Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Buy Shell, it's usually the best (better milage and least smoke, as a rule, over my cars). Other brands I don't have much experience with, since I almost always buy my fuel at Shell or the local CountryMark. The latter is 5% Biodiesel as a rule, and refined right down the road. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
It does happen in the current USLD era, especially with truckers. Diesel fuel in non-cold areas is rarely treated with anti-gel. Luther KB5QHUForest Park, IL '98 ML320 Max (171,xxx mi) On 9/29/2013 7:54 AM, Mitch Haley wrote: Used to hear stories of people fueling up in the south, driving to the north, and if they parked overnight without refueling up north first, having gel problems. Doesn't happen often, and of course, only once per driver, so it's hard to say if it still happens. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Probably just much better diesel fuel -- all those European engines require 50 cetane, and in the good old days of cheap diesel, you were very lucky if summer fuel in the US hit 30 cetane. Absolute crap -- that's why truckers always left their engines running, it was usually impossible to start them cold without a block heater. Winter fuel waxed up all the time, too, if indeed you could actually find any. USLD fuel is MUCH better all round except for lacking enough lubricity for some rotary pumps. Higher cetane, cleaner burning, easy starts. Of course, since it's not just what's left over from making gasoline, it's more expensive, too. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Gerry Archer wrote: When he was first out of college, son drove a diesel (110) back and forth, north to south, on his sales trips. He complained about hard starting in the north if he fueled up in the south during the cold months. Nowadays I suspect that mid-Florida, at least, gets winter fuel all year round since both my cars start with just a touch of the switch; winter or summer; something they didn't do in the past. Could it be that or could ULSD have something to do with it? I haven't seen anything on the internet about it. Used to hear stories of people fueling up in the south, driving to the north, and if they parked overnight without refueling up north first, having gel problems. Doesn't happen often, and of course, only once per driver, so it's hard to say if it still happens. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
So why does the same vehicle get better mileage with the good old higher sulphur diesel that the ulsd nowadays? Sent from my iPhone On Sep 29, 2013, at 7:33 AM, Peter Frederick psf...@earthlink.net wrote: Probably just much better diesel fuel -- all those European engines require 50 cetane, and in the good old days of cheap diesel, you were very lucky if summer fuel in the US hit 30 cetane. Absolute crap -- that's why truckers always left their engines running, it was usually impossible to start them cold without a block heater. Winter fuel waxed up all the time, too, if indeed you could actually find any. USLD fuel is MUCH better all round except for lacking enough lubricity for some rotary pumps. Higher cetane, cleaner burning, easy starts. Of course, since it's not just what's left over from making gasoline, it's more expensive, too. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Higher cetane index (ignitability) vs higher BTU content with lower ignitability. I have not noticed much of a difference, but then I've only been driving diesels for 17 years. Diesel fuel varies in BTU content and cetane index much more than gasoline, with quite a bit of it being fairly local. The stuff I usually use is refined a mile or so from where I work. All the good stuff goes to Europe, they won't buy the sludge. Peter ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Used to hear stories of people fueling up in the south, driving to the north, and if they parked overnight without refueling up north first, having gel problems. For me it was west to east. (Coastal to inland.) -- Jim ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Peter wrote: ...I have not noticed much of a difference, but then I've only been driving diesels for 17 years. ... All the good stuff goes to Europe, they won't buy the sludge. ...hmm... 25 years ago I was driving my first diesel 6.2 GM G30 rated Beanville van. Beanville is what insco put on my insco card, should have been Beauville. Maybe fonts from back then had upside-down u or n? Give us a hint - can we purchase the good stuff that goes to Europe? Or is that totally unobtainium? Thanks. mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Peter Frederick wrote: Higher cetane index (ignitability) vs higher BTU content with lower ignitability. I have not noticed much of a difference, but then I've only been driving diesels for 17 years. IIRC, a little bio is said to up the cetane and MPG, but B100 drops the mpg due to lower BTU content. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. Dan Sent from my iPad On Sep 27, 2013, at 10:06 PM, Mountain Man maontin@gmail.com wrote: D an wrote: As the ambient temps drop ... Perhaps change from summer to winter blend at the pump might affect your numbers this time of year also? mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. Here in Michigan, it all comes from the same pipeline, the difference between brands is all in the additives, and all of it gets 10% alcohol except for some rare and expensive boat and snowmobile fuel pumps. What's surprising to me is that the 1997 Oldsmobile is running slightly negative fuel trim on this crap (the feedback loop is reducing fuel injection from baseline programming). The E320 runs around 7% positive fuel trim on gasahol, and I wonder what the mpg would be like if I could feed it straight hydrocarbons. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
That is pretty much the point of top tier fuels. They pledge to meet specific standards (which everyone has to anyway) but also provide additives to the base stock that others do not. In other words, it's pretty much the same fuel you get anywhere, but it has additives that the manufacturers like MB and BMW want in their engines. Funny, as research indicates the cost of the additives is pretty insignificant. As I said, this is a highly unscientific experiment, since I can't accurately measure the amount of fuel I use each tank full or exactly how full I fill it. I have to believe that a half a mile in my MPG calculations can easily be attributed to any number of errors. I'm going to continue to go with this fuel and see if there is a long term increase or difference. The cost differential is minimal enough over a year's time that I'm willing to give it a try, and it's not like anything bad is going to happen, either. Dan On Sep 28, 2013, at 8:38 AM, m...@voyager.net wrote: I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. Here in Michigan, it all comes from the same pipeline, the difference between brands is all in the additives, and all of it gets 10% alcohol except for some rare and expensive boat and snowmobile fuel pumps. What's surprising to me is that the 1997 Oldsmobile is running slightly negative fuel trim on this crap (the feedback loop is reducing fuel injection from baseline programming). The E320 runs around 7% positive fuel trim on gasahol, and I wonder what the mpg would be like if I could feed it straight hydrocarbons. Mitch. ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Dan wrote: I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. The system is not going to apportion fuels by locale, I suggest. What is the mpg difference between a winter or summer blend? mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Mountain Man wrote: Perhaps change from summer to winter blend at the pump might affect your numbers this time of year also? Dan wrote: I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. I believe even Florida gets winter blend diesel fuel. But is Penoff talking about gasoline or diesel? I understood it to be gasoline. And I suspect the other Dan is talking about diesel. Or maybe I'm just lost and confused... --Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
I'm talking about gasoline. I don't think we get winter blended gasoline. Dan On Sep 28, 2013, at 6:25 PM, Fmiser wrote: Mountain Man wrote: Perhaps change from summer to winter blend at the pump might affect your numbers this time of year also? Dan wrote: I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. I believe even Florida gets winter blend diesel fuel. But is Penoff talking about gasoline or diesel? I understood it to be gasoline. And I suspect the other Dan is talking about diesel. Or maybe I'm just lost and confused... --Philip ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Philip wrote: But is Penoff talking about gasoline or diesel? I understood it to be gasoline. And I suspect the other Dan is talking about diesel. Or maybe I'm just lost and confused... Not lost and confused. Dan Dan are both talking about gasoline. I posit that there is only one fuel across the country, primarily, except for the specialty fuels Mitch mentions available at specialty pumps. It seems plausible that even if FL does not need winter blend, it gets winter blend because of the logistics issues. mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
When he was first out of college, son drove a diesel (110) back and forth, north to south, on his sales trips. He complained about hard starting in the north if he fueled up in the south during the cold months. Nowadays I suspect that mid-Florida, at least, gets winter fuel all year round since both my cars start with just a touch of the switch; winter or summer; something they didn't do in the past. Could it be that or could ULSD have something to do with it? I haven't seen anything on the internet about it. Gerry Dan wrote: I don't think we get seasonally blended fuels here, as it never gets that cold. The system is not going to apportion fuels by locale, I suggest. What is the mpg difference between a winter or summer blend? mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com - No virus found in this message. Checked by AVG - www.avg.com Version: 2014.0.4142 / Virus Database: 3604/6706 - Release Date: 09/28/13 ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
[MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Well, I now have three tanks of fuel from top tier suppliers (Mobil/Shell) through my car, and while highly unscientific, I do appear to have picked up at least a half a mile per gallon. I will continue the experiment for a while to see if this gets better, stabilizes, or deteriorates. As the ambient temps drop I suspect my mileage will increase anyway. That won't be for a few more weeks at least, I suspect. We're still in the 90F range daily, but things should start to drop by mid October. Dan ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
D an wrote: As the ambient temps drop ... Perhaps change from summer to winter blend at the pump might affect your numbers this time of year also? mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
Re: [MBZ] Top Tier Fuel
Doesn't that drive them lower, not higher/better? Luther KB5QHUForest Park, IL '98 ML320 Max (171,xxx mi) On 9/27/2013 9:06 PM, Mountain Man wrote: Perhaps change from summer to winter blend at the pump might affect your numbers this time of year also? mao ___ http://www.okiebenz.com To search list archives http://www.okiebenz.com/archive/ To Unsubscribe or change delivery options go to: http://mail.okiebenz.com/mailman/listinfo/mercedes_okiebenz.com
