Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
If you don't want to bother with pressure bleeding, drip bleeding will probably be fine. On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 9:32 PM, G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com wrote: New brakes, you should change out the fluid with new. Brake fluid degrades with use. Now is a good time. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 11:32 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: You may be right, I hate to spend all the money on a master cylinder and not need to... I need to get some more fluid and try again. This time I'll buy a quart. -Curt Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:23:42 -0700 From: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH! Message-ID: cantulyjj7ac+wrkn2vv2nvsk2bkis-e3f7qxpv9ggda0j5y...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Curt, I'll bet that you still have air in the line. Did you start the reverse bleed at the longest line, then the next longest, etc? Air acts as a spring since it can be compressed. If there is a section of the brake line what has fluid before the bubble and after the bubble [like from the master cylinder] that air will compress enough to feel like you have brake pressure then when released, expand and push the fluid back to the master... next peddle push, you start pushing fluid all over again.. Suggest you take some fluid out of the master tank and pump from the bleed screw again.. Or, if you have a spare electric fuel pump lying around... attach some barb fittings and clear hose to it and let it do the work while you watch the master tank for bubbles [you will see them as they are pushed up]. In any case, hope it sorts out for you. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 8:56 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Fred, who is the best guy in the whole wide world, loaned me his speedee bleeder (a proper one that hooks to the tire and has a regulator) which makes this the easiest job in the world. The guys who said air in the lines were right, everything now works as it should. Having used one, the next time I need to do brakes I'll either borrow Fred's again or buy my own bleeder, its not worth mucking about with any other method, you open the bleed line, the air comes out followed by fluid, you let as much fluid as you want to purge come out and you're done. I imagine it makes changing the fluid very easy. That reminds me I should see if the adapter he has fits the Ranger, I should replace the fluid in that while I have the bleeder. -Curt Date: Sun, 16 Jun 2013 11:46:21 -0600 From: Brian Toscano brian.tosc...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH! Message-ID: CACnCPhkWFs0jjxBk0rpLJC=39leggxele+_o71rrru5kssm...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 If you don't want to bother with pressure bleeding, drip bleeding will probably be fine. On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 9:32 PM, G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com wrote: New brakes, you should change out the fluid with new. Brake fluid degrades with use. Now is a good time. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 11:32 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: You may be right, I hate to spend all the money on a master cylinder and not need to... I need to get some more fluid and try again. This time I'll buy a quart. -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Curt Raymond wrote: Having used one, the next time I need to do brakes I'll either borrow Fred's again or buy my own bleeder, its not worth mucking about with any other method, you open the bleed line, the air comes out followed by fluid, you let as much fluid as you want to purge come out and you're done. I imagine it makes changing the fluid very easy. Now all you need is a liter of ATE racing blue to fill it with next year when you change the fluid before it darkens much. When the blue dye starts coming out, you've flushed that line. I bought a liter of the stuff ten years ago and still haven't opened it. I plan on annual changes but actually do it every two years or so and by then I can tell the old from the new by sight without the help of any dye. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 5:07 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: I bought a liter of the stuff ten years ago and still haven't opened it. M ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 5:35 PM, Alex Chamberlain apchamberl...@gmail.comwrote: On Sun, Jun 16, 2013 at 5:07 PM, Mitch Haley m...@voyager.net wrote: I bought a liter of the stuff ten years ago and still haven't opened it. Me too. (Well, more like five years ago.) Is it still good? Alex ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Alex Chamberlain wrote: Me too. (Well, more like five years ago.) Is it still good? Mine came in a steel can. I assume it's good until the can springs a leak. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Curt, I'll bet that you still have air in the line. Did you start the reverse bleed at the longest line, then the next longest, etc? Air acts as a spring since it can be compressed. If there is a section of the brake line what has fluid before the bubble and after the bubble [like from the master cylinder] that air will compress enough to feel like you have brake pressure then when released, expand and push the fluid back to the master... next peddle push, you start pushing fluid all over again.. Suggest you take some fluid out of the master tank and pump from the bleed screw again.. Or, if you have a spare electric fuel pump lying around... attach some barb fittings and clear hose to it and let it do the work while you watch the master tank for bubbles [you will see them as they are pushed up]. In any case, hope it sorts out for you. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 8:56 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
No. sounds exactly like air in the line. try bleeding again. Frustrating, and expensive, especially with silicon fluid. Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Curt. Sounds like an air bubble somewhere. I have a Speedi-Bleed that you can use. Use other email for reply. Fred Moir Lynn MA Diesel preferred. From: Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com To: Diesel List mercedes@okiebenz.com Sent: Wednesday, June 12, 2013 11:56 AM Subject: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH! Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
G Mann wrote: Curt, I'll bet that you still have air in the line. Did you start the reverse bleed at the longest line, then the next longest, etc? The Olds drove me nuts for a week. First I did the farthest wheel (the one I had to replace a line on) until I quit seeing bubbles, then I did the rest. Pedal still went to the floor. Tested it on a dirt road, one front brake would lock, the other three couldn't skid in gravel. Bled all around again, no change. Pretty much decided it was in the ABS unit or the master cylinder. Old style ABS unit with bleed screws on it, no bubbles from ABS bleeders. Problem was in the back brake that had the busted line. I just didn't bleed it enough the first two times. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? If it were a damaged master cylinder (MC) seals, then it would not _hold_ pressure. If pumping the pedal will build pressure, and the pedal does not sink, then the master cylinder is likely okay. Once there is pressure, does it feel soft? Soft pedal is a clear indication of air in the lines. When you release and try again, is that with the car driving down the road, or when sitting in the driveway? If the pedal is firm, but too low, then also check for something pushing the pads too far from the rotor surface. Drum brakes, which use a spring to return, a low pedal or pumping is an indication of brake mis-adjustment. Since disk brakes use the rotor movement rather than a spring for return, a warped rotor, or one not seated flush on the hub will cause similar symptoms. -- Philip, who has one car in the fleet with 4 wheel drum brakes. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
When I ordered new rubber brake lines for the 260E I had, I bought a $10 Brake Bleeding Kit as well http://www.autohausaz.com/search/product.aspx?sid=xz2z3q55xchaxxbgw1xftfropartnumber=19200LISLE First time for me, but had no issues (thankfully) bleeding/flushing the lines with new syn DOT 3/4 fluid, just by pumping the brake pedal (being careful not to depress it fully) keeping the reservoir filled. IIRC I did go through 2-3 (small) bottles making sure all the old brake fluid was flushed out. -- Chris J. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
You may be right, I hate to spend all the money on a master cylinder and not need to... I need to get some more fluid and try again. This time I'll buy a quart. -Curt Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:23:42 -0700 From: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH! Message-ID: cantulyjj7ac+wrkn2vv2nvsk2bkis-e3f7qxpv9ggda0j5y...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Curt, I'll bet that you still have air in the line. Did you start the reverse bleed at the longest line, then the next longest, etc? Air acts as a spring since it can be compressed. If there is a section of the brake line what has fluid before the bubble and after the bubble [like from the master cylinder] that air will compress enough to feel like you have brake pressure then when released, expand and push the fluid back to the master... next peddle push, you start pushing fluid all over again.. Suggest you take some fluid out of the master tank and pump from the bleed screw again.. Or, if you have a spare electric fuel pump lying around... attach some barb fittings and clear hose to it and let it do the work while you watch the master tank for bubbles [you will see them as they are pushed up]. In any case, hope it sorts out for you. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 8:56 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH!
New brakes, you should change out the fluid with new. Brake fluid degrades with use. Now is a good time. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 11:32 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: You may be right, I hate to spend all the money on a master cylinder and not need to... I need to get some more fluid and try again. This time I'll buy a quart. -Curt Date: Wed, 12 Jun 2013 09:23:42 -0700 From: G Mann g2ma...@gmail.com To: Mercedes Discussion List mercedes@okiebenz.com Subject: Re: [MBZ] 190D brakes ARRGH! Message-ID: cantulyjj7ac+wrkn2vv2nvsk2bkis-e3f7qxpv9ggda0j5y...@mail.gmail.com Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Curt, I'll bet that you still have air in the line. Did you start the reverse bleed at the longest line, then the next longest, etc? Air acts as a spring since it can be compressed. If there is a section of the brake line what has fluid before the bubble and after the bubble [like from the master cylinder] that air will compress enough to feel like you have brake pressure then when released, expand and push the fluid back to the master... next peddle push, you start pushing fluid all over again.. Suggest you take some fluid out of the master tank and pump from the bleed screw again.. Or, if you have a spare electric fuel pump lying around... attach some barb fittings and clear hose to it and let it do the work while you watch the master tank for bubbles [you will see them as they are pushed up]. In any case, hope it sorts out for you. Grant... On Wed, Jun 12, 2013 at 8:56 AM, Curt Raymond curtlud...@yahoo.com wrote: Used Grant's method to bleed the rear brakes on my '84 190D today. I wish I could say it worked perfectly but it didn't. I *think* yesterday's efforts to tag-team the bleeding (with Angie's help) may have cost me in the long run. Right now if I pump the brakes they'll build pressure and work fine until I release and try again at which point they're back to bottom of the throw. The fronts still work fine but the pedal is bottom of the barrel. I *think* this means the MC needs replacing, what say you? -Curt ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com For new and used parts go to www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
