Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Il giorno gio 29 apr 2021 alle ore 19:13 Paul Förster < paul.foers...@gmail.com> ha scritto: > nothing of it was a FUD. It was a comparison done on a single machine. > Then, I drew my conclusions from that and added my personal view. You don't > necessarily havet to agree to my opinion nor did I

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

I may be off-topic as I've only worked occasionally with ORA but still know it good enough. What I miss most of the Oracle DB in PostgreSQL is the elaborate system of object security and granting permissions which exists in Oracle DB. What I like most about the Postgres DB is that lots of

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Ludovico, > Sorry for this reply, but I feel it is necessary to make it clear what is > reality and what is FUD against Oracle from Paul's e-mails in this thread... nothing of it was a FUD. It was a comparison done on a single machine. Then, I drew my conclusions from that and added my

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Sorry for this reply, but I feel it is necessary to make it clear what is reality and what is FUD against Oracle from Paul's e-mails in this thread... (Note: I work for Oracle now, but I've had 20 years experience as multi-platform database consultant) Paul Förster wrote: > Oracle requires 161

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

>> Did Oracle change this? Last time I looked, I don't think Oracle supported local redo in their multitenant architecture either. Hi Jeremy, they are moving in this direction (project seems to be called DGPDB internally). And what is interesting for this discussion is that they initially had

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Sun, 2020-06-14 at 09:17 -0400, Bruce Momjian wrote: > On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 09:27:25PM -0400, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 05:06:37PM -0500, Ron wrote: > > > On 6/13/20 1:46 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 08:53:45PM +0200, Andreas Joseph Krogh

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 09:27:25PM -0400, Bruce Momjian wrote: > On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 05:06:37PM -0500, Ron wrote: > > On 6/13/20 1:46 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 08:53:45PM +0200, Andreas Joseph Krogh wrote: > > > > I agree these are all technical issues, but

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Sat, Jun 13, 2020 at 05:06:37PM -0500, Ron wrote: > On 6/13/20 1:46 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: > > On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 08:53:45PM +0200, Andreas Joseph Krogh wrote: > > > I agree these are all technical issues, but nevertheless - "implementation > > > details", which DBAs don't care about.

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/13/20 1:46 PM, Bruce Momjian wrote: On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 08:53:45PM +0200, Andreas Joseph Krogh wrote: I agree these are all technical issues, but nevertheless - "implementation details", which DBAs don't care about. What's important from a DBA's perspective is not whether WAL is

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Tue, Jun 2, 2020 at 03:45:08PM -0400, Ravi Krishna wrote: > > > > > Generally speaking, I discourage having lots of databases under one PG > > cluster for exactly these kinds of reasons. PG's individual clusters > > are relatively lightweight, after all. > > > > Plus PG does not directly

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 08:53:45PM +0200, Andreas Joseph Krogh wrote: > I agree these are all technical issues, but nevertheless - "implementation > details", which DBAs don't care about. What's important from a DBA's > perspective is not whether WAL is cluster-wide or database-wide, but whether >

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/5/20 10:02 AM, Achilleas Mantzios wrote: On 5/6/20 5:19 μ.μ., Thomas Kellerer wrote: Achilleas Mantzios schrieb am 05.06.2020 um 14:05: Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, something sqlserver excels at. Maybe because SQL server does not have real

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 5/6/20 5:19 μ.μ., Thomas Kellerer wrote: Achilleas Mantzios schrieb am 05.06.2020 um 14:05: Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, something sqlserver excels at. Maybe because SQL server does not have real databases but schemas instead ? This sucks

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Achilleas Mantzios schrieb am 05.06.2020 um 14:05: >> Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, >> something >> sqlserver excels at. > > Maybe because SQL server does not have real databases but schemas instead ? > This sucks security wise. That is wrong. SQL

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 5/6/20 3:33 μ.μ., Ravi Krishna wrote: Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, something sqlserver excels at. Maybe because SQL server does not have real databases but schemas instead ? This sucks security wise. SQLServer has real databases with its own

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

>> Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, >> something >> sqlserver excels at. >Maybe because SQL server does not have real databases but schemas instead ? >This sucks security wise. SQLServer has real databases with its own transaction log files. You can

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 2/6/20 10:45 μ.μ., Ravi Krishna wrote: Generally speaking, I discourage having lots of databases under one PG cluster for exactly these kinds of reasons. PG's individual clusters are relatively lightweight, after all. Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment on Mysql

On 2020-Jun-03, Martin Mueller wrote: > On the topic of what other databases do better: I much prefer Postgres to > Mysql because it has better string functions and better as well as very > courteous error messages. But MySQL has one feature that sometimes makes me > want to return it: it

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment on Mysql

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 5:21 PM Martin Mueller < martinmuel...@northwestern.edu> wrote: > On the topic of what other databases do better: I much prefer Postgres to > Mysql because it has better string functions and better as well as very > courteous error messages. > Martin, I definitely

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 11:26:07PM +1000, Tim Cross wrote: > Yes, even after longer time doing Oracle, I still never felt as > comfortable or across things as much as I do with PG. Started with > Oracle 7 and stayed until 11g and each year, it got worse rather than better. > > After working as a

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment on Mysql

that I am just missing? *From: *Andreas Joseph Krogh *Date: *Wednesday, June 3, 2020 at 12:54 PM *To: *Chris Travers *Cc: *"pgsql-generallists.postgresql.org" *Subject: *Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment På onsdag 03. juni 2020 kl. 20:07:24, skrev Chris Travers mailto:chr

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment on Mysql

at these things that I am just missing? From: Andreas Joseph Krogh Date: Wednesday, June 3, 2020 at 12:54 PM To: Chris Travers Cc: "pgsql-generallists.postgresql.org" Subject: Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment På onsdag 03. juni 2020 kl. 20:07:24, skrev Chris Travers mailto:

RE: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

I manage database clusters where the number of databases is a reason not to do logical replication based upgrades, where pg_upgrade is far preferred instead. If this were to be the case, I would be very concerned that a bunch of things would have to change: 1. Shared catalogs would have

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

På onsdag 03. juni 2020 kl. 20:07:24, skrev Chris Travers < chris.trav...@gmail.com >: [...] Regardless of what Oracle does, I agree this would be a huge step in the right direction for pg-DBAs. I have absolutely no clue about how much work is required etc.,

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Wed, Jun 3, 2020 at 7:45 PM Andreas Joseph Krogh wrote: > På onsdag 03. juni 2020 kl. 18:50:12, skrev Jeremy Schneider < > schnj...@amazon.com>: > > > On 6/2/20 1:30 PM, Stephen Frost wrote: > >> No, nothing does as PG doesn't support it as we have one WAL stream for > >> the entire cluster.

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

På onsdag 03. juni 2020 kl. 18:50:12, skrev Jeremy Schneider < schnj...@amazon.com >: > On 6/2/20 1:30 PM, Stephen Frost wrote: >> No, nothing does as PG doesn't support it as we have one WAL stream for >> the entire cluster. On 6/2/20 11:38, Ron wrote: > Right.

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Ron wrote: > On 6/2/20 1:56 PM, Tim Clarke wrote: > > On 02/06/2020 19:43, Stephen Frost wrote: > > > > But require a new port, and Enterprises have Processes that must be > > > > followed. > > > Sure they do. Automate them. > > > > > > :) > > > > > > Thanks, > > > Stephen > > > > +1 for

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Tue, Jun 02, 2020 at 11:18:52PM +0200, Thomas Kellerer wrote: > Ron schrieb am 02.06.2020 um 20:38: > > > >>   PG's individual clusters are relatively lightweight, after all. > > > >But require a new port, and Enterprises have Processes that must be followed. > > I am not 100% sure, but I

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Adam Brusselback (adambrusselb...@gmail.com) wrote: > > How good will that be in performance. > > In my experience, not great. It's definitely better than not having it at > all, but it does not make for quick queries and caused serious > connection overhead when a query referenced

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Guyren Howe (guy...@gmail.com) wrote: > On Jun 2, 2020, at 14:16 , Stephen Frost wrote: > > I'm sure there's things we can do to improve the performance of the FDW. > > Not sure we'll get to a point where we are actually cacheing information > > from the far side... but who knows,

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

> How good will that be in performance. In my experience, not great. It's definitely better than not having it at all, but it does not make for quick queries and caused serious connection overhead when a query referenced that foreign table. I've since moved to logical replication to improve the

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Jun 2, 2020, at 14:16 , Stephen Frost wrote: > > Greetings, > I'm sure there's things we can do to improve the performance of the FDW. > Not sure we'll get to a point where we are actually cacheing information > from the far side... but who knows, maybe if we arrange to have a > notification

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Ron schrieb am 02.06.2020 um 20:38:    PG's individual clusters are relatively lightweight, after all. But require a new port, and Enterprises have Processes that must be followed. I am not 100% sure, but I think you can get around that by putting pgPool or pgBouncer in front and make all

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Ravi Krishna (sravikris...@comcast.net) wrote: > > Eh, that's something that I think we should be looking at supporting, by > > using FDWs, but I haven't tried to figure out how hard it'd be. > > How good will that be in performance. > > In db2 you can do it using dblinks and that

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

> > Eh, that's something that I think we should be looking at supporting, by > using FDWs, but I haven't tried to figure out how hard it'd be. > How good will that be in performance. In db2 you can do it using dblinks and that kills performance. isn't FDW something like dblink. The cool

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

> On Jun 2, 2020, at 13:30, Stephen Frost wrote: > > Eh, that's something that I think we should be looking at supporting, by > using FDWs, but I haven't tried to figure out how hard it'd be. Being able to access a FDW that way would rock. -- -- Christophe Pettus x...@thebuild.com

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Ravi Krishna (sravikris...@comcast.net) wrote: > > Generally speaking, I discourage having lots of databases under one PG > > cluster for exactly these kinds of reasons. PG's individual clusters > > are relatively lightweight, after all. > > Plus PG does not directly support cross

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Jun 2, 2020, at 12:45 , Ravi Krishna wrote: > >> >> >> Generally speaking, I discourage having lots of databases under one PG >> cluster for exactly these kinds of reasons. PG's individual clusters >> are relatively lightweight, after all. >> > > Plus PG does not directly support cross

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

> > Generally speaking, I discourage having lots of databases under one PG > cluster for exactly these kinds of reasons. PG's individual clusters > are relatively lightweight, after all. > Plus PG does not directly support cross database queries using 3 part name, something sqlserver excels

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/2/20 1:56 PM, Tim Clarke wrote: On 02/06/2020 19:43, Stephen Frost wrote: But require a new port, and Enterprises have Processes that must be followed. Sure they do. Automate them. :) Thanks, Stephen +1 for automation, isoX != slow It is when FW rules must be manually approved (and

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 02/06/2020 19:43, Stephen Frost wrote: >> But require a new port, and Enterprises have Processes that must be followed. > Sure they do. Automate them. > > :) > > Thanks, > > Stephen +1 for automation, isoX != slow Tim Clarke MBCS IT Director Direct: +44 (0)1376 504510 | Mobile: +44 (0)7887

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Ron (ronljohnso...@gmail.com) wrote: > On 6/2/20 1:30 PM, Stephen Frost wrote: > >* Ron (ronljohnso...@gmail.com) wrote: > >>On 6/2/20 4:59 AM, Grigory Smolkin wrote: > >>>On 6/2/20 11:22 AM, Ron wrote: > The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database >

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/2/20 1:30 PM, Stephen Frost wrote: Greetings, * Ron (ronljohnso...@gmail.com) wrote: On 6/2/20 4:59 AM, Grigory Smolkin wrote: On 6/2/20 11:22 AM, Ron wrote: The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental --

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Greetings, * Ron (ronljohnso...@gmail.com) wrote: > On 6/2/20 4:59 AM, Grigory Smolkin wrote: > >On 6/2/20 11:22 AM, Ron wrote: > >>The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database > >>in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental -- missing feature > >>(never to be

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/2/20 4:59 AM, Grigory Smolkin wrote: On 6/2/20 11:22 AM, Ron wrote: The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental -- missing feature (never to be implemented because of the fundamental design). It is

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/2/20 3:27 AM, Tim Clarke wrote: On 02/06/2020 09:22, Ron wrote: The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental -- missing feature (never to be implemented because of the fundamental design). In SQL Server,

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

I spent about 10 years as an Oracle DBA (back around Oracle 7 and 8) and the last 20 or so years doing PostgreSQL. My initial impressions were that Oracle did a better job providing tools and options that users and DBAs need and PostgreSQL was pretty much roll-your-own. Things like being able to

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 02/06/2020 09:22, Ron wrote: The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a single database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental -- missing feature (never to be implemented because of the fundamental design). In SQL Server, it's trivial to restore -- including

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/2/20 11:22 AM, Ron wrote: The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental -- missing feature (never to be implemented because of the fundamental design). It is possible via 3rd party tools like pg_probackup and

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On 6/1/20 4:58 AM, Peter J. Holzer wrote: [snip] As a developer (and part time DBA) I have a hard time thinking of any Oracle feature that I'm missing in PostgreSQL. The inability to do a point-in-time restoration of a *single* database in a multi-db cluster is a serious -- and fundamental --

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Mon, Jun 01, 2020 at 12:36:14PM +0700, Stefan Knecht wrote: > The rubber duck barely tells you how and why it floats It sure doesn't spoonfeed but it certainly does tell us *exactly* how and why it floats. https://www.postgresql.org/docs/devel/install-getsource.html Best, Karsten --

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Oracle is losing market share consistently and irreversibly for the last 4-5 yrs. It is not due to migration to open source RDBMS, but also due to the fact that now there are many alternatives to RDBMS for data storage. Until about 10-15 yrs back, if the application has to store data, then

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

First I have to state that I have used Oracle mostly from 8.x to 10.x and I have little experience with 11 and 12 and none with current versions. So I'm comparing Oracle from 10 years ago with current PostgreSQL, which isn't fair. On 2020-06-01 12:36:14 +0700, Stefan Knecht wrote: > Comparing

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Stefan Knecht schrieb am 01.06.2020 um 07:36: Oracle is also the single most feature-rich database out there - the feature set of Postgres isn't even 1% of what Oracle has. I try to stay out of discussions like this, but the above is simply not true. Oracle indeed has more features but 1% is

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Stefan, > On 01. Jun, 2020, at 07:36, Stefan Knecht wrote: > > Okay I'll bite. > > Comparing Postgres with Oracle is a bit like comparing a rubber duck you > might buy your three year old, with a 30 ton super tanker. yes, and no. You are right about Oracle having gazillions of

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

On Sat, May 30, 2020 at 5:51 PM Paul Förster wrote: > Hi, > > I know, this list is not for this, but I just couldn't resist. Please > forgive me. > > Being an Oracle DBA for two decades now (back then starting with Oracle > 8.0.5) and only doing PostgreSQL since version 10.3, I feel compelled to

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Stefan, > On 01. Jun, 2020, at 00:35, Stefan Keller wrote: > Paul Förster wrote: >> Also, I like the idea of global container/cluster-wide views such as >> CDB_TABLES, etc., >> a thing which I definitely and seriously miss about PostgreSQL. > > Can you specify little more: What's the use

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Okay I'll bite. Comparing Postgres with Oracle is a bit like comparing a rubber duck you might buy your three year old, with a 30 ton super tanker. Do they both float? Yeah, but that's about the only similarity. The rubber duck barely tells you how and why it floats, but the super tanker is

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Paul Paul Förster wrote: > Also, I like the idea of global container/cluster-wide views such as > CDB_TABLES, etc., > a thing which I definitely and seriously miss about PostgreSQL. Can you specify little more: What's the use case for this (assuming you know dblink and postgres_fdw)?

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Tim, > On 31. May, 2020, at 15:26, Tim Cross wrote: > P.S. for moving Oracle databases, we use to just use sed and change the > paths in the control file. Worked remarkably well. Often used this > technique to 'refresh' our dev or testing systems to current prod data. it works well if the

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Paul Förster writes: > and then, some day, a developer approaches a DBA with a query which is > generated and, if printed out in a 11pt. sized font, can fill a billboard on > a street, to optimize it or search for what's wrong with it, or why it > performs so slow... That's usually when I

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Hi Tim, > On 30. May, 2020, at 23:14, Tim Cross wrote: > I didn't encounter the bugs you seem to have unless I wondered off into their > 'add-ons'. use Oracle Text for example and you'll sooner or later run into severe bugs. My current favorite is ORA-20084 which bugs me for almost a year

Re: Oracle vs. PostgreSQL - a comment

Paul Förster writes: > Hi, > > I know, this list is not for this, but I just couldn't resist. Please forgive > me. > > Being an Oracle DBA for two decades now (back then starting with Oracle > 8.0.5) and only doing PostgreSQL since version 10.3, I feel compelled to > share some of my