Re: [lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Simon Quigley]

Hello,

I'm going to keep my response here brief, see my other reply on this
thread for a better response.

On 12/26/2017 05:54 AM, Ralf Mardorf wrote:
> This is plain nonsense:
>> Clarification: The user is using a Ubuntu flavour Icon and Name
>> (Lubuntu and the icon of Lubuntu) all of them registered by Canonical
>> Ltd, UK, and allowed to be used only in the website http://lubuntu.me  
>
>   ^
>   
>> as indicated in the countersigned licence attached.  
>   ^^^
> 
> From the http://lubuntu.me/ footer:
> 
> "Lubuntu and Ubuntu are registered trademarks of Canonical Ltd. Content
> is licensed by Creative Commons License
> https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/.;
> 
> Let alone that the Lubuntu logo itself includes the LXDE icon, so it
> would be fishy, if it wouldn't be allowed to use the Lubuntu logo.
> 
> From https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/:
> 
> "(CC BY-NC-ND 4.0)
> This is a human-readable summary of (and not a substitute for) the
> license. Disclaimer. You are free to:
> 
> Share — copy and redistribute the material in any medium or format
> 
> The licensor cannot revoke these freedoms as long as you follow the
> license terms.
> 
> Under the following terms:
> 
> Attribution — You must give appropriate credit, provide a link to
> the license, and indicate if changes were made. You may do so in
> any reasonable manner, but not in any way that suggests the
> licensor endorses you or your use.
> 
> NonCommercial — You may not use the material for commercial
> purposes.
> 
> NoDerivatives — If you remix, transform, or build upon the
> material, you may not distribute the modified material.
> 
> No additional restrictions — You may not apply legal terms or
> technological measures that legally restrict others from doing
> anything the license permits.
> 
> Notices:
> 
> You do not have to comply with the license for elements of the
> material in the public domain or where your use is permitted by an
> applicable exception or limitation. No warranties are given. The
> license may not give you all of the permissions necessary for your
> intended use. For example, other rights such as publicity, privacy,
> or moral rights may limit how you use the material."
> 

Although I think the emphasis is less on the logo and more on the
Lubuntu name and the trademark associated with it. From Canonical's
Intellectual Property policy:

> You will require Canonical’s permission to use: (i) any mark ending with
> the letters UBUNTU or BUNTU which is sufficiently similar to the Trademarks> 
> or any other confusingly similar mark, and (ii) any Trademark in a domain
> name or URL or for merchandising purposes.
Rafael has this permission and Mario doesn't. I think that's all he's
alluding to here. :)

That's all. Happy holidays!

-- 
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Re: [lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Simon Quigley]

Hello Mario,

Before I give my response to you and my statement as the current Lubuntu
Team Lead, I would like to put forward a few quotes from the Ubuntu Code
of Conduct and Canonical's Intellectual Property statement to keep in
mind while reading my email.

From the Ubuntu Code of Conduct:

> We strive to:
> 
>   '''Be considerate.'''
> 
>   Our work will be used by other people, and we in turn will depend on
>   the work of others. Any decision we take will affect users and
>   colleagues, and we should consider them when making decisions.



>   '''Be collaborative.'''
> 
>   What we produce is a complex whole made of many parts, it is the sum
>   of many dreams. Collaboration between teams that each have their own
>   goal and vision is essential; for the whole to be more than the sum
>   of its parts, each part must make an effort to understand the whole.
> 
>   Collaboration reduces redundancy and improves the quality of our
>   work. Internally and externally, we celebrate good collaboration.
>   Wherever possible, we work closely with upstream projects and others
>   in the free software community to coordinate our efforts.
> 
>   We prefer to work transparently and involve interested parties as
>   early as possible.



>   '''Step down considerately.'''
> 
>   When somebody leaves or disengages from the project, we ask that
>   they do so in a way that minimises disruption to the project. They
>   should tell people they are leaving and take the proper steps to
>   ensure that others can pick up where they left off.



> '''Courage and considerateness'''
> 
> Leadership occasionally requires bold decisions that will not be
> widely understood, consensual or popular. We value the courage to take
> such decisions, because they enable the project as a whole to move
> forward faster than we could if we required complete consensus.
> Nevertheless, boldness demands considerateness; take bold decisions,
> but do so mindful of the challenges they present for others, and work
> to soften the impact of those decisions on them. Communicating changes
> and their reasoning clearly and early on is as important as the
> implementation of the change itself.

From Canonical's Intellectual Property statement:

> You will require Canonical’s permission to use: (i) any mark ending with
> the letters UBUNTU or BUNTU which is sufficiently similar to the Trademarks> 
> or any other confusingly similar mark, and (ii) any Trademark in a domain
> name or URL or for merchandising purposes.

Therefore, Canonical Limited is the rightful owner of the Lubuntu Trademark.

From here on, I speak as the Lubuntu Team Lead.

On 12/26/2017 05:16 AM, Mario Behling wrote:
> Hi,
> 
> is this supposed to be Christmas present? Please see the Trademark
> complaint of Rafael below. 

For the sake of transparency I would like to note that this was an
action taken not on behalf of Rafael directly but on behalf of the
Lubuntu Team/Project.

> This is making me very sad. The idea of Free and Open Source software
> was always to be inclusive and get others on board and build something
> open and free, where everyone can engage in.

Lubuntu as a project agrees with the notion that collaboration is
essential to any successful project, but the way you have been
displaying a lack of collaboration is contrary to the beliefs that
Lubuntu and Ubuntu has been founded on.

> Rafael & Co, why you are moving content to a closed site instead of
> keeping it up to date on the wiki?

The difference between Lubuntu.me and Lubuntu.net/org is that Lubuntu.me
is currently accessible by every single team lead within Lubuntu with
the exception of Unit193 as IRC lead, which we would be happy to grant
access to without hesitation if he wished (but he has declined). It is
the officially recognized (
https://www.ubuntu.com/download/ubuntu-flavours ) site where Lubuntu
publishes announcements which we, as a collaborative and open team, deem
are necessary to get out to users (and sometimes, we like to involve our
users in various projects that we are working on, including things like
artwork changes, new resources, etc.). The domain also rightfully is
under the control of Canonical Limited, who owns the trademark (and thus
should hold the domain) and we are in the process of transferring the
Wordpress site over to official Canonical Limited infrastructure.

On the other hand, Lubuntu.net/org is not accessible (despite your
claims) by any active member of the Lubuntu Team, is hosted on
infrastructure that is completely out of our control, and only makes
announcements when there is a new release of Lubuntu (which, by the way,
on Lubuntu.net/org, was published several days after the release, and
had the same content which was published on our official website) which
led dozens of users to contact us asking why we did not publish Lubuntu
17.10. This has crossed a boundary where it became detrimental to our users.

> lubuntu.net 
> always directed people 

Re: [lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Walter Lapchynski]

On Tue, Dec 26, 2017 at 12:16:55PM +0100, Mario Behling wrote:
> Rafael & Co, why you are moving content to a closed site instead of keeping it
> up to date on the wiki?

Because we couldn't count on you to keep lubuntu.net updated and despite
multiple requests, you would not:

 * give anyone on the Lubuntu team access
 * provide a redirect to lubuntu.me
 * transfer the ownership of the domains to Canonical

Also, a point here: when I say "Lubuntu team," I mean the people doing
the work, not the co-founder that hasn't done a darn thing for Lubuntu
since, yet insists on making the canonical (lowercase c) website his and
his alone.

> lubuntu.net always directed people to community
> resources

This is entirely untrue. It does in some places, but for a long time,
just didn't. The "GetLubuntu" wiki page was a ugly band-aid to try to
allow us to at least be able to have some degree of control over the
information users were getting from the website.

> Community resources are
> neglected

You're more than welcome to create your own Lubuntu community resource,
if you want. Of course, you'd need permission from Canonical to use
their trademark. And besides, why not work with the community that
already exists? Wouldn't you want users to have access to more
information rather than dilluting it across multiple resources?

> and a small closed group controls central resources

Everyone is open to being a member of the Lubuntu team. Everyone. You
just have to be willing to work with us. See the Ubuntu Code of Conduct
for how that works.

> * The distribution has become unstable for a lot of people (check out social
> media!) - we need a developers, that also contribute to upstream projects and
> develop new ideas. 

Great idea! All this infrastructure exists in Lubuntu (read: Ubuntu)
already. So, please, come join the Lubuntu team! And file bugs, too,
while you're at it.

> * The bloated wiki with lots of broken images needs to be cleaned up or a new
> community resource needs to come up. (I will provide my take on this later.)

This is, to some degree, an ongoing problem within Ubuntu. I won't deny
it. But we do what we can to keep up the wiki. Again, there's a Lubuntu
Wiki and Docs team that you're more than welcome to join.

> * Lots of groups that had been founded to simply show off "I am in a group" 
> and
> get people an ubuntu.com email addresses are inactive and the groups are often
> irrelevant. They should be dissolved.

I'm not sure what you're referring to but you don't get an ubuntu.com
email by becoming part of a group. It's from performing significant and
sustained contributions to the Ubuntu community. Groups (I'm assuming we
mean Launchpad) exist only for the purposes of organizing members
together. No Ubuntu Membership (that's how you get an ubuntu.com email)
is required to join any of these groups.

> * Outdated documentation, which has become unusable needs to be cleaned up

See Lubuntu Wiki and Docs team above.

> * Documentation which is just directing to Ubuntu and irrelevant for lubuntu
> needs to be changed

For some things, it's perfectly reasonable, but again, I mention:
Lubuntu Wiki and Docs team.

> * Links that are redirecting to closed sites should be taken out and content
> should be on the wiki itself

Exactly! So let's get rid of any links to closed sites like
lubuntu.net

> ... Still cannot believe that legal threats are used like that in the Free
> Software community.

This has got to be the most ridiculous thing I have ever heard from you.
The Free Software community is entirely focused on properly licensing.
It's not a minor undercurrent. It's a Big Thing™. I encourage you to
search it. Look up the Open Source Initiative, Debian Free Software
Guidelines, Creative Commons, etc. etc. etc. These things exist to protect 
people, most notably the user (but also the creators).

But there's the issue: lubuntu.net has always been out of lockstep with the
current reality and, as such, does not care about the user. You, as
owner of lubuntu.net, who has refused all entreaties to try to resolve
this issue, clearly doesn't care about the user, either. You can spin
things how you want in your messages, but this is the reality of your
actions, and they are most sad of all.

Lubuntu is a distro built using what is the core of Ubuntu. It is built
on Ubuntu (Canonical) infrastructure. It is Ubuntu. You should have
known this when you originally created Lubuntu. 

If you don't like it all of a sudden, that's weird, but that's ok. It's all 
free software. Make your own distro. But just don't use the Lubuntu name 
without permission from Canonical, who owns the trademark. Linux Mint, 
which is essentially Ubuntu with a little extra stuff, is not called 
Ubuntu Mint or Mintbuntu, is it now?

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Re: [lubuntu-users] No sound

[Barry Titterton]

On 24/12/17 13:58, Ian Bruntlett wrote:

> 
> 1. A friend that benefited on a refurbished laptop from the Computer
> Wombling Scheme had a sound problem. It was fixed by clicking on the
> loudspeaker icon on the bottom right of the screen and selecting
> "unmute" (IIRC).
> 
> 
> HTH,
> 
> 
> Ian
> 

Hi Ian,

I am intrigued by your mention of the 'Computer Wombling Scheme' but
cannot find anything about it by the usual search methods. Can you
please supply more details or a link to the scheme.

Cheers,
Barry T

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Re: [lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Rafael Laguna]

Now I ask you: who gave you permission to steal my images? Damn it, you
can even read my name in some screenshots you're using. You didn't even
bother to change or alter them a bit. You even took the buttons (that
look deformed in your site) and exactly the same text that I and the
Release Manager wrote.

And anyways, what's the point of having a "Lubuntu website" that
doesn't get updated regularly? Your solution was to copy the entire
content, knowing its graphic and text is protected under a copyright
licence? We have respect for the licences. What you did is a robbery of
Intellectual Property. Our site isn't  closed. It is hosted in Ubuntu /
Canonical servers, just to protect it and precisely to avoid someone to
take control it over the whole group.

How would you feel to know that someone is trying to steal your
identity and confusing our users? Please, stop doing this. Lubuntu is
for everybody, but if you want to create your own distro, fork it,
name it and create your own identity for it. We worked hard for the
end-users, for free, but not for someone to get advantage of it.

You perfectly knew how this works, you were warned several times.
Otherwise, if you continue, I can only consider your actions as a
deliberate attack to Lubuntu, the Ubuntu community and the users
themselves.

It is sad indeed.


On Tue, 2017-12-26 at 12:16 +0100, Mario Behling wrote:
> 
> Next: People and universities who want put u
-- 

Redwolf  |  Rafael Laguna
D2D7 3EC2 226F AF9F 7352
B314 C055 8B27 31B2 3553


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Re: [lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Ralf Mardorf]

This is plain nonsense:
> Clarification: The user is using a Ubuntu flavour Icon and Name
> (Lubuntu and the icon of Lubuntu) all of them registered by Canonical
> Ltd, UK, and allowed to be used only in the website http://lubuntu.me  
   
  ^
  
> as indicated in the countersigned licence attached.  
  ^^^

From the http://lubuntu.me/ footer:

"Lubuntu and Ubuntu are registered trademarks of Canonical Ltd. Content
is licensed by Creative Commons License
https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/.;

Let alone that the Lubuntu logo itself includes the LXDE icon, so it
would be fishy, if it wouldn't be allowed to use the Lubuntu logo.

From https://creativecommons.org/licenses/by-nc-nd/4.0/:

"(CC BY-NC-ND 4.0)
This is a human-readable summary of (and not a substitute for) the
license. Disclaimer. You are free to:

Share — copy and redistribute the material in any medium or format

The licensor cannot revoke these freedoms as long as you follow the
license terms.

Under the following terms:

Attribution — You must give appropriate credit, provide a link to
the license, and indicate if changes were made. You may do so in
any reasonable manner, but not in any way that suggests the
licensor endorses you or your use.

NonCommercial — You may not use the material for commercial
purposes.

NoDerivatives — If you remix, transform, or build upon the
material, you may not distribute the modified material.

No additional restrictions — You may not apply legal terms or
technological measures that legally restrict others from doing
anything the license permits.

Notices:

You do not have to comply with the license for elements of the
material in the public domain or where your use is permitted by an
applicable exception or limitation. No warranties are given. The
license may not give you all of the permissions necessary for your
intended use. For example, other rights such as publicity, privacy,
or moral rights may limit how you use the material."

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[lubuntu-users] lubuntu social media page shut down because of legal threats from Rafael Laguna

[Mario Behling]

Hi,

is this supposed to be Christmas present? Please see the Trademark
complaint of Rafael below.

This is making me very sad. The idea of Free and Open Source software was
always to be inclusive and get others on board and build something open and
free, where everyone can engage in.

Rafael & Co, why you are moving content to a closed site instead of keeping
it up to date on the wiki? lubuntu.net always directed people to community
resources, but you want to control things and redirect wiki pages more and
more to your closed site? This is not what a community project is about in
my view. This project has become all about control now. Community resources
are neglected and a small closed group controls central resources, that are
- closed.

Next: People and universities who want put up content, videos and pages
about lubuntu are getting threats of legal action. This project should be
open and inclusive the way it was started!

Here are suggestions, what needs to be done to fix community resources. Who
is interested to help?

* The distribution has become unstable for a lot of people (check out
social media!) - we need a developers, that also contribute to upstream
projects and develop new ideas.
* The bloated wiki with lots of broken images needs to be cleaned up or a
new community resource needs to come up. (I will provide my take on this
later.)
* Lots of groups that had been founded to simply show off "I am in a group"
and get people an ubuntu.com email addresses are inactive and the groups
are often irrelevant. They should be dissolved.
* Outdated documentation, which has become unusable needs to be cleaned up
* Documentation which is just directing to Ubuntu and irrelevant for
lubuntu needs to be changed
* Links that are redirecting to closed sites should be taken out and
content should be on the wiki itself

It seems a number of people have moved on to other channels from this list
already, but it would be great to read, what ideas people who are still
here have to get this project to the next level instead of wasting time on
legal threats.

If you are interested in those topics, please join the dedicated team to
follow up here: https://launchpad.net/~lubuntu-x

... Still cannot believe that legal threats are used like that in the Free
Software community.

Very sad :(

- Mario



On Mon, Dec 25, 2017 at 6:50 PM, YouTube Legal Support Team <
youtube-disputes+qdogt6rq5qagcveaqtzlumt5yq.aljz-kfr...@google.com> wrote:

> Hello,
>
> This is to notify you that we have received a trademark complaint
> regarding your content, the details of which appear at the end of this
> message.
>
> We strongly encourage parties to resolve their trademark disputes
> directly. In order to give you an opportunity to respond to the complaint,
> we will not take action on the complaint for 48 hours. If you are unable to
> resolve this issue with the complainant, the complaint will be reviewed by
> the YouTube Team and may be removed pursuant to our Trademark Guidelines (
> https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/2801979).
>
> For more information on editing the title, description, or tags of your
> video, please visit the YouTube Help Center at https://support.google.com/
> youtube/topic/4355241?ref_topic=4355169. If the alleged violation is
> located within the video itself, you may have to remove the video in its
> entirety (https://support.google.com/youtube/answer/55770).
>
> Regards,
>
> The YouTube Legal Support Team
>
> Title: Mr.
>
> Full legal name: Rafael Laguna
>
> Company name: Lubuntu
>
> Trademark owner name: Canonical Ltd.
>
> Relationship: Artwork Director Tram
>
> Email: w...@rafaellaguna.uk
>
> Brand type: Wordmark and Logo
>
> Register status: Yes
>
> Jurisdiction of registration: GB
>
> Registration number: 4578010
>
> Content type: Channel description
>
> Channels: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UC0nEnI4yt2OCiZwRT0q90tQ/about
>
> Clarification: The user is using a Ubuntu flavour Icon and Name (Lubuntu
> and the icon of Lubuntu) all of them registered by Canonical Ltd, UK, and
> allowed to be used only in the website http://lubuntu.me as indicated in
> the countersigned licence attached.
>
> Signature: Rafael Laguna
>
> Evidence: 1ec9131fda28410dba370d4840230e9c.pdf
> Help center  • Email options
> 
> ©2017 YouTube, LLC 901 Cherry Ave, San Bruno, CA 94066, USA
> 
>
>
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