RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
Have a look at the SA Perinatal Protocols which seem reasonable, there are many chapters to view you need to look at the guidelines in chapter 8 and 10. http://www.health.sa.gov.au/ppg/Default.aspx?tabid=113 Regards Christine -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Debbie Slater Sent: 14 June 2006 23:35 To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? The UKs NICE guidelines inherited from the UKs Royal College of Obs and Gynea suggest that it is fine to leave pre-labour rupture of membranes up to 96 hours before induction of labour see http://www.nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=17381 Debbie Slater Perth, WA From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Kelly @ BellyBelly Sent: Wednesday, 14 June 2006 8:48 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? For those who work in maternity units, I am just wondering what the policy is in your unit in regards to how long a woman can continue after her waters have broken before having synto put up? There seems to be such pressure to put it up fairly quickly (after you ask to at least wait at all!), with an average of about 1 hour before the woman gets the pressure to speed things up. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support
RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
I always find it amazing that what is happening to a womans body (i.e SROM) is not believed and that she has to go in for confirmation. Surely the woman would know and wouldnt need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women cant be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldnt deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days constant water trickling 37 +1 labour started 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, its all a load of rubbish. Jo From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ home Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt infusion. Sally - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? How frustrating then, that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to induce labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep coming back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for synto! Its a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having an ARM to ask to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not allow this? I get the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have asked many times if we can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do is walk the ward, and not leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to get things going, as mum ends anxious about the whole thing especially when you have such an unrealistic time frame to get things going! Obviously some cases are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, and the recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course makes it different but frustrating when you dont have much info about, I think I need a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the internet mum found it hard to get any good information. She was only borderline for cholestasis, but the doctors were scaring her about what *could* happen and how they just dont understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after only 2 hours despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. Just an assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting stressed from the labour wouldnt the induced labour be more likely to stress baby? And the fact mum couldnt cope with the contractions as well and then had peth? The labour went quite quickly and it was all over in a few hours. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Debbie Slater Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 12:05 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? The UKs NICE guidelines inherited from the UKs Royal College of Obs and Gynea suggest that it is fine to leave pre-labour rupture of membranes up to 96 hours before induction of labour see http://www.nice.org.uk/page.aspx?o=17381 Debbie Slater Perth, WA From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Kelly @ BellyBelly Sent: Wednesday, 14 June 2006 8:48 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? For those who work in maternity units, I am just wondering what the policy is in your unit in regards to how long a woman can continue after her waters have broken before having synto put up? There seems to be such pressure to put it up fairly quickly (after you ask to at least wait at all!), with an average of about 1 hour before the woman gets the pressure to speed things up. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support No virus found in this incoming message. Checked by AVG Free Edition.
Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
Our Syntocinon procedure has been updated to include routine EFM. this has apparently been routine in major hospitals for a long time and accepted by midwives in these units as being the best practice. I have unfortunately accepted this practice too - but feel saddened with the risk for midwives losing valuable skills by relying on CTG's instead of truly being With Woman. and assessing the labour with sonicaid and palpation of contractions and of course observing the woman. There is an increased risk of busy midwives assessing a woman's labour by CTG alone - not having the time to truly know the whole picture a bit scary!!. In our unit where we have caseload midwifery we have the time to stay with women in labour and be tuned into the progress of labour and the baby's wellbeing. I really still do not see the need in these situations to have to rely on CTG, I would rather any day to rely on a good midwivery care/skills. If there is any concern about the FH sure then use EFM Also woman will no longer have freedom of movement, and baths, but this will no longer be the case with compulsory continuous EFM for all Syntocinon Inductions. I can see Caesarians yet further on the increase at our hospital. Linda - Original Message - From: Janet Fraser [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 1:05 PM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? Amy your story is truly appalling and also totally normal in the system. How anyone can refuse your requests is disgusting! EFM does NOT save lives, it just increases c-sec rates. How about birthing with evidence based care at home if you have another baby? As Diana Korte says, if you don't want interventions, don't go where they're done ; ) I hope you recover well from your awful brush with the drug pushing and unnecessary intervention. I wish it were not the norm but it clearly is! J - Original Message - From: adamnamy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 11:49 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? This is really pertinent thread for us mothers on the list...it seems an issue about which there are no clear guidelines which makes it really hard for women who are attempting to be in charge of their own labors. They don't even know what sort of time frame they will have in which to relax into labor without pressure and threat of synto. I recently gave birth in our major hospital, by ARM (2nd birth, Hx of fast labor, 2cms dilated, 36 weeks but with cholestasis and very worried about that). I was extremely keen to avoid synto/EFM and all the other nasty possibilities. I asked over and over for some clear indication of how long they would give me to progress into labor with out synto but was not given one. Within an hour of ARM I was being asked very regularly if I had contractions, with frowns and talk about synto every time I said not much happening. I wonder how it might have panned out had I not been hassled every step of the way...It only served to increase my anxiety 20 fold. We managed to hold them off for 6 hours before it went up and the flogging of the body began. It is just a revolting drug that should be avoided unless strictly necessary. The labor was nothing short of torturous and degrading (I am sure you have all seen it in action). I also wonder if it was the unrelenting intensity of the contractions that forced my bub into a posterior, deflexed position within an hour of established labor. Being hooked up to EFM doesn't help with keeping mobile either. I am not a midwife-Could there be any truth in that idea? Anyway...I thought I had negotiated to switch it off once labor had begun but lo and behold...a change of shift and the next midwife refused. I ended up switching it off myself-to her utter bewilderment. This was an act of desperation which left me quite compromised with her because our relationship became quite frosty and unpleasant after this. I felt like I lost her support when I took the reigns and bucked against hospital protocol. It was like I had offended her...that she felt compromised by me asserting myself. If I ever needed to follow the same course of action I would have the ARM and then get myself home ASAP for labor to start itself. I feel as though getting my baby out and the room prepped for the next customer was as much of a priority as my wishes to keep my labor and birth low key...I don't know, am I an eternal cynic? Bub calls, I have to go... Amy -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of diane Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:54 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? We sometimes have some confusion over whether the women should have oral AB's cover if
Re: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
I agree completely Jo. I have been reading this whole thread and feel really frustrated. So many things have gone through my head about what to write, but I feel so disheartened at the moment by all the horror stories I have been reading and hearing. One thing I find so frustrating is the whole being 'allowed' to do this and the hospital 'letting' the woman do that. It's like we're on detention at school and we're the naughty girls that don't know anything. Surely, if as much time and effort went into building up women's confidence in themselves and their ability to birth and know their bodies, as goes into 'policy' and 'protocol' writing, then there would not be a need for this conversation. I think we, as women, need to take back the power and start saying, we are 'allowing' you to do this to MY body, I am 'letting' you do that to my baby, I will decide when the time is right for any procedure I so admire women like Amy that do take back the power, for women only lose it because hey give it away. On that note, Amy, you wrote, I felt like I lost her support when I took the reigns and bucked against hospital protocol. It was like I had offended her...that she felt compromised by me asserting myself. ~ but I think the reality is that you never had her support and she shouldn't have been offended as SHE was the one causing the offence against you. She was comprimising you, your baby and your birth by not listening and supporting you, you being the true expert. When women take back their power and 'care providers' realise that they are not the true experts, then that will be the time when birth becomes more empowered, safer and peaceful with a lot less serious and endangering outcomes. Love Abby Surely the woman would know and wouldn't need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women can't be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldn't deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days - constant water trickling - 37 +1 labour started - 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, it's all a load of rubbish. Jo -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
I agree completely Jo. I have been reading this whole thread and feel really frustrated. So many things have gone through my head about what to write, but I feel so disheartened at the moment by all the horror stories I have been reading and hearing. One thing I find so frustrating is the whole being 'allowed' to do this and the hospital 'letting' the woman do that. It's like we're on detention at school and we're the naughty girls that don't know anything. Surely, if as much time and effort went into building up women's confidence in themselves and their ability to birth and know their bodies, as goes into 'policy' and 'protocol' writing, then there would not be a need for this conversation. I think we, as women, need to take back the power and start saying, we are 'allowing' you to do this to MY body, I am 'letting' you do that to my baby, I will decide when the time is right for any procedure I so admire women like Amy that do take back the power, for women only lose it because hey give it away. On that note, Amy, you wrote, I felt like I lost her support when I took the reigns and bucked against hospital protocol. It was like I had offended her...that she felt compromised by me asserting myself. ~ but I think the reality is that you never had her support and she shouldn't have been offended as SHE was the one causing the offence against you. She was comprimising you, your baby and your birth by not listening and supporting you, you being the true expert. When women take back their power and 'care providers' realise that they are not the true experts, then that will be the time when birth becomes more empowered, safer and peaceful with a lot less serious and endangering outcomes. Love Abby Surely the woman would know and wouldn't need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women can't be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldn't deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days - constant water trickling - 37 +1 labour started - 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, it's all a load of rubbish. Jo -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
We have a system whereby women MUST be admitted to the ward after confirmed SROM. In passing I may say, of women who come in with ?SRM, fewer than half do have ROM so it isn't reasonable to expect Mum's opinion to be Gospel. After admission we have an ongoing battle with the medical staff to allow mums time to labour on their own. Durig the week it's not such a problem because the induction book is usually full (max 3 per day) but on the W/E (no booked IOL) the pressure is on to induce any who are sitting upstairs. We give them the option then but most of our clientele are crying out for induction and jump at the opportunity. We are supposed to be introducing a protocol where women may go home with term ROM to await labour but the Director has avowadly made it as difficult as possible in the hope that the midwives will cave and do immediate IOL. As a side note, I have recently been appointed acting CMC for Delivery Suite in our tertiary centre. I want to try to implement a caseload model during my tenure. Anyone who runs such a model, I would be very interested in learning the nitty gritty of how it is organised. Many thanks, Monica - Original Message - From: jo [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:26 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? I always find it amazing that what is happening to a woman's body (i.e SROM) is not believed and that she has to go in for 'confirmation'. Surely the woman would know and wouldn't need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women can't be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldn't deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days - constant water trickling - 37 +1 labour started - 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, it's all a load of rubbish. Jo _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of sally @ home Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt infusion. Sally - Original Message - From: Kelly @ mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? How frustrating then, that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to induce labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep coming back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for synto! It's a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having an ARM to ask to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not allow this? I get the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have asked many times if we can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do is walk the ward, and not leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to get things going, as mum ends anxious about the whole thing especially when you have such an unrealistic time frame to get things going! Obviously some cases are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, and the recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course makes it different but frustrating when you don't have much info about, I think I need a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the internet mum found it hard to get any good information. She was only borderline for cholestasis, but the doctors were scaring her about what *could* happen and how they just don't understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after only 2 hours despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. Just an assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting stressed from the labour - wouldn't the induced labour be more likely to stress baby? And the fact mum couldn't cope with the contractions as well and then had peth? The labour went quite quickly and it was all over in a few hours. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, http://www.bellybelly.com.au/ BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support BellyBelly Birth Support -
RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
u would think so but ive actually seen quite a few women in my limited experience come in saying they 'thought' their waters had broken and it turned out to be just a bit of extra vaginal discharge.. the one i hate is 'are you sure you havent wet yourself?' i actually saw an ob ask a woman this during 2nd stage, while pushing!! her waters broke with a huge pop and sprayed all over me in my position across the room as i walked past and the ob said 'do you think you might be doing a wee?' err no! i think the difference is women who come in and say 'my waters have broken' they usually have, but if they havent women arent always sure and are more likely to say 'i think they might have, im not sure i just wanted to come in to make sure' and things like that if that makes sense :)I always find it amazing that what is happening to a womans body (i.e SROM) is not believed and that she has to go in for confirmation. Surely the woman would know and wouldnt need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women cant be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets.I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldnt deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days constant water trickling 37 +1 labour started 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, its all a load of rubbish.JoFrom: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ home Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt infusion.Sally - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AMSubject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?How frustrating then, that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to induce labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep coming back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for synto! Its a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having an ARM to ask to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not allow this? I get the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have asked many times if we can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do is walk the ward, and not leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to get things going, as mum ends anxious about the whole thing especially when you have such an unrealistic time frame to get things going! Obviously some cases are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, and the recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course makes it different but frustrating when you dont have much info about, I think I need a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the internet mum found it hard to get any good information. She was only borderline for cholestasis, but the doctors were scaring her about what *could* happen and how they just dont understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after only 2 hours despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. Just an assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting stressed from the labour wouldnt the induced labour be more likely to stress baby? And the fact mum couldnt cope with the contractions as well and then had peth? The labour went quite quickly and it was all over in a few hours. Best Regards,Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-supportFrom: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Debbie Slater Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 12:05 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?The UKs NICE guidelines inherited from the UKs Royal College of Obs and Gynea suggest that it is fine to leave pre-labour rupture of
Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
i guess all you can do is educate each woman about how it is protocol to use CTG but tell her about the evidence that shows it to be of no benefit while increasing c/s and instrumental delivery rates and how it will reduce her mobility, positions possible, water usage, comfort etc etc and then ask for her decision on what type of monitoring she would like. then it is quite legitimate to record in the notes that they have refused consent for CTG. Bowman Family [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: Our Syntocinon procedure has been updated to include routine EFM. this hasapparently been routine in major hospitals for a long time and accepted bymidwives in these units as being the best practice.I have unfortunately accepted this practice too - but feel saddened with therisk for midwives losing valuable skills by relying on CTG's instead oftruly being With Woman". and assessing the labour with sonicaid andpalpation of contractions and of course observing the woman.There is an increased risk of busy midwives assessing a woman's labour byCTG alone - not having the time to truly know the whole picture a bitscary!!.In our unit where we have caseload midwifery we have the time to stay withwomen in labour and be tuned into the progress of labour and the baby'swellbeing. I really still do not see the need in these situations to have torely on CTG, I would rather any day to rely on a good midwivery care/skills.If there is any concern about the FH sure then use EFMAlso woman will no longer have freedom of movement, and baths, but this willno longer be the case with compulsory continuous EFM for all SyntocinonInductions. I can see Caesarians yet further on the increase at ourhospital.Linda- Original Message - From: "Janet Fraser" To: Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 1:05 PMSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? Amy your story is truly appalling and also totally normal in the system.How anyone can "refuse" your requests is disgusting! EFM does NOT save lives,it just increases c-sec rates. How about birthing with evidence based care at home if you have another baby? As Diana Korte says, if you don't want interventions, don't go where they're done ; ) I hope you recover well from your awful brush with the drug pushing and unnecessary intervention. I wish it were not the norm but it clearly is! J - Original Message - From: "adamnamy" To: Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 11:49 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? This is really pertinent thread for us mothers on the list...it seems an issue about which there are no clear guidelines which makes it reallyhard for women who are attempting to be in charge of their own labors. They don't even know what sort of time frame they will have in which to relax into labor without pressure and threat of synto. I recently gave birthin our major hospital, by ARM (2nd birth, Hx of fast labor, 2cms dilated,36 weeks but with cholestasis and very worried about that). I wasextremely keen to avoid synto/EFM and all the other nasty possibilities. I asked over and over for some clear indication of how long they would give me to progress into labor with out synto but was not given one. Withinan hour of ARM I was being asked very regularly if I had contractions, with frowns and talk about synto every time I said "not much happening". I wonder how it might have panned out had I not been hassled every step of the way...It only served to increase my anxiety 20 fold. We managed to hold them off for 6 hours before it went up and the flogging of the bodybegan. It is just a revolting drug that should be avoided unless strictly necessary. The labor was nothing short of torturous and degrading (I am sure you have all seen it in action). I also wonder if it was the unrelenting intensity of the contractionsthat forced my bub into a posterior, deflexed position within an hour of established labor. Being hooked up to EFM doesn't help with keeping mobile either. I am not a midwife-Could there be any truth in that idea? Anyway...I thought I had negotiated to switch it off once labor hadbegun but lo and behold...a change of shift and the next midwife refused. I ended up switching it off myself-to her utter bewilderment. This was an actof desperation which left me quite compromised with her because our relationship became quite frosty and unpleasant after this. I felt likeI lost her support when I took the reigns and bucked against hospital protocol. It was like I had offended her...that she felt compromised by me asserting myself. If I ever needed to follow the same course of action I would have theARM and then get myself home ASAP for labor to start itself. I feel asthough getting my baby out and the room prepped for the "next customer" was as much of a priority as my wishes to keep my labor and birth low key...I don't know, am I an eternal cynic? Bub calls, I have to go... Amy -Original
[ozmidwifery] Caseload / Group Practice Experiences Wanted
G'day,I am editing another book on behalf of the Australian College of Midwives. This time the book isn't about women or men but about those who help it all happen - the midwives. I am looking for midwives who are willing to write a short piece about their experiences as a caseload/group practice midwife. IPMs are also invited to write.For more information on the project and a copy of the Writer's Guidelines. Please email me at: [EMAIL PROTECTED] and I'll get back to you ASAP. You can also find more information about the project at this website: With Women - Shiftwork to Group Practice I hope to hear from you soon.Cheers,David _David Vernon, Editor and WriterHaving a Great Birth in Australia, Men at Birth, With Women - Shiftwork to Group Practice and The Hunt for MarasmusGPO Box 2314, Canberra ACT 2601, AustraliaEm: Click here to email meMy other websites: Beryl's Hansard | A Busy Dad's Guide to Cooking | Kitty Maus _
RE: [ozmidwifery] Introducing solids too early
Title: Re: [ozmidwifery] Introducing solids too early I decided to post that Suck This article on my site (talk about putting things in the lions den) and it started off disastrous but then, the ABA saved the day after someone sought information and the conversation is going so much better ;) Its amazing how things can be interpreted so badly, but something small can turn things around when you think they are never going to see the bigger picture! If you want to have a read (it gets a bit *itchy* LOL) you can do so here: http://bellybelly.com.au/forums/showthread.php?t=15099 it might help everyone get a bit more understanding of what works and doesnt with the whole can do attitude to breastfeeding Anyway, this is a taste of what women out there think and feel it doesnt need any elbowing or stirring, I think they are working it out on their own, and to add more fire would kill it I think! So I am leaving it up to them now. Best Regards, Kelly Zantey Creator, BellyBelly.com.au Gentle Solutions From Conception to Parenthood BellyBelly Birth Support - http://www.bellybelly.com.au/birth-support From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Justine Caines Sent: Thursday, 8 June 2006 12:47 PM To: OzMid List Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Introducing solids too early Dear Carol and all Very interesting re the global perspective. What we have now though is a gigantic industry both the formula and baby food industry. In informing women of the facts we but up against huge vested interests. I have been mulling over a book idea but keep coming back to the thought of how it would sell when it would critical analyse the benefits of much of the commercial baby flap/trap. What do you think Carol?? Only last night I checked labels again and the first food products say 4-6 months. This is despite the WHO code, Does NHMRC also have one?? I cant remember Doesnt matter that most babies cant sit up then!! When I worked for a pollie a few yrs back we successfully made Heinz re label rice cereal but I guess we only held them to that produce so without any diligent monitoring the sell sell approach remains unfettered. Re the formula industry I red a fascinating article that put all the arguments we know very succinctly. It is from a UK journal called Ecologist http://www.exacteditions.com/exact/browse/307/308/1267/3/22/0/ Well worth a look Justine Caines National Policy Co-ordinator Maternity Coalition Inc PO Box 625 SCONE NSW 2329 Ph: (02) 65453612 Fax: (02)65482902 Mob: 0408 210273 E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] www.maternitycoalition.org.au
[ozmidwifery] Uns*bscribing from the list
Hi everyone, A few people are having problems uns*bscribing themselves from the mailing so here are the instructions on how to do this: Send a message to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] with a line of text that reads: uns*bscribe ozmidwifery Remember to change the * to u, I have used the asterisk to stop this email bouncing. Please also remember that if you change your email address, you will have to uns*bscribe the old address and then s*bscribe the new address. Unfortunately, the list is NOT set up in a way that allows changes. Sorry about that. If you have any questions, please don't hesitate to contact me. Happy posting. Kim - Kim Hunter Step Two Designs Pty Ltd Intranets / Usability / Information Architecture / Knowledge Management / Content Management http://www.steptwo.com.au/ [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit http://www.acegraphics.com.au to subscribe or unsubscribe.
Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
I haveto say that, unfortunately, many women are not in tune enough with their bodies to know whether theyhave ruptured their membranes or not. this is evidenced by what they say on the phone...eg " I'm not sure if I have broken my waters or not". And we have had incidences of women desperate to be induced tipping a glass of water down their pants to make it look like they have!! Policies and guidelines are not necessarily 'a load of rubbish' either, they are not just a bunch of words written down at the whim of an individual person. Believe me, having been on a guidelines development committee, with everyone from the Director of Obstetrics to midwives from the birth centre. It has taken over 18 months to review and rewrite only a handful of guidelines. Unfortunately, we need these so that we all do the same thing.There is enough confliciting adveice dished out by midwives as it is. Not all of these guidelines are restrictive and if women know enough to challenge them then I see that as good for the system. I just wish there were more women out there who would challenge the system. However, whilst I was practicing as an independent midwife...I treated the women I wasworking with the respect and honour that they deserved and would definately watch and wait in cases like this. Sally - Original Message - From: jo To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:26 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? I always find it amazing that what is happening to a womans body (i.e SROM) is not believed and that she has to go in for confirmation. Surely the woman would know and wouldnt need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women cant be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldnt deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days constant water trickling 37 +1 labour started 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, its all a load of rubbish. Jo From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ homeSent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 AMTo: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.auSubject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt infusion. Sally - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? How frustrating then, that of the births I have been to, when there has been an ARM to induce labour, mum gets pressure for the drip after an hour, then they keep coming back in at periodic intervals of 30mins-1hr with more pressure for synto! Its a fight to keep them away! So would it be fair for a mum having an ARM to ask to have her waters broken and then go home, or will they not allow this? I get the impression that they want to keep you in, as I have asked many times if we can get out for a walk and the only thing you can do is walk the ward, and not leave it. Very frustrating if you are trying to get things going, as mum ends anxious about the whole thing especially when you have such an unrealistic time frame to get things going! Obviously some cases are different; I have seen ARM for things like post-dates baby, twins, and the recent one where there was cholestasis involved, which of course makes it different but frustrating when you dont have much info about, I think I need a good midwifery text or something similar as even on the internet mum found it hard to get any good information. She was only borderline for cholestasis, but the doctors were scaring her about what *could* happen and how they just dont understand the condition well enough. She had the drip up after only 2 hours despite regular 30 second contractions that were progressing. Just an assumption, but if they are worried about baby getting stressed from the labour wouldnt the
RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
I understand that there is a need for policies etc in the system. Your last line However, whilst I was practicing as an independent midwife...I treated the women I wasworking with the respect and honour that they deserved and would definately watch and wait in cases like this. Why cant women choosing to birth in hospital receive the same respect and support? This is exactly the problem and issue I have with policies, they are not individual based and do not take into account individual womens needs. When a woman says I'm not sure if I have broken my waters or not. Why cant those women be assured that if there was just a trickle its probably a hind water leak and if there was a pop and gush then they have more than likely broken, what do you think has happened, what is your feeling on it? Give it back to her and therefore give her back the power exactly where it should be. This is not a personal issue with you Sally, simply trying to understand why the policies are so strict with little room to move for individuals. When women do want to do something that is different to what the policies say they are labeled as being difficult simply because they are informed. Ive been attending 2 births a month for the past 3 years as a doula and have seen women treated like this over and over again and the eyes roll (not always) when I walk in as her doula. Is it because she is empowering herself with support and knowledge? I really dont understand! Thanks for listening Jo From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ home Sent: Friday, 16 June 2006 2:14 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? I haveto say that, unfortunately, many women are not in tune enough with their bodies to know whether theyhave ruptured their membranes or not. this is evidenced by what they say on the phone... And we have had incidences of women desperate to be induced tipping a glass of water down their pants to make it look like they have!! Policies and guidelines are not necessarily 'a load of rubbish' either, they are not just a bunch of words written down at the whim of an individual person. Believe me, having been on a guidelines development committee, with everyone from the Director of Obstetrics to midwives from the birth centre. It has taken over 18 months to review and rewrite only a handful of guidelines. Unfortunately, we need these so that we all do the same thing.There is enough confliciting adveice dished out by midwives as it is. Not all of these guidelines are restrictive and if women know enough to challenge them then I see that as good for the system. I just wish there were more women out there who would challenge the system. However, whilst I was practicing as an independent midwife...I treated the women I wasworking with the respect and honour that they deserved and would definately watch and wait in cases like this. Sally - Original Message - From: jo To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 8:26 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? I always find it amazing that what is happening to a womans body (i.e SROM) is not believed and that she has to go in for confirmation. Surely the woman would know and wouldnt need it confirmed - so the hosp needs evidence because women cant be trusted to tell the truth. Gggrr! The more I read about this the more frustrating it gets. I supported at a homebirth last year where SROM occurred at 36 weeks, mum new that midwife wouldnt deliver at home before 37 weeks. Got checked at hosp, signed herself out (they wanted her to stay until labour started and to birth there) bed rest for 8 days constant water trickling 37 +1 labour started 4 hours, beautiful healthy baby born in lounge room. Times, clocks, protocols, policies, its all a load of rubbish. Jo From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of sally @ home Sent: Thursday, 15 June 2006 11:10 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used? We wait up to 96 hours. If a woman rings with ?pre-labour SROM, we ask them to attend the unit for confirmation, either by history (checking pads) or spec if it looks inconclusive. We do an abdo palp, CTG then send her home with antibiotics to be commenced 18 hours after ROM. We ask to attend the unit daily for CTG. Usually the women will go into spontaneous labour but if they haven't by the 96 hours they come in for synt infusion. Sally - Original Message - From: Kelly @ BellyBelly To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Thursday, June 15, 2006 7:28 AM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] How long before synto is used?
