Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
(I'm posting this for the archives.) Thanks to a donation from Steven Fettig we have fixed the problem with using the keyboard at the boot prompt. This is in CVS, and in the latest snapshots. The keyboard does work under OpenBSD (including the installer), as long as ACPI is used. The keyboard does not yet work in DDB or UKC, so you can't just enable acpi at UKC; you will need to create an ACPI- enabled bsd.rd and bsd. Diffs similar to those Marco posted have also gone in, so there are no problems compiling an ACPI-enabled bsd.rd. If you just want OpenBSD (no Mac OS X) on your Intel Mac, you don't even need to bother with BootCamp. Create an install CD with an ACPI-enabled bsd.rd (and make sure you have an ACPI-enabled bsd to install - this can be made by running config(8) against an existing kernel). Then make sure you are running the latest firmware, and hold down C to boot the install CD. Share and enjoy :) Tom Theo de Raadt 5-Dec-06 14:13 Not working for me. I get this far: CD_ROM: 90 Loading /CDBOOT probing: pc0 com0 mem(699K 991M a20=on) disk: hd0+* cd0 boot c and there it stays forever. I suspect the c following the boot prompt is left over from hold c to boot from cd. The keyboard at this point is dead. Any ideas? I'd really like to get OpenBSD up on this beasty. I've tried several different home grown CDs plus the 11/29 snapshot CD from ftp.openbsd.org. In general this problem is happening because of usb keyboards being emulated as pckbd devices, perhaps using SMI or something. In anycase, something is wrong. I don't think anyone has figured out what yet. Maybe someone can get a machine to tom@ in the UK, so that he can try to figure it out.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Not working for me. I get this far: CD_ROM: 90 Loading /CDBOOT probing: pc0 com0 mem(699K 991M a20=on) disk: hd0+* cd0 boot c and there it stays forever. I suspect the c following the boot prompt is left over from hold c to boot from cd. The keyboard at this point is dead. Any ideas? I'd really like to get OpenBSD up on this beasty. I've tried several different home grown CDs plus the 11/29 snapshot CD from ftp.openbsd.org. In general this problem is happening because of usb keyboards being emulated as pckbd devices, perhaps using SMI or something. In anycase, something is wrong. I don't think anyone has figured out what yet. Maybe someone can get a machine to tom@ in the UK, so that he can try to figure it out.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On 12/1/2006 at 9:51 AM Jason Dixon wrote: |You can pick up cheap VLAN-capable switches on eBay. I have a Dell |3024 at home which works fine and runs $100-150 used. I'd never use |these in an enterprise environment, but they're fine for home testing. = Quick comment: the Dell 3024 switch has a noisy high-rpm fan in it. The Dell 3016 is fanless. Had I known that before I got my 3024, I would have gotten the 3016 :(
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On 12/1/06, Marco S Hyman [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Not working for me. I get this far: CD_ROM: 90 Loading /CDBOOT probing: pc0 com0 mem(699K 991M a20=on) disk: hd0+* cd0 boot c and there it stays forever. I suspect the c following the boot prompt is left over from hold c to boot from cd. The keyboard at this point is dead. Any ideas? I'd really like to get OpenBSD up on this beasty. I've tried several different home grown CDs plus the 11/29 snapshot CD from ftp.openbsd.org. // marc Hold the alt key instead of c. It will show a menu where you can double click on the cd (labelled Windows) to boot on it. It should then recognize your usb keyboard while booting.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Any ideas? I'd really like to get OpenBSD up on this beasty. There could be another way to install OpenBSD if you can't make the USB keyboard work while installing, I saw that in this post: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-miscm=116432931720765w=2 Well, at least theoretically, one could just replace the install script by one that does whatever you want it to, without asking any questions. Maybe that's easier than building an ACPI enabled bsd.rd? Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Tasmanian Devil writes: Well, at least theoretically, one could just replace the install script by one that does whatever you want it to, without asking any questions. Maybe that's easier than building an ACPI enabled bsd.rd? No, building an ACPI enabled bsd.rd was quite easy. It took more tries to build a working bsd for the running system -- just adding ACPI and MP to the generic kernel does NOT work with -current code -- than it did to get a working bsd.rd. However, the system dies under load. Took be about 4 tries to complete a build on the box. The lack of a keyboard under ddb doesn't make debugging easy. So I turned of ddb to get a crash but forgot to relocate /var/crash. Dumb, /var wasn't big enough. Then I got a crash, but had erased the bsd.gdb that went with it. Next time I build a new kernel I'll look at the dumps. // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
No, building an ACPI enabled bsd.rd was quite easy. It took more tries to build a working bsd for the running system -- just adding ACPI and MP to the generic kernel does NOT work with -current code -- than it did to get a working bsd.rd. However, the system dies under load. Took be about 4 tries to complete a build on the box. Hmm... sounds like I shouldn't update my source tree (it's still from Nov. 12, 2006). I had no crashes at all here so far. The lack of a keyboard under ddb doesn't make debugging easy. Yes, that's a bit of a problem. It seems that the keyboard doesn't work at the boot prompt either. Though for me that's exactly what I want, I want to have as little local access to my system as possible (it will run in a datacenter soon). Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Tasmanian Devil writes: Hmm... sounds like I shouldn't update my source tree (it's still from Nov. 12, 2006). I had no crashes at all here so far. Are you running stock Nov. 12, 2006 or that code plus patches? As for creating a bsd.rd that works with the mini... The easiest way to do that is to follow the instructions in release(8) to generate a home grown release directory and burn that directory onto a CD. Before issuing the make release command in /usr/src/etc replace the file /sys/arch/i386/conf/RAMDISK_CD with a config file that will create a bsd.rd that the mini can use. The result is a custom release CD with a bsd.rd for the mini and containing all of the release sets. I've a config file that works, but I'm still tweaking it. When I'm finished I'll post it. The biggest issue is that option SMALL_KERNEL cant be used with the ACPI devices so, to make space, you have to remove many of the unused devices. I wound up removing just about everything that wasn't mentioned in the mini dmesg. // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Hmm... sounds like I shouldn't update my source tree (it's still from Nov. 12, 2006). I had no crashes at all here so far. Are you running stock Nov. 12, 2006 or that code plus patches? My kernel and kernel sources are from Nov. 12, 2006, there's no important kernel patch since that date and the kernel works really fine. As for creating a bsd.rd that works with the mini... ... Thank you very much for these tips, I'll try that. :-) Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
- Original message - You can pick up cheap VLAN-capable switches on eBay. I have a Dell ... Bleh - the last time I messed with them (2-3 years ago), they were crap. On 12/1/06, Jason Dixon [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: On Dec 1, 2006, at 1:16 AM, Antoine Jacoutot wrote: On Thu, 30 Nov 2006, Jason Dixon wrote: Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. That's what VLANs are for. Just make sure your switch doesn't allow hopping. :) Ah yes ;-) Although, playing with the mini as a server looks more like something I would do at home where I don't have VLAN capable switches. I don't (yet?) feel like using a mini at work (well except for workstation stuffs)... but sure, VLANs are ok. You can pick up cheap VLAN-capable switches on eBay. I have a Dell 3024 at home which works fine and runs $100-150 used. I'd never use these in an enterprise environment, but they're fine for home testing. -- Jason Dixon DixonGroup Consulting http://www.dixongroup.net
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Thursday 30 November 2006 15:34, Tasmanian Devil wrote: Boot Camp: No, it's not required, it works fine with a usual OpenBSD-only configured internal harddisk, at least with Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B05 and Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B08. Of course you can only upgrade if you install a minimal OS X... :-/ I don't have a mini (or any reasonably current Apple hardware) but the issue you mentioned reminded me of this post by Brian Keefer: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-sparcm=116483175532387w=2 It may be possible to do something similar with the mini? Kind Regards, JCR
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-sparcm=116483175532387w=2 It may be possible to do something similar with the mini? Maybe, yes. Interesting! :-) At least Macs can do a netboot. Though you'd probably need an EFI guru to make that work... Bsically there might even be a more easy way to upgrade the firmware: If the firmware of a Mac is broken (e.g. due to power failture while upgrading), you can use a firmware restoration CD to repair it: http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/firmwarerestorationcd12.html If I understand that right, the CD contains a few floppy disk images, each for a different Mac. If the Mac's firmware is broken (and only then), you can make it boot from such a CD and the restore process will start and run automatically just from the CD. Unforunately the CD doesn't contain the latest Mac mini firmware version, so you'd again need a guru to put the latest firmware into such a floppy disk image, and you would have to destroy the firmware somehow to make the mini boot from the restoration CD... Sorry for being off-topic, all this has not much to do with OpenBSD. ;-) Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Dec 1, 2006, at 8:25 AM, J.C. Roberts wrote: On Thursday 30 November 2006 15:34, Tasmanian Devil wrote: Boot Camp: No, it's not required, it works fine with a usual OpenBSD-only configured internal harddisk, at least with Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B05 and Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B08. Of course you can only upgrade if you install a minimal OS X... :-/ I don't have a mini (or any reasonably current Apple hardware) but the issue you mentioned reminded me of this post by Brian Keefer: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-sparcm=116483175532387w=2 It may be possible to do something similar with the mini? Kind Regards, JCR I'm skeptical of that working on the MacIntels. Looking in /Applications/Utilities/MacBook Pro EFI Firmware Update.app/Contents/ Resources I see the following interesting bits: EFIUpdaterApp.efi LOCKED_MBP11_0055_08B.fd LOCKED_MBP12_0061_03B.fd According to file(1) the first is a MSDOS executable, and the next two are data files. I vaguely recollect from my DOS days that flashing the BIOS on PC motherboards required a flash utility, and a data file (unlike Sun, where you just boot the flash updater in place of a kernel--in my weak understanding). Now there is a Firmware Restoration CD available from Apple that you can burn to a CD, but apparently this only works if: 1.) You have partially flashed the firmware and suffered a failure and 2.) You have to play their power button + flashing lights game of whack-a-mole. I profess to know nothing about low-level workings of machinery, but if these MacIntels have a somewhat PC-like boot process, perhaps you could make a DOS boot CD with the three files above, boot while holding down 'c', and run EFIUpdaterApp.efi from a DOS prompt? I'm sure there are all kinds of good reasons why that's impossible, but that's my wild-ass-guess. In any case, I highly doubt you could do this with a net boot since the firmware update does not appear to be a self-contained executable and might need a command interpreter to work. Brian Keefer www.Tumbleweed.com The Experts in Secure Internet Communication
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Ah, yes, booting from CD. Maybe I was really a little bit lucky with that because it worked quite well here right from the beginning. ;-) I'm not being so lucky :-( Boot Camp: No, it's not required, it works fine with a usual OpenBSD-only configured internal harddisk, at least with Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B05 and Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B08. Of macos says I'm running MM11.0055.B08. When I first fired the system up (just to verify that it was working OK) it downloaded new firmware and had be go throught the power cycle dance holding the power button to do the update so I expect the box came with MM11.0055.B05. Some recent CD: The 4.0 release CD and snapshots from Nov. 12, 2006 or later should boot fine, a few snapshots between that didn't work. You don't need a -current boot CD to install a -current (or snapshot) file set. Not working for me. I get this far: CD_ROM: 90 Loading /CDBOOT probing: pc0 com0 mem(699K 991M a20=on) disk: hd0+* cd0 boot c and there it stays forever. I suspect the c following the boot prompt is left over from hold c to boot from cd. The keyboard at this point is dead. Any ideas? I'd really like to get OpenBSD up on this beasty. I've tried several different home grown CDs plus the 11/29 snapshot CD from ftp.openbsd.org. // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
I'm not being so lucky :-( I'm sure you will not give up, it's worth it! :-) Some recent CD: The 4.0 release CD and snapshots from Nov. 12, 2006 or later should boot fine, a few snapshots between that didn't work. You don't need a -current boot CD to install a -current (or snapshot) file set. Not working for me. I get this far: CD_ROM: 90 Loading /CDBOOT probing: pc0 com0 mem(699K 991M a20=on) disk: hd0+* cd0 boot c and there it stays forever. I suspect the c following the boot prompt is left over from hold c to boot from cd. The keyboard at this point is dead. Any ideas? Of course! :-) And yes, you're probably right with the c key. I'd try it step by step now. The mini boots from CD without holding any key, even without a keyboard attached, as long as there's no OS on the harddisk. You want to use OpenBSD only, right? So I'd configure the internal harddisk with one MS-DOS partition using the Disk Utility on the Mac OS X install CD. You can even write a MS-DOS MBR with that utility, though that's not really necessary at this point, you can do that later with fdisk. Just remove the OS. The mini should boot from an OpenBSD boot CD then, also without a keybard and without pressing any key. Does it do that? If you have an ACPI enabled kernel on the boot CD, the USB keyboard should work fine then as soon as you attach it. Tas.
Mac Mini (intel) status
What is the status of the Mac Mini? I saw some messages and patches regarding the mini flowing by a week or three ago but didn't own one at that time so wasn't paying attention. Are the patches in CVS? Thanks, // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
What is the status of the Mac Mini? I saw some messages and patches regarding the mini flowing by a week or three ago but didn't own one at that time so wasn't paying attention. Are the patches in CVS? Yes, works really fine on my mini. :-) Last time I installed a snapshot (from Nov. 24, 2006) there were basically all files there, though you've to build your own kernel with: $ cat /usr/src/sys/arch/i386/conf/GENERIC.ACPI # $OpenBSD$ # # GENERIC.ACPI - sample ACPI kernel # include arch/i386/conf/GENERIC option MULTIPROCESSOR # Multiple processor support #option MPVERBOSE cpu*at mainbus? ioapic* at mainbus? #option ACPIVERBOSE option ACPI_ENABLE acpi0 at mainbus? acpitimer* at acpi? acpihpet* at acpi? acpiac* at acpi? acpibat*at acpi? acpibtn*at acpi? acpicpu*at acpi? acpiec* at acpi? acpitz* at acpi? acpimadt* at acpi? acpiprt*at acpi? One thing is important: Don't configure the network while installing, the Marvell Yucon NIC won't work without an ACPI enabled kernel, afaik due to EFI instead of PC BIOS. You can compile the kernel either on another i386 machine (transfer it on CD) or on the mini itself (transfer the -current source tree from another machine to the mini using a tar archive on CD). An openssl speed aes-128-cbc shows nearly twice as good results under OpenBSD than under OS X on the same machine and both cores of the Intel Core Duo work fine. :-) Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Yes, works really fine on my mini. :-) Last time I installed a Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
as a web server. If your server will not be near by, this post might also be interesting for you: http://marc.theaimsgroup.com/?l=openbsd-miscm=116443142317676w=2 :-) Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. Quite expensive also
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Luca Losio wrote: Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. Quite expensive also When you compare its price/performance versus something like a Soekris, it looks pretty good and is still a reasonably small form factor. Are there better options? Perhaps. Feel free to share your hardware suggestions. If you know of a platform which is similar in size, low power, has similar performance, has similar build quality, and is lower priced than a Mini then please share your info with the rest of the group! Your comment on its own is of little value since most of us are already aware of the pricing of the Mini, or we can easily find out if we aren't. Breeno
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Thu, 30 Nov 2006, Marco S Hyman wrote: Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. -- Antoine
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Yeah, I saw that one. Since the server won't live in my pocket it'll be something that I add to rc.local. Or earlier in the boot process, like in /etc/rc.securelevel. I was even a bit more adventurous, I've put this right after the mount commands and this lines: # pick up option configuration . /etc/rc.conf into /etc/rc: # START - Mac mini server mode if [ -x /usr/X11R6/bin/pcitweak ]; then echo -n setting server mode: /usr/X11R6/bin/pcitweak -w 0:1f:0 -b 0xa4 0x00 /usr/X11R6/bin/pcitweak -r 0:1f:0 -b 0xa4 fi # END - Mac mini server mode I did only install xbase40.tgz, nothing else of X (afaik that's necessary for php5-gd), and pcitweak is in xserv40.tgz. Though it's sufficent to to make pcitweak work to copy /usr/X11R6/bin/pcitweak from the archive or from another machine, everything else it needs is already there, at least with xbase40.tgz. Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Your comment on its own is of little value since most of us are already aware of the pricing of the Mini, or we can easily find out if we aren't. Oh sorry for ruining your day with this...
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Stupid question number eleventy seven... is boot camp required? I tried booting a someone recent i386 CD by holding down the C key while powering on and got to the OpenBSD cd boot -- where the system seemed to hang. Guess: it needs a keyboard, doesn't recognize the USB keyboard, I need boot camp. Ah, yes, booting from CD. Maybe I was really a little bit lucky with that because it worked quite well here right from the beginning. ;-) Boot Camp: No, it's not required, it works fine with a usual OpenBSD-only configured internal harddisk, at least with Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B05 and Boot-ROM-Version MM11.0055.B08. Of course you can only upgrade if you install a minimal OS X... :-/ (maybe it's sufficient if you install that on an external firewire harddisk and boot from there, I didn't test that for the Boot-ROM upgrade). Latest Boot-ROM-Version here: http://www.apple.com/support/downloads/macminiefifirmwareupdate11.html Some recent CD: The 4.0 release CD and snapshots from Nov. 12, 2006 or later should boot fine, a few snapshots between that didn't work. You don't need a -current boot CD to install a -current (or snapshot) file set. Guess: it needs a keyboard, doesn't recognize the USB keyboard, I need boot camp. Yeah, keyboard. The lucky part for me. I found out later that an USB keyboard won't work without an ACPI kernel, so it doesn't work just with an usual OpenBSD boot CD. Afaik Boot Camp doesn't help you at all here. But if you've paired a wireless bluetooth keyboard with the mini while OS X was still installed, what I did by accident, it'll work also perfectly while installing OpenBSD. I don't think there's a way to do the bluetooth pairing just with OpenBSD. And btw one more tip for headless servers: The mini doesn't feel like booting without a monitor connected (no matter if switched on or off) as long as there's no OS X on the harddisk. But fortunately there's a hardware fix to convince the mini that there's a (non-DDC) monitor attached: A 75 ohm resistor (100 ohm works also) as load between pin 2 and pin 7 of a 15 pin highdensity D-SUB male connector (with DVI to VGA adapter) or between pin C2 and C5 of a 29 pin DVI male connector as a dongle for the DVI/VGA port (that's between analog green and analog ground, 75 ohm is the standard load for that output pin). Just plug in the dongle and the mini will boot happily also without a monitor. :-) There seem to be no software fix for this problem. Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Some recent CD: The 4.0 release CD and snapshots from Nov. 12, 2006 or later should boot fine, a few snapshots between that didn't work. You don't need a -current boot CD to install a -current (or snapshot) file set. The CD I tried was a home grown snapshot of -current from October That may fall into your a few snapshots between that didn't work period. I'm building a new one now and will give it a try. I don't have a bluetooth keyboard to play with. I can, however, make a bsd.rd that has ACPI it that's what it takes. Time to play some more. A 75 ohm resistor (100 ohm works also) as load between pin 2 and pin 7 of a 15 pin highdensity D-SUB male connector (with DVI to VGA adapter) or between pin C2 and C5 of a 29 pin DVI male connector as a dongle for the DVI/VGA port (that's between analog green and analog ground, 75 ohm is the standard load for that output pin). Just plug in the dongle and the mini will boot happily also without a monitor. :-) Time to scrounge around for a connector. Maybe a trip to Fry's is in order. // marc
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
I don't have a bluetooth keyboard to play with. I can, however, make a bsd.rd that has ACPI it that's what it takes. Time to play some more. Yes, that should work if you can build the bsd.rd just like the bsd.mp with ACPI enabled, even configuring the network while installing should work then and you should be able to do an install from FTP/HTTP servers! The bsd.mp with ACPI kernel is the only kernel I have so far that makes the Marvell Yukon NIC work. Such a bsd.rd kernel would be very interesting for me, too. :-) Would be very kind of you if you could post the config file for such a kernel (I think that's what is needed?) as I don't know much about bsd.rd yet. Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. Um, no, there are two ethernet adapters included, the Marvell Yukon and the wifi adapter: $ dmesg | grep ath ath0 at pci2 dev 0 function 0 Atheros AR5424 rev 0x01: apic 2 int 17 (irq 11) ath0: AR5424 10.3 phy 6.1 rf 10.2, WORAW, address 00:17:f2:4d:21:4a I didn't test that one yet with OpenBSD as I won't need wifi, but I'm quite sure it works fine. :-) (It worked out-of-the-box with a NetBSD test install, sorry to say that, it was at the time when it didn't work with OpenBSD yet, was just a test, I didn't want to use that other OS). Tas.
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Nov 30, 2006, at 5:43 PM, Antoine Jacoutot wrote: On Thu, 30 Nov 2006, Marco S Hyman wrote: Thank you. The goal is to have the mini replace my dying sparc64 as a web server. Small, low power draw, quiet: I like that. Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. That's what VLANs are for. Just make sure your switch doesn't allow hopping. :) -- Jason Dixon DixonGroup Consulting http://www.dixongroup.net
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Fri, 1 Dec 2006, Tasmanian Devil wrote: Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. Um, no, there are two ethernet adapters included, the Marvell Yukon and the wifi adapter: Since when is a wireless adapter an ethernet adapter? -- Antoine
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
On Thu, 30 Nov 2006, Jason Dixon wrote: Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. That's what VLANs are for. Just make sure your switch doesn't allow hopping. :) Ah yes ;-) Although, playing with the mini as a server looks more like something I would do at home where I don't have VLAN capable switches. I don't (yet?) feel like using a mini at work (well except for workstation stuffs)... but sure, VLANs are ok. -- Antoine
Re: Mac Mini (intel) status
Yes, too bad it only includes 1 ethernet adapter. Um, no, there are two ethernet adapters included, the Marvell Yukon and the wifi adapter: Since when is a wireless adapter an ethernet adapter? Ah yes, sorry. You're right! Tas.
