Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
> > Yes, I believe so. Isn't that what "To that end, we have established this Code > of Conduct for community interaction and participation in the project’s > work and the community at large." basically says? > No? What's the "community at large"? To me that sounds like "all interactions" whether

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
> To many of us, we absolutely are a community. Remember, there are people > here who have been around for 20+ years, of which many have become close > friends, having started working on PostgreSQL as a hobby. We have always > seen the project as a community of like-minded technologists, and

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
Yes. They can. The people who make the majority of the contributions to the > software can decide what happens, because without them there is no > software. If you want to spend 20 years of your life > So everyone who moderates this group and that will be part of the CoC committee will have had

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
> Community is people who joined it We're not a "community." We're people using email to get help with or discuss technical aspects of PostgreSQL. The types of discussions that would normally be held within a "community" would be entirely off-topic here. We should be professional to each other

Fwd: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
I didn't realize they had replied personally to me. -- Forwarded message -- From: James Keener Date: Fri, Sep 14, 2018 at 10:43 AM Subject: Re: Code of Conduct plan To: Dave Page If that business is publicly bringing the project into disrepute, or > harassing other commun

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
> > And if you believe strongly that a given statement you may have made is > not objectionable...you should be willing to defend it in an adjudication > investigation. So because someone doesn't like what I say in a venue 100% separate from postgres, I have to subject myself, and waste my

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
I understand the concern, however, if you look at how attacks happen > it is frequently through other sites. Specifically under/poorly > moderated sites. For specific examples, people who have issues with > people on Quora will frequently go after them on Facebook and Twitter. > > these aren't a

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
> Now, you may say that (2) would be rejected by the committee, but I would >> counter that it's still a stain on me and something that will forever >> appear >> along side my name in search results and that the amount of time and >> stress it'd take me to defend myself would make my voluntarily

Re: Code of Conduct plan

2018-09-14 Thread James Keener
I find a lot of neo-con/trumpian political stances moronic, short-sighted, and anti-intellectual and therefore consider them offensive, an affront on my way of life, and a stain on my country. 1) Can I report anyone holding such views and discussing them on a 3rd party forum? 2) Could I be

Re: Code of Conduct

2018-09-18 Thread James Keener
> > You may dislike the outcome, but it was not ignored. I can accept that I don't like the outcome, but I can point to maybe a dozen people in the last exchange worried about the CoC being used to further political goals, and the only response was "well, the CoC Committee will handle it

Re: Code of Conduct

2018-09-18 Thread James Keener
> following a long consultation process It's not a consultation if any dissenting voice is simply ignored. Don't sugar-coat or politicize it like this -- it was rammed down everyone's throats. That is core's right, but don't act as everyone's opinions and concerns were taken into