RE: [ozmidwifery] Fish oils and postdates
Fish Oil in Various Doses or Flax Oil in Pregnancy and Timing of Spontaneous Delivery: A Randomized Controlled Trial [Obstetrics: Preconception and Prenatal Care] Knudsen, V K.; Hansen, H S.; Østerdal, M L.; Mikkelsen, T B.; Mu, H; Olsen, S F. Maternal Nutrition Group, Department of Epidemiology Research, Statens Serum Institut, Copenhagen S, Denmark; the Department of Pharmacology, Danish University of Pharmaceutical Sciences, Copenhagen, Denmark; and the Biochemistry and Nutrition Group, BioCentrum-DTU, Technical University of Denmark, Lyngby, Denmark BJOG 2006;113:536543 ABSTRACT http://gateway.ut.ovid.com/gw1/ovidweb.cgi#toc#toc Previous studies have suggested that a diet containing long-chain n-3 fatty acids derived from fish oil may delay spontaneous delivery. The investigators, in a randomized, controlled trial, addressed this hypothesis and also sought to determine whether alpha-linolenic acid (ALA), in the form of flax oil capsules, might have the same effect. Participants were 3098 women who reported a low intake of fish and who were randomized to receive one of 5 doses (0.1, 0.3, 0.7, 1.4, or 2.8 g) of eicosapentaenoic acid and docosahexaenoic acid daily, 2.2 g daily of ALA, or no treatment. Supplementation began at 17 to 27 weeks gestation and continued until delivery. The treatment groups were similar with respect to age, parity, gestational age, fish consumption, body mass index, and smoking. Analyzing singleton live-born pregnancies, no significant difference in gestational length was found between control women and any of the treatment groups whether comparing mean gestational ages or hazard rates of spontaneous delivery. This held for both intention-to-treat analyses and analyses based on the participants only. There were no apparent differences in intake of any of the fatty acids between the treatment groups. The difference in time to spontaneous delivery between pregnant women given the highest dose of fish oil and control women was less than 1 day. A majority of women in the treatment groups failed to continue taking their capsules up to the time of delivery. These findings may indicate that there is in fact no meaningful effect of dietary n-3 fatty acids on the timing of spontaneous delivery. It also is possible that there is a rapidly diminishing effect that depends on continued supplementation. _ EDITORIAL COMMENT http://gateway.ut.ovid.com/gw1/ovidweb.cgi#toc#toc (For some time, there has been interest in the potential for the n-3, or omega-3 fatty acids eicosapentaenoic acid (EPA) and docosahexaenoic acid (DHA), to prolong gestation and/or prevent preterm birth. Marine foods are a rich source of both EPA and DHA, and Olsen and his colleagues observed that birth weight and gestational age was higher in the Faroe Islands, which are between Norway and Iceland and where the rate of consumption of marine food is very high, than in Denmark, where it is lower (J Epidemiol Community Health 1985;39:27). Pregnant Faroese women had higher omega-3/omega-6 erythrocyte ratios, and among Danish women, an increased ratio was associated with longer gestation (Olsen SF, et al. Am J Obstet Gynecol 1991;164:1203). This association is plausible. As opposed to omega-6 fatty acids, which are proinflammatory, omega-3 fatty acids are antiinflammatory and suppress the production of inflammatory cytokines and prostaglandins E and F. Thus, the overall intake of omega-3 fatty acids, and the proportion of omega-3 to omega-6 fatty acids in the diet and in various tissue compartments, might influence the onset of parturition. However, the observational data to support that dietary omega-3 intake influences the length of gestation is not all one-sided, because there are studies that report no association (eg, Oken E, et al. Am J Epidemiol 2004;160:774). Whether omega-3 supplementation can prolong gestation or prevent preterm birth has also been the subject of a fair number of randomized studies. The first was conducted in 1938 and 1939 and reanalyzed with an eye to gestational length some 50 years later (Olsen SF, Secher NJ. Br J Nutr 1990;64:599). In this trial, over 5500 pregnant women were randomly allocated to daily supplementation with halibut oil, vitamins, and minerals or to no supplementation. Women allocated to supplementation were 20% less likely to deliver before 40 weeks, but no information was available on preterm delivery, and neither infant birth weights nor perinatal mortality differed between groups. The strongest experimental support for the prevention of preterm birth with omega-3 fatty acids is the trial of Olsen et al (BJOG 2000;107:382) in which 232 women with a history of preterm birth were randomly allocated to a daily fish oil supplement containing 1300 mg of EPA and 900 mg DHA or matching placebo (olive oil). In this trial, women allocated to fish oil had a significantly reduced risk of preterm birth (37 weeks, 21% vs 33%) and early preterm birth (34 weeks,
RE: [ozmidwifery] Premature birth risks of loop diathermy
Hello wise women, Does anyone know the probability of having a pre-term birth or miscarriage in women who have previously undergone a LLETZ procedure? I asked an ob at our hospital and couldn't get a straight answer. Ta Tiff :-) BBC NEWS Womb cell op 'raises birth risk' The most common operation to remove abnormal cervical cells raises the risk of giving birth early, experts say. A study of 5,000 Australian women found when a heated wire, loop diathermy, was used the risk rose substantially. Young women should not automatically have diathermy, the British Journal of Obstetrics and Gynaecology (BJOG) says. UK experts said abandoning the treatment could mean up to 1,500 fewer premature births a year - and they said doctors should consider alternatives. Last year, more than 3.3 million women in the UK underwent screening, and just over 1% of these had clear changes in the cells lining the cervix. Women need to know about the risks involved and discuss alternative treatments with their gynaecologist, before going ahead with a procedure that increases the risk of pre-term birth Phil Steer BJOG Women with severe changes in these cells are at higher risk of going on to develop cervical cancer at some point, and are often referred to hospital to have them removed. Increased risk There are three main ways of doing this, two of which - cone biopsy and loop diathermy - can remove relatively large amounts of tissue from the cervix. Cone biopsy is now used only rarely in the UK. The third - called laser ablation - destroys just the abnormal surface cells. While other studies have already made a link between loop diathermy and premature birth, the Australian research, from Melbourne University and Royal Women's Hospital in Australia, is the largest yet. It found that having had abnormal cells, regardless of the method of removal, increased the risk of having a premature baby, but having either loop diathermy or cone biopsy raised that risk even further. Only the laser ablation technique - in the UK more commonly used on women with very mild cell changes - did not increase the chance of a premature baby. Babies born prematurely - before 37 weeks pregnancy - are at increased risk of a variety of health problems. Practical problems The researchers said that doctors should consider using alternatives to loop diathermy in women of childbearing age, and that women should be made fully aware of the risks before undergoing the procedure. Phil Steer, editor of the BJOG said: Women need to know about the risks involved and discuss alternative treatments with their gynaecologist, before going ahead with a procedure that increases the risk of pre-term birth. Dr Margaret Cruickshank, a senior lecturer in obstetrics and gynaecology at Aberdeen University, said that the vast majority of UK women with abnormal cells currently received diathermy rather than ablation. She said there would be huge practical difficulties and expense involved in hospitals abandoning it. The key thing appears to be the volume of tissue removed, and we need to find out in more detail the relationship between this and the risk of preterm birth. She said that the main advantage of diathermy was that it produced a sample of tissue which could be removed and analysed in the laboratory to make sure a cancer had not been missed, whereas ablation destroyed the tissue. Story from BBC NEWS: http://news.bbc.co.uk/go/pr/fr/-/2/hi/health/6227555.stm Published: 2007/01/03 11:57:27 GMT C BBC MMVII image001.gif Description: GIF image
RE: [ozmidwifery] paed burn cream
Are you referring to SSD cream? René Tiff _ From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Kristin Beckedahl Sent: Friday, 8 December 2006 4:37 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] paed burn cream I'm trying to find out the name of the burn cream used in paed (and maybe others) wards for childrens burns - apparently been around for years and really helps to rapidly heal the wounds?? Any idea? Thanks, Kristin _ Advertisement: Fresh jobs daily. Stop waiting for the newspaper. Search Now! http://g.msn.com/8HMBENAU/2752??PS=47575 www.seek.com.au -- This mailing list is sponsored by ACE Graphics. Visit to subscribe or unsubscribe. attachment: image001.jpg
RE: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc
Hi Di! Yes I'm here! Just got back from my honeymoon. The midwives I mentioned were in Mareeba about an hour west of Cairns on the Tablelands! Hope you find a midwife soon Phillipa! Tiff -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of diane Sent: Wednesday, 15 November 2006 9:46 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc I thought Tiff had mentioned a midwife around Townsville a while back, you out there Tiff?? When are you expecting your bub Philippa? Cheers, Di (now in Mackay) - Original Message - From: Philippa Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 6:56 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc Ok I need some more info I guess. I have had some midwives locally say that this is a better option to have at home for an emergency. This is my own birth I am talking about I am not a midwife, I am a doula and will be birthing unassisted due to the non-existence of MIPP up here, I am wanting something on hand for just in case. I have been told Misoprostol is very effective with few side effects. It will be for me a last resort whilst waiting for an ambo if things like shepherds purse and eating placenta do not work (if I have another PPH). Would anyone be able to tell me a bit more about the side effect and why you would/would not recommend it. I am due in a couple of months so want to start getting something organized and a decision made about which way to go. Thank you, Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Amanda W Sent: Wednesday, 15 November 2006 4:41 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc We use Misoprostol at the hospital where I work and it is kept in the fridge next to the syntocinon and syntometrine and the prostins etc. Why would you want to use it at your homebirth but. Syntocinon should be just fine. Misoprostol is a fairly heavy drug of choice with a fair few side effects and we only use it for large PPH's Amanda Ward Creative Memories Consultant Ph. (07) 3261 4354 Mob, 0417 009 648 Email. [EMAIL PROTECTED] From: Lisa Barrett [EMAIL PROTECTED] Reply-To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc Date: Wed, 15 Nov 2006 16:18:45 +1030 misoprostal isn't licenced here is Australia. I wouldn't be prescribing it if I were a GP. When I was Working at a private Hospital the Obs kept it in their own possesion. It isn't licenced to be kept at the hospital as far as I know. The pharmacy at the hospital wouldn't touch it. It's not the sort of drug you should have at a homebirth anyway. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Philippa Scott [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 3:55 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc I am hoping to get a script for Misoprostal (sp) for my homebirth. Any ideas. Should I just ask a GP? What are they liable for if they do prescribe it. Cheers Philippa Scott Birth Buddies - Doula Assisting women and their families in the preparation towards childbirth and labour. President of Friends of the Birth Centre Townsville -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Robyn Dempsey Sent: Wednesday, 15 November 2006 12:10 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc Yes, the synto is about $100 a box. So what I do, is buy/pay for one box, which lasts for the next women ( does that make sense?), I only use Synto about once a year! ( and then there are the years you need it 3 times in a row!) Robyn D - Original Message - From: Jennifairy [EMAIL PROTECTED] To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Wednesday, November 15, 2006 8:47 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] getting synto etc I have a few births at home coming up and was wondering about synto and other drugs in my kit. How do others purchase them? Do I have to have a script from a doctor? The other issue that I do find difficult is the issue of cost for homebirth.Others I have been involved in have been for friends and colleagues. Does anyone have a schedule of payment and cost that they use? I am meeting with a couple on Monday and would love to have a bit more idea. Any feedback will be greatly appreciated, Thanks Cath Had a client recently who I sent to her GP for a script for synt. She got the script, went to the chemist to fill it found it was going to cost her around $80 to get it - they only sold it in the boxes of five vials. I ended up asking around my MIPP friends managed to find some that
RE: [ozmidwifery] rural maternity services
Di M. Youre not in Mareeba in NQ by any chance? J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of D. Morgan Sent: Monday, 23 October 2006 11:17 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: [ozmidwifery] rural maternity services Hi Louise, Just a comment about rural maternity services or lack of!! I am a midwife in a rural facility and was hitting my head against the wall trying to get birthing back to our town. We have a Midwives clinic which wasn't well attended and lots of times couldn't bring postnatals back because we had no beds. (We are now marketing our product to the local GP's!!) Well one day, about 6 mths ago; along came two consumers from our town to ask why we had birthing taken away and why we couldn't get it back .This spurred me on again and together they(as a group) of consumers/Midwives are at a point where the district has set up a committee to work out the appropriate model of care for our birthing women. It can be done, but it must come from consumers and they must lobby there local politician and district health servicefor support. Our group affiliated with Maternity Coalition who have been really wonderful. >From a Midwives perspective I have learned so much in the last 6 months and feel supported to continue the fight for our community. Go for it. You only need one or two passionate people. Cheers Di M
RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question
HI Lisa Am not at work until next Wednesday but will try and get hold of the title of the book that was sent down to the ward when we had the lac consultant tut tutting that the bub wasnt getting the expressed milk bub is also getting valp levels, platelets and LFTs done! Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 8:36 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] medication question Hi Tiff I have looked after a woman taking Olanzapine for Bi Polarrecently and she hasn't been able to breast feed, this information was gained through the WCH drug information service. She was changed from Sodium Valp to Olanzapine while pregnant due the the well known effects of the Sodium Valp on the baby. It was as well researched as we could make it. I worked in conjunction with the mental health service and the womens and Childrens. she had a fantastic homebirth and was gutted about the breast feeding. Who publishes the book on medications I would like to follow this up more closely. Thanks Lisa Barrett
RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question
Oh thats right - I am pretty sure Medication and Mothers Milk was the book they sent us! It said that these meds were L1 (safe) drugs for bubs? Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Grant and Louise McLeod Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 8:31 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] medication question Sue try medication and mothers milk by Tom Hale, it should be in any maternity unit or Mothersafe 02 93826539 or 1800 647 848 ABA have a great booklet, very new and co written with PANDA about PND. It has a table of common medication groups and also a pro/con of feeding and meds. Thicker than their usual booklet, All for $5.00 Louise [EMAIL PROTECTED] ---Original Message--- From: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Date: 10/19/06 23:29:48 To: midwifery list Subject: [ozmidwifery] medication question Dear List-wives I have a new mum who normally takes Dexamphetamine for ADD (adult) and whose baby was quite growth retarded, probably as a result but no-one is saying that for sure. She has been off meds for a few weeks and is breast feeding her little bub, really wants to continue but is not doing too well off the meds and is getting quite scared of a repeat of PND that she had last time. Mimms wasn't greatly helpful apart from discouraging use in lactation and pregnancy - but as she had been using it in pregnancy anyway Do any of you have knowledge or experience of this med and effects in B/F? TIA Sue
RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question
Lisa - FYI my patient is on 500mg valproate mane as well as 500 mg valproate and 15mg Olanapine nocte. J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 10:07 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] medication question Thanks Tiff. I rerang the WCH (this is in Adelaide) and they still gave me the same story. Going to talk to the head honcho about this on Monday. I thought it may be related to dose as she is on a large one,but they think not. Apparently, according the them Olanzapine has very little over all research done on the effects. They also faxed me the information on it. Going to continue to follow it up as I feel very upset. We ( psychiatrist) and myself worked hard on this. We thought that the unit at the Women's would provide us with the best information and I thought I'd done my utmost to get it right. Will let you all know what they say. Lisa Barrett - Original Message - From: Rene and Tiffany To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Friday, October 20, 2006 7:56 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question Thanks Shaugn, Went to the site you are right that IS the book! For Lisa it says Olanzapine and valproate are okay for breastfeeding. Cheer! Tiff From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Shaughn Leach Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 8:05 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question Maybe the book you are thinking of is: Medications and Mothers Milk 2006, 12th Edition by Thomas Hale If you want more information about this book go to www.ibreastfeeding.com and go to the Books section. Hope this helps Shaughn From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Rene and Tiffany Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 5:40 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question HI Lisa Am not at work until next Wednesday but will try and get hold of the title of the book that was sent down to the ward when we had the lac consultant tut tutting that the bub wasnt getting the expressed milk bub is also getting valp levels, platelets and LFTs done! Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 8:36 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] medication question Hi Tiff I have looked after a woman taking Olanzapine for Bi Polarrecently and she hasn't been able to breast feed, this information was gained through the WCH drug information service. She was changed from Sodium Valp to Olanzapine while pregnant due the the well known effects of the Sodium Valp on the baby. It was as well researched as we could make it. I worked in conjunction with the mental health service and the womens and Childrens. she had a fantastic homebirth and was gutted about the breast feeding. Who publishes the book on medications I would like to follow this up more closely. Thanks Lisa Barrett
RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question
Kate I agree MIMs can be very unhelpful at times. Where I work in Mental Health, we currently have a mum admitted with a post-partum psychosis/mania. Bubs was born at 32 weeks and is in SCBU, and mum was expressing. We were discarding her milk after she gave it to us as she was taking olanzapine (an antipsychotic) and Sodium Valproate (a mood stabilizer). MIMs said that this was not safe for bubs, however, at mums insistence (she is a doctor), we accessed a brilliant little book called Medications in Breastfeeding, which showed that these 2 meds whilst were bad in pregnancy are safe in breastfeeding. SO now bub is receiving mums expressed milk if we had just relied on MIMs mum AND bub would have both missed out! Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Kate and/or Nick Sent: Friday, 20 October 2006 6:49 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] medication question I am a final year mid student. This week we had the chief pharmacist from the Adelaide WCH attend to discuss drugs in pregnancy breastfeeding. He said MIMS and drug company info is often unhelpful, and misleading. They have a number anyone can call for information, and they strongly encourage people (inc consumers, midwives, doctors) to call re meds during pregnancy, breastfeeding and meds for children. He was awesomely helpful, and Id give them a call. Service is Medicines and Drug Information Centre, open M-F 9-5 (Adelaide time), 08 8161 7222 Kate From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Susan Cudlipp Sent: Thursday, 19 October 2006 10:47 PM To: midwifery list Subject: [ozmidwifery] medication question Dear List-wives I have a new mum who normally takes Dexamphetamine for ADD (adult) and whose baby was quite growth retarded, probably as a result but no-one is saying that for sure. She has been off meds for a few weeks and is breast feeding her little bub, really wants to continue but is not doing too well off the meds and is getting quite scared of a repeat of PND that she had last time. Mimms wasn't greatly helpful apart from discouraging use in lactation and pregnancy - but as she had been using it in pregnancy anyway Do any of you have knowledge or experience of this med and effects in B/F? TIA Sue
RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step
DI, Are you moving? Where from and Where to? LOL Tiff From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of diane Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 4:50 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Well I'm glad I didn't wait for DE courses. They were talking about them when I first became interested in midwifery, during my second pregnancy. He was seven by the time I became a Midwife! That baby has just pulled out of my driveway in MY car, to take his girlfriend (born on the same day in same hospy, BTW) out for a picnic to celebrate their two year anniversary as a couple. He is sitting his HSC in a few weeks time. Time flys doesn't it Carolyn? That 9 1/2 lb boy is 18 in Feb, 6 ft 4in and 110kg (mostly just large not fat!) Di PS. I will be learning all about the little quirks of the Queensland way real soon. 5 1/2 weeks till moving day!! - Original Message - From: Rene and Tiffany To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 4:11 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Di thats fantastic! I wonder why we are so behind? I started my nursing training in 1997 and such a thing was unheard of. The mere fact that we havent got a direct-entry mid course is MAD! Even madder as I said before 12-months nursing is a pre-requisite for mid courses here! I wonder if there are plans for any QLD unis to get mid-only courses? Tiff From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of diane Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 3:48 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Tiff, we have them in NSW too! Uni of Technology in Sydney. Di - Original Message - From: Rene and Tiffany To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 3:30 PM Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Ganesha! Victoria has direct mid courses too?!! Thats awesome I thought it was only south Australia that did. If I had a choice I would not have done nursing just midwifery. My family is all doctors and nurses and I NEVER wanted to be a nurse. Im in Queensland and we still have to do nursing first we are s behind! My goal has always been to one day be an independent midwife and I have been ridiculed and dismissed by some of the nurses in my family because of this. Once I complete my mid training I wont nurse again but I am kind of glad now I have that skill René (husband) is a doctor doing GP training and wants to go into rural practice so I might be more equip to help him out if he needs as well as get into those rural areas where there is a need for midwives. This forum has been great guys thankyou youre have really helped me broaden my understanding! Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Ganesha Rosat Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 2:39 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Hi again guys, where is the nursing care in midwifery is an interesting point. When I began my grad. last year it was stressed to me that it was important to do some work in the nursing wards to enhance my midwifery skills. I think it was because I went through doing my nursing and midwifery together as a double degree (maybe unsure of my skills because I had never been a nurse). Like rene and tiffany I only did nursing to become a midwife. The year after I began my course direct midwifery courses were introduced in my state vic. I would have loved to have gone through that way. If we want others to respect our skills as midwives as unique and a separate profession, we need to acknowledge that midwifery is not a specialist nursing field. Cheers ganesha From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Rene and Tiffany Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 10:59 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step It has been fantastic reading all the responses to the nurse/midwife question. As a nurse about to begin midwifery training, I look forward to learning and developing the specialist skills you wonderful women have described! My original response stemmed from the fact that I became a nurse ONLY to become a midwife (as there was no other way at the time), but found that, I was unable to get any exposure to such, as training nurses and RNs are generally unwelcome in maternity. I would have given anything to have the opportunity to work and help out in maternity whilst waiting to secure a student midwife place. Instead I went straight into Mental Health after I qualified as an RN, whilst waiting for one of the 6 midwifery training positions that are offered. Perhaps
RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step
It has been fantastic reading all the responses to the nurse/midwife question. As a nurse about to begin midwifery training, I look forward to learning and developing the specialist skills you wonderful women have described! My original response stemmed from the fact that I became a nurse ONLY to become a midwife (as there was no other way at the time), but found that, I was unable to get any exposure to such, as training nurses and RNs are generally unwelcome in maternity. I would have given anything to have the opportunity to work and help out in maternity whilst waiting to secure a student midwife place. Instead I went straight into Mental Health after I qualified as an RN, whilst waiting for one of the 6 midwifery training positions that are offered. Perhaps this does raise the issue about providing more training places for student midwives, and why is it that we have to work as NURSES for a minimum 12 months before we can train as midwives, when as many have pointed out where is the nursing care in midwifery? Thanks J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of brendamanning Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 10:13 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Going back to the maternity nurse or Gen/ Obstetric nurse workingin Midwifery ishow NZ worked in the 70's 80's. It was unsatisfactory then would be the same now, despite the fact the we did 6 months obsin our general training we weren't midwives it showed. I worked in mid whilst attending homebirths, worked in birth suite, postnatal, taught pre-natal classesspent 3 yearsin charge of SCN as a RGON in the early 80's when I went to train as a midwife justlike Di MI too found it a revelation. It's a retrograde step undermines all the recognition of your specialised professionyou Australian midwives have fought so hard for. It's just another path on: follow the American leader. With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: D. Morgan To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 9:54 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: I agree Michelle, I too worked in a rural area prior to completing my Mid many years ago and can still remember the revelations I felt while learning Midwifery.As anRN non Midwife, I was quite ignorant of what a true Midwife's role involved. It was scarey stuff. Cheers Di M
RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step
Ganesha! Victoria has direct mid courses too?!! Thats awesome I thought it was only south Australia that did. If I had a choice I would not have done nursing just midwifery. My family is all doctors and nurses and I NEVER wanted to be a nurse. Im in Queensland and we still have to do nursing first we are s behind! My goal has always been to one day be an independent midwife and I have been ridiculed and dismissed by some of the nurses in my family because of this. Once I complete my mid training I wont nurse again but I am kind of glad now I have that skill Ren (husband) is a doctor doing GP training and wants to go into rural practice so I might be more equip to help him out if he needs as well as get into those rural areas where there is a need for midwives. This forum has been great guys thankyou youre have really helped me broaden my understanding! Tiff J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Ganesha Rosat Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 2:39 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Hi again guys, where is the nursing care in midwifery is an interesting point. When I began my grad. last year it was stressed to me that it was important to do some work in the nursing wards to enhance my midwifery skills. I think it was because I went through doing my nursing and midwifery together as a double degree (maybe unsure of my skills because I had never been a nurse). Like rene and tiffany I only did nursing to become a midwife. The year after I began my course direct midwifery courses were introduced in my state vic. I would have loved to have gone through that way. If we want others to respect our skills as midwives as unique and a separate profession, we need to acknowledge that midwifery is not a specialist nursing field. Cheers ganesha From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of Rene and Tiffany Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 10:59 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: RE: [ozmidwifery] Backward step It has been fantastic reading all the responses to the nurse/midwife question. As a nurse about to begin midwifery training, I look forward to learning and developing the specialist skills you wonderful women have described! My original response stemmed from the fact that I became a nurse ONLY to become a midwife (as there was no other way at the time), but found that, I was unable to get any exposure to such, as training nurses and RNs are generally unwelcome in maternity. I would have given anything to have the opportunity to work and help out in maternity whilst waiting to secure a student midwife place. Instead I went straight into Mental Health after I qualified as an RN, whilst waiting for one of the 6 midwifery training positions that are offered. Perhaps this does raise the issue about providing more training places for student midwives, and why is it that we have to work as NURSES for a minimum 12 months before we can train as midwives, when as many have pointed out where is the nursing care in midwifery? Thanks J From: owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au [mailto:owner-ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au] On Behalf Of brendamanning Sent: Monday, 2 October 2006 10:13 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] Backward step Going back to the maternity nurse or Gen/ Obstetric nurse workingin Midwifery ishow NZ worked in the 70's 80's. It was unsatisfactory then would be the same now, despite the fact the we did 6 months obsin our general training we weren't midwives it showed. I worked in mid whilst attending homebirths, worked in birth suite, postnatal, taught pre-natal classesspent 3 yearsin charge of SCN as a RGON in the early 80's when I went to train as a midwife justlike Di MI too found it a revelation. It's a retrograde step undermines all the recognition of your specialised professionyou Australian midwives have fought so hard for. It's just another path on: follow the American leader. With kind regards Brenda Manning www.themidwife.com.au - Original Message - From: D. Morgan To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Sent: Monday, October 02, 2006 9:54 AM Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: I agree Michelle, I too worked in a rural area prior to completing my Mid many years ago and can still remember the revelations I felt while learning Midwifery.As anRN non Midwife, I was quite ignorant of what a true Midwife's role involved. It was scarey stuff. Cheers Di M __ NOD32 1.1784 (20060929) Information __ This message was checked by NOD32 antivirus system. http://www.eset.com
RE: [ozmidwifery] RE:
The art of midwifery existed long before the need for qualifications existedfunny how I had to do 3 years nursing training (with 6 months of antenatal/womens health training included) to become a registered nurse and have had to work as such for 12 months before I could even apply to train as a midwife. From the original post it appears that they are not suggesting the nurses birth babies, but assist in the care of the woman and the neonate - something new mothers do without the need for specialist training I personally do not object to this. From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Lisa Barrett Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 4:28 PM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Re: [ozmidwifery] RE: Some of the best people I have worked with have been div2's. Their knowledge and understanding put some of the 'midwives' to shame. Just how much nursing care does a newborn need? Many LC's are not midwives, as are childbirth educators. Maybe we should be assisting these people to be woman wise, and not judge them on qualifications. I have no doubt that there are many people other than midwives that have vast knowledge and understanding but antenatal and postnatal care is not nursing care at all. It is specific to normal healthy women who are childbearing. If anyone can be trained to do this in just 8 days why bother with midwifery training. If we and not judging people on their qualifications some of the brilliant lay midwives out there wouldn't be persecuted and they are way more specialised than nurses. Lisa Barrett -Original Message- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]On Behalf Of Ganesha Rosat Sent: Thursday, 28 September 2006 8:33 AM To: ozmidwifery@acegraphics.com.au Subject: Hi all u wonderful women! Just a quick posting in line with the current debate about maternity services within country areas and who provides services. The hospital I am currently working in has decided to address our midwife shortage but training division two nurses to work in the maternity department. These nurses have 3 days of theory, one day of orientation in óbstetric and five days of clinical experience. On completion of their modules these girls will be able to: Assist in the provision of antenatal nursing care to the client Assist in the provision of nursing care to the healthy newborn baby Discuss the establishment and maintenance of breastfeeding Assist in the evaluation of key stage of growth and development of the baby Assist in the provision of postnatal nursing care to the woman This again indicates to me the lack of understanding of the needs of women (not clients). Instead of the hospital supporting midwives and creating a working environment that encourages new midwives to come to the area, they find quick fixes that only further add to the fragmentation of care. Anyway what do u all think? And is this happening anywhere else? Cheers Ganesha
