Re: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip

[Peter Reisfeld]

While I do not profess expertise in this matter, I just wanted to comment on 
the study by Baumann et. al in the Journal of Field Ornithology on 
distinguishing Western and yellow bellied flycatcher. While precise separation 
required in the hand measurement of wing and buffy fringe lengths, as others 
have noted the space space between the proximal edge of the buffy fringing on 
the secondaries and lower wing bar was judged to be a good field mark. 

On the photo used to illustrate this, the band between the lower wing bar and 
the top edge of the fringe is about 1/3 of the length of the visible 
secondaries on the yellow-bellied, while not more than 1/4 of this length on 
the western.  Looking at several of the photos of the Inwood bird, the band is 
much closer to 1/4 than 1/3.  I think this would support western, rather than 
yellow, as some have previously commented.

Peter
> On Dec 9, 2016, at 11:01 AM, Anders Peltomaa  
> wrote:
> 
> Thanks for the reminder Shai,
> 
> Here is a link to a PDF of the article that Joe referenced.
> 
> https://biology.unm.edu/Witt/pub_files/Baumann-etal-2014-JFO-yellow-Empid-ID-jofo12078.pdf
> 
> good birding,
> 
> Anders Peltomaa
> Manhattan
> 
> On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 9:12 AM, Shaibal Mitra 
> wrote:
> 
>> In a really nice example of how this list serves as institutional memory
>> for our community, Dave Klauber just reminded me of this very relevant post
>> from Joe DiCostanzo, from December 2014. It details the foundation of the
>> wing pattern feature mentioned in the Whatbird discussions, and I would
>> agree that this feature also favors Yellow-bellied Flycatcher.
>> 
>> It's not fun to admit this, but the things I learn nowadays don't stick
>> with me to nearly the same degree as the things I learned before, say 2000!
>> So n.b. to those whose brains are still limber: don't put off learning
>> until later, front-load the data hoarding as much as possible!
>> 
>> From: bounce-118614530-3714...@list.cornell.edu > list.cornell.edu> on behalf of Joe DiCostanzo 
>> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 7:24 PM
>> To: NYSBirds
>> Subject: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip
>> 
>> 
>> Just got the current issue of the Journal of Field Ornithology (vol. 85,
>> no. 4, December 2014). I figure this is not a journal that most birders
>> check for ID articles so I thought I would draw attention to an article in
>> it: “Simple technique for distinguishing Yellow-bellied Flycatchers from
>> Cordilleran and Pacific-slope flycatchers by M. J. Baumann, S. C. Galen, N.
>> D. Pederson and C. C. Witt. Pp. 391-396. Anyone interested should read the
>> article for all the details, many of which involve measurements that can
>> only be done in the hand, but there is one character that can be used to
>> distinguish Yellow-bellied Flycatcher from “Western Flycatcher” (the
>> complex composed of Cordilleran and Pacific-slope flys.). It involves the
>> space on the folded wing between the lower wing bar and the start of the
>> pale fringes on the secondaries. This space is much larger in the
>> Yellow-bellied than in the “Western”. I pulled out a few field guides from
>> my bookshelf to see if it was distinguishable in published illustrations. I
>> found it was apparent in the photos in Kenn Kaufman’s Birds of North
>> America (at least in the first edition that I have). It was also obvious in
>> Dave Sibley’s paintings of these species in his Second Edition of the
>> Sibley Guide to Birds (I didn’t check the first edition). The authors of
>> the Journal of Field Ornithology article tested their technique on 113
>> museum specimens that had been identified based on locality. They found
>> their technique correctly place 112 of the specimens. One specimen labeled
>> as a Yellow-bellied Flycatcher that had been collected in Illinois was
>> identified as a “Western Flycatcher” by their technique. Amazingly, when
>> the mtDNA of this specimen was examined, the specimen proved to be a
>> “Western Flycatcher”, the first for the complex for Illinois!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Distinguishing a Yellow-bellied Fly from a “Western Fly” has not come up
>> yet in New York, but hey, you never know.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Joe DiCostanzo
>> 
>> www.greatgullisland.org
>> 
>> www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com
>> 
>> [http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zlSALCVoYnM/U0SFqj6uWfI/
>> AWQ/xYjr3pf15r0/s80/Joe.jpg]>> 
>> 
>> Inwood Birder
>> www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com
>> A very pretty morning in the Ramble for my Thursday morning AMNH bird walk
>> group. It would have been an even prettier morning if there had been more
>> birds around!
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
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[nysbirds-l] Inwood Empidonax - photo & comment

[Deborah Allen]

Hi All, 
  
I photographed the Empidonax flycatcher at Inwood at around 2:30 this afternoon 
(Dec. 9):
  
http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=18320149
 
   
A close look reveals emargination on p6-p9 (four primaries)so the bird is 
certainly not an Acadian, Willow, or Alder Flycatcher (see Pyle Vol. 1), if 
anyone is still considering those species as possibilities.
  
I was also struck by the warm, buffy tones on this bird, especially on the 
cheek, but from some of the photos I've seen on the New York Birders Facebook 
Group, the bird does look greener in the shade. 
  
One other characteristic that may be worth mentioning. The rectrices have pale 
tips which appear a bit worn, so I would think this is a hatch-year bird. I 
have not been able to find a reference to pale-tipped rectrices in Pyle for any 
Empids other  than Least Flycatcher. It would be good to get a photo of the 
spread tail, which may be useful for determining the age of the bird. 
  
Deb Allen

P. S. Apparently some problem with formatting an earlier post - sorry. 

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[nysbirds-l] Inwood Empidonax - photo & comment

[Deborah Allen]

Hi All, I photographed the Empidonax flycatcher at Inwood at around 2:30 this afternoon (Dec. 9):

http://photo.net/photodb/photo?photo_id=18320149

A close look reveals emargination on p6-p9 (four primaries) so the bird is certainly not an Acadian, Willow, or Alder Flycatcher (see Pyle Vol. 1), if anyone is still considering those species as possibilities.I was also struck by the warm, buffy tones on this bird, especially on the cheek, but from some of the photos I've seen on the New York Birders Facebook Group, the bird does look greener in the shade. One other characteristic that may be worth mentioning. The rectrices have pale tips which appear a bit worn, so I would think this is a hatch-year bird. I have not been able to find a reference to pale-tipped rectrices in Pyle for any Empids other than Least Flycatcher. It would be good to get a photo of the spread tail, which may be useful for determining the age of the bird.  Deb Allen
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[nysbirds-l] NYC Area RBA: 9 December 2016

[Ben Cacace]

- RBA
* New York
* New York City, Long Island, Westchester County
* Dec. 9, 2016
* NYNY1612.09

- Birds mentioned
PACIFIC LOON+
ASH-THROATED FLYCATCHER+
CAVE SWALLOW+
WESTERN TANAGER+
(+ Details requested by NYSARC)

Red-necked Grebe
Rough-legged Hawk
Black-legged Kittiwake
Snowy Owl
Long-eared Owl
Blue-gray Gnatcatcher
Lapland Longspur
Orange-crowned Warbler
Pine Warbler
Black-throated Green Warbler
Yellow-breasted Chat
Lincoln's Sparrow
Dickcissel
Baltimore Oriole
Red Crossbill

Other taxa mentioned:
Selasphorus hummingbird
Empidonax flycatcher

- Transcript

If followed by (+) please submit documentation of your report
electronically and use the NYSARC online submission form found at
http://www.nybirds.org/NYSARC/goodreport.htm

You can also send reports and digital image files via email to
nysarc44(at)nybirds{dot}org.

If electronic submission is not possible, hardcopy reports and photos or
sketches are welcome. Hardcopy documentation should be mailed to:

Gary Chapin - Secretary
NYS Avian Records Committee (NYSARC)
125 Pine Springs Drive
Ticonderoga, NY 12883

Hotline: New York City Area Rare Bird Alert
Number: (212) 979-3070

To report sightings call:
Tom Burke (212) 372-1483 (weekdays, during the day)
Tony Lauro at (631) 734-4126 (Long Island)

Compiler: Tom Burke, Tony Lauro
Coverage: New York City, Long Island, Westchester County

Transcriber: Ben Cacace

BEGIN TAPE

Greetings. This is the NYS Rare Bird alert for Friday, December 9th 2016.

The highlights of today's tape include PACIFIC LOON, CAVE SWALLOW,
ASH-THROATED FLYCATCHER, WESTERN TANAGER, and a very unseasonal Empidonax
flycatcher.

An Empidonax flycatcher found and photographed at Inwood Hill Park on Dec 8
was seen again this morning. Its identity has not been confirmed, but
debate has centered on Yellow-bellied and "Western" Flycatchers, the latter
comprising the sibling taxa, Pacific-slope and Cordilleran. Field
impressions of shape and posture could help to determine the ID, as would
additional photos and any information about vocalizations.

This season's run of ASH-THROATED FLYCATCHERS continued this week. The
individual at Lido West Park persisted at least through Dec 4, and another
Ash-throated was found at Marine Park, Brooklyn on Dec 5 and was seen to at
least Dec 7. In the vicinity of the former was a late BALTIMORE ORIOLE, and
of the latter were an ORANGE-CROWNED WARBLER and a very late BLACK-THROATED
GREEN WARBLER, both seen at least through Dec 6.

On eastern Long Island, a basic plumaged PACIFIC LOON flew east past Camp
Hero bluffs in Montauk on Dec 4, and a RED-NECKED GREBE, originally found
Nov 23, continued on nearby Fort Pond to at least Dec 4. A dark morph
ROUGH-LEGGED HAWK was found hovering over the sand islands north of
Cupsogue County Park Dec 4, and a Selasphorus hummingbird was still coming
to a private Aquebogue feeder on Dec 5, now apparently accompanied by a
second, unidentified hummingbird.

A CAVE SWALLOW at Point Lookout Fireman's Park was discovered Dec 3,
spending some time along sandy path south of ball field during the day but
not reported again afterwards.

The WESTERN TANAGER at City Hall Park was still present as of Dec 8, and
the YELLOW-BREASTED CHAT there was still present at least to Dec 3. The
Trinity Church Chat was present to at least Dec 4. Other seasonally unusual
birds included a BLUE-GRAY GNATCATCHER at Randall's Island, found Nov 28
and seen again Dec 4, as well as a late LINCOLN'S SPARROW at the much
scarified Bryant Park Dec 3.

Highlights among the more regular winter species reported this week
included a first-year BLACK-LEGGED KITTIWAKE photographed from the base of
the ferry terminal at Staten Island Dec 3, flying toward Bayonne, NJ;
reports of SNOWY and LONG-EARED OWL; at least 2 LAPLAND LONGSPURS
continuing with the Horned Lark flocks at Jones Beach West End, last
reported Dec 2; and another flock of four RED CROSSBILLS, suggestive of at
least a minor irruption this season. This flock flew into the pines at
Midland Beach on Staten Island at the terminus of Father Capodanno Blvd on
7 Dec. In this same area were a DICKCISSEL and a PINE WARBLER.

The compilers for this week's RBA were Shaibal Mitra and Patricia Lindsay.

Tom Burke has returned from his trip to the Southern Ocean and would
appreciate reports for next week. To phone in reports on weekdays call Tom
Burke at (212) 372-1483.

- End transcript

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[nysbirds-l] Empidonax sp., Manhattan NYC 12/9

[Thomas Fiore]

Inwood Hill Park, northern Manhattan (NYC)
Friday, 9 December 2016

The Empidonax [genus] Flycatcher (found Thursday 12/8 by John Keane)  
was continuing to be seen today in the area described in prior posts  
on this individual - at least 15 birders were there (at various times)  
by about noon to try to see it - and among them, Isaac Grant, myself,  
and Jose Ramirez (who first spotted!) and we 3 then watched, and HEARD  
(after 9 a.m.) - giving what (to my ears) sounded like soft "seet" or  
seep" calls, a number of them and given singly - I do not speak for  
any other birders, and we ought hear from them, how they perceive[d]  
what was heard! In addition, I failed (-later, when the bird may  
have no longer been vocal-) to capture audio in a short video-attempt  
with a point-and-shoot (that is, zero audio of the Empidonax in what  
is a sound-filled clip, with wind, some traffic and my unwanted  
exclamation as the bird came very near to us!) - it is possible that  
other observers managed some audio of the flycatcher in attempting to  
do that, and if so it is hoped any sound-files might be shared, no  
matter the quality?  Thanks to all who made appearances, and a  
particular thanks to Joe DiCostanzo who was showing some of us, on- 
scene, some good illustration-work by artists who have depicted these  
Empidonax in various works (such as David Sibley in particular);

IF (and I am qualifying it as "if") my hearing of the calls of this  
bird this morning are reasonably accurate, the sounds heard seem  
inconsistent with those I am aware of for Yellow-bellied, and perhaps  
more consistent with a "western" type (or what was once known, in the  
collective, as WESTERN) but, again, some thoughts from others on- 
scene, and in any audio-captures?   I can't give too much more (than  
the good photos made available show) on the appearance of this bird,  
other than that a few features (as observed) did not seem "just right"  
for a typical Yellow-bellied; I was also wondering about the somewhat  
bold (on a few occasions) behavior of this individual, coming out on  
the paved path, & to the open edge of the field, a few times in the 4+  
hours I spent in the area (with a total of perhaps 45-50+ minutes of  
viewing - much of the time I was not aware, or the bird was not easy  
to find, and I think that may be consistent with how some others  
(there for a while) found the viewing of; the bird would seem to be  
"lost" from us for periods, and then, more than a few times, pop up  
nearly in front of us - often at eye-level or below and just a few  
times much more than ~5 feet above the ground!  Of course, a hungry &  
either very "late", or rather off-course migrant, could well behave in  
ways unexpected in a more-typical migration appearance! (The bird seen  
this day did seem to be feeding on miniscule insect &/or arthropod  
prey, but how much? And it can't be good for what the weather is now  
bringing in colder temperatures, and wind-chill.  I believe the  
initial observation today 12/9 was at after 9 am, and that attempts to  
see the bird before then were not successful; also it seems the first  
sighting of this bird on Thursday 12/8 may have been not before 9, and  
perhaps a good bit later.

Incidentally (and seriously), an observation was made at one point,  
that the Empidonax had defecated & some went to see if they might  
retrieve any of that matter, but it was too difficult just then to  
determine the 'landing-zone', as this was above an area just off-path  
with much natural leaf-liiter and other such detritus. It was actually  
a brief moment of added excitement - yes, we birders are an odd  
collection!   Thanks to everyone who has offered excellent comment and  
photography, & more on this interesting sighting.

In some other sightings at Inwood, while positioned at the edges of  
the soccer lawn (white goal nets at east & west ends) by the water &  
western path of the field, some of us had too-brief sightings of a  
warbler, which was quite yellow underneath, and which for a few  
seconds went up quite high in distant tree (by the water), then down &  
perhaps "lost" in a mass of brush & such, where we barely glimpsed it  
again;  my 'call' on that was initially of a Nashville, but it may  
have been some other species, perhaps even one showing a bit of 'wing- 
bars' (I and the others were at least sure of it being a warbler, & - 
most probably- an eastern-breeding species!!) - and a far more  
definitive sighting were the 2 Bald Eagles that soared over, rather  
briefly at mid-morning, an adult & a younger bird, both directly  
overhead and then apparently gone on southwards.

- - - - - -
Separate sighting: today, 12/9, at City Hall Park in lower Manhattan,  
a Western Tanager was seen (by others) - for now the 17th day in a  
row, if my date calculations are accurate!  (And we again thank Cedric  
Duhalde for that tanager of his finding!!)

good birding,

Tom Fiore
Manhat

Re: [nysbirds-l] Inwood emptied

[pwpost]

I would like to remind everyone looking for this bird that droppings of the 
last year's Central Park Western Flycatcher were helpful in It's identification 
as a probable Pacific-slope. 

Carry a ziplock bag?

Peter Post. 

Sent from my iPhone

> On Dec 9, 2016, at 3:53 PM, zach schwartz-weinstein  wrote:
> 
> None while I was there.  I think Isaac and Jose tried to record it this 
> morning, without success, but maybe they can describe the call note?
>> On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 3:51 PM Shaibal Mitra  
>> wrote:
>> Hi all,
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Based on these new photos, I can definitely agree with Hugh's earlier points 
>> about the brownish flight feather tones (vs. blackish in Yellow-bellied) and 
>> the spacing of the primary tips (one large gap, vs. two roughly equal gaps). 
>> The pale edgings on the secondaries look much dingier here and less 
>> contrasting than the way I perceived them on the earlier photos. It also 
>> looks consistently small-headed in these photos, and not as large- and 
>> round-headed as expected in Yellow-bellied. And finally the tone of the 
>> green coloring here really seems more golden-tinged (as in Western) vs. the 
>> colder, yellower-green tone of Yellow-bellied.
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Any vocalizations heard?
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Shai
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> From: bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu 
>> [bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of zach 
>> schwartz-weinstein [zac...@gmail.com]
>> 
>> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 3:00 PM
>> 
>> To: NYSbirds-L@cornell.edu; ebirds...@yahoogroups.com
>> 
>> Subject: [nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32934114
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> 
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>> 
>> 
>> --
>> 
>> 
>> 
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Re: [nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid

[zach schwartz-weinstein]

None while I was there.  I think Isaac and Jose tried to record it this
morning, without success, but maybe they can describe the call note?
On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 3:51 PM Shaibal Mitra 
wrote:

> Hi all,
>
>
>
> Based on these new photos, I can definitely agree with Hugh's earlier
> points about the brownish flight feather tones (vs. blackish in
> Yellow-bellied) and the spacing of the primary tips (one large gap, vs. two
> roughly equal gaps). The pale edgings on the secondaries look much dingier
> here and less contrasting than the way I perceived them on the earlier
> photos. It also looks consistently small-headed in these photos, and not as
> large- and round-headed as expected in Yellow-bellied. And finally the tone
> of the green coloring here really seems more golden-tinged (as in Western)
> vs. the colder, yellower-green tone of Yellow-bellied.
>
>
>
> Any vocalizations heard?
>
>
>
> Shai
>
> 
>
> From: bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu [
> bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of zach
> schwartz-weinstein [zac...@gmail.com]
>
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 3:00 PM
>
> To: NYSbirds-L@cornell.edu; ebirds...@yahoogroups.com
>
> Subject: [nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid
>
>
>
> http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32934114
>
>
>
>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
>
>
> --
>
>
>
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>
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>
>
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
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RE: [nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid

[Shaibal Mitra]

Hi all,

Based on these new photos, I can definitely agree with Hugh's earlier points 
about the brownish flight feather tones (vs. blackish in Yellow-bellied) and 
the spacing of the primary tips (one large gap, vs. two roughly equal gaps). 
The pale edgings on the secondaries look much dingier here and less contrasting 
than the way I perceived them on the earlier photos. It also looks consistently 
small-headed in these photos, and not as large- and round-headed as expected in 
Yellow-bellied. And finally the tone of the green coloring here really seems 
more golden-tinged (as in Western) vs. the colder, yellower-green tone of 
Yellow-bellied. 

Any vocalizations heard?

Shai

From: bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu 
[bounce-121072315-11143...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of zach 
schwartz-weinstein [zac...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 3:00 PM
To: NYSbirds-L@cornell.edu; ebirds...@yahoogroups.com
Subject: [nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid

http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32934114


Sent from my iPhone

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[nysbirds-l] Additional photos of the Inwood empid

[zach schwartz-weinstein]

http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32934114


Sent from my iPhone

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RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Wasilco, Mike R (DEC)]

Chipmunks and red squirrels and even deer have been known to take advantage of 
bird nests, eggs and even adult birds when the opportunity presents itself.  
They can be a problem when mist-netting.

Michael R. Wasilco
Regional Wildlife Manager, Division of Fish, Wildlife and Marine Resources

New York State Department of Environmental Conservation
6274 E. Avon-Lima Rd., Avon, NY 14414
P: (585)226-5460 | F: (585) 226-6323 | mike.wasi...@dec.ny.gov

www.dec.ny.gov | [cid:image002.gif@01D01928.215FD820] 
  | [cid:image001.gif@01D01927.D33C0790] 


From: bounce-121072206-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-121072206-3714...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of 
redk...@optonline.net
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 2:31 PM
To: Rick & Linda 
Cc: NYS BIRDS 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!


ATTENTION: This email came from an external source. Do not open attachments or 
click on links from unknown senders or unexpected emails.

Hi Rick: Grey squirrels, red squirrels, both species of flying squirrels (often 
come to feeding stations to feed on suet), and chipmunks covet protein and are 
known to eat bird eggs and nestlings. Indeed, they are an under appreciated 
source of mortality for songbirds, especially chipmunks.

If would like stickers from WindowAlert which you can put on your sliding glass 
door to make it more visible to birds let me know. They reflect UV light and I 
have put them up at Brookhaven Town Hall to good success. I have a packet which 
contains four stickers I'd be happy to send to you.

Happy Holidays.

John

- Original Message -
From: Rick & Linda
Date: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!
To: NYS BIRDS

> I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures
> of a squirrel on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe
> my eyes but there it is.
>
> I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the
> sliding glass door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the
> glass. I finished what I was doing and went to see if the bird
> needed to be put in a box and kept warm until it recovered.
> When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds
> head off and was eating the rest.
>
> I have never seen this before, has anyone else?
>
> I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other
> table scraps that the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the
> squirrels always turn their noses up at that food.
>
> She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only
> feathers stuck to her head and leg.
>
> This is a first for me and I don't know if I like the idea of a
> carnivorous squirrel.
>
>
>
> IMG_9673
>
>
>
> IMG_9672
>
>
>
> IMG_9671
>
>
>
> IMG_9670
>
>
>
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the
> Google Groups "North Fork Birds" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from
> it, send an email to north-fork-
> birds+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com 
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>
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[redknot]

Hi Rick: Grey squirrels, red squirrels, both species of flying squirrels (often 
come to feeding stations to feed on suet), and chipmunks covet protein and are 
known to eat bird eggs and nestlings. Indeed, they are an under appreciated 
source of mortality for songbirds, especially chipmunks. 

If would like stickers from WindowAlert which you can put on your sliding glass 
door to make it more visible to birds let me know. They reflect UV light and I 
have put them up at Brookhaven Town Hall to good success. I have a packet which 
contains four stickers I'd be happy to send to you.

Happy Holidays.

John 

- Original Message -
From: Rick & Linda 
Date: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 pm
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!
To: NYS BIRDS 

> I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures 
> of a squirrel on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe 
> my eyes but there it is.
> 
> I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the 
> sliding glass door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the 
> glass. I finished what I was doing and went to see if the bird 
> needed to be put in a box and kept warm until it recovered. 
> When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds 
> head off and was eating the rest.
> 
> I have never seen this before, has anyone else?
> 
> I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other 
> table scraps that the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the 
> squirrels always turn their noses up at that food.
> 
> She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only 
> feathers stuck to her head and leg.
> 
> This is a first for me and I don’t know if I like the idea of a 
> carnivorous squirrel. 
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_9673
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_9672
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_9671
> 
> 
> 
> IMG_9670
> 
> 
> 
> -- 
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the 
> Google Groups "North Fork Birds" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from 
> it, send an email to north-fork-
> birds+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com > birds+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com>.For 
> more options, visit 
> https://groups.google.com/d/optout .
> 
> --
> 
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
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> 2) http://www.surfbirds.com/birdingmail/Group/NYSBirds-L
> 3) http://birdingonthe.net/mailinglists/NYSB.html
> 
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
> http://ebird.org/content/ebird/
> 
> --

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RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Weiskotten, Kurt]

Wait – squirrels like poached eggs??  …  Sorry, couldn’t help myself!

[GPI Logo 03.png]



Kurt Weiskotten
Environmental Scientist

Greenman-Pedersen, Inc.
Engineering and Construction Services

80 Wolf Road, Suite 300, Albany, NY 12205
Main 518-898-9553 ext. 1553 | cell 518-542-3489
kweiskot...@gpinet.com | 
www.gpinet.com

An Equal Opportunity Employer



From: bounce-121072120-75443...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-121072120-75443...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Gabriel Willow
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 2:01 PM
To: Joan Collins
Cc: Shaibal Mitra; NYS BIRDS
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

Agreeing with others on this thread, I believe squirrels are opportunistic 
feeders, and likely consume a higher quantity of meat than we may suspect (much 
as coyotes, foxes, and other carnivores eat substantial quantities of vegetable 
matter during certain seasons).

Many years ago I had the disturbing experience of hearing the alarm calls of a 
pair of Wood Thrushes, and upon investigation, discovered a Gray Squirrel 
devouring their entire nestful of small nestlings. Seeing the blood-smeared 
squirrel calmly sitting on its haunches in their nest, gnawing on chicks was 
certainly memorable.  I have since witnessed squirrels poaching eggs on more 
than one occasion.

It is my understanding that Red Squirrels are more carnivorous than Grays, and 
Chipmunks are still more meat-loving.  In fact, chipmunks are one of the major 
predators of eggs and nestlings in our region.

Cheers,

Gabriel Willow
Nyc Audubon

On Dec 9, 2016, at 1:50 PM, Joan Collins 
mailto:joan.coll...@frontier.com>> wrote:

Shai - wonderful description of the squirrel spinning the drumstick like a pine 
cone!  That is exactly how I describe what it looks like when a Red Squirrel 
eats a bird.  I take photos and videos of lots of behaviors - many that my 
husband objects to me putting on Facebook (too gross) - but after the list 
discussion about the Gray Squirrel behavior, I decided to post a short clip of 
one of the videos I took on May 8, 2016 of a Red Squirrel that captured, 
killed, and then consumed a Pine Siskin foraging on the ground under our 
feeders (I could go into the details, but I’d rather not re-live it).  (On my 
Facebook page below)  I suspect that this (killing) behavior is much more 
frequent in Red Squirrels - they are extremely fast compared to Gray Squirrels 
and quite capable of capturing a bird if an opportunity exists.

In the winter, I put down sunflower seeds for the Black-capped Chickadees at 
Sabattis Bog where I feed Gray Jays.  All of the birds keep a good distance 
from the Red Squirrels that venture to the food.  The chickadees are extremely 
observant and let out alarm calls - when the Red Squirrels first come in and 
anytime they are within striking distance.

Joan Collins

President, NYS Ornithological Association

Editor, New York Birders

Long Lake, NY

(315) 244-7127 cell

(518) 624-5528 home

http://www.adirondackavianexpeditions.com/

http://www.facebook.com/AdirondackAvian

-Original Message-
From: 
bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu
 [mailto:bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Shaibal Mitra
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 1:01 PM
To: NYS BIRDS mailto:NYSbirds-L@cornell.edu>>
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly 
plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart 
enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and 
wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.

When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on 
what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were visually 
amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and fried 
drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane, 
especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little 
fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging a 
fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really needed 
the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some moral abyss, 
I approached the rodent to assess the point at which self-preservation might 
take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I could have caught it, but what 
good would that have done? I walked away, Desiderata in my mind's ear.

Shai Mitra

Bay Shore



From: 
bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu
 
[bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu]
 on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern 
[kerns...@hotmail.com]

Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Gabriel Willow]

Agreeing with others on this thread, I believe squirrels are opportunistic 
feeders, and likely consume a higher quantity of meat than we may suspect (much 
as coyotes, foxes, and other carnivores eat substantial quantities of vegetable 
matter during certain seasons).

Many years ago I had the disturbing experience of hearing the alarm calls of a 
pair of Wood Thrushes, and upon investigation, discovered a Gray Squirrel 
devouring their entire nestful of small nestlings. Seeing the blood-smeared 
squirrel calmly sitting on its haunches in their nest, gnawing on chicks was 
certainly memorable.  I have since witnessed squirrels poaching eggs on more 
than one occasion.

It is my understanding that Red Squirrels are more carnivorous than Grays, and 
Chipmunks are still more meat-loving.  In fact, chipmunks are one of the major 
predators of eggs and nestlings in our region.

Cheers,

Gabriel Willow
Nyc Audubon 

> On Dec 9, 2016, at 1:50 PM, Joan Collins  wrote:
> 
> Shai - wonderful description of the squirrel spinning the drumstick like a 
> pine cone!  That is exactly how I describe what it looks like when a Red 
> Squirrel eats a bird.  I take photos and videos of lots of behaviors - many 
> that my husband objects to me putting on Facebook (too gross) - but after the 
> list discussion about the Gray Squirrel behavior, I decided to post a short 
> clip of one of the videos I took on May 8, 2016 of a Red Squirrel that 
> captured, killed, and then consumed a Pine Siskin foraging on the ground 
> under our feeders (I could go into the details, but I’d rather not re-live 
> it).  (On my Facebook page below)  I suspect that this (killing) behavior is 
> much more frequent in Red Squirrels - they are extremely fast compared to 
> Gray Squirrels and quite capable of capturing a bird if an opportunity exists.
> 
> In the winter, I put down sunflower seeds for the Black-capped Chickadees at 
> Sabattis Bog where I feed Gray Jays.  All of the birds keep a good distance 
> from the Red Squirrels that venture to the food.  The chickadees are 
> extremely observant and let out alarm calls - when the Red Squirrels first 
> come in and anytime they are within striking distance.
> 
> Joan Collins
> 
> President, NYS Ornithological Association
> 
> Editor, New York Birders
> 
> Long Lake, NY
> 
> (315) 244-7127 cell  
> 
> (518) 624-5528 home
> 
> http://www.adirondackavianexpeditions.com/  
> 
> http://www.facebook.com/AdirondackAvian
> 
> 
> -Original Message-
> From: bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu 
> [mailto:bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Shaibal Mitra
> Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 1:01 PM
> To: NYS BIRDS 
> Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before 
> !!
> 
> Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly 
> plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart 
> enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and 
> wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.
> 
> When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on 
> what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were 
> visually amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and 
> fried drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane, 
> especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little 
> fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging a 
> fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really 
> needed the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some 
> moral abyss, I approached the rodent to assess the point at which 
> self-preservation might take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I could 
> have caught it, but what good would that have done? I walked away, Desiderata 
> in my mind's ear.
> 
> Shai Mitra
> 
> Bay Shore
> 
> 
> 
> From: bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
> [bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern 
> [kerns...@hotmail.com]
> 
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:21 PM
> 
> To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda
> 
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before 
> !!
> 
> I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
> road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
> Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of 
> hunger.
> 
> 
> Nancy Kern
> 
> 
> Austerlitz, NY
> 
> Columbia County
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu 
>  on behalf of Rick & Linda 
> 
> 
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
> 
> To: NYS BIRDS
> 
> Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!
> 
> I always thought G Squirrels were

Re: [nysbirds-l] Inwood Hill Park (New York City) empid

[zach schwartz-weinstein]

Present again for the last ten minutes foraging very low by the paved
path.  Many photos, no recording of call
On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 1:52 PM David Barrett  wrote:

> The empid was visible during most of the hour, starting at 10:50 a,m.,
> that I was present. It was nearly always perching low on twigs, and
> frequently was on the ground. It ranged immediately west of the paved path
> on the west boundary of the soccer fields, which lie south of Spuyten
> Duyvil Creek. This Google Maps link has pins at sighting locations:
>
> https://drive.google.com/open?id=1jXpbow97iip_3WAlr9_bxiEpo-k&usp=sharing
>
> David Barrett
> www.bigmanhattanyear.com
>
>
>
>
> --
>
>
> *NYSbirds-L List Info:*
>
>
> Welcome and Basics 
>
>
> Rules and Information 
>
>
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> 
>
>
> *Archives:*
>
>
> The Mail Archive
> 
>
>
> Surfbirds 
>
>
> BirdingOnThe.Net 
>
>
> *Please submit your observations to **eBird*
> *!*
>
>
> --
>

--

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Please submit your observations to eBird:
http://ebird.org/content/ebird/

--

RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Weiskotten, Kurt]

And of course, a relative, the eastern chipmunk is a notorious egg thief and 
will go after nestlings and other meaty creatures of circumstance.   I have 
even seen a chipmunk readily eating the hind quarters of another chipmunk!

[GPI Logo with Wreath]

Kurt Weiskotten
Environmental Scientist

Greenman-Pedersen, Inc.
Engineering and Construction Services
80 Wolf Road, Suite 300, Albany, NY  12205
Office: 518.453.9431 x1553  Direct Dial: 518.898.9553
kweiskot...@gpinet.com | 
www.gpinet.com

[cid:image003.png@01D15500.1F51CAB0]
  [cid:image008.png@01D15500.1F51CAB0] 
   [Youtube_icon] 


An Equal Opportunity Employer



From: bounce-121072082-75443...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-121072082-75443...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Joan Collins
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 1:51 PM
To: 'Shaibal Mitra'; 'NYS BIRDS'
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!


Shai - wonderful description of the squirrel spinning the drumstick like a pine 
cone!  That is exactly how I describe what it looks like when a Red Squirrel 
eats a bird.  I take photos and videos of lots of behaviors - many that my 
husband objects to me putting on Facebook (too gross) - but after the list 
discussion about the Gray Squirrel behavior, I decided to post a short clip of 
one of the videos I took on May 8, 2016 of a Red Squirrel that captured, 
killed, and then consumed a Pine Siskin foraging on the ground under our 
feeders (I could go into the details, but I'd rather not re-live it).  (On my 
Facebook page below)  I suspect that this (killing) behavior is much more 
frequent in Red Squirrels - they are extremely fast compared to Gray Squirrels 
and quite capable of capturing a bird if an opportunity exists.

In the winter, I put down sunflower seeds for the Black-capped Chickadees at 
Sabattis Bog where I feed Gray Jays.  All of the birds keep a good distance 
from the Red Squirrels that venture to the food.  The chickadees are extremely 
observant and let out alarm calls - when the Red Squirrels first come in and 
anytime they are within striking distance.

Joan Collins

President, NYS Ornithological Association

Editor, New York Birders

Long Lake, NY

(315) 244-7127 cell

(518) 624-5528 home

http://www.adirondackavianexpeditions.com/

http://www.facebook.com/AdirondackAvian

-Original Message-
From: 
bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu
 [mailto:bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Shaibal Mitra
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 1:01 PM
To: NYS BIRDS mailto:NYSbirds-L@cornell.edu>>
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly 
plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart 
enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and 
wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.

When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on 
what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were visually 
amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and fried 
drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane, 
especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little 
fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging a 
fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really needed 
the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some moral abyss, 
I approached the rodent to assess the point at which self-preservation might 
take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I could have caught it, but what 
good would that have done? I walked away, Desiderata in my mind's ear.

Shai Mitra

Bay Shore



From: 
bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu
 [bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern 
[kerns...@hotmail.com]

Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:21 PM

To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda

Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of hunger.


Nancy Kern


Austerlitz, NY

Columbia County








From: 
bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu
 
mailto:bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu>>
 on behalf 

[nysbirds-l] Inwood Hill Park (New York City) empid

[David Barrett]

The empid was visible during most of the hour, starting at 10:50 a,m., that
I was present. It was nearly always perching low on twigs, and frequently
was on the ground. It ranged immediately west of the paved path on the west
boundary of the soccer fields, which lie south of Spuyten Duyvil Creek.
This Google Maps link has pins at sighting locations:

https://drive.google.com/open?id=1jXpbow97iip_3WAlr9_bxiEpo-k&usp=sharing

David Barrett
www.bigmanhattanyear.com

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RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Joan Collins]

Shai - wonderful description of the squirrel spinning the drumstick like a
pine cone!  That is exactly how I describe what it looks like when a Red
Squirrel eats a bird.  I take photos and videos of lots of behaviors - many
that my husband objects to me putting on Facebook (too gross) - but after
the list discussion about the Gray Squirrel behavior, I decided to post a
short clip of one of the videos I took on May 8, 2016 of a Red Squirrel that
captured, killed, and then consumed a Pine Siskin foraging on the ground
under our feeders (I could go into the details, but I'd rather not re-live
it).  (On my Facebook page below)  I suspect that this (killing) behavior is
much more frequent in Red Squirrels - they are extremely fast compared to
Gray Squirrels and quite capable of capturing a bird if an opportunity
exists.

In the winter, I put down sunflower seeds for the Black-capped Chickadees at
Sabattis Bog where I feed Gray Jays.  All of the birds keep a good distance
from the Red Squirrels that venture to the food.  The chickadees are
extremely observant and let out alarm calls - when the Red Squirrels first
come in and anytime they are within striking distance.

Joan Collins
President, NYS Ornithological Association
Editor, New York Birders
Long Lake, NY
(315) 244-7127 cell   
(518) 624-5528 home
http://www.adirondackavianexpeditions.com/  
http://www.facebook.com/AdirondackAvian

-Original Message-
From: bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu
[mailto:bounce-121071933-13418...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Shaibal
Mitra
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 1:01 PM
To: NYS BIRDS 
Subject: RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This
Before !!

Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly
plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart
enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and
wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.

When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on
what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were
visually amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and
fried drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane,
especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little
fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging
a fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really
needed the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some
moral abyss, I approached the rodent to assess the point at which
self-preservation might take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I
could have caught it, but what good would that have done? I walked away,
Desiderata in my mind's ear. 

Shai Mitra
Bay Shore 

From: bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu

[bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern
[kerns...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:21 PM
To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This
Before !!

I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat
on road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in
Albany. Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level
of hunger.


Nancy Kern


Austerlitz, NY

Columbia County








From: bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu

mailto:bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu> > on behalf of Rick &
Linda mailto:kedenb...@optonline.net> >
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
To: NYS BIRDS
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a
squirrel on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there
it is.

I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding
glass door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what
I was doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept
warm until it recovered.
When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and
was eating the rest.

I have never seen this before, has anyone else?

I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps
that the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their
noses up at that food.

She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to
her head and leg.

This is a first for me and I don't know if I like the idea of a carnivorous
squirrel.

[cid:DFE8FBDE-B4B2-4B9F-9531-FCBFB311FC21]

IMG_9673


[cid:10AC657C-5218-4F3E-8109-F2AEEABD5C2A]
IMG_9672


[cid:272CDC01-2A40-4AEB-9A34-7B02B0BFF996]
IMG_9671


[cid:F66C8D08-3E61-48D1-BCE8-

Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Rick & Linda]

Thanks Arie, Shai & Nancy Jane,
Upon reflection I concur with what you have to say. Although it was still a 
shock to see the bird still twitching as it was being eaten.

I was worried that the squirrel might have rabies and that was the reason for, 
what I thought of, it’s aberrant behavior.
Thanks for the feed back. Pun intended.
rk

> On Dec 9, 2016, at 1:01 PM, Shaibal Mitra  wrote:
> 
> Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly 
> plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart 
> enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and 
> wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.
> 
> When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on 
> what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were 
> visually amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and 
> fried drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane, 
> especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little 
> fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging a 
> fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really 
> needed the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some 
> moral abyss, I approached the rodent to assess the point at which 
> self-preservation might take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I could 
> have caught it, but what good would that have done? I walked away, Desiderata 
> in my mind's ear. 
> 
> Shai Mitra
> Bay Shore 
> 
> From: bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
> [bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern 
> [kerns...@hotmail.com]
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:21 PM
> To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda
> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before 
> !!
> 
> I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
> road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
> Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of 
> hunger.
> 
> 
> Nancy Kern
> 
> 
> Austerlitz, NY
> 
> Columbia County
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> From: bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu 
>  on behalf of Rick & Linda 
> 
> Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
> To: NYS BIRDS
> Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!
> 
> I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a 
> squirrel on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there 
> it is.
> 
> I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding 
> glass door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I 
> was doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept warm 
> until it recovered.
> When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and 
> was eating the rest.
> 
> I have never seen this before, has anyone else?
> 
> I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps that 
> the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses 
> up at that food.
> 
> She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to 
> her head and leg.
> 
> This is a first for me and I don’t know if I like the idea of a carnivorous 
> squirrel.
> 
> [cid:DFE8FBDE-B4B2-4B9F-9531-FCBFB311FC21]
> 
> IMG_9673
> 
> 
> [cid:10AC657C-5218-4F3E-8109-F2AEEABD5C2A]
> IMG_9672
> 
> 
> [cid:272CDC01-2A40-4AEB-9A34-7B02B0BFF996]
> IMG_9671
> 
> 
> [cid:F66C8D08-3E61-48D1-BCE8-4DB14B1A2AA2]
> IMG_9670
> 
> 
> 
> --
> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups 
> "North Fork Birds" group.
> To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an 
> email to 
> north-fork-birds+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com.
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RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Shaibal Mitra]

Benign explanations, such as hunger or calcium deficit, are certainly 
plausible, but I wouldn't rule out depravity. These little mammals are smart 
enough that they probably form some sort of conviction of right and 
wrong--along with the concomitant and irresistible urge to transgress.

When I lived on the South Side of Chicago in the early 90s, I kept notes on 
what the squirrels ate. Bagels, pizza, and other high-carb items were visually 
amusing in their little paws, but not notably deviant. Battered and fried 
drumsticks from Harold's Chicken Shack took the optics to a new plane, 
especially when spun as dexterously as a pine cone between furry little 
fingers. The worst was one deplorable individual whom I discovered dragging a 
fairly large slab of pork ribs with its mouth. To test whether it really needed 
the ribs in some pardonable way, or was just too far gone in some moral abyss, 
I approached the rodent to assess the point at which self-preservation might 
take over from gluttony. It would not let go! I could have caught it, but what 
good would that have done? I walked away, Desiderata in my mind's ear. 

Shai Mitra
Bay Shore 

From: bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
[bounce-121071794-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Nancy Jane Kern 
[kerns...@hotmail.com]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:21 PM
To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of hunger.


Nancy Kern


Austerlitz, NY

Columbia County








From: bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu 
 on behalf of Rick & Linda 

Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
To: NYS BIRDS
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a squirrel 
on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there it is.

I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding glass 
door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I was 
doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept warm until 
it recovered.
When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and 
was eating the rest.

I have never seen this before, has anyone else?

I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps that 
the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses up 
at that food.

She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to her 
head and leg.

This is a first for me and I don’t know if I like the idea of a carnivorous 
squirrel.

[cid:DFE8FBDE-B4B2-4B9F-9531-FCBFB311FC21]

IMG_9673


[cid:10AC657C-5218-4F3E-8109-F2AEEABD5C2A]
IMG_9672


[cid:272CDC01-2A40-4AEB-9A34-7B02B0BFF996]
IMG_9671


[cid:F66C8D08-3E61-48D1-BCE8-4DB14B1A2AA2]
IMG_9670



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Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Arie Gilbert]

  
  
Rick,

Most animals are ~predominantly~ of one persuasion; be it
vegetarian, omnivore, or carnivorous.  That is to say that your dog
or cat will predominantly eat meat, and must do so, but this does
not preclude them from eating grass or sampling your house plants
etc. 

Similarly, 'vegetarian' animals are capable of opportunistically
availing themselves of protein. Squirrels are known to raid nests
for nestlings and eggs, but mostly gather nuts etc and have
successfully occupied that niche. The thought of killer squirrels is
either humorous or frightening 

Also, The cubby-holes assigned by mankind are nowhere near as rigid
as people think, or as far as nature is concerned.

Arie Gilbert
North Babylon, NY

WWW.Powerbirder.blogspot.com 
 WWW.qcbirdclub.org 





On 12/9/2016 12:05 PM, Rick & Linda
  wrote:


  
  
  


  I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians.
Here are pictures of a squirrel on my deck eating a DE
Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there it is.
  
  
  I was working on my laptop this morning and
heard a thump on the sliding glass door. Evidently it was a
DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I was doing and
went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept
warm until it recovered. 
  When I got to the door I saw the squirrel
already had the birds head off and was eating the rest.
  
  
  I have never seen this before, has anyone else?
  
  
  I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food,
fat and other table scraps that the Bluejays and Blackbirds
enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses up at that
food.
  
  
  She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later
with only feathers stuck to her head and leg.
  
  
  This is a first for me and I don’t know if I
like the idea of a carnivorous squirrel. 
  
  
  


IMG_9673
 


  

IMG_9672
 


  

IMG_9671
 


  

IMG_9670
 



  

  
  
  
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RE: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Larry Trachtenberg]

So McD's hamburgers are meat, good to know.

L Trachtenberg
Ossining.


Lawrence B. Trachtenberg | 
trachtenb...@amsllp.com
Aronson Mayefsky & Sloan, LLP
12 E. 49th Street, New York, New York 10017 | T: 212.521.3511 | F: 212.838.5505

NOTICE: This e-mail is intended only for the named recipient(s). It contains 
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From: bounce-121071794-10490...@list.cornell.edu 
[mailto:bounce-121071794-10490...@list.cornell.edu] On Behalf Of Nancy Jane Kern
Sent: Friday, December 09, 2016 12:21 PM
To: NYS BIRDS; Rick & Linda
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!


I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of hunger.



Nancy Kern



Austerlitz, NY

Columbia County







From: 
bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu
 
mailto:bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu>>
 on behalf of Rick & Linda 
mailto:kedenb...@optonline.net>>
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
To: NYS BIRDS
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a squirrel 
on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there it is.

I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding glass 
door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I was 
doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept warm until 
it recovered.
When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and 
was eating the rest.

I have never seen this before, has anyone else?

I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps that 
the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses up 
at that food.

She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to her 
head and leg.

This is a first for me and I don't know if I like the idea of a carnivorous 
squirrel.

[cid:image001.jpg@01D25217.040FDE80]

IMG_9673


[cid:image002.jpg@01D25217.040FDE80]
IMG_9672


[cid:image003.jpg@01D25217.040FDE80]
IMG_9671


[cid:image004.jpg@01D25217.040FDE80]
IMG_9670



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Please submit your observations to eBird:
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Re: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Nancy Jane Kern]

I have seen gray squirrels gnaw on a deer carcass, regularly eat suet, eat on 
road kill, and chew MacDonald's hamburgers taken out of a dumpster in Albany. 
Not that often, but some will do it. Maybe it relates to their level of hunger.


Nancy Kern


Austerlitz, NY

Columbia County








From: bounce-121071743-44613...@list.cornell.edu 
 on behalf of Rick & Linda 

Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 12:05 PM
To: NYS BIRDS
Subject: [nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a squirrel 
on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there it is.

I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding glass 
door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I was 
doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept warm until 
it recovered.
When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and 
was eating the rest.

I have never seen this before, has anyone else?

I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps that 
the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses up 
at that food.

She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to her 
head and leg.

This is a first for me and I don't know if I like the idea of a carnivorous 
squirrel.

[cid:DFE8FBDE-B4B2-4B9F-9531-FCBFB311FC21]

IMG_9673


[cid:10AC657C-5218-4F3E-8109-F2AEEABD5C2A]
IMG_9672


[cid:272CDC01-2A40-4AEB-9A34-7B02B0BFF996]
IMG_9671


[cid:F66C8D08-3E61-48D1-BCE8-4DB14B1A2AA2]
IMG_9670



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[nysbirds-l] [NFBirds Report 2905] I Have Never Seen This Before !!

[Rick & Linda]

I always thought G Squirrels were vegetarians. Here are pictures of a squirrel 
on my deck eating a DE Junco. I could not believe my eyes but there it is.

I was working on my laptop this morning and heard a thump on the sliding glass 
door. Evidently it was a DE Junco that hit the glass. I finished what I was 
doing and went to see if the bird needed to be put in a box and kept warm until 
it recovered. 
When I got to the door I saw the squirrel already had the birds head off and 
was eating the rest.

I have never seen this before, has anyone else?

I frequently throw out leftover wet cat food, fat and other table scraps that 
the Bluejays and Blackbirds enjoy but the squirrels always turn their noses up 
at that food.

She ate the whole bird and I spotted her later with only feathers stuck to her 
head and leg.

This is a first for me and I don’t know if I like the idea of a carnivorous 
squirrel. 



IMG_9673
 


IMG_9672
 


IMG_9671
 


IMG_9670
 


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Re: FW: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip

[Anders Peltomaa]

Thanks for the reminder Shai,

Here is a link to a PDF of the article that Joe referenced.

https://biology.unm.edu/Witt/pub_files/Baumann-etal-2014-JFO-yellow-Empid-ID-jofo12078.pdf

good birding,

Anders Peltomaa
Manhattan

On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 9:12 AM, Shaibal Mitra 
wrote:

> In a really nice example of how this list serves as institutional memory
> for our community, Dave Klauber just reminded me of this very relevant post
> from Joe DiCostanzo, from December 2014. It details the foundation of the
> wing pattern feature mentioned in the Whatbird discussions, and I would
> agree that this feature also favors Yellow-bellied Flycatcher.
>
> It's not fun to admit this, but the things I learn nowadays don't stick
> with me to nearly the same degree as the things I learned before, say 2000!
> So n.b. to those whose brains are still limber: don't put off learning
> until later, front-load the data hoarding as much as possible!
> 
> From: bounce-118614530-3714...@list.cornell.edu  list.cornell.edu> on behalf of Joe DiCostanzo 
> Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 7:24 PM
> To: NYSBirds
> Subject: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip
>
>
> Just got the current issue of the Journal of Field Ornithology (vol. 85,
> no. 4, December 2014). I figure this is not a journal that most birders
> check for ID articles so I thought I would draw attention to an article in
> it: “Simple technique for distinguishing Yellow-bellied Flycatchers from
> Cordilleran and Pacific-slope flycatchers by M. J. Baumann, S. C. Galen, N.
> D. Pederson and C. C. Witt. Pp. 391-396. Anyone interested should read the
> article for all the details, many of which involve measurements that can
> only be done in the hand, but there is one character that can be used to
> distinguish Yellow-bellied Flycatcher from “Western Flycatcher” (the
> complex composed of Cordilleran and Pacific-slope flys.). It involves the
> space on the folded wing between the lower wing bar and the start of the
> pale fringes on the secondaries. This space is much larger in the
> Yellow-bellied than in the “Western”. I pulled out a few field guides from
> my bookshelf to see if it was distinguishable in published illustrations. I
> found it was apparent in the photos in Kenn Kaufman’s Birds of North
> America (at least in the first edition that I have). It was also obvious in
> Dave Sibley’s paintings of these species in his Second Edition of the
> Sibley Guide to Birds (I didn’t check the first edition). The authors of
> the Journal of Field Ornithology article tested their technique on 113
> museum specimens that had been identified based on locality. They found
> their technique correctly place 112 of the specimens. One specimen labeled
> as a Yellow-bellied Flycatcher that had been collected in Illinois was
> identified as a “Western Flycatcher” by their technique. Amazingly, when
> the mtDNA of this specimen was examined, the specimen proved to be a
> “Western Flycatcher”, the first for the complex for Illinois!
>
>
>
> Distinguishing a Yellow-bellied Fly from a “Western Fly” has not come up
> yet in New York, but hey, you never know.
>
>
>
> Joe DiCostanzo
>
> www.greatgullisland.org
>
> www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com
>
> [http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zlSALCVoYnM/U0SFqj6uWfI/
> AWQ/xYjr3pf15r0/s80/Joe.jpg] >
>
> Inwood Birder
> www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com
> A very pretty morning in the Ramble for my Thursday morning AMNH bird walk
> group. It would have been an even prettier morning if there had been more
> birds around!
>
>
>
>
>
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave NYSbirdsSubscribeConfigurationLeave.htm>
> Archives:
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> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --
>
> --
>
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>
> Please submit your observations to eBird:
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>
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>
>

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[nysbirds-l] NYC Inwood Hill Park empid YES

[Sean Sime]

I just received a call from Joe DiCostanzo letting me know he had just
arrived at the previously reported location and the bird was seen briefly
by other birders on the scene.

Good luck if you go,

Sean Sime
Brooklyn, NY

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FW: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip

[Shaibal Mitra]

In a really nice example of how this list serves as institutional memory for 
our community, Dave Klauber just reminded me of this very relevant post from 
Joe DiCostanzo, from December 2014. It details the foundation of the wing 
pattern feature mentioned in the Whatbird discussions, and I would agree that 
this feature also favors Yellow-bellied Flycatcher.

It's not fun to admit this, but the things I learn nowadays don't stick with me 
to nearly the same degree as the things I learned before, say 2000! So n.b. to 
those whose brains are still limber: don't put off learning until later, 
front-load the data hoarding as much as possible!

From: bounce-118614530-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
 on behalf of Joe DiCostanzo 

Sent: Wednesday, December 10, 2014 7:24 PM
To: NYSBirds
Subject: [nysbirds-l] New Empidonax identification tip


Just got the current issue of the Journal of Field Ornithology (vol. 85, no. 4, 
December 2014). I figure this is not a journal that most birders check for ID 
articles so I thought I would draw attention to an article in it: “Simple 
technique for distinguishing Yellow-bellied Flycatchers from Cordilleran and 
Pacific-slope flycatchers by M. J. Baumann, S. C. Galen, N. D. Pederson and C. 
C. Witt. Pp. 391-396. Anyone interested should read the article for all the 
details, many of which involve measurements that can only be done in the hand, 
but there is one character that can be used to distinguish Yellow-bellied 
Flycatcher from “Western Flycatcher” (the complex composed of Cordilleran and 
Pacific-slope flys.). It involves the space on the folded wing between the 
lower wing bar and the start of the pale fringes on the secondaries. This space 
is much larger in the Yellow-bellied than in the “Western”. I pulled out a few 
field guides from my bookshelf to see if it was distinguishable in published 
illustrations. I found it was apparent in the photos in Kenn Kaufman’s Birds of 
North America (at least in the first edition that I have). It was also obvious 
in Dave Sibley’s paintings of these species in his Second Edition of the Sibley 
Guide to Birds (I didn’t check the first edition). The authors of the Journal 
of Field Ornithology article tested their technique on 113 museum specimens 
that had been identified based on locality. They found their technique 
correctly place 112 of the specimens. One specimen labeled as a Yellow-bellied 
Flycatcher that had been collected in Illinois was identified as a “Western 
Flycatcher” by their technique. Amazingly, when the mtDNA of this specimen was 
examined, the specimen proved to be a “Western Flycatcher”, the first for the 
complex for Illinois!



Distinguishing a Yellow-bellied Fly from a “Western Fly” has not come up yet in 
New York, but hey, you never know.



Joe DiCostanzo

www.greatgullisland.org

www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com

[http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-zlSALCVoYnM/U0SFqj6uWfI/AWQ/xYjr3pf15r0/s80/Joe.jpg]

Inwood Birder
www.inwoodbirder.blogspot.com
A very pretty morning in the Ramble for my Thursday morning AMNH bird walk 
group. It would have been an even prettier morning if there had been more birds 
around!





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Re: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

[Jose G]

Issac Grant, Tom Fiore and I have relocated the bird.

Dropped Pin
near Inwood, New York, NY
https://goo.gl/maps/eS2tuMgiieq

On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 9:09 AM Hugh McGuinness 
wrote:

> Last year the Maryland-DC Records Committee evaluated Maryland's first
> record of "Western" Flycatcher in the affirmative. In order to do this we
> spent a day at the NMNH looking at skins. Using my notes from that day, I
> find the Manhattan bird a bit confusing.
>
> I spent about 20 minutes last night and felt comfortable ruling out Least
> & Acadian Flycatchers. Similarly I don't think this has the right jizz for
> Hammonds or Dusky. I also agree that it most closely looks like
> Western/Yellow-bellied.
>
> The major factor that least supports Western is the shape of the eye-ring.
> In Western the eyering often has an exaggerated posterier margin creating
> the tear drop shape and it often disappears at the 12 o'clock position.
> This bird has a complete eyering without an exaggerated teardrop.
> Nevertheless, I can find photos of Western on the internet that show
> similar eye-rings to the Inwood bird.
>
> The factors that I believe support Western Flycatcher are as follows: 1.
> dull brownish-black ground color of the flightfeathers (in yellow-bellied
> these are noticeably darker and blacker); 2. the relatively small dark
> patch between the lower wing bar and the pale secondary panel (in YB this
> patch is wider and darker); 3. the primary pattern (in YB there is even
> spacing of tips between p5-6 and p6-7) where this bird shows a single wide
> space between p5-6; the relatively long tail (in specimens body size was
> virtually identical between western and YB, but the tail of the former was
> about 1cm longer); 5. the eye-ring appears to be white (which can
> admittedly occur in YB, but is more commonly yellowish).
>
> Given all that I have said this is an Empidonax in winter, so I may be
> completely wrong. It would be great to get more photos, especially
> detailing the shape of the bill from above or below, a sharper picture of
> the wing tip, the size of the post wingbar dark patch and the face in
> profile.
>
> Hugh
>
> On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 8:40 AM, Shaibal Mitra 
> wrote:
>
> Having asked for more posts to this list, I'll contribute one.
>
>
>
>
>
> My thought process on any late (after early October) Empidonax in the
> Northeast is roughly as follows:
>
>
>
>
>
> 1. Can we rule out Least?
>
>
> Least Flycatcher is an abundant species and more prone to late occurrence
> than other common eastern species. In this case, the NY bird appears too
> green, with too long of a primary projection. Its eyering also is narrower
> on the top and bottom and longer to the rear than I would expect for Least.
>
>
>
>
>
> 2. Can we rule out the narrow-billed western North American species
> (Hammond's, Dusky, Gray)?
>
>
> These three potential vagrants have bills shaped very differently from all
> our common eastern species, which have spade-shaped bills. The NY bird
> clearly has a spade-shaped bill, so these can be excluded.
>
>
>
>
>
> 3. This leaves us with two groups: (A) Willow/Alder/Acadian, which are
> large and lanky (and especially unlikely in December); and (A)
> "Western"/Yellow-bellied, which are small, relatively bright green and
> yellow, very similar-looking, and both proven to occur from time to time in
> late fall in the Northeast. Ken Feustel found a Yellow-bellied at Jones
> Beach in December 2009:
>
>
>
>
>
> https://flic.kr/p/PteiBu
>
>
>
>
>
> --and he and Bob Paxton have summarized the rare but regular late-season
> occurrence of this species:
>
>
>
>
>
> http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2002v52n3/y2002v52n3p220-221paxton.pdf#
>
>
> http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2010v60n2/v2010v60n2p90-94feustel.pdf#
>
>
>
>
>
> The bird just doesn't look like a Willow/Alder type ("Traill's
> Flycatcher") by virtue of overall appearance. Willow especially would not
> look so green, would not show such a long primary projection, and would
> have a less distinct eyering. Alder averages closer to the NY bird in each
> of these respects, but just not enough to make me consider it seriously. I
> did, however, get an impression of Acadian when first scanning images
> (especially the more distant ones) of the NY bird. The next thing I looked
> at was leg color: they appear gray.
>
>
>
>
>
> This is interesting because Acadian, Yellow-bellied, and "Western" have
> gray legs, whereas the others have blacker legs. So, picking up here with
> these three, I would cautiously exclude Acadian because the bill does not
> look big enough, the face-throat area doesn't look right, and the eye-ring
> is too bold and asymmetrical.
>
>
>
>
>
> As noted by many already, distinguishing Yellow-bellied from "Western" can
> be very difficult, especially when dealing with images rather actual views
> of a living bird. My initial impression was that the bird was consistent
> with Yellow-bellied, but that it looked a bit smaller-headed and more

Re: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

[Hugh McGuinness]

Last year the Maryland-DC Records Committee evaluated Maryland's first
record of "Western" Flycatcher in the affirmative. In order to do this we
spent a day at the NMNH looking at skins. Using my notes from that day, I
find the Manhattan bird a bit confusing.

I spent about 20 minutes last night and felt comfortable ruling out Least &
Acadian Flycatchers. Similarly I don't think this has the right jizz for
Hammonds or Dusky. I also agree that it most closely looks like
Western/Yellow-bellied.

The major factor that least supports Western is the shape of the eye-ring.
In Western the eyering often has an exaggerated posterier margin creating
the tear drop shape and it often disappears at the 12 o'clock position.
This bird has a complete eyering without an exaggerated teardrop.
Nevertheless, I can find photos of Western on the internet that show
similar eye-rings to the Inwood bird.

The factors that I believe support Western Flycatcher are as follows: 1.
dull brownish-black ground color of the flightfeathers (in yellow-bellied
these are noticeably darker and blacker); 2. the relatively small dark
patch between the lower wing bar and the pale secondary panel (in YB this
patch is wider and darker); 3. the primary pattern (in YB there is even
spacing of tips between p5-6 and p6-7) where this bird shows a single wide
space between p5-6; the relatively long tail (in specimens body size was
virtually identical between western and YB, but the tail of the former was
about 1cm longer); 5. the eye-ring appears to be white (which can
admittedly occur in YB, but is more commonly yellowish).

Given all that I have said this is an Empidonax in winter, so I may be
completely wrong. It would be great to get more photos, especially
detailing the shape of the bill from above or below, a sharper picture of
the wing tip, the size of the post wingbar dark patch and the face in
profile.

Hugh

On Fri, Dec 9, 2016 at 8:40 AM, Shaibal Mitra 
wrote:

> Having asked for more posts to this list, I'll contribute one.
>
> My thought process on any late (after early October) Empidonax in the
> Northeast is roughly as follows:
>
> 1. Can we rule out Least?
> Least Flycatcher is an abundant species and more prone to late occurrence
> than other common eastern species. In this case, the NY bird appears too
> green, with too long of a primary projection. Its eyering also is narrower
> on the top and bottom and longer to the rear than I would expect for Least.
>
> 2. Can we rule out the narrow-billed western North American species
> (Hammond's, Dusky, Gray)?
> These three potential vagrants have bills shaped very differently from all
> our common eastern species, which have spade-shaped bills. The NY bird
> clearly has a spade-shaped bill, so these can be excluded.
>
> 3. This leaves us with two groups: (A) Willow/Alder/Acadian, which are
> large and lanky (and especially unlikely in December); and (A)
> "Western"/Yellow-bellied, which are small, relatively bright green and
> yellow, very similar-looking, and both proven to occur from time to time in
> late fall in the Northeast. Ken Feustel found a Yellow-bellied at Jones
> Beach in December 2009:
>
> https://flic.kr/p/PteiBu
>
> --and he and Bob Paxton have summarized the rare but regular late-season
> occurrence of this species:
>
> http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2002v52n3/y2002v52n3p220-221paxton.pdf#
> http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2010v60n2/v2010v60n2p90-94feustel.pdf#
>
> The bird just doesn't look like a Willow/Alder type ("Traill's
> Flycatcher") by virtue of overall appearance. Willow especially would not
> look so green, would not show such a long primary projection, and would
> have a less distinct eyering. Alder averages closer to the NY bird in each
> of these respects, but just not enough to make me consider it seriously. I
> did, however, get an impression of Acadian when first scanning images
> (especially the more distant ones) of the NY bird. The next thing I looked
> at was leg color: they appear gray.
>
> This is interesting because Acadian, Yellow-bellied, and "Western" have
> gray legs, whereas the others have blacker legs. So, picking up here with
> these three, I would cautiously exclude Acadian because the bill does not
> look big enough, the face-throat area doesn't look right, and the eye-ring
> is too bold and asymmetrical.
>
> As noted by many already, distinguishing Yellow-bellied from "Western" can
> be very difficult, especially when dealing with images rather actual views
> of a living bird. My initial impression was that the bird was consistent
> with Yellow-bellied, but that it looked a bit smaller-headed and more
> crested (points favoring "Western") than I was entirely comfortable with.
> That said, I think an actual "Western" would be more richly colored (I
> don't know them well, but I know that Yellow-bellied can be surprisingly
> drab) and would have a much more obvious small-headed, crested jizz. In
> addition, I think that the high contrast win

RE: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

[Shaibal Mitra]

Having asked for more posts to this list, I'll contribute one.

My thought process on any late (after early October) Empidonax in the Northeast 
is roughly as follows:

1. Can we rule out Least?
Least Flycatcher is an abundant species and more prone to late occurrence than 
other common eastern species. In this case, the NY bird appears too green, with 
too long of a primary projection. Its eyering also is narrower on the top and 
bottom and longer to the rear than I would expect for Least.

2. Can we rule out the narrow-billed western North American species (Hammond's, 
Dusky, Gray)?
These three potential vagrants have bills shaped very differently from all our 
common eastern species, which have spade-shaped bills. The NY bird clearly has 
a spade-shaped bill, so these can be excluded.

3. This leaves us with two groups: (A) Willow/Alder/Acadian, which are large 
and lanky (and especially unlikely in December); and (A) 
"Western"/Yellow-bellied, which are small, relatively bright green and yellow, 
very similar-looking, and both proven to occur from time to time in late fall 
in the Northeast. Ken Feustel found a Yellow-bellied at Jones Beach in December 
2009:

https://flic.kr/p/PteiBu

--and he and Bob Paxton have summarized the rare but regular late-season 
occurrence of this species:

http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2002v52n3/y2002v52n3p220-221paxton.pdf#
http://www.nybirds.org/KBsearch/y2010v60n2/v2010v60n2p90-94feustel.pdf#

The bird just doesn't look like a Willow/Alder type ("Traill's Flycatcher") by 
virtue of overall appearance. Willow especially would not look so green, would 
not show such a long primary projection, and would have a less distinct 
eyering. Alder averages closer to the NY bird in each of these respects, but 
just not enough to make me consider it seriously. I did, however, get an 
impression of Acadian when first scanning images (especially the more distant 
ones) of the NY bird. The next thing I looked at was leg color: they appear 
gray.

This is interesting because Acadian, Yellow-bellied, and "Western" have gray 
legs, whereas the others have blacker legs. So, picking up here with these 
three, I would cautiously exclude Acadian because the bill does not look big 
enough, the face-throat area doesn't look right, and the eye-ring is too bold 
and asymmetrical.

As noted by many already, distinguishing Yellow-bellied from "Western" can be 
very difficult, especially when dealing with images rather actual views of a 
living bird. My initial impression was that the bird was consistent with 
Yellow-bellied, but that it looked a bit smaller-headed and more crested 
(points favoring "Western") than I was entirely comfortable with. That said, I 
think an actual "Western" would be more richly colored (I don't know them well, 
but I know that Yellow-bellied can be surprisingly drab) and would have a much 
more obvious small-headed, crested jizz. In addition, I think that the high 
contrast wings look right for Yellow-bellied and less consistent with my 
(admittedly inexperienced) impression of "Western."

I would lean to Yellow-bellied pending further information about calls, further 
photos, and further commentary from others.

Shai Mitra
Bay Shore


From: bounce-121070624-3714...@list.cornell.edu 
[bounce-121070624-3714...@list.cornell.edu] on behalf of Andrew Baksh 
[birdingd...@gmail.com]
Sent: Friday, December 9, 2016 7:20 AM
To: Donna Schulman
Cc: Angus Wilson; Isaac Grant; 
Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

Always tough at this time of the year. For me, I would also include Acadian to 
the list of possibilities.


"I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of 
others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence." ~ Frederick 
Douglass

風　Swift as the wind
林　Quiet as the forest
火　Conquer like the fire
山　Steady as the mountain
Sun Tzu  The Art of 
War

(__/)
(= '.'=)
(") _ (")
Sent from somewhere in the field using my mobile device!

Andrew Baksh
www.birdingdude.blogspot.com

On Dec 8, 2016, at 11:55 PM, Donna Schulman 
mailto:queensgir...@gmail.com>> wrote:

Angus,

This looks like the Whatbird discussion:  
http://www.whatbird.com/forum/index.php?/topic/157667-eastern-wood-pewee-nyc/

There is also some discussion now going on, on the New York Birders Facebook 
page.

Donna

---
Donna L. Schulman
Forest Hills, NY
queensgir...@gmail.com





On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Angus Wilson 
mailto:oceanwander...@gmail.com>> wrote:
Hi Isaac, Thanks for bring this to everyone's attention.

As most readers will already know, the field identification of empidonax 
flycatchers in the fall can be extremely difficult but not impossible. I thi

Re: [ebirdsnyc] Fwd: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

[Andrew Baksh]

Thanks for the report Nathan. I copied to NYSBirds for folks there who might be 
interested in any updates.

"I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of 
others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence." ~ Frederick 
Douglass

風　Swift as the wind
林　Quiet as the forest
火　Conquer like the fire
山　Steady as the mountain
Sun Tzu  The Art of War

> (\__/)
> (= '.'=)
> (") _ (") 
> Sent from somewhere in the field using my mobile device! 

Andrew Baksh
www.birdingdude.blogspot.com

> On Dec 9, 2016, at 7:37 AM, nathan o'reilly  wrote:
> 
> Gave a quick look in the area described on the Ebird report but didn't see 
> it. Saw some birders walking in as I left so hopefully someone refinds it 
> (and then I hope it sticks until Monday). 
> 
> Nate
> 
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> On Dec 9, 2016, at 7:06 AM, Andrew Baksh birdingd...@gmail.com [ebirdsnyc] 
>  wrote:
> 
>> Cross posting.
>> 
>> 
>> "I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule 
>> of others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence." ~ 
>> Frederick Douglass
>> 
>> 風　Swift as the wind
>> 林　Quiet as the forest
>> 火　Conquer like the fire
>> 山　Steady as the mountain
>> Sun Tzu  The Art of War
>> 
>>> (\__/)
>>> (= '.'=)
>>> (") _ (") 
>>> Sent from somewhere in the field using my mobile device! 
>> 
>> Andrew Baksh
>> www.birdingdude.blogspot.com
>> 
>> Begin forwarded message:
>> 
>>> From: Donna Schulman 
>>> Date: December 8, 2016 at 11:55:42 PM EST
>>> To: Angus Wilson , Isaac Grant 
>>> 
>>> Cc: "" 
>>> Subject: Re: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park
>>> Reply-To: Donna Schulman 
>>> 
>>> Angus,
>>> 
>>> This looks like the Whatbird discussion:  
>>> http://www.whatbird.com/forum/index.php?/topic/157667-eastern-wood-pewee-nyc/
>>> 
>>> There is also some discussion now going on, on the New York Birders 
>>> Facebook page.
>>> 
>>> Donna 
>>> 
>>> ---
>>> Donna L. Schulman
>>> Forest Hills, NY 
>>> queensgir...@gmail.com
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
>>> 
 On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Angus Wilson  
 wrote:
 Hi Isaac, Thanks for bring this to everyone's attention. 
 
 As most readers will already know, the field identification of empidonax 
 flycatchers in the fall can be extremely difficult but not impossible. I 
 think it would be educational and healthy for the list for us to have an 
 online discussion of this bird beyond the usual 'it's still here' updates. 
 
 Based on the eye ring and shape of the bird the main contenders are 
 WESTERN FLYCATCHER (WEFL) and YELLOW-BELLIED FLYCATCHER (YBFL). Even 
 though YBFL pass through New York City area with some regularity on 
 migration they are extremely rare at such a late date, although not 
 unheard of. Using 'likelihood' is therefore not really appropriate and we 
 must rely on images, live views, and if we get really lucky, some 
 vocalization. 
 
 I'd be very curious to hear the arguments advocating YBFL put forward on 
 Whatbird as mentioned but not expanded upon in John Keane's written 
 comments. Perhaps someone who has seen them can paraphrase?
 
 At this late hour I am happy to remain agnostic about the identification 
 and would like to hear the arguments. Any empid in December is exciting 
 and a great find. 
 
 Hopefully local birders will be able to refind the bird tomorrow and 
 obtain additional photos. If not, we already have a good set of images to 
 chew on.
 
 Cheers, Angus Wilson
 New York City
 
 
 
> On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 9:45 PM, isaac grant  
> wrote:
> This was just posted to ebird.  If any are not on it have a look.  
> 
> http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32922727
 
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>>> 
>>> --
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>> 
>> __._,_.___
>> Posted by: Andrew Baksh 
>> Reply via web post   •   Reply to sender •   Reply to group  •   
>> Start a New Topic   •   Messages in this topic (1)
>>  
>> Have you tried the highest rated email app?
>> With 4.5 stars in iTunes, the Yahoo Mail app is the highest rated email app 
>> on the market. What are you waiting for? Now you can access all your inboxes 
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[nysbirds-l] Manhattan-rare, NYC 12/8

[Thomas Fiore]

Manhattan (New York City) -
Thursday, 8 December, 2016

A Western Tanager was again seen at City Hall Park in lower Manhattan  
on Thursday 12/8;  the 4 warbler species there previously (including a  
chat) may not have been - but might yet be in the area, if the tanager  
is hanging on - the coming freeze here is going to be very rough on  
these and any mainly-insectivorous species!

The report came that came thru of an Empidonax [genus] flycatcher,  
seen Thursday 12/8, photographed extensively; there is a fair chance  
that this is a non-eastern (ie, western) species, and it is not known  
if this bird was heard giving any calls (!!) - the sighting is from  
birder John Keane, the Manhattan park it was seen in: Inwood Hill  
Park, and the given location would be a bit south of the "lagoon"  
area, and west of West 218th Street; it is not far from that street's  
western terminus, perhaps a 10-minute walk into that 'corner' of this  
rather extensive wooded northern-Manhattan park - if there are any  
sightings of this bird for Friday, they ought be posted here, too!  A  
link to the report: http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32922727

In other areas of uptown - northern Manhattan, a couple of Baltimore  
Orioles have persisted (thru Thursday) at Fort Tryon park in & around  
the "heather gardens" area- which is a bit north of West 190th Street  
and Fort Washington Ave. - just inside the southern entrance to that  
park;  there was also a warbler in that garden on Thursday, most  
likely Orange-crowned, but views were obscured so the ID is tentative,  
but a plain warbler of dull ochre-yellow color, with no obvious  
markings.

At Riverbank State Park on Thursday, & following up a report of a  
Wilson's Warbler a few days prior there, I found a number of warblers  
in the SE quadrant of that park, which is off Riverside Drive & West  
145 Street (main entry), & 135 Street (secondary entry, & the latter  
nearer to where the birds of note were), with several Pine and Myrtle  
Warblers seen & photographed, but a couple of others getting away, one  
of them a potential Orange-crowned, & another which appeared brighter  
& more yellow (the Pine Warblers seen were of varying age &/or sex,  
with 1 quite bright, & at least one rather drab); also present with  
these birds were a few Red-breasted Nuthatches, many Juncos (20+), and  
some Black-capped Chickadees, & perhaps a few other migrant-visitant  
species.  An American Tree Sparrow was seen at the north edge of this  
park on arrival; there have been very modest numbers of that Spizella  
type sparrow in Manhattan recently, while (late) Chipping Sparrows are  
turning up including at least 4 in Central Park on the west side of  
the reservoir, out in "lawn" areas.

Central Park has also had a Rusty Blackbird again seen at the Gill  
area (stream in the Ramble) and there've been at least 2 warbler  
species there this week, Common Yellowthroat and Ovenbird, both of  
which are also being seen in a few "mid" and "down" town areas in  
Manhattan this week.  A report of an Indigo Bunting this past weekend,  
at the Conservatory Garden area of Central Park is interesting (there  
has been a well-documented Indigo Bunting in Central many years ago  
that overwintered and changed from brown to bright indigo as the  
spring came on; that bird wintered in the outdoor part of the CP zoo  
grounds, some years back!) - there is also a Red-headed Woodpecker  
(first-year bird, not red at all) in Central, hopefully around for the  
upcoming Manhattan (and overall, the Lower Hudson) CBC, the proper  
name for the count that takes in Central as just one of a good many NY  
& NJ parks covered for that count;  to find "Lower Hudson" in the CBC  
listings, one may need to search the NJ count tables (& not the NY  
state CBC listings) - there is no separated "central park CBC", it is  
'subsumed' into the full NY & NJ count-circle, as is done each year.

- - - - - - - -
A citizen’s basic responsibility is to be aware of the consequences of  
his or her acts.

"They tried to bury us. They didn't know we were seeds." - DeRay  
Mckesson, American activist & writer.
- - - - - - - - -
good birding,

Tom Fiore,
Manhattan









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Re: [nysbirds-l] Manhattan Empidonax - Inwood Hill Park

[Andrew Baksh]

Always tough at this time of the year. For me, I would also include Acadian to 
the list of possibilities.


"I prefer to be true to myself, even at the hazard of incurring the ridicule of 
others, rather than to be false, and to incur my own abhorrence." ~ Frederick 
Douglass

風　Swift as the wind
林　Quiet as the forest
火　Conquer like the fire
山　Steady as the mountain
Sun Tzu  The Art of War

> (__/)
> (= '.'=)
> (") _ (") 
> Sent from somewhere in the field using my mobile device! 

Andrew Baksh
www.birdingdude.blogspot.com

> On Dec 8, 2016, at 11:55 PM, Donna Schulman  wrote:
> 
> Angus,
> 
> This looks like the Whatbird discussion:  
> http://www.whatbird.com/forum/index.php?/topic/157667-eastern-wood-pewee-nyc/
> 
> There is also some discussion now going on, on the New York Birders Facebook 
> page.
> 
> Donna 
> 
> ---
> Donna L. Schulman
> Forest Hills, NY 
> queensgir...@gmail.com
> 
> 
> 
> 
>> On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Angus Wilson  
>> wrote:
>> Hi Isaac, Thanks for bring this to everyone's attention. 
>> 
>> As most readers will already know, the field identification of empidonax 
>> flycatchers in the fall can be extremely difficult but not impossible. I 
>> think it would be educational and healthy for the list for us to have an 
>> online discussion of this bird beyond the usual 'it's still here' updates. 
>> 
>> Based on the eye ring and shape of the bird the main contenders are WESTERN 
>> FLYCATCHER (WEFL) and YELLOW-BELLIED FLYCATCHER (YBFL). Even though YBFL 
>> pass through New York City area with some regularity on migration they are 
>> extremely rare at such a late date, although not unheard of. Using 
>> 'likelihood' is therefore not really appropriate and we must rely on images, 
>> live views, and if we get really lucky, some vocalization. 
>> 
>> I'd be very curious to hear the arguments advocating YBFL put forward on 
>> Whatbird as mentioned but not expanded upon in John Keane's written 
>> comments. Perhaps someone who has seen them can paraphrase?
>> 
>> At this late hour I am happy to remain agnostic about the identification and 
>> would like to hear the arguments. Any empid in December is exciting and a 
>> great find. 
>> 
>> Hopefully local birders will be able to refind the bird tomorrow and obtain 
>> additional photos. If not, we already have a good set of images to chew on.
>> 
>> Cheers, Angus Wilson
>> New York City
>> 
>> 
>> 
>>> On Thu, Dec 8, 2016 at 9:45 PM, isaac grant  
>>> wrote:
>>> This was just posted to ebird.  If any are not on it have a look.  
>>> 
>>> http://ebird.org/ebird/view/checklist/S32922727
>> 
>> --
>> NYSbirds-L List Info:
>> Welcome and Basics
>> Rules and Information
>> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
>> Archives:
>> The Mail Archive
>> Surfbirds
>> BirdingOnThe.Net
>> Please submit your observations to eBird!
>> --
> 
> --
> NYSbirds-L List Info:
> Welcome and Basics
> Rules and Information
> Subscribe, Configuration and Leave
> Archives:
> The Mail Archive
> Surfbirds
> BirdingOnThe.Net
> Please submit your observations to eBird!
> --

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