributor.  A Subsequent Work will "originate" from a Subsequent  
Contributor if  the Subsequent Work was a result of efforts by such  
Subsequent Contributor  (or anyone acting on such Subsequent  
Contributor's behalf, such as,  a contractor or other entity that is  
engaged by or under the direction  of the Subsequent Contributor). For  
greater certainty, a Subsequent  Work expressly excludes and shall not  
capture within its meaning any  Independent Module.

3.6. INDEPENDENT MODULES.
 This License shall not apply to Independent Modules of any Initial   
Contributor, Subsequent Contributor, Distributor or any Recipient, and   
such Independent Modules may be licensed or made available under one   
or more separate license agreements.

 3.7. LARGER WORKS.
 Any Distributor or Recipient may create or contribute to a Larger Work  
 by combining any of the Licensed Work with other code not governed by   
the terms of this License, and may distribute the Larger Work as one   
or more products. However, in any such case, Distributor or Recipient   
(as the case may be) must make sure that the requirements of this  
License  are fulfilled for the Licensed Work portion of the Larger  
Work.

(b) The Initial Contributor may at any time introduce requirements  or  
add to or change earlier requirements (in each case, the "EARLIER   
DESCRIPTION REQUIREMENTS") for documenting changes resulting  in  
Subsequent Works by revising Part 1 of each copy  of the Supplement  
File distributed by the Initial Contributor with  future copies of the  
Licensed Work so that Part 1  then contains new requirements (the "NEW  
DESCRIPTION REQUIREMENTS")  for documenting such changes.

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License Committee Report v2

2004-04-14 Thread Russell Nelson
[ note the addition of the Adaptive Public License at the end.  There
have STILL not been sufficient comments on the Adaptive Public
License.  -russ ]

I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
promptly.

--

Restricts license termination to only if the original work is alleged
to infringe a patent.

Title: OSL/AFL version 2.1 submitted for approval
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:8002:fdhkogbdmecjfdifioea
License: www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1.html
License: www.rosenlaw.com/afl2.1.html
Comments:
  John Cowan gives it the thumbs up with no comments.
  The redline is at   www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1-redline.pdf
Recommend: approval.

--

There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
in the United States.

Title: NASA Open Source Agreement (NOSA) version 1.3
Original Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm
Re-Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7999:ieccombmcpkdjmpppfil
License: 
http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Agreement_1.3.txt
Comments:
  John Cowan did a complete re-review of it and found that the
  previous concerns had been addressed.
Recommend: approval.

--

The author wants to control software which is merely written to work
in conjunction with this software.

Title: Open Project Public License (OPPL) 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7926:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
License: http://nextco.net/~matti/awaiting_approval.htm
Comments:
  John Cowan is not enthusiastic about it.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7981:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
  Neither is Alex Rousskov.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7983:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
Recommend: turn it down.

--

Title: Eclipse Public License - v 1.0 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7933:okcnnifeagbhadopkkoe
License: http://www.eclipse.org/org/documents/epl-v10.html
Comments:
  Ernie and Rod both point out that since the only change is removing
the patent termination, that that doesn't affect its compliance
with OSD.
Recommend: approval.

--

Unfortunately, even after two tries there have been insufficient
comments on the Adaptive Public License.  Maybe the third's the charm?

Title:  Adaptive Public License
Submission:  
http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:6913:200305:bogcdnbbhnfbgpdeahob
License:  http://www.mamook.net/APL.html

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Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | way to eat spinach?  Or a
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | bad way to eat ice cream?
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Re: License Committee Report

2004-04-14 Thread Carmen Leeming
Hi Russell.  I am still hoping to get approval for the Adaptive Public 
License. I have attached our follow-up from the last License Committee 
Report.
--Carmen Leeming

Carmen Leeming writes:
> Title:  Adaptive Public License
> Submission:  
> http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:6913:200305:bogcdnbbhnfbgpdeahob
> License:  http://www.mamook.net/APL.html
> 
> This license was submitted in May 2003.  I checked in June to make sure 
> that the license had entered the submission process, and received a 
> reply indicating that it was received and was currently under review.  I 
> wrote again in November and never heard back.

Sorry, your license fell through the cracks.  I have no automated
system for tracking license approvals.  On a quick reading, I don't
see any problem with it.
May I suggest that the CUA Public License use a particular form of the
Adaptive Public License instead?
-- --My blog is at angry-economist.russnelson.com | Coding in Python 
Crynwr sells support for free software | PGPok | is like 521 Pleasant 
Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | sucking on sugar. Potsdam, NY 
13676-3213 | +1 315 268 9201 FAX | Sweet! -- license-discuss archive 
is at http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3



Russell Nelson wrote:

I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
promptly.
--

Restricts license termination to only if the original work is alleged
to infringe a patent.
Title: OSL/AFL version 2.1 submitted for approval
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:8002:fdhkogbdmecjfdifioea
License: www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1.html
License: www.rosenlaw.com/afl2.1.html
Comments:
 John Cowan gives it the thumbs up with no comments.
 The redline is at   www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1-redline.pdf
Recommend: approval.
--

There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
in the United States.
Title: NASA Open Source Agreement (NOSA) version 1.3
Original Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm
Re-Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7999:ieccombmcpkdjmpppfil
License: 
http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Agreement_1.3.txt
Comments:
 John Cowan did a complete re-review of it and found that the
 previous concerns had been addressed.
Recommend: approval.
--

The author wants to control software which is merely written to work
in conjunction with this software.
Title: Open Project Public License (OPPL) 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7926:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
License: http://nextco.net/~matti/awaiting_approval.htm
Comments:
 John Cowan is not enthusiastic about it.
   http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7981:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
 Neither is Alex Rousskov.
   http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7983:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
Recommend: turn it down.

--

Title: Eclipse Public License - v 1.0 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7933:okcnnifeagbhadopkkoe
License: http://www.eclipse.org/org/documents/epl-v10.html
Comments:
 Ernie and Rod both point out that since the only change is removing
   the patent termination, that that doesn't affect its compliance
   with OSD.
Recommend: approval.

 

--
license-discuss archive is at http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3


RE: License Committee Report

2004-04-14 Thread =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Rod=20Dixon=2C=20J=2ED=2E=2C=20LL=2EM=2E?=
For the record, I may have inadvertently submitted my comments and recommendation for 
approval of the OSL/AFL version 2.1 only to Larry offlist. Sorry.

-Rod


-Original Message-
From:  Russell Nelson
Date:  4/14/04 5:47 pm
To:  [EMAIL PROTECTED],  [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Subj:  License Committee Report

I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
promptly.

--

Restricts license termination to only if the original work is alleged
to infringe a patent.

Title: OSL/AFL version 2.1 submitted for approval
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:8002:fdhkogbdmecjfdifioea
License: www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1.html
License: www.rosenlaw.com/afl2.1.html
Comments:
  John Cowan gives it the thumbs up with no comments.
  The redline is at   www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1-redline.pdf
Recommend: approval.

--

There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
in the United States.

Title: NASA Open Source Agreement (NOSA) version 1.3
Original Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljjm
Re-Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7999:ieccombmcpkdjmpppfil
License: 
http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Aggreement_1.3.txt
Comments:
  John Cowan did a complete re-review of it and found that the
  previous concerns had been addressed.
Recommend: approval.

--

The author wants to control software which is merely written to work
in conjunction with this software.

Title: Open Project Public License (OPPL)
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7926:200403:flibooikigifnhkcicllb
License: http://nextco.net/~matti/awaiting_approval.htm
Comments:
  John Cowan is not enthusiastic about it.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7981:200403:flibooikigifnhkcicllb
  Neither is Alex Rousskov.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7983:200403:flibooikigifnhkcicllb
Recommend: turn it down.

--

Title: Eclipse Public License - v 1.0
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7933:okcnnifeagbhadopkkoe
License: http://www.eclipse.org/org/documents/epl-v10.html
Comments:
  Ernie and Rod both point out that since the only change is removing
the patent termination, that that doesn't affect its compliance
with OSD.
Recommend: approval.

--
--My blog is at angry-economist.russnelson.com  | Spinach ala mode -- a good
Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | way to eat spinach?  Or a
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | bad way to eat ice  cream?
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | FWD# 404529 via VOIP  |
--
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--
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License Committee Report

2004-04-14 Thread Russell Nelson
I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
promptly.

--

Restricts license termination to only if the original work is alleged
to infringe a patent.

Title: OSL/AFL version 2.1 submitted for approval
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:8002:fdhkogbdmecjfdifioea
License: www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1.html
License: www.rosenlaw.com/afl2.1.html
Comments:
  John Cowan gives it the thumbs up with no comments.
  The redline is at   www.rosenlaw.com/osl2.1-redline.pdf
Recommend: approval.

--

There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
in the United States.

Title: NASA Open Source Agreement (NOSA) version 1.3
Original Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm
Re-Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7999:ieccombmcpkdjmpppfil
License: 
http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Agreement_1.3.txt
Comments:
  John Cowan did a complete re-review of it and found that the
  previous concerns had been addressed.
Recommend: approval.

--

The author wants to control software which is merely written to work
in conjunction with this software.

Title: Open Project Public License (OPPL) 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7926:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
License: http://nextco.net/~matti/awaiting_approval.htm
Comments:
  John Cowan is not enthusiastic about it.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7981:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
  Neither is Alex Rousskov.
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7983:200403:flibooikigifnhkciclb
Recommend: turn it down.

--

Title: Eclipse Public License - v 1.0 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7933:okcnnifeagbhadopkkoe
License: http://www.eclipse.org/org/documents/epl-v10.html
Comments:
  Ernie and Rod both point out that since the only change is removing
the patent termination, that that doesn't affect its compliance
with OSD.
Recommend: approval.

-- 
--My blog is at angry-economist.russnelson.com  | Spinach ala mode -- a good
Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | way to eat spinach?  Or a
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | bad way to eat ice cream?
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | FWD# 404529 via VOIP  | 
--
license-discuss archive is at http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3


Re: License Committee report

2004-02-22 Thread Russell Nelson
[EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
 > I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
 > for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
 > disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
 > promptly.

The board voted on Thursday afternoon to accept the committee's
recommendations.  Thanks to everyone who commented on various
licenses.  In particular, I want to single out (in no particular
order) John Cowen, Ernie Prabhakar, Larry Rosen, Brian Behlendorf and
Rod Dixon for extra thanks for their years of active participation.

Hrm.  Can you really single out five people?  Wouldn't you have to
pentuple them out?

-- 
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Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | is like
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | sucking on sugar.
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | +1 315 268 9201 FAX   | Sweet!
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-21 Thread Ben Reser
On Tue, Feb 17, 2004 at 08:20:49PM -0500, Russell Nelson wrote:

> There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
> software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
> in the United States.
> 
> The only serious concern that I can see is that the license requires
> the recipient to indemnify the Government of the United States against
> third party lawsuits.

I disagree.  I raised two potentially problems that I saw with the
license where it had vageness issues that could cause it to not meet the
OSD.  See:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7720:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm

I think the mere aggregation problem I raised is probably the clearest
of the issues.

I don't think either of these issues are by intent.  I think they're on
accident and some minor modifications could fix them.


> Title: NASA Open Source Agreement Version 1.1
> Submission: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm
> License: 
> http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Agreement_1.1.txt
> Comments: ongoing as of this writing.
> Recommend: more discussion.


-- 
Ben Reser <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
http://ben.reser.org

"Conscience is the inner voice which warns us somebody may be looking."
- H.L. Mencken
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-19 Thread James William Pye
Just to precede my statements with a warning that they are as it seems to
me. I am not a lawyer, so my opinions could use any [dis|]qualifications.

On 02/17/04:07/2, Zooko O'Whielacronx wrote:
> Does the Fair License require the software developer who uses such licensed 
> source code to inform his users (i.e. at runtime or in documentation) about the 
> existence of the Fair License?

Yes, but the choice of method is ultimately left to the author and later
"forwarded" to the user. So not specifically at runtime or in
documentation.

I had concerns with that wording. I felt that 'notify' was a fine term to
help enforce a goal of Due Credit(attribution).  Although, my purpose was
not so much as to require a user to force the instrument in another user's
face, but rather to keep the creator of a derivative work from hiding the
instrument to obfuscate the origins of the original works to help his/her
profits. Of course, intention doesn't quite always map to effect, so I plan
to give this more thought in the future.  Another concern would be from the
other side. For instance, a litigious developer that claims works based on
his/her works did not provide a proper method of instrument notification.

The license does not specify the method of instrument notification, so I
think that leaving that ambiguity *might* imply that the method of
notification should be similarly conspicuous to the method that the author
implemented in his/her original works. Well, I think that would be the
safest way for the user.

---
I was thinking about this while I was writing this response, perhaps
something along the lines of: ...any entity that uses the works is notified
of this instrument by a method that is leastwise conspicuous as the method
implemented within the original works...

I think such an addition may help clarity, but is probably unnecessary from
both views, and potentially harmful in a case where an odd developer deems
it necessary to smother his users with copyright/license notifications.
Such a case would be more like advertising than mere notification.
---

> Another thing I don't understand is if the "let's not proliferate substantially
> similar licenses" reasoning should not also apply to the approval of the Fair
> License.

I was unsure of this myself. I think the main distinction between my
license and most open source licenses is that most open source license
specify the license as covering "source", "source code" or distribution,
which I felt may be too specific for my some of my usage. 'Works' seems
more appropriate to me; although, I'm not sure if it would make a
significant difference if it were ever brought under serious scrutiny.
 
Regards,
James William Pye


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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-19 Thread James William Pye
On 02/17/04:07/2, Russell Nelson wrote:
> This must surely be the shortest open source license ever!  Still, we
> should send it back to the author because he uses the hated word
> "utilize".  Don't use utilize!  Utilize "use" instead.  Means the same
> thing and avoids a phony formality.
> 
> Title: Fair License
> Submission: 
>   Original: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7623:hhkgifnkgiiejnigaakm
>   Revised: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7623:200401:hhkgifnkgiiejnigaakm
> Comments: none
> Recommend: remanding.

Thanks for the report and the information about "utilization". I've sent
the remanded version to license-approval, and I've included it in this
message as well.

---LICENSE---
Usage of the works is permitted provided that this
instrument is retained with the works, so that any entity
that uses the works is notified of this instrument.

DISCLAIMER: THE WORKS ARE WITHOUT WARRANTY.

[2004, Fair License; rhid.com/fair]
---LICENSE---

Regards,
James William Pye


pgp0.pgp
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-18 Thread Russell Nelson
Carmen Leeming writes:
 > Title:  Adaptive Public License
 > Submission:  
 > http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:6913:200305:bogcdnbbhnfbgpdeahob
 > License:  http://www.mamook.net/APL.html
 > 
 > This license was submitted in May 2003.  I checked in June to make sure 
 > that the license had entered the submission process, and received a 
 > reply indicating that it was received and was currently under review.  I 
 > wrote again in November and never heard back.

Sorry, your license fell through the cracks.  I have no automated
system for tracking license approvals.  On a quick reading, I don't
see any problem with it.

May I suggest that the CUA Public License use a particular form of the
Adaptive Public License instead?

-- 
--My blog is at angry-economist.russnelson.com  | Coding in Python
Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | is like
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | sucking on sugar.
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | +1 315 268 9201 FAX   | Sweet!
--
license-discuss archive is at http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3


Re: License Committee report

2004-02-18 Thread Russell Nelson
Zooko O'Whielacronx writes:

 > So if I understand correctly, the Simple Permissive License and the
 > (ideally edited) Fair License both pass the litmus test of OSD.  In
 > addition to approving licenses which meet the OSD, the OSI also
 > prefers to slow the proliferation of substantially similar
 > licenses, and is therefore loathe to approve the Simple Permissive
 > License.  Finally, it seems that brevity in a license is not
 > valued, or else that the value of brevity is outside the scope of
 > the approval process.

Not in-and-of itself, particularly when you're talking about a license
which is well understood like the MIT license.

 > Another thing I don't understand is if the "let's not proliferate
 > substantially similar licenses" reasoning should not also apply to
 > the approval of the Fair License.

What is it substantially similar to?

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Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | is like
521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | sucking on sugar.
Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | +1 315 268 9201 FAX   | Sweet!
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-18 Thread Carmen Leeming
My license does not appear on your list:

Title:  Adaptive Public License
Submission:  
http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:6913:200305:bogcdnbbhnfbgpdeahob
License:  http://www.mamook.net/APL.html

This license was submitted in May 2003.  I checked in June to make sure 
that the license had entered the submission process, and received a 
reply indicating that it was received and was currently under review.  I 
wrote again in November and never heard back.

Can anyone give me an update and let me know if it is still under 
consideration?

Thank you,
Carmen Leeming
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Re: License Committee report - regarding NASA Open Source Agreement Version 1.1

2004-02-18 Thread Brian Behlendorf
On Wed, 18 Feb 2004, Rod Dixon, J.D., LL.M. wrote:
> Regarding the issue concerning whether NASA may license software it cannot
> copyright in the U.S., the answer is yes, notwithstanding that significant
> harm to the conception of public domain for digital works is likely to
> follow.

And if there's anything actually useful in what they release, they should
expect U.S. developers to acquire under PD, derive, and sublicense,
thereby avoiding the NOSA requirements altogether.  But sure, go ahead and
approve it.

Brian

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Re: License Committee report - regarding NASA Open Source Agreement Version 1.1

2004-02-18 Thread Rod Dixon, J.D., LL.M.
I think the NASA Open Source Agreement is worthy of OSI's approval - - with
revision, but it also raises issues worthy of discussion and, perhaps,
adjustment to the OSD since the internationalization of intellectual
property law will likely raise similar open source licensing issues for
other governments.

Regarding the issue concerning whether NASA may license software it cannot
copyright in the U.S., the answer is yes, notwithstanding that significant
harm to the conception of public domain for digital works is likely to
follow.

More generally, there may be good reason to add an article to the OSD
regarding government open source licensing. Since it might be prudent to
encourage open source licensing by governments for a number of reasons, OSI
may want to consider under what conditions that this may be done. For
instance, government bodies could be permitted/required to add a clause to
the license safeguarding public domain rights where applicable. Further, it
may be worth noting that government agencies like NASA could be encouraged
to seek out open source developers when developing software rather than
outsource development strictly to non-open source developers, which means
the software is neither public domain (a government contractor may assert
copyright), nor
open source.

With regard to the NASA license, I have three points. [1] The license
contains an ambitious definition of "display" under section 1, which,
effectively, imposes a restriction on the use of the software that I doubt
is consistent with the spirit of a number of articles of the OSD. This
definition may need revision to be more consistent with traditional
Copyright law conceptions of display of a computer program. The user
registration requirement/request line at the beginning of the license seems
unclear as to purpose and, therefore, it is difficult to determine whether
it is in compliance with article 7 of the OSD. Why is the government
collecting user names, and is this part of the license intended to reach
those licensees/sublicensees receiving the work as part of a redistribution?
I do not view section 3.F of the license as answering my question since it
is not clear why tracking registrations is needed either.

[2] Regarding section 3.J, in all fairness, open source licenses used to
distribute online software initially created by the U.S. government ought to
carry a provision clearly indicating whether the export license from the
Commerce department has been obtained and/or whether such a license is
required. Notably, NASA IS ostensibly exporting the software since the open
source license is not necessary, if the program is distributed within the
United States or to U.S. citizens. Section 3.J should be revised.

[3] Section 5.F should also be posted on NASA's website since the designated
representative listed on any particular license in the hands of a licensee
is likely to be outdated long before the license terminates.

 - Rod
Rod Dixon
Blog: http://opensource.cyberspaces.org




: --
:
: There is much discussion spent deciding whether NASA can copyright
: software at all.  The license itself says that no copyright is claimed
: in the United States.
:
: The only serious concern that I can see is that the license requires
: the recipient to indemnify the Government of the United States against
: third party lawsuits.
:
: Title: NASA Open Source Agreement Version 1.1
: Submission:
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7698:200402:jfdgbalgdhgblndpmljm
: License:
http://www.nas.nasa.gov/Research/Software/Open-Source/NASA_Open_Source_Agreement_1.1.txt
: Comments: ongoing as of this writing.
: Recommend: more discussion.
:
: -- 
: --My blog is at angry-economist.russnelson.com  | Coding in Python
: Crynwr sells support for free software  | PGPok | is like
: 521 Pleasant Valley Rd. | +1 315 268 1925 voice | sucking on sugar.
: Potsdam, NY 13676-3213  | +1 315 268 9201 FAX   | Sweet!
: --
: license-discuss archive is at http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3

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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-18 Thread Ian Lance Taylor
Alex Rousskov <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:

> > While I agree with the goals of the license author, he's putting
> > restrictions on the use of the software, and restrictions on use are
> > not allowed.  He points to other licenses which restrict some
> > modifications, but they do it at redistribution time, not at use
> > time. Fundamentally, the author is trying to use licensing to
> > substitute for trademark law.
> >
> > Title: Open Test License v1.1
> > Submission: 
> > http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7537:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
> > Comments:
> >   Larry Rosen: 
> > http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7541:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
> >   Rod Dixon: 
> > http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7545:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
> > Recommend: disapproval.
> 
> Thank you for reviewing my license submission.
> 
> The license submission instructions indicate that OSI "will work with
> [submittors] to resolve any problems uncovered in public comment".
> Could you please let me know how that problem resolution process
> works? Should I make modifications in hope to change your opinion and
> resubmit the license? Or is there a better way?

I don't speak for the OSI.

However, the way to resolve the problems is to consider the issues
raised on the mailing list, and adjust the license accordingly.

As can be seen form the comments, the problem is clause 3:

3. Publication of results from standardized tests contained within
   this software (, ) must either strictly
   adhere to the execution rules for such tests or be accompanied
   by explicit prior written permission of .

Earlier, you said, about that clause:

The above is not meant to restrict the ways to use copies or
the types of derivative works.  It is meant to restrict only how test
results are _named_. If a user renames a standard test or invents her
own new test, she can publish whatever she wants, regardless of
standardized test rules.

But that is not what the clause says.  The clause says that you can't
publish test results except under certain restrictions.  That is a
condition on use of the software.

Please note that OSI certified licenses already have similar (but not
generic enough)  clauses! See, for example, Artistic License and Open
Group Test Suite license. Both require users to rename standardized
tests if standardized tests are modified.

The restrictions in those licenses are restrictions on distribution,
not use.  They state that if you distribute a modified version of the
package, you must change certain standard names.  They do not say
anything about publishing test results, or about how you use the
software in general.  You are free to use modified versions of the
standard executables under the same name if you choose, including
publishing anything you like about them; you are just not free to
redistribute them under the same name.

The distinction between distribution and use is important.  A license
based on copyright can't restrict the use of the software.  It can
only restrict copying of the software.

> Specifically, I would like to adjust the license so that there is no
> perception that some uses of software are restricted. I am not sure I
> understand the "modification restriction at redistribution time"
> loophole you refer to above, but would be happy to use that if needed
> (note that the submitted license does not restrict modifications of
> software at all!).

I think that you will need to remove any restrictions on the use of
the software.  That means no restrictions on publishing test results.

I should add that I understand why you want the restrictions.  But
there are many things which people want which do not fall under the
actions permitted by open source.

> Please advise what my post-disapproval options are.

Basically, to fix the problems in the license, and resubmit it.

Ian
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-17 Thread Richard Schilling
On 2004.02.17 17:43 Zooko O'Whielacronx wrote:

[snip]



So if I understand correctly, the Simple Permissive License and the
(ideally
edited) Fair License both pass the litmus test of OSD.  In addition to
approving
licenses which meet the OSD, the OSI also prefers to slow the
proliferation of
substantially similar licenses, and is therefore loathe to approve the
Simple
Permissive License.  Finally, it seems that brevity in a license is
not valued,
or else that the value of brevity is outside the scope of the approval
process.
With all due respect to opensource.org and the long volunteer hours 
they seem to be putting in, I would like to point out that their role 
seems to be that of a licensing approval body with some well defined 
criteria. They may be in flux and vague to some non-licensing types, 
but they are there, and those criteria are not easy to create.

And as such, their criteria and their general priorities are clearly 
stated.  As with any standards type organization it's important to 
recognize that opensource.org people are working together to approve 
licenses they feel meet certain criteria and goals.  Such direction and 
backbone is rare to find in the Open Source world.

Sure, I argue quite a bit, but it's just debate.  I also expect that by 
definition, a licensing approval body like opensource.org _must_ have a 
record of denials in order to demonstrate their goals (which I might 
add are for the better).

My hat's off to them for sticking to their guns.  They didn't even have 
my submission on the list but that's O.K., because if it's not meant 
for their purposes then at least they have said so.  They didn't even 
list my license as being under consideration, which is O.K.  When I 
submitted it I was told that there currently is a problem with the 
number of licenses being submitted in the first place.



One thing I don't understand is if the Fair License would satisfy the
goals of
the Simple Permissive License while being even shorter.  Personally,
I'm a bit
uncertain about the Fair License, perhaps because I have no legal
training and
I am already familiar with the MIT (-original) license.
Keeping redundancy out of the mix is important.  Since opensource.org 
has some trained legal people on their staff, I would suspect that if 
they think something is redundant for their criteria, then they should 
say so.  I was surprised at the reaction to the NASA license, but I do 
hope that one provides some stimulus for opensource.org to evaluate its 
criteria.  Open Source communities, especially governments using open 
source might learn a thing or two.

This licensing thing is complicated ;-)

Richard Schilling
(who hopes he doesn't confuse people when he makes an argument on a 
variety of sides of a debate)
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-17 Thread Alex Rousskov
On Tue, 17 Feb 2004, Russell Nelson wrote:

> While I agree with the goals of the license author, he's putting
> restrictions on the use of the software, and restrictions on use are
> not allowed.  He points to other licenses which restrict some
> modifications, but they do it at redistribution time, not at use
> time. Fundamentally, the author is trying to use licensing to
> substitute for trademark law.
>
> Title: Open Test License v1.1
> Submission: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7537:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
> Comments:
>   Larry Rosen: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7541:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
>   Rod Dixon: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7545:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
> Recommend: disapproval.

Thank you for reviewing my license submission.

The license submission instructions indicate that OSI "will work with
[submittors] to resolve any problems uncovered in public comment".
Could you please let me know how that problem resolution process
works? Should I make modifications in hope to change your opinion and
resubmit the license? Or is there a better way?

Specifically, I would like to adjust the license so that there is no
perception that some uses of software are restricted. I am not sure I
understand the "modification restriction at redistribution time"
loophole you refer to above, but would be happy to use that if needed
(note that the submitted license does not restrict modifications of
software at all!).

Please advise what my post-disapproval options are.

Thank you,

Alex.
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Re: License Committee report

2004-02-17 Thread Zooko O'Whielacronx

> This must surely be the shortest open source license ever!  Still, we
> should send it back to the author because he uses the hated word
> "utilize".  Don't use utilize!  Utilize "use" instead.  Means the same
> thing and avoids a phony formality.
> 
> Title: Fair License
> Submission: 
>   Original: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7623:hhkgifnkgiiejnigaakm
>   Revised: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7623:200401:hhkgifnkgiiejnigaakm
> Comments: none
> Recommend: remanding.
...
> This license is intended to have the same legal effect as the MIT
> license, only be simpler to read.  Thanks, but that doesn't make it an
> improvement.  We will approve it if the author simply insists, but we
> officially discourage the proliferation of substantially similar licenses.
> 
> Title: Simple Permissive License
> Submission: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7654:200402:ponaihiojnjdnagclgek
> License: http://zooko.com/simple_permissive_license.html
> Comments:
>   Ian Lance Taylor: 
> http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7656:200402:ponaihiojnjdnagclgek
> Recommend: disapproval.


So if I understand correctly, the Simple Permissive License and the (ideally 
edited) Fair License both pass the litmus test of OSD.  In addition to approving 
licenses which meet the OSD, the OSI also prefers to slow the proliferation of 
substantially similar licenses, and is therefore loathe to approve the Simple 
Permissive License.  Finally, it seems that brevity in a license is not valued, 
or else that the value of brevity is outside the scope of the approval process.

One thing I don't understand is if the Fair License would satisfy the goals of 
the Simple Permissive License while being even shorter.  Personally, I'm a bit 
uncertain about the Fair License, perhaps because I have no legal training and 
I am already familiar with the MIT (-original) license.

Does the Fair License require the software developer who uses such licensed 
source code to inform his users (i.e. at runtime or in documentation) about the 
existence of the Fair License?

Another thing I don't understand is if the "let's not proliferate substantially 
similar licenses" reasoning should not also apply to the approval of the Fair 
License.

I will not presume to "insist" that OSI approve the Simple Permissive License.

Regards,

Bryce "Zooko" Wilcox-O'Hearn

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License Committee report

2004-02-17 Thread Russell Nelson
I'm the chair of the license approval committee.  This is my report
for the current set of licenses under discussion.  If anybody
disagrees with my assessment of the committee's conclusions, say so
promptly.

--

We've sat on this license submission for far too long.  It's a clever
and innovative license which we should approve.

Title: EU DataGrid Software License
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7072:200308:fcnekdmjcpiaemibokne
License: http://eu-datagrid.web.cern.ch/eu-datagrid/license.html
Comments:
  John Cowan: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7262:eplnoepdlnfmkgagdbmp
  Ernie Prabhakar: 
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7262:200309:eplnoepdlnfmkgagdbmp
  Dave Presotto: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7337:eplnoepdlnfmkgagdbmp
Recommend: approval.

--

Minor revisions to a license we have already approved.  Clarification
of language and removal of excess parameterization.

Title: Lucent Public License Version 1.02 
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7142:200309:onciffgepemojkpkiimk
License: http://plan9.bell-labs.com/hidden/lpl102-template.html
Comments:
  Ben Reser: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7744:200402:onciffgepemojkpkiimk
Recommend: approval.

--

This license, while seeming to comply with the OSD, isn't sufficiently
different from the GPL or OSL.  It's shorter, but in spite of its
length, the GPL is reasonably well understood, so the WSOSL's
shortness is not an improvement.

Title: The Wilhelm Svenselius Open Source License version 1.1 
Submission:
  Original: 
http://www.crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7080:200308:ekmofmlcjbbcddoaoahj
  Revised: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7086:200309:pehonmokjnclhgnhddjo
License: ttp://home.ws83.net/code/WSOSL.html
Comments:
  John Cowan: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7083:ekmofmlcjbbcddoaoahj
Recommend: disapproval.

--

This license puts restrictions on the use of software, specifically
modifications for private use.

Title: Public Security Interrest "PSI" License
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7098:bcgogjkdclpfihdgnoil
License: 
Comments:
  John Cowan: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7098:bcgogjkdclpfihdgnoil
Recommend: disapproval.

--

This license is EXTREMELY controversial.  It is a license which seems
to comply with the OSD, yet whose purpose is explicitly to be
incompatible with the GPL.  

Title: Open Source Software Alliance License
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7133:200309:ahoninpjbapbnmdbglmm
License: http://people.FreeBSD.org/~seanc/ossal/ossal.html
Comments: many, however the most cogent comment comes from Rick Moen at:
  http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7259:ahoninpjbapbnmdbglmm
Recommend: remanding back to the author for rewording.

--

MPL 1.1 with the name scratched off and replaced by CUA Office Public
License.  Danese pointed out that the submittor might be trying to
relicense code that could not be relicensed in this manner.  He
replied that his code was all newly crafted.

Title: CUA Office Public License
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7486:hdlmlbkpenifmmkhppdd
License: 
Comments: 
  Danese Cooper: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msn:7486:hdlmlbkpenifmmkhppdd
  Patranun Limudomporn: 
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7496:hdlmlbkpenifmmkhppdd
Recommend: approval.

--

Rod Dixon made a couple of comments the day before Christmas Eve.  I
think we should contact the Panda3D folks and ask them to respond to
Rod's comments.  Otherwise I see no reason why we should not approve
this license.

Title: Panda3D Public License Version 1.0
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7499:ljampdokbpbinfhgnknf
License: http://www.etc.cmu.edu/panda3d/docs/license/
Comments:
  John Cowan: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:msp:7501:ljampdokbpbinfhgnknf
  Rod Dixon: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7501:200312:ljampdokbpbinfhgnknf
Recommend: remanding.

--

While I agree with the goals of the license author, he's putting
restrictions on the use of the software, and restrictions on use are
not allowed.  He points to other licenses which restrict some
modifications, but they do it at redistribution time, not at use time.
Fundamentally, the author is trying to use licensing to substitute for
trademark law.

Title: Open Test License v1.1
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7537:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
Comments:
  Larry Rosen: 
http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7541:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
  Rod Dixon: http://crynwr.com/cgi-bin/ezmlm-cgi?3:mss:7545:200401:cldkhgfpmlhkdcokelpg
Recommend: disapproval.

--

Not different enough from any existing license.  We should send it
back to them suggesting that they use an existing license.  If they
simply cannot, and must have this license, then we will approve it
upon resubmission.

Title: Linisys Open Source License v1.4
Submission: http://crynwr.com/cgi