Eeeew.
- Original Message -
From: Daniel Winheld dwinh...@comcast.net
Date: Wednesday, January 11, 2012 12:40 am
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
To: EUGENE BRAIG IV brai...@osu.edu
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
When did they change from gut saws?
On Jan 10
I agree with Chris, it is surprising that with their interest in
timbre-structures Schoenberg and followers apparently made no remarks on such
a major timbre change as that caused by moving from gut to metal strings;
although, Klangfarbenmelodie seems to have been a technique for fracturing
Howard,
--- On Sun, 1/8/12, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
Performances of their music were rare in those days, so the
issue of performance practice alternatives would not have
loomed large. And with the exception of the modern
early music movement, I can't think of many
Interesting topic.
This is maybe a bit facile, but I believe that the sound produced has a
lot more to do with the musician than it does with the particular
instrument or string material. OK an authentic gut-strung violin will
no doubt feel better to somebody who wants to produce
...@yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 5:34 am
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
To: Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
I agree with Chris, it is surprising that with their interest
in timbre-structures Schoenberg
On Jan 10, 2012, at 4:21 AM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
OK, I used the Second Viennese School composers as an example due to the
particular concern they had with timbre at a minute level. The issue could
just as easily been voiced by Strauss, Mahler, Debussy, Ravel or others.
Around the
Howard,
--- On Tue, 1/10/12, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
Have you read Rimsky-Korsakov's Principles of
Orchestration? It comes from precisely this
period. (You can find English versions online)
I've read portions of it, but it's quite a large document to browse
On Tue, 10 Jan 2012 12:21:18 -0800 (PST), Christopher Wilke wrote
Howard,
--- On Tue, 1/10/12, howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com wrote:
Have you read Rimsky-Korsakov's Principles of
Orchestration? It comes from precisely this
period. (You can find English versions online)
Eugene,
--- On Tue, 1/10/12, EUGENE BRAIG IV brai...@osu.edu wrote:
In the song cycle Ancient
Voices of Children, George Crumb asks
the mandolin be played with a
metal paper clip in stead of a plectrum
of more typical material:
plastics, tortoiseshell, etc. His
intent was to
On Jan 10, 2012, at 12:21 PM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
I've read portions of it,
More than I have, then.
but it's quite a large document to browse through. Relevant to the topic of
this discussion: What does he have to say about the relative merits and
defects of gut vs. steel strings
Did his ghost finish it for him
RT
From: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com
On Jan 10, 2012, at 12:21 PM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
I've read portions of it,
More than I have, then.
but it's quite a large document to browse through. Relevant to the topic
of this discussion: What does
--- On Tue, 1/10/12, R. Mattes r...@mh-freiburg.de wrote:
He died in 1908 - that's pretty much before the general
shift to
metal strings on bowed instruments.
I thought it seemed a bit early for Rimsky-Korsakov to be discussing steel
strings in much depth. Does he discuss the tone of
On Jan 10, 2012, at 12:52 PM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
I thought it seemed a bit early for Rimsky-Korsakov to be discussing steel
strings in much depth. Does he discuss the tone of metal strings anywhere,
perhaps even a remark noting them as a new novelty?
Metal and steel are mentioned
On Jan 10, 2012, at 12:49 PM, Roman Turovsky wrote of Rimsky-Korsakov's
Principles of Orchestration:
Did his ghost finish it for him
RT.
Of course. Rimsky-Korsakov was like most musicians. On the whole, they don't
write well, so they make much use of ghost writers.
The name you're
4:00 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
On Jan 10, 2012, at 12:49 PM, Roman Turovsky wrote of Rimsky-Korsakov's
Principles of Orchestration:
Did his ghost finish it for him
RT.
Of course. Rimsky-Korsakov was like most musicians. On the whole, they
don't write well, so
On Jan 10, 2012, at 1:09 PM, Roman Turovsky wrote:
Hmmm, what about those musicians who write rather well, in many languages,
including dead ones?
You have to have a ghost writer if you're going to write in a dead language.
--
To get on or off this list see list information at
as I recall Orff wrote masterfully in ancient Greek and Latin, without being
dead.
RT
- Original Message -
From: howard posner howardpos...@ca.rr.com
To: lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 4:14 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
On Jan 10
howardpos...@ca.rr.com
To: lute List lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Sent: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 4:14 PM
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
On Jan 10, 2012, at 1:09 PM, Roman Turovsky wrote:
Hmmm, what about those musicians who write rather well, in many
languages, including dead ones
: Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:43 pm
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, EUGENE BRAIG IV
brai...@osu.edu
Eugene,
--- On Tue, 1/10/12, EUGENE BRAIG IV brai...@osu.edu wrote:
In the song cycle
the melody up or
down. Bowed saw isn't much like any lutey kin.
Eugene
- Original Message -
From: Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:43 pm
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
To: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, EUGENE BRAIG IV
close to the pitches
notated for saw. The best I could do is generally follow the melody up or
down. Bowed saw isn't much like any lutey kin.
Eugene
- Original Message -
From: Christopher Wilke chriswi...@yahoo.com
Date: Tuesday, January 10, 2012 3:43 pm
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning
, Guitarist and Composer
www.christopherwilke.com
--- On Sat, 1/7/12, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com wrote:
From: Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
To: t...@heartistrymusic.com, e...@gamutstrings.com, howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Date
On Jan 8, 2012, at 5:17 AM, Christopher Wilke wrote:
I find the area of performance practice in the early 20th century to be
extremely fascinating. There were a lot of changes that effected the quality
of instrumental timbre, but they seem to have happened with little complaint
or
2012 15h47
Objet : [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
I don't think it was me made the remarks about tense people tuning
sharp,
it's not an effect I've noticed.
Gordon
-Original Message-
From: [1]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu
[mailto:[2]lute-...@cs.dartmouth.edu] On Behalf
.
--- En date de : Ven 6.1.12, t...@heartistrymusic.com
t...@heartistrymusic.com a ecrit :
De: t...@heartistrymusic.com t...@heartistrymusic.com
Objet: Re: [LUTE] tuning fork at 433Hz?
A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com
Date: Vendredi 6 janvier 2012
...@gamutstrings.com; howardpos...@ca.rr.com
Cc: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu
Subject: [LUTE] Re: tuning fork at 433Hz?
Thank you all for your responses, and your detailed explanations, Tom.
I agree that
In fact, that's one reason pitch has risen over the past few hundred
years - more string
...@heartistrymusic.com a
ecrit :
De: t...@heartistrymusic.com t...@heartistrymusic.com
Objet: Re: [LUTE] tuning fork at 433Hz?
A: lute@cs.dartmouth.edu, Anthony Hind agno3ph...@yahoo.com
Date: Vendredi 6 janvier 2012, 23h39
This is very interesting
This is very interesting to me, because an old friend recently alerted me to
a new line of thinking claiming that 432Hz OUGHT to be true concert pitch.
There are websites devoting a lot of space to articles and discussions about
this.
http://www.omega432.com/music.html
So true. I recall years ago, playing a mandolino in the double
Vovaldi concerto, with a modern chamber orchestra. The concertmaster
gave a true a=440 to tune all the string players, but most of the
string players tuned sharper than that, and they were around 443. I
recall in rehearsals
On Jan 6, 2012, at 3:43 PM, Edward Martin wrote:
I
recall in rehearsals stopping, and inquiring why they did that. They
responded that many of the individual violinists tuned sharp, so I
can hear myself, and they found that it was easier for them to play that way.
The usual answer is
How silly is that? Playing sharp _is_ out of tune!
At 05:51 PM 1/6/2012, howard posner wrote:
On Jan 6, 2012, at 3:43 PM, Edward Martin wrote:
I
recall in rehearsals stopping, and inquiring why they did that. They
responded that many of the individual violinists tuned sharp, so I
On Jan 6, 2012, at 4:17 PM, Edward Martin wrote:
The usual answer is better sharp than out of tune.
How silly is that? Playing sharp _is_ out of tune!
Well, it's a joke, but like much humor, it's based in experience. If the
orchestra is playing at 441 and the flute player comes in at 442
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