Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread ZmnSCPxj via Lightning-dev
Good morning James, > It seems like the router in this case is essentially short a straddle on the > BTC vs. WJT exchange rate with almost 0 premium. One way for the router to > hedge this is to be long an equivalent straddle by constructing their own > cross-chain payment to themselves with s

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread ZmnSCPxj via Lightning-dev
Good morning Tamas, > Although there is no escape from above reasoning, a market maker could still > be profitable as long as the option is worth less than the bid-ask spread. > Therefore the issue does not mean that LN cross asset exchange is not > feasible, but that there is lower bound on bid

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread ZmnSCPxj via Lightning-dev
Good morning Alex, > > Do you mean, that if you make a swap on Lightning, which *might* be a > > Bitcoin-to-WJT American Call Option, I will refuse to forward until I also > > get something that is a WJT-to-Bitcoin call option, similar to a butterfly > > spread? > > That implies that in the "no

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread Alexander Leishman
Hello ZmnSCPxj, > Do you mean, that if you make a swap on Lightning, which *might* be a Bitcoin-to-WJT American Call Option, I will refuse to forward until I also get something that is a WJT-to-Bitcoin call option, similar to a butterfly spread? > That implies that in the "normal", non-American-ca

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread James Asefa
It seems like the router in this case is essentially short a straddle on the BTC vs. WJT exchange rate with almost 0 premium. One way for the router to hedge this is to be long an equivalent straddle by constructing their own cross-chain payment to themselves with some other node, for the same amou

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread Tamas Blummer
ZmnSCPxj, Brilliant reasoning. I sum it up to make it more accessible: Failing to route on purpose can be used to opt out of a previously agreed exchange of two differents assets. A rational actor will opt out if the exchange is no longer fair. Anyone who grants an option for free heads financ

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread ZmnSCPxj via Lightning-dev
Good morning Alex and Will, > 1. Cross-asset brokers charge a standard option premium to perform the > brokerage. I can't tell if you think this is totally broken or if it's just > sad. I don't understand lightning well enough to figure that out on my own - > could you expand more on what effec

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread Alexander Leishman
There’s another potential partial solution here if we can create some cryptographic protocol for atomically swapping information. This would be used to swap the final HTLC sig for the hash preimage, preventing the optionality issue. This idea was inspired by a paper called “Timed Commitments” by

Re: [Lightning-dev] An Argument For Single-Asset Lightning Network

2018-12-27 Thread Will Yager
Very good point. Two possible responses come to mind. 1. Cross-asset brokers charge a standard option premium to perform the brokerage. I can't tell if you think this is totally broken or if it's just sad. I don't understand lightning well enough to figure that out on my own - could you expand