Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Marco Marongiu]

Thanks for the effort you guys put into this

Ciao
-- bronto

On Fri, 19 Mar 2021, 12:03 Aaron Trevena,  wrote:

> Hi All,
>
> As some of you may have noticed - rt.cpan.org hasn't gone away and has
> been upgraded to RT5 with help and support from best practical - no
> mean feat given the age and customisations of the cpan RT instance.
>
> It's looking nicer and much easier to use.
>
> Kind regards,
>
> A.
>
> On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 at 14:41, Paul "LeoNerd" Evans
>  wrote:
> >
> > 
> >
> >   rt.cpan.org, the bugtracker used by nearly 80% of all CPAN modules
> >   [1], is going to be shut down on 1st March this year [2]; 39 days
> >   from when I write this email.
> >
> > 
> >
> > I am rather concerned about this, as there doesn't appear to be any
> > sort of co-ordinated bailout plan or migration of the *huge amount* of
> > CPAN modules this is about to affect.
> >
> > I am furthermore concerned at the total lack of discussion or response
> > that has so far been generated; aside from Karen Etheridge I haven't
> > seen any noise of upset being generated at all. Nor am I aware of any
> > sort of effort to handle what will become a huge outage of a major
> > component of the CPAN ecosystem.
> >
> > I personally have 189 modules in need of migration - somehow. As yet
> > I have no clue what I am going to do about it. Existing bugs need to be
> > moved somewhere else (and I have no clue how I'm going to fix up URLs
> > that currently point to those, in code comments, documentation, blog
> > posts, ... anywhere else), and a new for users to report new bugs needs
> > to exist. Of special note are the numerous "in progress" tickets I have
> > across my distributions, containing ongoing discussions about design
> > issues and the like. To say that I am "concerned" is an understatement;
> > I am fairly close to panicing about this.
> >
> > I am quite sure I am but the smallest tip of the iceberg here. Every
> > time I mention it on Freenode's #perl or irc.perl.org's #p5p there are
> > always new folks who were totally unaware of this fact. This is going
> > to hit lots of people in a very hard surprise.
> >
> > I am therefore interested to know if anyone has any sort of thoughts or
> > plan on what to do about this; either
> >
> >   a) Attempts to take over maintenance of the system as it stands, or
> >
> >   b) Find an alternative location and implement some sort of
> >  mass-bailout in that direction.
> >
> >
> > To emphasise again: in 39 days time the bug tracker used by nearly 80%
> > of all of CPAN is going to be shut down and become unavailable for
> > either historic or newly-reported bugs. We *need* to find a solution in
> > that time. It would be great if we all went the same way, thus making
> > the lives of users (and metacpan.org) a lot simpler, rather than all
> > scattering in 50 different ways, which will cause a huge splintering of
> > what has been a very coherent service so far.
> >
> >
> > 1: Add the "known to be RT" and "unknown" categories of
> >https://cpan.rocks/; because metacpan.org defaults to RT in the
> >latter case.
> >
> > 2: https://log.perl.org/2020/12/rtcpanorg-sunset.html
> >
> > --
> > Paul "LeoNerd" Evans
> >
> > leon...@leonerd.org.uk  |  https://metacpan.org/author/PEVANS
> > http://www.leonerd.org.uk/  |  https://www.tindie.com/stores/leonerd/
>
>
>
> --
> Aaron J Trevena, BSc Hons
> http://www.aarontrevena.co.uk
> LAMP System Integration, Development and Consulting
>

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Aaron Trevena]

Hi All,

As some of you may have noticed - rt.cpan.org hasn't gone away and has
been upgraded to RT5 with help and support from best practical - no
mean feat given the age and customisations of the cpan RT instance.

It's looking nicer and much easier to use.

Kind regards,

A.

On Thu, 21 Jan 2021 at 14:41, Paul "LeoNerd" Evans
 wrote:
>
> 
>
>   rt.cpan.org, the bugtracker used by nearly 80% of all CPAN modules
>   [1], is going to be shut down on 1st March this year [2]; 39 days
>   from when I write this email.
>
> 
>
> I am rather concerned about this, as there doesn't appear to be any
> sort of co-ordinated bailout plan or migration of the *huge amount* of
> CPAN modules this is about to affect.
>
> I am furthermore concerned at the total lack of discussion or response
> that has so far been generated; aside from Karen Etheridge I haven't
> seen any noise of upset being generated at all. Nor am I aware of any
> sort of effort to handle what will become a huge outage of a major
> component of the CPAN ecosystem.
>
> I personally have 189 modules in need of migration - somehow. As yet
> I have no clue what I am going to do about it. Existing bugs need to be
> moved somewhere else (and I have no clue how I'm going to fix up URLs
> that currently point to those, in code comments, documentation, blog
> posts, ... anywhere else), and a new for users to report new bugs needs
> to exist. Of special note are the numerous "in progress" tickets I have
> across my distributions, containing ongoing discussions about design
> issues and the like. To say that I am "concerned" is an understatement;
> I am fairly close to panicing about this.
>
> I am quite sure I am but the smallest tip of the iceberg here. Every
> time I mention it on Freenode's #perl or irc.perl.org's #p5p there are
> always new folks who were totally unaware of this fact. This is going
> to hit lots of people in a very hard surprise.
>
> I am therefore interested to know if anyone has any sort of thoughts or
> plan on what to do about this; either
>
>   a) Attempts to take over maintenance of the system as it stands, or
>
>   b) Find an alternative location and implement some sort of
>  mass-bailout in that direction.
>
>
> To emphasise again: in 39 days time the bug tracker used by nearly 80%
> of all of CPAN is going to be shut down and become unavailable for
> either historic or newly-reported bugs. We *need* to find a solution in
> that time. It would be great if we all went the same way, thus making
> the lives of users (and metacpan.org) a lot simpler, rather than all
> scattering in 50 different ways, which will cause a huge splintering of
> what has been a very coherent service so far.
>
>
> 1: Add the "known to be RT" and "unknown" categories of
>https://cpan.rocks/; because metacpan.org defaults to RT in the
>latter case.
>
> 2: https://log.perl.org/2020/12/rtcpanorg-sunset.html
>
> --
> Paul "LeoNerd" Evans
>
> leon...@leonerd.org.uk  |  https://metacpan.org/author/PEVANS
> http://www.leonerd.org.uk/  |  https://www.tindie.com/stores/leonerd/



-- 
Aaron J Trevena, BSc Hons
http://www.aarontrevena.co.uk
LAMP System Integration, Development and Consulting

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Olaf Alders via module-authors]

> On Jan 21, 2021, at 9:31 AM, Paul LeoNerd Evans  > wrote:
> 
> 
> 
>  rt.cpan.org , the bugtracker used by nearly 80% of all 
> CPAN modules
>  [1], is going to be shut down on 1st March this year [2]; 39 days
>  from when I write this email.
> 
> 
> 
> I am rather concerned about this, as there doesn't appear to be any
> sort of co-ordinated bailout plan or migration of the *huge amount* of
> CPAN modules this is about to affect.

I know this is not exactly what you’re looking for, but there is an attempt at 
generating a static archive: https://github.com/rt-cpan/rt-cpan.github.io 


Olaf

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Diab Jerius]

On 1/21/21 11:40 AM, Dave Rolsky wrote:
On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 10:26 AM Diab Jerius > wrote:



On 1/21/21 11:06 AM, Diab Jerius wrote:
>
> I would hope that at the very least TPF would step forward to
fund a
> grant to someone to take over rt.cpan.
>

Or maybe not.  Just tried to email the address provided on TPF's web
site and got this:

550 5.1.1 mailto:i...@perlfoundation.org>>: Recipient address rejected: User
unknown in virtual mailbox table


This should be fixed. The info@ address will work now, but I've 
changed the website to use hello@, which goes to the right people.




Thanks!

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Dave Rolsky]

On Thu, Jan 21, 2021 at 10:26 AM Diab Jerius  wrote:

>
> On 1/21/21 11:06 AM, Diab Jerius wrote:
> >
> > I would hope that at the very least TPF would step forward to fund a
> > grant to someone to take over rt.cpan.
> >
>
> Or maybe not.  Just tried to email the address provided on TPF's web
> site and got this:
>
> 550 5.1.1 : Recipient address rejected: User
> unknown in virtual mailbox table
>

This should be fixed. The info@ address will work now, but I've changed the
website to use hello@, which goes to the right people.


Cheers,

Dave Rolsky
http://blog.urth.org
https://github.com/autarch

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Diab Jerius]

On 1/21/21 11:06 AM, Diab Jerius wrote:


I would hope that at the very least TPF would step forward to fund a 
grant to someone to take over rt.cpan.




Or maybe not.  Just tried to email the address provided on TPF's web 
site and got this:


550 5.1.1 : Recipient address rejected: User 
unknown in virtual mailbox table

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Diab Jerius]

On 1/21/21 9:31 AM, Paul "LeoNerd" Evans wrote:



   rt.cpan.org, the bugtracker used by nearly 80% of all CPAN modules
   [1], is going to be shut down on 1st March this year [2]; 39 days
   from when I write this email.



I am rather concerned about this, as there doesn't appear to be any
sort of co-ordinated bailout plan or migration of the *huge amount* of
CPAN modules this is about to affect.

I am furthermore concerned at the total lack of discussion or response
that has so far been generated; aside from Karen Etheridge I haven't
seen any noise of upset being generated at all. Nor am I aware of any
sort of effort to handle what will become a huge outage of a major
component of the CPAN ecosystem.

I personally have 189 modules in need of migration - somehow. As yet
I have no clue what I am going to do about it. Existing bugs need to be
moved somewhere else (and I have no clue how I'm going to fix up URLs
that currently point to those, in code comments, documentation, blog
posts, ... anywhere else), and a new for users to report new bugs needs
to exist. Of special note are the numerous "in progress" tickets I have
across my distributions, containing ongoing discussions about design
issues and the like. To say that I am "concerned" is an understatement;
I am fairly close to panicing about this.

I am quite sure I am but the smallest tip of the iceberg here. Every
time I mention it on Freenode's #perl or irc.perl.org's #p5p there are
always new folks who were totally unaware of this fact. This is going
to hit lots of people in a very hard surprise.

I am therefore interested to know if anyone has any sort of thoughts or
plan on what to do about this; either

   a) Attempts to take over maintenance of the system as it stands, or

   b) Find an alternative location and implement some sort of
  mass-bailout in that direction.


To emphasise again: in 39 days time the bug tracker used by nearly 80%
of all of CPAN is going to be shut down and become unavailable for
either historic or newly-reported bugs. We *need* to find a solution in
that time. It would be great if we all went the same way, thus making
the lives of users (and metacpan.org) a lot simpler, rather than all
scattering in 50 different ways, which will cause a huge splintering of
what has been a very coherent service so far.


1: Add the "known to be RT" and "unknown" categories of
https://cpan.rocks/; because metacpan.org defaults to RT in the
latter case.

2: https://log.perl.org/2020/12/rtcpanorg-sunset.html



Thanks for more widely distributing this.

This is probably one of the worst things to happen to Perl since I've 
been using it.


I can handle a stagnant language.  I cannot handle the uncertainty of 
knowing whether a CPAN module has bugs, especially when that module may 
no longer be in active development, or CPAN is the only authoritative 
location for the source code. There are *many* CPAN modules for which 
CPAN is the only public place to find the source.


rt.cpan precedes the creation of public cloud based source repositories, 
and provides a vital service for the Perl community.  Cloud based 
repositories come and go.  Who here (other than myself) was forced to 
migrate from Bitbucket when they shut down their Mercurial service and 
401'd all of the existing repositories?  They broke every single URL in 
my Perl ecosystem and in the wider Mercurial ecosystem.  What happens 
when GitHub or GitLab does the same?


I don't trust commercial services.  I do (did) trust Perl's.  I don't 
place any blame on the volunteers who ran rt.cpan.  I was under the 
impression that the TPF funded them, but I guess not.  I don't know who 
is in charge of this asylum anymore.


I'm more than frustrated by the response from on of the PSC on 
p5porters, which was


 This is infrastructure maintained by NOC volunteers. What would you 
suggest Perl 5 Porters do?


Is Perl so compartmentalized that those elected to lead the language 
forward have no insight into this?  Did anyone at the "higher levels" 
actually talk with the NOC volunteers to determine what was going on?  
All I hear is "Abandon Ship!" and don't bother helping out those who 
have no place to go.


So. Not. Perl.

I'm more than willing to donate money towards retaining rt.cpan as an 
active site (I cannot provide time).  But without any indication of what 
state its in or how much time is required to do so, it's hard to move 
forward.


I would hope that at the very least TPF would step forward to fund a 
grant to someone to take over rt.cpan, but TPF does not strike me as 
proactive.


Diab

P.S.  Don't bother asking me why I think Perl should be different in 
this aspect than other ecosystems.  Would it be better if Perl sucked 
just as much as the others?  I don't think so.  Perl has had higher 
standards.  This is not a shining moment for Perl.

Re: rt.cpan.org is going away

[Ryan Thompson]

I share your frustration, Paul. My own few personal modules really only 
required changing the bugtracker URL, but even still, the historical 
bugs that have been closed will be gone, so tracking regressions will be 
difficult. I opted to semi-automatically generate a rich text file of 
all the issues, that I'll be including in GitHub (where my repos are 
hosted, and where new bugs are tracked).


But those are the easy ones. I also run a much larger PAUSE account for 
my company, and that would be more akin to the situation you're facing 
with hundreds of dists, a whole mess of open issues, and years worth of 
historical issues that need to be preserved. I have a strategy. I don't 
have a good strategy. I've tasked a junior developer to write a script 
to scrape rt.cpan.org for every open and archived issue and then use the 
https://docs.github.com/en/rest/reference/issues API to migrate them to 
GitHub. With abuse rate limits, it's a slow process and, frankly, a 
hack, but at least it's better than that essential history being gone 
forever.


- Ryan

On 2021-01-21 8:31 a.m., Paul "LeoNerd" Evans wrote:



   rt.cpan.org, the bugtracker used by nearly 80% of all CPAN modules
   [1], is going to be shut down on 1st March this year [2]; 39 days
   from when I write this email.



I am rather concerned about this, as there doesn't appear to be any
sort of co-ordinated bailout plan or migration of the *huge amount* of
CPAN modules this is about to affect.

I am furthermore concerned at the total lack of discussion or response
that has so far been generated; aside from Karen Etheridge I haven't
seen any noise of upset being generated at all. Nor am I aware of any
sort of effort to handle what will become a huge outage of a major
component of the CPAN ecosystem.

I personally have 189 modules in need of migration - somehow. As yet
I have no clue what I am going to do about it. Existing bugs need to be
moved somewhere else (and I have no clue how I'm going to fix up URLs
that currently point to those, in code comments, documentation, blog
posts, ... anywhere else), and a new for users to report new bugs needs
to exist. Of special note are the numerous "in progress" tickets I have
across my distributions, containing ongoing discussions about design
issues and the like. To say that I am "concerned" is an understatement;
I am fairly close to panicing about this.

I am quite sure I am but the smallest tip of the iceberg here. Every
time I mention it on Freenode's #perl or irc.perl.org's #p5p there are
always new folks who were totally unaware of this fact. This is going
to hit lots of people in a very hard surprise.

I am therefore interested to know if anyone has any sort of thoughts or
plan on what to do about this; either

   a) Attempts to take over maintenance of the system as it stands, or

   b) Find an alternative location and implement some sort of
  mass-bailout in that direction.


To emphasise again: in 39 days time the bug tracker used by nearly 80%
of all of CPAN is going to be shut down and become unavailable for
either historic or newly-reported bugs. We *need* to find a solution in
that time. It would be great if we all went the same way, thus making
the lives of users (and metacpan.org) a lot simpler, rather than all
scattering in 50 different ways, which will cause a huge splintering of
what has been a very coherent service so far.


1: Add the "known to be RT" and "unknown" categories of
https://cpan.rocks/; because metacpan.org defaults to RT in the
latter case.

2: https://log.perl.org/2020/12/rtcpanorg-sunset.html