Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Hi Miller, Is this with the test tone patch? for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: I have also gotten the HDA way lower than 20 ms in ubuntu 12.04...! best, J /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
you are right - those numbers seem to be to good to be true. On the other hand I followed the instructions in the latency patch and don't know what could have been wrong. Am 26.11.2012 um 19:04 schrieb Miller Puckette m...@ucsd.edu: Hmm - I'm getting latencies between 6 and 7 (Fedora 17, Core 7200, INTEL HDA, latest Pd from git, but I think Pd 0.43 should do similar). cheers Miller On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 06:53:31PM +0100, Max wrote: Am 26.11.2012 um 16:18 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J I wanted to do this, but I don't have a linux machine with firewire, so i can't test the ffado driver for the card. I wanted to try out the class compliant mode, but there is a bug in ALSA which prevents it to work. see http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net/msg28935.html I didn't wanted to get started recompiling the kernel for this. sorry. So in theory it should work, but only if you remove the bug in the ALSA part. for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Am 27.11.2012 um 17:02 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: I have also gotten the HDA way lower than 20 ms in ubuntu 12.04...! for comparability I've set the delay time in Pd to 20. So that's a constant you should subtract from the latency measured by the latency.pd patch. The rest of ~1.9 ms is a little hard to believe. ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
If I'm reading rour post right, you're specifying 20 msec latency and getting about 22, which is OK, but I think you should be able to get lower latencies (i.e., I don't see that numbers like 21.9012 are too good to be true - those are typical Macintosh latencies but I think in linux you should be able to do much better.) cheers Miller On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 05:15:35PM +0100, Max wrote: you are right - those numbers seem to be to good to be true. On the other hand I followed the instructions in the latency patch and don't know what could have been wrong. Am 26.11.2012 um 19:04 schrieb Miller Puckette m...@ucsd.edu: Hmm - I'm getting latencies between 6 and 7 (Fedora 17, Core 7200, INTEL HDA, latest Pd from git, but I think Pd 0.43 should do similar). cheers Miller On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 06:53:31PM +0100, Max wrote: Am 26.11.2012 um 16:18 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J I wanted to do this, but I don't have a linux machine with firewire, so i can't test the ffado driver for the card. I wanted to try out the class compliant mode, but there is a bug in ALSA which prevents it to work. see http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net/msg28935.html I didn't wanted to get started recompiling the kernel for this. sorry. So in theory it should work, but only if you remove the bug in the ALSA part. for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
oh really? that's interesting. The later numbers come from a Ubuntu machine which isn't set up for sound at all, so when I compare those with a os x machine and the famous rme drivers the numbers are still impressive. Am 27.11.2012 um 17:47 schrieb Miller Puckette m...@ucsd.edu: If I'm reading rour post right, you're specifying 20 msec latency and getting about 22, which is OK, but I think you should be able to get lower latencies (i.e., I don't see that numbers like 21.9012 are too good to be true - those are typical Macintosh latencies but I think in linux you should be able to do much better.) cheers Miller On Tue, Nov 27, 2012 at 05:15:35PM +0100, Max wrote: you are right - those numbers seem to be to good to be true. On the other hand I followed the instructions in the latency patch and don't know what could have been wrong. Am 26.11.2012 um 19:04 schrieb Miller Puckette m...@ucsd.edu: Hmm - I'm getting latencies between 6 and 7 (Fedora 17, Core 7200, INTEL HDA, latest Pd from git, but I think Pd 0.43 should do similar). cheers Miller On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 06:53:31PM +0100, Max wrote: Am 26.11.2012 um 16:18 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J I wanted to do this, but I don't have a linux machine with firewire, so i can't test the ffado driver for the card. I wanted to try out the class compliant mode, but there is a bug in ALSA which prevents it to work. see http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net/msg28935.html I didn't wanted to get started recompiling the kernel for this. sorry. So in theory it should work, but only if you remove the bug in the ALSA part. for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
I got a new Fireface UCX, updated drivers and did a fresh test (replacement for the first one which didn't work). It has three modes: Firewire, USB and USB in Class Compliant (Plug and Play) mode. Interesting is, that Firewire is the worst when it comes to latency and Class Compliant is less than two milliseconds worse than the proprietary RME USB Driver. Bandwith might still be better in Firewire for multichannel setups, but I didn't test this. In my previous post on the topic the USB latency was wrong, it was a driver problem. Tested with Pure Data 0.43.4-extended-20121101 /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64, No callbacks OS X 10.8.2 Mac Book Pro 2 Ghz i7 latency of internal laptop soundcard (Intel High Definition Audio) for reference: print: 24.348 print: 24.3098 print: 24.3123 print: 24.3148 print: 24.3173 print: 24.3199 print: 24.3224 print: 24.3249 print: 24.3275 print: 24.33 print: 24.3326 latency Fireface UCX via Firewire, RME Driver print: 27.8751 print: 27.8777 print: 27.8803 print: 27.8829 print: 27.8854 print: 27.8472 print: 27.8497 print: 27.8522 print: 27.8548 print: 27.8573 print: 27.8598 print: 27.8624 print: 27.8649 print: 27.8675 print: 27.87 print: 27.8726 latency of Fireface UCX via USB, RME Driver print: 23.0024 print: 23.005 print: 23.0076 print: 23.0101 print: 22.9719 print: 22.9744 print: 22.9769 print: 22.9795 print: 22.982 print: 22.9845 print: 22.9871 print: 22.9896 print: 22.9922 print: 22.9947 print: 22.9973 print: 22.9998 print: 23.0024 print: 23.005 latency Fireface UCX via USB, Class Compliant Mode print: 24.3173 print: 24.3199 print: 24.3224 print: 24.3249 print: 24.3275 print: 24.33 print: 24.3326 print: 24.3352 print: 24.3377 print: 24.3403 print: 24.3429 print: 24.3454 print: 24.348 print: 24.3098 print: 24.3123 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J On Nov 26, 2012, at 9:25 AM, Max wrote: I got a new Fireface UCX, updated drivers and did a fresh test (replacement for the first one which didn't work). It has three modes: Firewire, USB and USB in Class Compliant (Plug and Play) mode. Interesting is, that Firewire is the worst when it comes to latency and Class Compliant is less than two milliseconds worse than the proprietary RME USB Driver. Bandwith might still be better in Firewire for multichannel setups, but I didn't test this. In my previous post on the topic the USB latency was wrong, it was a driver problem. Tested with Pure Data 0.43.4-extended-20121101 /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64, No callbacks OS X 10.8.2 Mac Book Pro 2 Ghz i7 latency of internal laptop soundcard (Intel High Definition Audio) for reference: print: 24.348 print: 24.3098 print: 24.3123 print: 24.3148 print: 24.3173 print: 24.3199 print: 24.3224 print: 24.3249 print: 24.3275 print: 24.33 print: 24.3326 latency Fireface UCX via Firewire, RME Driver print: 27.8751 print: 27.8777 print: 27.8803 print: 27.8829 print: 27.8854 print: 27.8472 print: 27.8497 print: 27.8522 print: 27.8548 print: 27.8573 print: 27.8598 print: 27.8624 print: 27.8649 print: 27.8675 print: 27.87 print: 27.8726 latency of Fireface UCX via USB, RME Driver print: 23.0024 print: 23.005 print: 23.0076 print: 23.0101 print: 22.9719 print: 22.9744 print: 22.9769 print: 22.9795 print: 22.982 print: 22.9845 print: 22.9871 print: 22.9896 print: 22.9922 print: 22.9947 print: 22.9973 print: 22.9998 print: 23.0024 print: 23.005 latency Fireface UCX via USB, Class Compliant Mode print: 24.3173 print: 24.3199 print: 24.3224 print: 24.3249 print: 24.3275 print: 24.33 print: 24.3326 print: 24.3352 print: 24.3377 print: 24.3403 print: 24.3429 print: 24.3454 print: 24.348 print: 24.3098 print: 24.3123 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Am 26.11.2012 um 16:18 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J I wanted to do this, but I don't have a linux machine with firewire, so i can't test the ffado driver for the card. I wanted to try out the class compliant mode, but there is a bug in ALSA which prevents it to work. see http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net/msg28935.html I didn't wanted to get started recompiling the kernel for this. sorry. So in theory it should work, but only if you remove the bug in the ALSA part. for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Hmm - I'm getting latencies between 6 and 7 (Fedora 17, Core 7200, INTEL HDA, latest Pd from git, but I think Pd 0.43 should do similar). cheers Miller On Mon, Nov 26, 2012 at 06:53:31PM +0100, Max wrote: Am 26.11.2012 um 16:18 schrieb J Oliver jaime.oliv...@gmail.com: Hi Max, Is it possible for you to test this same card in linux? J I wanted to do this, but I don't have a linux machine with firewire, so i can't test the ffado driver for the card. I wanted to try out the class compliant mode, but there is a bug in ALSA which prevents it to work. see http://www.mail-archive.com/alsa-user@lists.sourceforge.net/msg28935.html I didn't wanted to get started recompiling the kernel for this. sorry. So in theory it should work, but only if you remove the bug in the ALSA part. for the record i compared the on board intel card of the linux machine, the result is quite impressive, i don't think it can get any better: /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64 Ubuntu 12.04 Intel® Core™ i3 CPU 550 @ 3.20GHz × 4 Latency HDA Intel (hardware) print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 print: 21.9063 print: 21.9088 print: 21.9114 print: 21.914 print: 21.9165 print: 21.9191 print: 21.9217 print: 21.8834 print: 21.886 print: 21.8885 print: 21.891 print: 21.8936 print: 21.8961 print: 21.8986 print: 21.9012 print: 21.9037 ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
On 16/10/2012 11:03, Max wrote: Am 16.10.2012 um 10:47 schrieb Lorenzo Sutton lorenzofsut...@gmail.com: I will spear you my rant about the situation of external sound card for linux laptop users (many electronic musicians IMHO) as it would only be full of bitterness and frustration. I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). i use a focusrite saffire 24 dsp, the slightly bigger version of the saffire pro 24 that is listed as experimentally supported since 2009. some months ago, a bit of code was added to also recognize the saffire 24 dsp. while the dsp part (VRM) is fully unsupported, the audio interface itself works nicely for me. in this case the ffado device support database status is a bit outdated. the interface is hooked up to a thinkpad T400 running debian. i cannot remember the no-xrun latency achieved out of the top of my head but iirc something 5ms. i also heard good things about the edirol fa-66 and echo but never tried them myself. hth, Tee ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
hi, finally i got my new computer with an external firewire PCI-E TI chipset card (25$/CAD). it is working. my latency is now 8ms (round-trip measure with jack_iodelay). i am using ubuntu-studio that use the low-latency kernel by default. à+ ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Am 19.11.2012 um 09:45 schrieb Peter P. p8...@aol.com: * Max abonneme...@revolwear.com [2012-11-19 09:05]: I just got a RME Fireface UCX and will test it on linux soon. it has a USB class compliant mode, so it should run. The documentation says that the latency in the class compliant mode is not as good as with the proprietary driver. It would be interesting to have numbers here how much better exactly the rme driver is over the class compliant. I guess i'd simply connect output to input and measure the delay? Someone must have done this before, Is there a standard method? A patch? Use jdelay by Fons Adriaensen. http://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/ There is also a patch: /usr/local/lib/pd/doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Had no chance to test the Fireface UCX on linux yet, but here the results for OS X 10.8.2: Tested with Pure Data 0.43.4-extended-20121101 /doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd Sampling rate 44100 Hz, delay 20 ms Blocksize 64, No callbacks latency via USB, RME Driver print: 0.00193273 print: 0 print: 0 print: 0.000630273 print: 0 print: 0.000632601 print: 0.00253273 print: 0.000634696 print: 0.00190642 print: 0.000636792 print: 0.00191317 print: 0 print: 0.00191946 print: 0 print: 0.00192621 print: 0 print: 0.00193273 print: 0 print: 0 print: 0.000630273 latency via USB, Class Compliant Mode print: 24.3173 print: 24.3199 print: 24.3224 print: 24.3249 print: 24.3275 print: 24.33 print: 24.3326 print: 24.3352 print: 24.3377 print: 24.3403 print: 24.3429 print: 24.3454 print: 24.348 print: 24.3098 print: 24.3123 In the USB Class Compliant mode, when I change the delay in the Pd Audio properties to 40, the patch will output around 44.3. When set to 80 it will be 84.3 and so forth. Using the RME driver the latency shown in the patch always stays in the number range as seen above, no matter what delay is set in the Pd's Audio Properties. What's the explanation for this? I have to send the Fireface back because the Firewire port is not working for me. ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
I just got a RME Fireface UCX and will test it on linux soon. it has a USB class compliant mode, so it should run. The documentation says that the latency in the class compliant mode is not as good as with the proprietary driver. It would be interesting to have numbers here how much better exactly the rme driver is over the class compliant. I guess i'd simply connect output to input and measure the delay? Someone must have done this before, Is there a standard method? A patch? I must say that I am a bit disappointed about the drivers for os x. I installed the firewire and USB drivers and updated the firmware, with the result that the settings app now crashes and the firmware update also quits unsuccessfully now. in the regular mode now all the led on the device are on and the sound is chpped up. USB class compliant mode however still works. i mailed the support. Disappointing for a device i just spend 1000 eur on. also the rme fireface driver is the only process which isn't 64bit that is loaded by the os. Am 18.10.2012 um 14:24 schrieb Peter Venus n...@petervenus.de: a quick look on ffado.org brought up, that RMEs fireface 400 and 800 have now the full support status. i haven´t tested this yet, but if this works, this would be a perfect solution i think. anyone checked this yet? cheers, peter Gesendet: Mittwoch, 17. Oktober 2012 um 23:33 Uhr Von: Ed Kelly morph_2...@yahoo.co.uk An: Rob Bothof rbot...@xs4all.nl, pd-list@iem.at pd-list@iem.at Betreff: Re: [PD] firewire is dead? Jack + fa101? I have never, ever got this to give me anything other than glitchy, unusable audio! actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
* Max abonneme...@revolwear.com [2012-11-19 09:05]: I just got a RME Fireface UCX and will test it on linux soon. it has a USB class compliant mode, so it should run. The documentation says that the latency in the class compliant mode is not as good as with the proprietary driver. It would be interesting to have numbers here how much better exactly the rme driver is over the class compliant. I guess i'd simply connect output to input and measure the delay? Someone must have done this before, Is there a standard method? A patch? Use jdelay by Fons Adriaensen. http://kokkinizita.linuxaudio.org/linuxaudio/ There is also a patch: /usr/local/lib/pd/doc/7.stuff/tools/latency.pd best, P I must say that I am a bit disappointed about the drivers for os x. I installed the firewire and USB drivers and updated the firmware, with the result that the settings app now crashes and the firmware update also quits unsuccessfully now. in the regular mode now all the led on the device are on and the sound is chpped up. USB class compliant mode however still works. i mailed the support. Disappointing for a device i just spend 1000 eur on. also the rme fireface driver is the only process which isn't 64bit that is loaded by the os. Am 18.10.2012 um 14:24 schrieb Peter Venus n...@petervenus.de: a quick look on ffado.org brought up, that RMEs fireface 400 and 800 have now the full support status. i haven´t tested this yet, but if this works, this would be a perfect solution i think. anyone checked this yet? cheers, peter Gesendet: Mittwoch, 17. Oktober 2012 um 23:33 Uhr Von: Ed Kelly morph_2...@yahoo.co.uk An: Rob Bothof rbot...@xs4all.nl, pd-list@iem.at pd-list@iem.at Betreff: Re: [PD] firewire is dead? Jack + fa101? I have never, ever got this to give me anything other than glitchy, unusable audio! actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
a quick look on ffado.org brought up, that RMEs fireface 400 and 800have now the full support status.i havent tested this yet, but if this works, this would be a perfect solution i think.anyone checked this yet?cheers, peter Gesendet:Mittwoch, 17. Oktober 2012 um 23:33 Uhr Von:Ed Kelly morph_2...@yahoo.co.uk An:Rob Bothof rbot...@xs4all.nl, pd-list@iem.at pd-list@iem.at Betreff:Re: [PD] firewire is dead? Jack + fa101? I have never, ever got this to give me anything other than glitchy, unusable audio! actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Sorry, yes of course, it's the quasi firewire. On 16 October 2012 16:48, András Murányi muran...@gmail.com wrote: On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Julian Brooks jbee...@gmail.com wrote: I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). I have a Lenovo x61s (s/h £180, best laptop I've ever had) with an RME Hammerfall (v.1 [s/h £150]). It's great - stable, easy to setup, 8IO + the software HDSP_conf/mixer works well (and seems to have done for years). Firewire via pcmcia card: Got to love redundant technologies. Is that a standard firewire card or RME's proprietary quasi firewire? András ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
On Tue, 2012-10-16 at 17:48 +0200, András Murányi wrote: On Tue, Oct 16, 2012 at 5:11 PM, Julian Brooks jbee...@gmail.com wrote: I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). I have a Lenovo x61s (s/h £180, best laptop I've ever had) with an RME Hammerfall (v.1 [s/h £150]). It's great - stable, easy to setup, 8IO + the software HDSP_conf/mixer works well (and seems to have done for years). Firewire via pcmcia card: Got to love redundant technologies. Is that a standard firewire card or RME's proprietary quasi firewire? The protocol is from what I know not at all firewire, only the plugs and the cable are. Roman ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Le 16/10/2012 11:03, Max a écrit : Am 16.10.2012 um 10:47 schrieb Lorenzo Sutton lorenzofsut...@gmail.com: I will spear you my rant about the situation of external sound card for linux laptop users (many electronic musicians IMHO) as it would only be full of bitterness and frustration. I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). hello, here are link that I find looking for the same information : http://wiki.linuxaudio.org/wiki/current_audio_gear http://wiki.linuxmusicians.com/doku.php?id=hardware_matrix cheers c ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Jack + fa101? I have never, ever got this to give me anything other than glitchy, unusable audio! actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
no kiddin? been using it for about 5years with both jack1 and 2 i've been mainly used pd and lots of midi-controllers though and only at 44kz maybe that is the issue ? i meant to say cardbus-firewire ofcourse (smartcard ?!) grtz Rob Jack + fa101? I have never, ever got this to give me anything other than glitchy, unusable audio! actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list . ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
On 16/10/12 01:17, patrick wrote: hi all, i have a firepod 1010 firewire soundcard, i am using linux / jack. the new motherboard doesn't have firewire. what to do? You talk about motherboard, so I assume this is a desktop machine, I think you can easily get a firewire card and hook your soundcard to that. I will spear you my rant about the situation of external sound card for linux laptop users (many electronic musicians IMHO) as it would only be full of bitterness and frustration. Lorenzo. ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Am 16.10.2012 um 10:47 schrieb Lorenzo Sutton lorenzofsut...@gmail.com: I will spear you my rant about the situation of external sound card for linux laptop users (many electronic musicians IMHO) as it would only be full of bitterness and frustration. I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
I did some research about new laptops, and its far easier to find laptops with expresscard ports than laptops with fw ports. My laptop has one of these awfully fragile-looking tiny fw ports AND an expresscard port, so i can use a firewire-expresscard port adapter whenever i don't feel like using the tiny port (live situations typically). It has the benefit to protect the motherboard at some degree if someone trips on the fw cable : hopefully the only thing that get destroyed is the adapter itself, and not the motherboard. Most of the times when the cable is pulled hard, either the cable is unplugged or the adapter gets out of its port without any damage. On 16/10/2012 10:47, Lorenzo Sutton wrote: On 16/10/12 01:17, patrick wrote: hi all, i have a firepod 1010 firewire soundcard, i am using linux / jack. the new motherboard doesn't have firewire. what to do? You talk about motherboard, so I assume this is a desktop machine, I think you can easily get a firewire card and hook your soundcard to that. I will spear you my rant about the situation of external sound card for linux laptop users (many electronic musicians IMHO) as it would only be full of bitterness and frustration. Lorenzo. ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
-BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE- Hash: SHA1 On 2012-10-16 01:17, patrick wrote: hi all, i have a firepod 1010 firewire soundcard, i am using linux / jack. the new motherboard doesn't have firewire. what to do? just yesterday i was searching for some expansion card and discovered a whole bunch of PCI-cards that provide firewire. those were bought when firewire was not yet standard on all motherboardsand i couldn't help thinking (and smiling) that they will become handy soon, as motherboard manufacturers start dropping ieee1394 support again (well, unfortunately those cards are PCI, and newer mobos tend to not have PCI-slots anymore) so to answer your question: there should be plenty of expansion boards (PCI, PCIe, ...) that give you ieee1394 even if your motherboard does not support it. fgm asdr IOhannes -BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE- Version: GnuPG v1.4.12 (GNU/Linux) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org/ iEYEARECAAYFAlB9KVUACgkQkX2Xpv6ydvT7qwCfR3VWfTJoLVsBxqYoIcEg52Sr LgsAn1SmgM0i7suHqCnseppqaLCtsit2 =q5CR -END PGP SIGNATURE- ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
I'd be interested in a recommendation for that (external soundcard for linux laptops). I have a Lenovo x61s (s/h £180, best laptop I've ever had) with an RME Hammerfall (v.1 [s/h £150]). It's great - stable, easy to setup, 8IO + the software HDSP_conf/mixer works well (and seems to have done for years). Firewire via pcmcia card: Got to love redundant technologies. I also really like that nothing lights up on the RME unless there's a fault. Very recommended. Julian ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... -- http://yvanvolochine.com http://soundcloud.com/yvanvolochine http://vimeo.com/yv ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
actually it was still called smartcard.. either how i use it still with edirol fa101 never failed me, rocksolid performance with jack On 10/16/2012 6:11 PM, yvan volochine wrote: On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
Ive used expresscard a lot with jack for live stuff, the ones with TI chip are assumed the best for this, but i'v gotten perfect results with an other brand aswell i did have the little firewire port on my laptop but it broke down twice..useless On 10/16/2012 02:45 PM, patrick wrote: good, i was a little bit worried about using a pci-e firewire adapter for audio in linux / jack. about latency, yesterday i used jdelay to measure the round-trip of my latency, at 44100 with 128, 3 = 17 ms (jack reports 8 ms). at 96000 i get 7 ms, BUT my cpu seems to be working hard and i get glitches. so the question is: with a faster cpu, can i lower the latency? yes =) i.e. I have to use huge buffer sizes (so more latency) because of my old Intel Core Duo 1.6Ghz (great thinkpad x60 with expresscard slot for my FW card though)... ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
[PD] firewire is dead?
hi all, i have a firepod 1010 firewire soundcard, i am using linux / jack. the new motherboard doesn't have firewire. what to do? also will i be able to lower the latency even more if i have a faster cpu? or it's really the firewire / soundcard limitation? what it the lowest latency soundcard for linux available on the market? i might consider to make a move towards usb. pat ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
Re: [PD] firewire is dead?
You can buy a firewire interface, I think they're pretty cheap nowadays. I think one advantage of firewire is that USB has some overhead associated with managing the bus from the OS. This part I'm a little shaky on, so someone please tell me if I'm wrong-- if you're trying to deal with low latency with USB it's impossible to tell the OS to prioritize traffic going over USB to the connected USB audio interface but at the same time deprioritize traffic going over that same USB hub to other connected devices. So a crappy driver for a usb laser mouse can cause problems even if everything is working perfectly with the audio interface. But I may be completely misremembering what I learned about USB awhile back... On a somewhat related note-- I think there is still some BIOS stuff related to power management (esp. on laptops) that are not affected by even the real time kernel patches. Those latencies that the BIOS introduces are just a result of however well (or poor) the stuff was written that ships with the machine you're using. If it was written very inefficiently then you're just stuck with it no matter what OS you use. Yet another in a long list of reasons to have control over the software that runs in your machine! -Jonathan - Original Message - From: patrick pured...@11h11.com To: Pure Data list pd-list@iem.at Cc: Sent: Monday, October 15, 2012 7:17 PM Subject: [PD] firewire is dead? hi all, i have a firepod 1010 firewire soundcard, i am using linux / jack. the new motherboard doesn't have firewire. what to do? also will i be able to lower the latency even more if i have a faster cpu? or it's really the firewire / soundcard limitation? what it the lowest latency soundcard for linux available on the market? i might consider to make a move towards usb. pat ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list ___ Pd-list@iem.at mailing list UNSUBSCRIBE and account-management - http://lists.puredata.info/listinfo/pd-list
