Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-20 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > Why do you constantly stress level 19? Yes, that one is special, all > > other positive levels were already relatively consistent. > > i constantly stress it for the reason i mentioned a good number of > times: because it's by far the most

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-20 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > [more rude insults deleted] > > > I've been waiting for that obvious question, and i _might_ be able > > > to answer it, but somehow it never occured to you ;-) Thanks, > > the ";-)" emoticon (and its contents) clearly signals this as a >

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-20 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: [more rude insults deleted] I've been waiting for that obvious question, and i _might_ be able to answer it, but somehow it never occured to you ;-) Thanks, the ;-) emoticon (and its contents) clearly signals this as a sarcastic,

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-20 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: Why do you constantly stress level 19? Yes, that one is special, all other positive levels were already relatively consistent. i constantly stress it for the reason i mentioned a good number of times: because it's by far the most commonly

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Don't make such suggestions if you have no idea how insulting they > are. Especially the one deleted insult above where you have the > impertinence to quote it, such tone is more appropriate between lord > and inferior, where the latter have to make

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple > > of times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter > > correctly observed) we've been through a couple of iterations > > already. And as i mentioned it before, the

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple of > times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter correctly > observed) we've been through a couple of iterations already. And as i > mentioned it before, the outer

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > The only expectation is that a process with a lower nice level gets more > time. Any other expectation is a bug. Yes, users are buggy, they expect a lot of stupid things... Is this really reason enough to break this? What exactly is the damage

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. > > Breaking user expectations of nice levels is? _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple of times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 15:26 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > > > By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. > > BTW what is the "UNIX model of nice levels"? > > SUS specifies the limit via NZERO, which is defined as

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. BTW what is the "UNIX model of nice levels"? SUS specifies the limit via NZERO, which is defined as "Minimum Acceptable Value: 20", I can't find any information that it must

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 15:07 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > > > By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. > > Breaking user expectations of nice levels is?

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. Breaking user expectations of nice levels is? bye, Roman - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line "unsubscribe linux-kernel" in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Peter Zijlstra <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 14:45 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: > > Hi, > > > > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > > > > > I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of > > > background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen.

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 14:45 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: > Hi, > > On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > > > I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of > > background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen. > > The extra range is not really a problem, in > >

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: > I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of > background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen. The extra range is not really a problem, in http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0707.2/0850.html I suggested how

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: > > > > > > [insult deleted] > In this discussion about > nice levels you were (very) agressively asserting things that were > untrue, Instead of simply asserting things, how

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: > > > > " Ingo, you've been maintaining the scheduler for years. In fact you > >wrote the old nice code we are talking about here. You

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Mon, 2007-07-16 at 10:47 -0700, Linus Torvalds wrote: > > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Roman Zippel wrote: > > > > To illustrate the problem a little different: a task with a nice level -20 > > got around 700% more cpu time (or 8 times more), now it gets 8500% more > > cpu time (or 86.7 times more).

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Mon, 2007-07-16 at 10:47 -0700, Linus Torvalds wrote: On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Roman Zippel wrote: To illustrate the problem a little different: a task with a nice level -20 got around 700% more cpu time (or 8 times more), now it gets 8500% more cpu time (or 86.7 times more). Ingo,

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: Ingo, you've been maintaining the scheduler for years. In fact you wrote the old nice code we are talking about here. You changed it a

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: [insult deleted] In this discussion about nice levels you were (very) agressively asserting things that were untrue, Instead of simply asserting things, how about you

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen. The extra range is not really a problem, in http://www.ussg.iu.edu/hypermail/linux/kernel/0707.2/0850.html I suggested how we

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 14:45 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen. The extra range is not really a problem, in

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Peter Zijlstra [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 14:45 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: I actually like the extra range, it allows for a much softer punch of background tasks even on somewhat slower boxen. The extra

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. Breaking user expectations of nice levels is? bye, Roman - To unsubscribe from this list: send the line unsubscribe linux-kernel in the body of a message to [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 15:07 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. Breaking user expectations of nice levels is?

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. BTW what is the UNIX model of nice levels? SUS specifies the limit via NZERO, which is defined as Minimum Acceptable Value: 20, I can't find any information that it must be 20.

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Peter Zijlstra
On Wed, 2007-07-18 at 15:26 +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. BTW what is the UNIX model of nice levels? SUS specifies the limit via NZERO, which is defined as Minimum

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: By breaking the UNIX model of nice levels. Not an option in my book. Breaking user expectations of nice levels is? _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple of times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Peter Zijlstra wrote: The only expectation is that a process with a lower nice level gets more time. Any other expectation is a bug. Yes, users are buggy, they expect a lot of stupid things... Is this really reason enough to break this? What exactly is the damage if

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Wed, 18 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple of times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter correctly observed) we've been through a couple of iterations already. And as i mentioned it before, the outer edge

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: _changing_ it is an option within reason, and we've done it a couple of times already in the past, and even within CFS (as Peter correctly observed) we've been through a couple of iterations already. And as i mentioned it before, the outer edge

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-18 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Don't make such suggestions if you have no idea how insulting they are. Especially the one deleted insult above where you have the impertinence to quote it, such tone is more appropriate between lord and inferior, where the latter have to make a

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > * Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't > > > > explain why this ratio had to be increase that much from around > > > > 1:10 to 1:69. > > > > > > More dynamic range is

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: > > " Ingo, you've been maintaining the scheduler for years. In fact you >wrote the old nice code we are talking about here. You changed it a >number of times since then. So

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Nice level 19 shows the largest artifacts, as that level only gets a > single tick, so the ratio is often 1:HZ/10 (except for 1000HZ where > it's 5:100). [...] Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: " Ingo, you've been

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't > > > explain why this ratio had to be increase that much from around > > > 1:10 to 1:69. > > > > More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x > > the CPU

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't explain why this ratio had to be increase that much from around 1:10 to 1:69. More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x the CPU time of another,

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Nice level 19 shows the largest artifacts, as that level only gets a single tick, so the ratio is often 1:HZ/10 (except for 1000HZ where it's 5:100). [...] Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: Ingo, you've been

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: Roman, please do me a favor, and ask me the following question: Ingo, you've been maintaining the scheduler for years. In fact you wrote the old nice code we are talking about here. You changed it a number of times since then. So you

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-17 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: * Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't explain why this ratio had to be increase that much from around 1:10 to 1:69. More dynamic range is better? If you actually

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, I wrote: > Playing around with some other nice levels, confirms the theory that > something is a little off, so I'm quite correct at saying that the ratio > _should_ be 1:10. Rechecking everything there was actually a small error in my test program, so the ratio

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > * Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > Hi, > > > > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > > > and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was "3200% more > > > powerful" than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), > > > > How did you

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > Hi, > > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was "3200% more > > powerful" than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), > > How did you get that value? At any HZ the ratio should be around 1:10 > (+-

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was "3200% more > powerful" than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), How did you get that value? At any HZ the ratio should be around 1:10 (+- rounding error). > in fact i like it that nice -20 has a

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Matt Mackall wrote: > > It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't explain > > why this ratio had to be increase that much from around 1:10 to 1:69. > > More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x > the CPU time of another,

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Matt Mackall <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x > the CPU time of another, the older scheduler doesn't really allow it. > > Getting 1/69th of a modern CPU is still a fair number of cycles. > Nevermind 1/69th of a machine with >

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Matt Mackall
On Mon, Jul 16, 2007 at 04:01:17PM +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: > Hi, > > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in > > practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, > > depending on the value of HZ. This

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Linus Torvalds wrote: > How about trying a much less aggressive nice-level (and preferably linear, > not exponential)? I think the exponential increase isn't the problem. The old code did approximate something like this rather crudely with the result that there was a

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Linus Torvalds
On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Roman Zippel wrote: > > To illustrate the problem a little different: a task with a nice level -20 > got around 700% more cpu time (or 8 times more), now it gets 8500% more > cpu time (or 86.7 times more). Ingo, that _does_ sound excessive. How about trying a much less

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread James Bruce
Ingo Molnar wrote: * Ingo Molnar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: * James Bruce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Al Boldi
Roman Zippel wrote: > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in > > practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, > > depending on the value of HZ. This is quite inconsistent and illogical. > > You're correct

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in > practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, > depending on the value of HZ. This is quite inconsistent and illogical. You're correct that you can find

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > It has been a common request for nice levels to be more logical > > (i.e. to make them universal and to detach them from HZ) and for > > them to be more effective as well. > > Huh? What has this to do with HZ? The scheduler used ticks internally,

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > > As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, > > > > while it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] > > > > > > yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. > > > > Why did you cut off the rest

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > > > As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, > > > while it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] > > > > yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. >

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > > As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, while > > it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] > > yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. Why did you cut off the rest of the sentence? To

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU > > utilization, when running two CPU intense tasks, is ~10%: > > > > PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEMTIME+ COMMAND > > 8246 mingo 20 0 1576 244 196

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: > yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU > utilization, when running two CPU intense tasks, is ~10%: > > PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEMTIME+ COMMAND > 8246 mingo 20 0 1576 244 196 R 55

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Ingo Molnar <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > * James Bruce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? > > The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. > > yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* James Bruce <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? > The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU utilization, when running two CPU intense

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread James Bruce
Thomas Gleixner wrote: Roman Zippel noticed inconsistency of the wmult table. wmult[16] has a missing digit. [snip] While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. - Jim - To unsubscribe from this

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread James Bruce
Thomas Gleixner wrote: Roman Zippel noticed inconsistency of the wmult table. wmult[16] has a missing digit. [snip] While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. - Jim - To unsubscribe from this

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* James Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU utilization, when running two CPU intense

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Ingo Molnar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * James Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU utilization, when running two CPU intense tasks, is ~10%: PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEMTIME+ COMMAND 8246 mingo 20 0 1576 244 196 R 55 0.0

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual difference in CPU utilization, when running two CPU intense tasks, is ~10%: PID USER PR NI VIRT RES SHR S %CPU %MEMTIME+ COMMAND 8246 mingo 20 0 1576 244 196 R 55 0.0

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, while it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. Why did you cut off the rest of the sentence? To

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, while it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. Why did you

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: As soon as you add another loop the difference changes again, while it's always correct to say it gets 25% more cpu time [...] yep, and i'll add the relative effect to the comment too. Why did you cut off the rest of the sentence?

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: It has been a common request for nice levels to be more logical (i.e. to make them universal and to detach them from HZ) and for them to be more effective as well. Huh? What has this to do with HZ? The scheduler used ticks internally, but it's

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, depending on the value of HZ. This is quite inconsistent and illogical. You're correct that you can find

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Al Boldi
Roman Zippel wrote: On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, depending on the value of HZ. This is quite inconsistent and illogical. You're correct that you

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread James Bruce
Ingo Molnar wrote: * Ingo Molnar [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: * James Bruce [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: While we're at it, isn't the comment above the wmult table incorrect? The multiplier is 1.25, meaning a 25% change per nice level, not 10%. yes, the weight multiplier 1.25, but the actual

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Linus Torvalds
On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Roman Zippel wrote: To illustrate the problem a little different: a task with a nice level -20 got around 700% more cpu time (or 8 times more), now it gets 8500% more cpu time (or 86.7 times more). Ingo, that _does_ sound excessive. How about trying a much less

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Linus Torvalds wrote: How about trying a much less aggressive nice-level (and preferably linear, not exponential)? I think the exponential increase isn't the problem. The old code did approximate something like this rather crudely with the result that there was a

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Matt Mackall
On Mon, Jul 16, 2007 at 04:01:17PM +0200, Roman Zippel wrote: Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: to sum it up: a nice +19 task (the most commonly used nice level in practice) gets 9.1%, 3.9%, 3.1% of CPU time on the old scheduler, depending on the value of HZ. This is quite

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Matt Mackall [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x the CPU time of another, the older scheduler doesn't really allow it. Getting 1/69th of a modern CPU is still a fair number of cycles. Nevermind 1/69th of a machine with 64

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Matt Mackall wrote: It's nice that these artifacts are gone, but that still doesn't explain why this ratio had to be increase that much from around 1:10 to 1:69. More dynamic range is better? If you actually want a task to get 20x the CPU time of another, the

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was 3200% more powerful than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), How did you get that value? At any HZ the ratio should be around 1:10 (+- rounding error). in fact i like it that nice -20 has a slightly

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Ingo Molnar
* Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was 3200% more powerful than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), How did you get that value? At any HZ the ratio should be around 1:10 (+- rounding

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: * Roman Zippel [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Hi, On Mon, 16 Jul 2007, Ingo Molnar wrote: and note that even on the old scheduler, nice-0 was 3200% more powerful than nice +19 (with CONFIG_HZ=300), How did you get that value? At any

Re: [PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-16 Thread Roman Zippel
Hi, On Tue, 17 Jul 2007, I wrote: Playing around with some other nice levels, confirms the theory that something is a little off, so I'm quite correct at saying that the ratio _should_ be 1:10. Rechecking everything there was actually a small error in my test program, so the ratio should

[PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-13 Thread Thomas Gleixner
Roman Zippel noticed inconsistency of the wmult table. wmult[16] has a missing digit. Signed-off-by: Thomas Gleixner <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> diff --git a/kernel/sched.c b/kernel/sched.c index 0559665..3332bbb 100644 --- a/kernel/sched.c +++ b/kernel/sched.c @@ -750,7 +750,7 @@ static const u32

[PATCH] CFS: Fix missing digit off in wmult table

2007-07-13 Thread Thomas Gleixner
Roman Zippel noticed inconsistency of the wmult table. wmult[16] has a missing digit. Signed-off-by: Thomas Gleixner [EMAIL PROTECTED] diff --git a/kernel/sched.c b/kernel/sched.c index 0559665..3332bbb 100644 --- a/kernel/sched.c +++ b/kernel/sched.c @@ -750,7 +750,7 @@ static const u32