LyX-to-LaTeX roundtrips (was: Re: why people give up on open source software)

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 8:59 PM, Scott Kostyshak skost...@lyx.org wrote: On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead hal.kierst...@icloud.com wrote: On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: LOL, how can you expect fast advances when the LyX pretty much

LyX-to-LaTeX roundtrips (was: Re: why people give up on open source software)

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 8:59 PM, Scott Kostyshak skost...@lyx.org wrote: On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead hal.kierst...@icloud.com wrote: On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: LOL, how can you expect fast advances when the LyX pretty much

LyX-to-LaTeX roundtrips (was: Re: why people give up on open source software)

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 8:59 PM, Scott Kostyshak wrote: > On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead > wrote: >> On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt wrote: >> LOL, how can you expect fast advances when the LyX

Re: why people give up on open source software

No, hed doesn't, he got into the program :-)-O el On 2013-10-23 18:50 , Ernesto Posse wrote: You do understand that a lot of open-source software, including LyX, is developed by *volunteers*, do you? On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 12:33 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com mailto:snowsh...@q.com

Re: why people give up on open source software

I do my CVs (in German and English, hence 2) in the EuroPass format. (Google is your friend here). Unfortunately there is no LyX module for it which really works (for me) so I use the LaTeX version(s) with TeXshop. That is ok, because it doesn't change a lot and the changes are easy (the odd

Re: why people give up on open source software

No, hed doesn't, he got into the program :-)-O el On 2013-10-23 18:50 , Ernesto Posse wrote: You do understand that a lot of open-source software, including LyX, is developed by *volunteers*, do you? On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 12:33 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com mailto:snowsh...@q.com

Re: why people give up on open source software

I do my CVs (in German and English, hence 2) in the EuroPass format. (Google is your friend here). Unfortunately there is no LyX module for it which really works (for me) so I use the LaTeX version(s) with TeXshop. That is ok, because it doesn't change a lot and the changes are easy (the odd

Re: why people give up on open source software

No, hed doesn't, he "got into the program" :-)-O el On 2013-10-23 18:50 , Ernesto Posse wrote: > You do understand that a lot of open-source software, including > LyX, is developed by *volunteers*, do you? > > > On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 12:33 PM, Ken Springer

Re: why people give up on open source software

I do my CVs (in German and English, hence 2) in the EuroPass format. (Google is your friend here). Unfortunately there is no LyX module for it which really works (for me) so I use the LaTeX version(s) with TeXshop. That is ok, because it doesn't change a lot and the changes are easy (the odd

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But, as I wrote in

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 11:28:44 +1300 Bryan Baldwin br...@katofiad.co.nz wrote: On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. That's backwards. Its part of the

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead hal.kierst...@icloud.com wrote: On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 10:32:05 +1300 John O'Gorman j...@og.co.nz wrote: On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting is requested by developers, shouldn't there be some thanks shown by

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 10:17 AM, Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But,

Re: why people give up on open source software

Ken, you are not the one doing the fixing. The ones doing the fixing are the ones deserving of gratitude and the ones doing the real work, far more than the ones reporting the bugs. Reporting bugs (politely) is always appreciated. Reporting bugs while insulting, and trashing the *volunteer* work

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 1:25 PM, John Coppens wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting is requested by developers,

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But, as I wrote in

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 11:28:44 +1300 Bryan Baldwin br...@katofiad.co.nz wrote: On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. That's backwards. Its part of the

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead hal.kierst...@icloud.com wrote: On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt sl...@troubleshooters.com wrote: On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 10:32:05 +1300 John O'Gorman j...@og.co.nz wrote: On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting is requested by developers, shouldn't there be some thanks shown by

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 10:17 AM, Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But,

Re: why people give up on open source software

Ken, you are not the one doing the fixing. The ones doing the fixing are the ones deserving of gratitude and the ones doing the real work, far more than the ones reporting the bugs. Reporting bugs (politely) is always appreciated. Reporting bugs while insulting, and trashing the *volunteer* work

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 1:25 PM, John Coppens wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting is requested by developers,

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer wrote: > I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But > I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial > program for a platform now long gone. > > But, as I wrote in >

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: > > Just a question, does viable equate something that will be > > successful in the long run? > > It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, > although

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 11:28:44 +1300 Bryan Baldwin wrote: > On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: > > And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS > > PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. > > That's backwards. Its part of the

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt wrote: > On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 > Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > >> 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: >>> Just a question, does viable equate something that will be >>> successful in the long run?

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, Oct 26, 2013 at 12:38 PM, Hal Kierstead wrote: > > On Oct 26, 2013, at 9:25 AM, Steve Litt wrote: > >> On Fri, 25 Oct 2013 09:49:13 +0200 >> Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: >> >>> 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer:

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Sat, 26 Oct 2013 10:32:05 +1300 John O'Gorman wrote: > On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: > > On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > > > > > > For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any > > need or desire to have an

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer wrote: > But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, > if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting > is requested by developers, shouldn't there be some thanks shown by

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 10:17 AM, Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer wrote: I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone.

Re: why people give up on open source software

Ken, you are not the one doing the fixing. The ones doing the fixing are the ones deserving of gratitude and the ones doing the real work, far more than the ones reporting the bugs. Reporting bugs (politely) is always appreciated. Reporting bugs while insulting, and trashing the *volunteer* work

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/13 1:25 PM, John Coppens wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 17:53:35 -0600 Ken Springer wrote: But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a program, assuming that reporting is requested by developers,

Re: why people give up on open source software

25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a frustratingly slow pace these days. But in some sense, the fact that we continue to advance

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: What I mean is that I do not want personally to create some kind of killer app, ..which LyX already is. I like the gasp of people, who have been inflicted with LaTeX, when I show them how easy and straightforward it

Re: why people give up on open source software

You think you are owed an explanation of how everything you download and run works. That could be a mistake. These licenses generally state, AS IS WITH NO WARRANTY OR MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. Its usually printed all or in part in all captial letters. And that may

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a frustratingly slow pace these

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 11:12 AM, Bruce Pourciau wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers that contain mathematics, figures, cross-references, and

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. That's backwards. Its part of the solution. It doesn't matter if you read it

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:55:37 -0600 Richard Talley rich.tal...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an impression of mass exodus. Just my pulling back from the potential promise

Re: why people give up on open source software

25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a frustratingly slow pace these days. But in some sense, the fact that we continue to advance

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes lasgout...@lyx.org wrote: What I mean is that I do not want personally to create some kind of killer app, ..which LyX already is. I like the gasp of people, who have been inflicted with LaTeX, when I show them how easy and straightforward it

Re: why people give up on open source software

You think you are owed an explanation of how everything you download and run works. That could be a mistake. These licenses generally state, AS IS WITH NO WARRANTY OR MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A PARTICULAR PURPOSE. Its usually printed all or in part in all captial letters. And that may

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a frustratingly slow pace these

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 11:12 AM, Bruce Pourciau wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers that contain mathematics, figures, cross-references, and

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. That's backwards. Its part of the solution. It doesn't matter if you read it

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:55:37 -0600 Richard Talley rich.tal...@gmail.com wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an impression of mass exodus. Just my pulling back from the potential promise

Re: why people give up on open source software

25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in the long run? It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although at a frustratingly slow pace these days. But in some sense, the fact that we continue to advance

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Fri, Oct 25, 2013 at 9:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > What I mean is that I do not want personally to create some kind of killer > app, > ..which LyX already is. I like the gasp of people, who have been inflicted with LaTeX, when I show them how easy and

Re: why people give up on open source software

> You think you are owed an explanation of how everything you download > and run works. That could be a mistake. These licenses generally > state, "AS IS WITH NO WARRANTY OR MERCHANTABILITY OR FITNESS FOR A > PARTICULAR PURPOSE". Its usually printed all or in part in all > captial letters. And

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: > 25/10/2013 02:37, Ken Springer: >> Just a question, does viable equate something that will be successful in >> the long run? > > It is already successful. We have users, LyX continues to advance, although > at a frustratingly slow pace

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 11:12 AM, Bruce Pourciau wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers that contain mathematics, figures, cross-references, and

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 26/10/13 04:12, Bruce Pourciau wrote: On Oct 25, 2013, at 2:49 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: For me, LyX is in fact a killer app, in the sense that it has killed any need or desire to have an affair, a one night stand, or even flirt with any other app. I write long, structured papers

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/26/2013 02:08 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote: And that may be the origin of the problem, SINCE IN ALL CAPS IT IS PLAIN UNREADABLE AND THUS NO ONE WILL ACTUALLY READ IT. That's backwards. Its part of the solution. It doesn't matter if you read it

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 12:55:37 -0600 Richard Talley wrote: > On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer > wrote: > > > > > I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an > > impression of "mass exodus". Just my pulling back from the > >

Re: why people give up on open source software

2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious, and so am I: if you want professional software and think LyX is not professional (or if it does not fit your needs for other reasons), don't use it. Sine ira et studio.

Re: why people give up on open source software

), and then somehow turns that into why people give up on open source software, as if there's some kind of mass exodus from Open Source. How does THAT work? My observation is that Open Source is gaining mindshare and usage pretty much continuously. I leave you with one more article I often think of when reading

Re: why people give up on open source software

You do seem to have very strong opinions about open-source, and demand very high standards. Would you care to tell us how many open-source projects have you created or at least been an active developer in? On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 1:41 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I do, but that's no

Re: why people give up on open source software

Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious, and so am I: if you want professional software and think LyX is not

Re: why people give up on open source software

24/10/2013 15:59, Ken Springer: There is also the segment of the open source area where they actively ask you to file bugs that can be fixed. Then the bugs just sit there, never getting fixed. If you aren't going to actively fix the bugs, then don't ask for help in identifying those bugs.

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 3:59 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious,

Re: why people give up on open source software

. Another puzzler: someone has a problem with a single LaTeX package, generalizes it to all Open Source (except LyX), and then somehow turns that into why people give up on open source software, as if there's some kind of mass exodus from Open Source. How does THAT work? My observation is that Open

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to print, then they export to LaTeX. Good luck with it. A somewhat close analog to

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an impression of mass exodus. Just my pulling back from the potential promise I saw that open source has, but IMO is not doing a good job of meeting. I think

Getting Support: was: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 10:32:55 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: Product support, customer service, in general, sucks. Online, offline, commercial, open source, just about everywhere. For software these days, you are supposed to join a forum. If I went back through all my forum posts

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 7:35 PM, Walter van Holst walter.van.ho...@xs4all.nl wrote: On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 25/10/2013 3:32 a.m., Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: I cannot speak for other free (as in freedom) software, but the deal is simple: programmers do what they can and scratch their own itches, either because they need a feature or they want to implement it, and users do what they want and

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 05:32 AM, Ken Springer wrote: snip We know your argument. Seriously, We've heard it everywhere all the time...end-less-ly. Everybody wishes that their software was robust with magic documentation and free specialists that will fix

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 9:03 AM, Vincent van Ravesteijn wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 3:59 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com mailto:snowsh...@q.com wrote: Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not

Re: why people give up on open source software

I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 11:35 AM, Walter van Holst wrote: On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to print, then they export to LaTeX. Good

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 5:13 PM, Bryan Baldwin wrote: On 10/25/2013 05:32 AM, Ken Springer wrote: snip We know your argument. Seriously, We've heard it everywhere all the time...end-less-ly. Everybody wishes that their software was robust with magic documentation and free specialists that will fix your

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 12:55 PM, Richard Talley wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com mailto:snowsh...@q.com wrote: I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an impression of mass exodus. Just my pulling back from the potential promise I saw

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 8:32 AM, Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: 24/10/2013 15:59, Ken Springer: There is also the segment of the open source area where they actively ask you to file bugs that can be fixed. Then the bugs just sit there, never getting fixed. If you aren't going to actively fix the bugs, then

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 01:29 PM, Ken Springer wrote: On 10/24/13 5:13 PM, Bryan Baldwin wrote: On 10/25/2013 05:32 AM, Ken Springer wrote: snip We know your argument. Seriously, We've heard it

Re: Getting Support: was: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 1:27 PM, Steve Litt wrote: On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 10:32:55 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: Product support, customer service, in general, sucks. Online, offline, commercial, open source, just about everywhere. For software these days, you are supposed to join a forum. If

Re: why people give up on open source software

2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious, and so am I: if you want professional software and think LyX is not professional (or if it does not fit your needs for other reasons), don't use it. Sine ira et studio.

Re: why people give up on open source software

), and then somehow turns that into why people give up on open source software, as if there's some kind of mass exodus from Open Source. How does THAT work? My observation is that Open Source is gaining mindshare and usage pretty much continuously. I leave you with one more article I often think of when reading

Re: why people give up on open source software

You do seem to have very strong opinions about open-source, and demand very high standards. Would you care to tell us how many open-source projects have you created or at least been an active developer in? On Wed, Oct 23, 2013 at 1:41 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I do, but that's no

Re: why people give up on open source software

Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious, and so am I: if you want professional software and think LyX is not

Re: why people give up on open source software

24/10/2013 15:59, Ken Springer: There is also the segment of the open source area where they actively ask you to file bugs that can be fixed. Then the bugs just sit there, never getting fixed. If you aren't going to actively fix the bugs, then don't ask for help in identifying those bugs.

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 3:59 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not professional ? Right, don't use it then. Not sure how you feel, so no reply. He's serious,

Re: why people give up on open source software

. Another puzzler: someone has a problem with a single LaTeX package, generalizes it to all Open Source (except LyX), and then somehow turns that into why people give up on open source software, as if there's some kind of mass exodus from Open Source. How does THAT work? My observation is that Open

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to print, then they export to LaTeX. Good luck with it. A somewhat close analog to

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 10:32 AM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: I can't speak for Rich, but it was not my intent to leave an impression of mass exodus. Just my pulling back from the potential promise I saw that open source has, but IMO is not doing a good job of meeting. I think

Getting Support: was: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, 24 Oct 2013 10:32:55 -0600 Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com wrote: Product support, customer service, in general, sucks. Online, offline, commercial, open source, just about everywhere. For software these days, you are supposed to join a forum. If I went back through all my forum posts

Re: why people give up on open source software

On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 7:35 PM, Walter van Holst walter.van.ho...@xs4all.nl wrote: On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 25/10/2013 3:32 a.m., Jean-Marc Lasgouttes wrote: I cannot speak for other free (as in freedom) software, but the deal is simple: programmers do what they can and scratch their own itches, either because they need a feature or they want to implement it, and users do what they want and

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/25/2013 05:32 AM, Ken Springer wrote: snip We know your argument. Seriously, We've heard it everywhere all the time...end-less-ly. Everybody wishes that their software was robust with magic documentation and free specialists that will fix

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 9:03 AM, Vincent van Ravesteijn wrote: On Thu, Oct 24, 2013 at 3:59 PM, Ken Springer snowsh...@q.com mailto:snowsh...@q.com wrote: Hi, Jürgen, Interspersed reply... On 10/24/13 1:01 AM, Jürgen Spitzmüller wrote: 2013/10/24 Ken Springe Not

Re: why people give up on open source software

I'm not a programmer, learned many years ago that is not for me. But I did contribute, for free, to writing the help files of a commercial program for a platform now long gone. But, as I wrote in news://news.gmane.org:119/l4bi37$vh$1...@ger.gmane.org, if I help by reporting bugs I find in a

Re: why people give up on open source software

On 10/24/13 11:35 AM, Walter van Holst wrote: On 24/10/2013 07:32, Richard Talley wrote: I've read good things about Scrivener. It's more a 'book project management' program than a word processor. I know some people use it for everything until it's time to print, then they export to LaTeX. Good

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