AW: AW: /27 the new /24

Hi Mike, it's not a bureaucracy problem ... if you're a big player and you have to decide about a 2-3 Mio invest to upgrade only a few of your POPs (and let's say you have hundreds of POPs) it will be hard to find the "right" decision. Some questions these decision makers have to think about:

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 1:35 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: > > > On Oct 1, 2015, at 21:47 , Rob McEwen wrote: > > Also, it seems so bizarre that in order to TRY to solve this, we have to > make sure that MASSIVE numbers of individual IPv6 IP addresses.. that equal

Re: Mikrotik in the DFZ (Was Re: AW: AW: /27 the new /24)

Sure MT has issues, but so does everyone. As someone that has used them for 10+ years, the past six months has seen a bit of a re-awakening over there. You can see this in the time to completion of many feature requests, bug fixes, new features, etc. I'm not sure they're going to do everything

Re: Bandwidth estimation question

Would cloudflare caching (free tier?) help in this case? Maybe easier than upgrades for short time traffic bump. On 2 Oct 2015 23:47, "Tom Sands" wrote: > > There is no telling how big a flash crowd might be. I've see them jump in > the Gbps range and not Mbps. > > > > Sent

Re: AW: AW: AW: /27 the new /24

I don't think we are talking different things, though I think we are talking in circles and thus the thread probably needs to die. People keep thinking I want Level 3 to replace a loaded 6500 with a CCR and that's simply not what I'm saying at all. The point of rattling off the newer\smaller

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

Except we might very well reach 1+ million routes soon without accepting longer prefixes than /24. Also route updates is a concern - do I really need to be informed every time someone on the other end of the world resets a link? On 3 October 2015 at 12:57, William Waites

AW: AW: /27 the new /24

Hi, yeah, of course there are newer models ... I mentioned the older ones (from the past 3-5 years). There are also Cisco routers available that are able to handle more than 1 Mio routes - of course also from Juniper. Jürgen Jaritsch Head of Network & Infrastructure ANEXIA

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

On Sat, 3 Oct 2015 12:42:01 +0200, Baldur Norddahl said: > 2 million routes will not be enough if we go full /27. This is > not a scalable solution. Something else is needed to provide > multihoming for small networks (LISP?). It's not too far off though.

AW: AW: AW: /27 the new /24

Hi Mike, > but the boxes that have been there for 10 years have more than paid for > themselves (unless they're a shitty business). No question about that! But why should they throw them away if they can still print $$$ with these boxes? They have to change nothing till the global routing

Re: Bandwidth estimation question

Treatment of this scenario by beefing up hardware or hosting plans, or temporarily increasing your metered limit is insufficient. Use a CDN for all static content, all the time. If your site averages low volume, it'll be very cheap. If you get a million page views in the first minute, you'll be

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

2 million routes will not be enough if we go full /27. This is not a scalable solution. Something else is needed to provide multihoming for small networks (LISP?). Regards, Baldur On 3 October 2015 at 11:03, Youssef Bengelloun-Zahr wrote: > Hi, > > FYI, newer linecard models

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

Hi, FYI, newer linecard models from BROCADE can hold 2 million routes. Probably others can do that now too. Disclaimer : I'm not working for them or defending them, just setting an information straight. My 2 cents. > Le 3 oct. 2015 à 10:33, Jürgen Jaritsch a écrit : > >

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

On 10/3/2015 10:35 AM, Scott Morizot wrote: One of the points in having 64 bits reserved for the host portion of the address is that you never need to think or worry about individual addresses. IPv6 eliminates the address scarcity issue. There's no reason to ever think about how many

RE: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

So let me ask a question -- there's several folks looking at overall IPv6 usage, but what about on a per-protocol level, and compared to IPv4? Frank -Original Message- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-boun...@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Randy Bush Sent: Saturday, October 03, 2015 11:37 AM To: Scott

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

I followed up later, but so that it doesn't look like I'm ignoring you, if I were to take a /32 at my ISP, my ARIN fee would quadruple. I can't justify that. - Mike Hammett Intelligent Computing Solutions http://www.ics-il.com Midwest Internet Exchange http://www.midwest-ix.com

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

The majority of the large eyeball providers in the US are already doing this to most, if not all, of their customers. Comcast I believe has 100% IPv6 availability to residential and I think they are most of the way on Business too. I’m not sure of the percentage, but I know Time Warner Cable

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

> On Oct 2, 2015, at 07:56 , Brett A Mansfield > wrote: > > The problem with this is some of us smaller guys don't have the ability to > get IPv6 addresses from our upstream providers that don't support it. And > even if we did do dual stack, then we're paying

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

This still would have required updating every application, host, router, everything. Just as much work as deploying IPv6 without many of the benefits. No thanks, Owen > On Oct 2, 2015, at 14:18 , William Herrin wrote: > > On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 5:03 PM, Fred Baker (fred)

Re: Bandwidth estimation question

On Friday, October 2, 2015, Dylan Ambauen wrote: > ... > Enjoy a worldwide caching reverse proxy with limitless resources, priced > per page view. Maybe someone can recommend a IPv6 capable CDN service. > > Cloudflare. Also does IPv6 on the client facing side while doing IPv4

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

>One thing that I thought was going to be a huge help with sending-IP >blacklists in the IPv6 world... was perhaps shifting to tighter >standards and greater reliance for Forward Confirmed rDNS (FCrDNS). A lot of IPv6 mail systems want you to use SPF and DKIM signatures on IPv6 mail, or they

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

> On Oct 2, 2015, at 13:45 , Todd Underwood wrote: > > On Fri, Oct 2, 2015 at 2:07 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: >> >> None of them does what you propose — Smooth seamless communication between >> an IPv4-only host and an IPv6-only host. > > i view this

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

On Saturday, October 3, 2015, Owen DeLong wrote: > The majority of the large eyeball providers in the US are already doing > this to most, if not all, of their customers. > > Comcast I believe has 100% IPv6 availability to residential and I think > they are most of the way on

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

> It's not too far off though. One way of looking at it is, for each > extra bit we allow, we potentially double the table size. that is math. in reality table size is proportional to multihoming + traffic engineering randy

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

Yes… This is a problem the ARIN board needs to fix post haste, but that’s not justification, that’s cost. Owen > On Oct 2, 2015, at 06:45 , Mike Hammett wrote: > > I may be able to justify it to ARIN, but I can't make a quadrupling of ARIN's > fees justifiable to me. > >

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

> On Oct 2, 2015, at 08:05 , Justin M. Streiner wrote: > > On Fri, 2 Oct 2015, Rob McEwen wrote: > >> it then seems like dividing lines can get really blurred here and this >> statement might betray your premise. A site needing more than 1 address... >> subtly

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

Well, outside of RIR speak, I can't justify quadrupling my cost for what the community considers to be the minimum ISP allocation. Maybe that's a better phrasing? *shrugs* {insert rent is too damn high meme}? This 8 bit network division stuff does make it difficult for ARIN to adequately

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

> Also, good luck trying to shove the IPv6 genie back into the bottle. the problem is not getting it into the bottle. the problem is getting it out, at scale. when you actually measure, cgn and other forms of nat are now massive. it is horrifying. randy

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

> On Oct 2, 2015, at 07:48 , Cryptographrix wrote: > > For ISPs that already exist, what benefit do they get from > providing/allowing IPv6 transit to their customers? > > Keep in mind that the net is now basically another broadcast medium. It really isn’t. If it

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 10:35 AM, Scott Morizot wrote: > One of the points in having 64 bits reserved for the host > portion of the address is that you never need to think or worry about > individual addresses Well, that turned out to be a farce. Instead of worrying about

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

How do you figure that? Owen > On Oct 2, 2015, at 04:14 , Mike Hammett wrote: > > Not all providers are large enough to justify a /32. > > > > > - > Mike Hammett > Intelligent Computing Solutions > http://www.ics-il.com > > > > Midwest Internet Exchange >

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

> On Oct 2, 2015, at 06:44 , Stephen Satchell wrote: > > On 10/02/2015 12:44 AM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: >> On Fri, 02 Oct 2015 02:09:00 -0400, Rob McEwen said: >> >>> Likewise, sub-allocations can come into play, where a hoster is >>> delegated a /48, but then

Re: Inexpensive probes for automated bandwidth testing purposes

Measure IP bandwidth? Could use a Mikrotik depending on the throughout expectations. Josh Luthman Office: 937-552-2340 Direct: 937-552-2343 1100 Wayne St Suite 1337 Troy, OH 45373 On Oct 3, 2015 6:27 PM, "Lorell Hathcock" wrote: > Greetings, NANOG. Happy Saturday to all.

RE: Telus ADSL IPv6 Roll Out

> Looks like Telus is rolling out IPv6 to their ADSL customers. >If the /64 is on the inside (and not part of a larger supernet, say a /48) then there is little cause for celebration, as you will be limited to one (1) IPv6 subnet in the home. /56 PD. /64 assigned to the CPE LAN interface(s).

Re: Bandwidth estimation question

On Fri, 02 Oct 2015 20:04:50 -0700, JoeSox said: > Does anyone know how much traffic a 'media blitz' (for lack of a better > word) generates? We had a tragic incident on campus in 2007. Our dual 1G's died right away, and we hurried to deploy an in-progress 10G link install that day, and *that*

Inexpensive probes for automated bandwidth testing purposes

Greetings, NANOG. Happy Saturday to all. I am running a DOCSIS network that has a noisy cable plant. I want to be able to substantiate and quantify users' bandwidth issues. I would like a set of inexpensive probes that I could place at selected customer's homes/businesses that would on a

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 12:22 PM, Owen DeLong wrote: > So the problem you are suggesting we focus on is mostly a solved problem. > Content Providers are progressing, modulo some serious laggards, notably > Amazon and a few others. > > newly released IOS9 and OSX El Capitan add

Fw: new message

Hello! New message, please read charl...@unixrealm.com

Re: Telus ADSL IPv6 Roll Out

On Sat, 2015-10-03 at 21:37 +, Steve Mikulasik wrote: > Looks like Telus is rolling out IPv6 to their ADSL customers. My ISP > modem/router is getting a /64 at home. I have a really big smile right > now [] If that /64 is on the outside interface, well done - what

Telus ADSL IPv6 Roll Out

Looks like Telus is rolling out IPv6 to their ADSL customers. My ISP modem/router is getting a /64 at home. I have a really big smile right now []

Re: Inexpensive probes for automated bandwidth testing purposes

If you are going to roll your own something like a raspberry PI would work. You can also build your own measurements with a platform like ripe atlas. It all depends if you want to run iperf3 tests or simple smokeping type of stuff to correlate errors. Jared Mauch > On Oct 3, 2015, at 6:27

Re: /27 the new /24

The race is on… One or more of these things will be the death of IPv4: 1. Not enough addresses 2. Routing Table Bloat due to one or more of: A. Traffic Engineering B. Stupid configuration C. Address

Re: Inexpensive probes for automated bandwidth testing purposes

In article <37dba43e-ee76-4323-962c-30bb988d0...@hathcock.org> you write: >Greetings, NANOG. Happy Saturday to all. > >I am running a DOCSIS network that has a noisy cable plant. I want to be able >to substantiate and quantify users' bandwidth issues. I would >like a set of inexpensive probes

Android and DHCPv6 again

Hi I noticed that my Nexus 9 tablet did not have any IPv6 although everything else in my house is IPv6 enabled. Then I noticed that my Samsung S6 was also without IPv6. Hmm. A little work with tcpdump and I got this: 03:27:15.978826 IP6 (hlim 255, next-header ICMPv6 (58) payload length: 120)

Re: Bandwidth estimation question

On 10/3/15 6:04 PM, valdis.kletni...@vt.edu wrote: > On Fri, 02 Oct 2015 20:04:50 -0700, JoeSox said: > >> Does anyone know how much traffic a 'media blitz' (for lack of a better >> word) generates? Disclaimer I work for a CDN of but I'm a former consumer of such services as well. if you have

Re: How to force rapid ipv6 adoption

--- ma...@isc.org wrote: From: Mark Andrews :: Lots of homes don't even know they are running :: IPv6 in parallel with IPv4. It is usually a :: non-event. -- That's for sure. I have been focusing a lot on work lately instead of my

Fw: new message

Hello! New message, please read Charles Gagnon

Re: How to wish you hadn't forced ipv6 adoption (was "How to force rapid ipv6 adoption")

> On Oct 3, 2015, at 14:01 , William Herrin wrote: > > On Sat, Oct 3, 2015 at 10:35 AM, Scott Morizot wrote: >> One of the points in having 64 bits reserved for the host >> portion of the address is that you never need to think or worry about >> individual

Re: AW: /27 the new /24

Which routers? DIR-300 with OpenWRT/Quagga? :) I think all above-the-trash level routers supports >1M routes, isn't it? On 02.10.15 17:45, Jürgen Jaritsch wrote: > Hi, > > this would at least help to get rid of many old routing engines around the > world :) ... or people would keep their

Mikrotik in the DFZ (Was Re: AW: AW: /27 the new /24)

On Fri, 2 Oct 2015 23:11:47 +, Jürgen Jaritsch said: > Regarding the words "I have a small router which handles > multiple full tables ...": push and pull a few full tables at > the same time and you'll see what's happening: the CCRs are > SLOW. And why?

RE: AW: /27 the new /24

As mentioned before: even the new SUP2T from Cisco is limited to 1Mio routes ... There are MANY other vendors with the same limitations: Juniper, Brocade, etc And the solt equipment is not the 99USD trash from the super market at the corner ... Jürgen Jaritsch Head of Network & Infrastructure