Re: Private Apple App distribution

[David Connors via ozdotnet]

Yeah you can use testflight to distribute betas and set up an enterprise
area in the app store for your own enterprise apps to be distributed to
enterprise enrolled devices.

Not the same as sideloading a random executable though and you're still
subject to Apple's review process etc.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 16:22, Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> Are you in the Apple Developer program? I’m guessing there might be a test
> option there.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
> 
>  |
> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
> 
>
>
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 4:46 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* Re: Private Apple App distribution
>
>
>
> So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone
> apps?! This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff
> phones. Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150
> goddamn $), but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation
> and make keys and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on
> and on. Goddammit again.
>
>
>
> *GK*
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
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RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Are you in the Apple Developer program? I’m guessing there might be a test 
option there.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 4:46 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Re: Private Apple App distribution

So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone apps?! 
This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff phones. 
Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150 goddamn $), 
but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation and make keys 
and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on and on. Goddammit 
again.

GK
-- 
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

So you're all telling me that there is no "side load" feature for iPhone
apps?! This is a dreadful obstacle to getting the app onto company staff
phones. Luckily I have an Apple account that was recently renewed (for 150
goddamn $), but I'll have to fill-in all the store compliance documentation
and make keys and fumble through their cryptic alien processes, and so on
and on. Goddammit again.

*GK*
-- 
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[David Connors via ozdotnet]

The Pro and Pro Max do, the others don't.



On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 15:35, mike smith via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> They're not even doing full speed USB C iirc
>
> We've come full circle: remember db25 connections, the only thing standard
> was the connector.
>
> Mike
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:45 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Yeah they did for iPhone 15 - still sell the old ones with Lightning, and
>> most headphones, and mice, and trackpads, and probably other things.
>>
>> I love how Apple used the argument that they didn't want to be forced to
>> do it because it would stifle innovation - meanwhile they're selling
>> lightning that runs at USB 2.0 speeds while the rest of the planet has
>> moved on.
>>
>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 15:08, mike smith via ozdotnet <
>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Didn't the Euros make them go to USB C?
>>>
>>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:31 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
>>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>>
 I am sure other countries will jump on board once the technical
 precedence has been set.

 Apple can be very stubborn in holding on to old/dumb ideas. They're
 still selling stuff with lightning connector in 2024.

 On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:12, mike smith via ozdotnet <
 ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in
> Europe?
>
> I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.
>
> Mike
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
>> this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
>> response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store 
>> with
>> one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Greg
>>
>>
>>
>> Dr Greg Low
>>
>>
>>
>> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>>
>> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
>> 
>>  |
>> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
>> *To:* ozDotNet 
>> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
>> *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution
>>
>>
>>
>> Folks,
>>
>>
>>
>> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and
>> Apple phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load 
>> it
>> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the 
>> same
>> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
>> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
>> doing this?
>>
>>
>>
>> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public
>> and was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the
>> company.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> *Greg Keogh*
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives:
> https://codify.mailman3.com/

 --
 ozdotnet mailing list
 To manage your subscription, access archives:
 https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>>
>>> --
>>> ozdotnet mailing list
>>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
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Re: Private Apple App distribution

[mike smith via ozdotnet]

They're not even doing full speed USB C iirc

We've come full circle: remember db25 connections, the only thing standard
was the connector.

Mike

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:45 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> Yeah they did for iPhone 15 - still sell the old ones with Lightning, and
> most headphones, and mice, and trackpads, and probably other things.
>
> I love how Apple used the argument that they didn't want to be forced to
> do it because it would stifle innovation - meanwhile they're selling
> lightning that runs at USB 2.0 speeds while the rest of the planet has
> moved on.
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 15:08, mike smith via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Didn't the Euros make them go to USB C?
>>
>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:31 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I am sure other countries will jump on board once the technical
>>> precedence has been set.
>>>
>>> Apple can be very stubborn in holding on to old/dumb ideas. They're
>>> still selling stuff with lightning connector in 2024.
>>>
>>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:12, mike smith via ozdotnet <
>>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>>
 So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in
 Europe?

 I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.

 Mike

 On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, <
 ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
> this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
> response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with
> one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
> 
>  |
> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
> 
>
>
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution
>
>
>
> Folks,
>
>
>
> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
> phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
> doing this?
>
>
>
> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public
> and was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the
> company.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> *Greg Keogh*
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives:
> https://codify.mailman3.com/

 --
 ozdotnet mailing list
 To manage your subscription, access archives:
 https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>>
>>> --
>>> ozdotnet mailing list
>>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[David Connors via ozdotnet]

Yeah they did for iPhone 15 - still sell the old ones with Lightning, and
most headphones, and mice, and trackpads, and probably other things.

I love how Apple used the argument that they didn't want to be forced to do
it because it would stifle innovation - meanwhile they're selling lightning
that runs at USB 2.0 speeds while the rest of the planet has moved on.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 15:08, mike smith via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> Didn't the Euros make them go to USB C?
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:31 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> I am sure other countries will jump on board once the technical
>> precedence has been set.
>>
>> Apple can be very stubborn in holding on to old/dumb ideas. They're still
>> selling stuff with lightning connector in 2024.
>>
>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:12, mike smith via ozdotnet <
>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in
>>> Europe?
>>>
>>> I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.
>>>
>>> Mike
>>>
>>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, <
>>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>>
 Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
 this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
 response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with
 one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.



 Regards,



 Greg



 Dr Greg Low



 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile

 SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
 
  |
 About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
 



 *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
 *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
 *To:* ozDotNet 
 *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
 *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution



 Folks,



 We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
 phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
 (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
 for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
 convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
 doing this?



 A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public
 and was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the
 company.



 Thanks,

 *Greg Keogh*
 --
 ozdotnet mailing list
 To manage your subscription, access archives:
 https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>>
>>> --
>>> ozdotnet mailing list
>>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[mike smith via ozdotnet]

Didn't the Euros make them go to USB C?

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 15:31 David Connors via ozdotnet, <
ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:

> I am sure other countries will jump on board once the technical
> precedence has been set.
>
> Apple can be very stubborn in holding on to old/dumb ideas. They're still
> selling stuff with lightning connector in 2024.
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:12, mike smith via ozdotnet <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in
>> Europe?
>>
>> I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, <
>> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
>>> this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
>>> response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with
>>> one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Greg
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Dr Greg Low
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>>>
>>> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
>>> 
>>>  |
>>> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
>>> 
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
>>> *To:* ozDotNet 
>>> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
>>> *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Folks,
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
>>> phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
>>> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
>>> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
>>> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
>>> doing this?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public
>>> and was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the
>>> company.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>>
>>> *Greg Keogh*
>>> --
>>> ozdotnet mailing list
>>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>>
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
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To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[David Connors via ozdotnet]

I am sure other countries will jump on board once the technical
precedence has been set.

Apple can be very stubborn in holding on to old/dumb ideas. They're still
selling stuff with lightning connector in 2024.

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024 at 14:12, mike smith via ozdotnet 
wrote:

> So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in Europe?
>
> I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.
>
> Mike
>
> On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, <
> ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com> wrote:
>
>> Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
>> this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
>> response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with
>> one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.
>>
>>
>>
>> Regards,
>>
>>
>>
>> Greg
>>
>>
>>
>> Dr Greg Low
>>
>>
>>
>> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>>
>> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
>> 
>>  |
>> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
>> 
>>
>>
>>
>> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
>> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
>> *To:* ozDotNet 
>> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
>> *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution
>>
>>
>>
>> Folks,
>>
>>
>>
>> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
>> phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
>> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
>> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
>> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
>> doing this?
>>
>>
>>
>> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and
>> was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.
>>
>>
>>
>> Thanks,
>>
>> *Greg Keogh*
>> --
>> ozdotnet mailing list
>> To manage your subscription, access archives:
>> https://codify.mailman3.com/
>
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]



I like the lateral thinking.

I wonder if it will be based on the user’s home location, or where the phone is.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low

From: mike smith via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 3:11 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: mike smith 
Subject: Re: Private Apple App distribution

So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in Europe?

I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.

Mike
On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>> wrote:
Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about this. 
They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In response, Apple 
has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with one for EU, and one 
for the rest of the world.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
To: ozDotNet mailto:ozdotnet@ozdotnet.com>>
Cc: Greg Keogh mailto:gfke...@gmail.com>>
Subject: Private Apple App distribution

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple phones. 
For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it (after the 
security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same for iPhones. We 
don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a convention for 
"side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and was 
published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
Greg Keogh
--
ozdotnet mailing list
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Re: Private Apple App distribution

[mike smith via ozdotnet]

So the "way" will be to use a VPN, and set your Apple devices up in Europe?

I'm wondering if any other countries will jump on board.

Mike

On Wed, 17 Jan 2024, 14:29 Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet, 
wrote:

> Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about
> this. They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In
> response, Apple has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with
> one for EU, and one for the rest of the world.
>
>
>
> Regards,
>
>
>
> Greg
>
>
>
> Dr Greg Low
>
>
>
> 1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
>
> SQL Down Under | Web: https://sqldownunder.com
> 
>  |
> About Greg:  https://about.me/greg.low
> 
>
>
>
> *From:* Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
> *Sent:* Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
> *To:* ozDotNet 
> *Cc:* Greg Keogh 
> *Subject:* Private Apple App distribution
>
>
>
> Folks,
>
>
>
> We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
> phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
> (after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
> for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
> convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
> doing this?
>
>
>
> A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and
> was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
> *Greg Keogh*
> --
> ozdotnet mailing list
> To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

RE: Private Apple App distribution

[Dr Greg Low via ozdotnet]

Interesting that there’s been a discussion going on with the EU about this. 
They’re insisting that Apple allow “side-loading” of apps. In response, Apple 
has apparently said they’re splitting their app store with one for EU, and one 
for the rest of the world.

Regards,

Greg

Dr Greg Low

1300SQLSQL (1300 775 775) office | +61 419201410 mobile
SQL Down Under | Web: 
https://sqldownunder.com
 | About Greg:  
https://about.me/greg.low

From: Greg Keogh via ozdotnet 
Sent: Wednesday, January 17, 2024 2:46 PM
To: ozDotNet 
Cc: Greg Keogh 
Subject: Private Apple App distribution

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple phones. 
For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it (after the 
security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same for iPhones. We 
don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a convention for 
"side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and was 
published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
Greg Keogh
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/ 

Private Apple App distribution

[Greg Keogh via ozdotnet]

Folks,

We're planning a MAUI app to be installed on company Android and Apple
phones. For Android I can just generate the APK file and side-load it
(after the security settings are relaxed). I don't know how to do the same
for iPhones. We don't want the app in the store. Assuming there is a
convention for "side-loading" Apple apps, what's the technique? Is anyone
doing this?

A few years ago we published a Xamarin app, but it was for the public and
was published in both stores. This time the app's private to the company.

Thanks,
*Greg Keogh*
-- 
ozdotnet mailing list 
To manage your subscription, access archives: https://codify.mailman3.com/