Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-30 Thread Tim Goetze
[Thomas Strathmann] BTW, for those who can read some German, this book https://hps.hs-regensburg.de/~elektrogitarre/ might be a fascinating read. It's a scholarly treatise on the physics of e-guitars. Nice! There's a truly dire need for the scientific approach to the physics of the electric

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-30 Thread robert bristow-johnson
On 11/29/13 11:54 AM, Nigel Redmon wrote: Not to Robert so much, but for anyone who hasn't thought too deeply about guitar amps, maybe it's helpful to look at what you're up against. It's the extremely wide useful range of the distortion that fundamental to the issue. yes, and there's no

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-30 Thread Nigel Redmon
On Nov 30, 2013, at 11:28 AM, robert bristow-johnson r...@audioimagination.com wrote: On 11/29/13 11:54 AM, Nigel Redmon wrote: Not to Robert so much, but for anyone who hasn't thought too deeply about guitar amps, maybe it's helpful to look at what you're up against. It's the extremely

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-30 Thread Theo Verelst
A short few notes for those interested. AD converters have self-noise, which in most cases will not even be lower than the equivalent of 16 bits, except for some pro cases and in case there are tricks being used (which influence the bit accuracy). Say you have a 24 bits converter, seldom will

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-29 Thread Thomas Strathmann
On 29.11.13 09:35, Tim Goetze wrote: Harmonics in electric guitar signals tend to roll off quite fast though. There's usually not much high-frequency spectral content to worry about, relaxing this requirement greatly in practice. BTW, for those who can read some German, this book

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-29 Thread Nigel Redmon
Hi Stephan, I don't disagree with Robert's formula at all. I'm simply saying it doesn't apply. In a real implementation, you clip the signal as soon as you get outside of the portion of the polynomial curve you're using. And that happens very quickly. (Sure, you could say that you'll use a

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-29 Thread robert bristow-johnson
well, i dunno how many real-world implementation[s] use the integral of (1-x^2)^N or (1-x^N)^2 (the former was my proposal and the latter is Stephan's idea). Nigel says it doesn't apply because his premise is that he'll be clipping the polynomial anyway, so i presume the case for doesn't

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-29 Thread Nigel Redmon
Not to Robert so much, but for anyone who hasn't thought too deeply about guitar amps, maybe it's helpful to look at what you're up against. It's the extremely wide useful range of the distortion that fundamental to the issue. You want things to warm up a little with some mild overdrive. For a

[music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-28 Thread Jeff Smith
Hi I have a couple of questions... Let's start with the latter: (1) How does a guitar amp distortion effect deal with aliasing. If you use a transfer function like tanh, you get lots of high frequencies well beyond nyquist. How do commercial products like:

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-28 Thread Nigel Redmon
1) Sure, oversampling. You need frequency headroom. 2) There isn't a specific minimum requirement, so this isn't really an issue. That is, the more cpu you have, the more and better you can oversample, but you do what you need and what you can get away with. (You could go nuts and think that,

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-28 Thread Jeff Smith
Thanks Nigel, Thanks Thomas, I glanced at David Yeh's introductory chapter in his dissertation and it's full of great information. Anyone else who stumbles upon this thread should also read that chapter. Link: https://ccrma.stanford.edu/~dtyeh/papers/DavidYehThesissinglesided.pdf On Thu, Nov

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-28 Thread robert bristow-johnson
On 11/28/13 1:16 PM, Nigel Redmon wrote: It's really a pretty easy call in the end—one made by ear. Basically, you see how noticeable aliasing is on things like guitar note bends. Really quickly, you'll figure out that 4x doesn't get the job done, and 8x is does it pretty well at a reasonable

Re: [music-dsp] Oversampling and CPU + Bandlimited Distortion Effects?

2013-11-28 Thread Nigel Redmon
Robert…If you're talking about distortion, of significance, you're *always* talking about clipping that polynomial. Your (N+1)/2 times oversampling goes out the window, and you simply need as much oversampling as will get the job done. Don't forget that although the outlook get more grim as you