Tom Lane wrote:
We did do that (not very rigorously) during the 7.4 release cycle.
I'm not sure why we fell out of the habit again for 8.0. It seems
like a reasonable idea to me.
In the past I have suggested incrementally maintaining release.sgml (or
some plaintext version of it), rather than
On T, 2005-05-17 at 00:42 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
David Fetter [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
What's the next step?
I suppose the first thing would be to look over the patches I
mentioned and the SQL:2003 specification, then put together a
preliminary patch and send it to -hackers.
...
I
Tom, Juan,
Wouldn't this simple SQL do the trick?
CREATE OR REPLACE FUNCTION pk_column(text) RETURNS SETOF text
AS '
SELECT attname::text
FROM pg_class, pg_constraint, pg_attribute
WHERE pg_class.oid = conrelid
AND contype=''p''
AND attrelid = pg_class.oid
On T, 2005-05-17 at 01:32 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
As against that I notice some new arrivals proposing to add deductive
reasoning to Postgres:
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-hackers/2005-05/msg01045.php
or implement SQL99 hierarchical queries:
I think it might also be valuable to have a list of things that are good
'starter projects'. Maybe some indication of TODO items that are
simpler. Possibly a list of bugs, too.
As someone who has looked at hacking the pg code, I agree it is difficult to
know what to look at to get started.
On Tue, May 17, 2005 at 09:23:42PM +1000, Russell Smith wrote:
I think it might also be valuable to have a list of things that are good
'starter projects'. Maybe some indication of TODO items that are
simpler. Possibly a list of bugs, too.
As someone who has looked at hacking the pg code,
(BI tested crctest in two machines and two versions of gcc.
(B
(BUltraSPARC III, gcc 2.95.3:
(Bgcc -O1 crctest.c 1.321517 s
(Bgcc -O2 crctest.c 1.099186 s
(Bgcc -O3 crctest.c 1.099330 s
(Bgcc -O1 crctest64.c
David--
My boss has given me approval to put up to 8 hours per week of SourceLabs'
time in on the SQL99 hierarchical query implementation. (I'm free, of
course, to supplement this with whatever of my own time I can spare.) I'm
willing to take on the work. What's the next step?
--Jason
-Original Message-
From: Tom Lane [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Sent: 16 May 2005 17:36
To: Mark Cave-Ayland (External)
Cc: pgsql-hackers@postgresql.org
Subject: Re: [HACKERS] Cost of XLogInsert CRC calculations
(cut)
I did some experimentation and concluded that gcc is screwing
It would be useful to outline positions that are actually available for people
to take.
It's easy to give a general list. I've asked and seen may like it. For me,
what does
helping with advocacy mean? What should be performance tested (I assume new
code,
like the bitmap scan). But at the
Russell Smith wrote:
Maybe people shouldn't be hacking the code before being here a year.
If you want to code, jump in. It is a practical craft that you only
learn by doing. You might learn something of the people but you'll
probably learn precious little of the code by just watching.
But
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 01:32:03 -0400
As against that I notice some new arrivals proposing to add deductive
reasoning to Postgres:
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-hackers/2005-05/msg01045.php
or implement SQL99 hierarchical queries:
Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On T, 2005-05-17 at 00:42 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
I seem to recall some discussion of how to do this in the past;
have you trolled the pghackers archives?
I think that Jasons inspiration for doing it came from the the fact that
there are already now
Tom Lane wrote:
Hannu Krosing [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On T, 2005-05-17 at 00:42 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
I seem to recall some discussion of how to do this in the past;
have you trolled the pghackers archives?
I think that Jasons inspiration for doing it came from the the fact that
Can anyone explain what's going on with the slashes?
ssdb=# select version();
version
---
PostgreSQL 8.0.1 on sparc-sun-solaris2.9, compiled by GCC gcc (GCC)
3.4.2
(1 row)
ssdb=# select
Andrew Dunstan wrote:
Anyway, see
http://archives.postgresql.org/pgsql-patches/2005-05/msg00179.php
Sorry for the delay -- I'm on the final stretch of a major project at work.
No objections from me.
Joe
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 6: Have you
Russell,
What should be performance tested (I assume new code,
like the bitmap scan).
I've been meaning to put a task list for performance testing up on the
TestPerf project. Yet another personal TODO ...
--
Josh Berkus
Aglio Database Solutions
San Francisco
I don't see anything broken. V 7.4.8 shows the same:
andrew=# select ARRAY['\\a'] as f1, ARRAY['\a']as f2 , ARRAY['\\\a'] as f2;
f1| f2 | f2
+-+-
{\\a} | {a} | {\\a}
It might be mildly confusing because '\a' == 'a'
cheers
andrew
Rod Taylor wrote:
Can anyone
On Mon, 16 May 2005, Tom Lane wrote:
I did some experimentation and concluded that gcc is screwing up
big-time on optimizing the CRC64 code for 32-bit Intel. It does much
better on every other architecture though.
Anyone want to try it with non-gcc compilers?
Solaris 9 x86 - Sun
On Tue, 2005-05-17 at 13:18 -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote:
I don't see anything broken. V 7.4.8 shows the same:
How the heck do you store a single backslash in an text array?
andrew=# select ARRAY['\\a'] as f1, ARRAY['\a']as f2 , ARRAY['\\\a'] as f2;
f1| f2 | f2
As someone who's been lurking on the postgres lists for quite some
time, and submitted one (minor) patch, I think the notion of an
entry-level task list for we beginners is fantastic.
And, I'm sure this has been asked and answered a billion times
already, but why *don't* we have a real bug
Rod Taylor [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Tue, 2005-05-17 at 13:18 -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote:
I don't see anything broken. V 7.4.8 shows the same:
How the heck do you store a single backslash in an text array?
You just did. array_out doubles the backslashes again, though.
regression=#
How the heck do you store a single backslash in an text array?
... array_out doubles the backslashes again, though.
That explains how I got confused.
regression=# select ARRAY['\\a'];
array
-
{\\a}
(1 row)
regression=# select (ARRAY['\\a'])[1];
array
---
\a
(1
On Wed, 18 May 2005, Brendan Jurd wrote:
As someone who's been lurking on the postgres lists for quite some
time, and submitted one (minor) patch, I think the notion of an
entry-level task list for we beginners is fantastic.
And, I'm sure this has been asked and answered a billion times
already,
Rod Taylor wrote:
On Tue, 2005-05-17 at 13:18 -0400, Andrew Dunstan wrote:
I don't see anything broken. V 7.4.8 shows the same:
How the heck do you store a single backslash in an text array?
Well, in v 8.0 I use dollar quoting :-)
select ARRAY[$\$];
But as Tom says the text output
Marc G. Fournier wrote:
And, I'm sure this has been asked and answered a billion times
already, but why *don't* we have a real bug tracking system?
Because none of the core developers will use it, so bugs would be
added, but never removed ...
Last time it came up I thought the problem was that
On Tue, 17 May 2005, Andrew Dunstan wrote:
Last time it came up I thought the problem was that there was not a
consensus on *which* bugtracker to use.
The key requirement that has always come up is that the core developers
wouldn't use anything web based, so the tracker would have to somehow tie
Andrew Dunstan [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Try attached ... season to taste. The bulk of it is changes for dblink
which has the dbname hardcoded.
There is probably more to be done with the regression stuff, but this
and the earlier change give us the low hanging fruit at least, I think.
Andrew,
Last time it came up I thought the problem was that there was not a
consensus on *which* bugtracker to use.
Or whether to use one.Roughly 1/3 bugzilla, 1/3 something else, and 1/3
don't want a bugtracker. And, among the people who didn't want bugzilla,
some were vehemently
Incidentally, I'm not advocating we use bugzilla (if anything I think
I'd lean towards using RT), but this seems like a good opportunity to
note that as of a week or two ago bugzilla's HEAD branch supports using
PostgreSQL as its backing store, and this will be maintained.
One of the things
On 5/18/05, Marc G. Fournier [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The key requirement that has always come up is that the core developers
wouldn't use anything web based, so the tracker would have to somehow tie
into the mailing lists themselves ...
What's the basis of this objection to a web-based
What's the basis of this objection to a web-based dev management
system? Seems like web-based makes plenty of sense for a physically
disparate development community like this one.
I can't speak for the people who don't like web based but my guess is
that the web is not their primary medium of
Joshua D. Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
It also seems that, once you get it up and running, any worthwhile dev
management system is going to actually take less time / effort to
maintain than, say, maintaining manually concocted todo lists and
coordinating development via a mailing list.
Brendan Jurd wrote:
What's the basis of this objection to a web-based dev management
system? Seems like web-based makes plenty of sense for a physically
disparate development community like this one.
Brendan,
please review the past versions of this thread.
For example, see here:
On Mon, 16 May 2005 12:35:35 -0400, Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Anyone want to try it with non-gcc compilers?
MS VC++ 6.0 with various predefined optimizer settings
2x3264
Default (without any /O) 0.828125 0.906250
MinSize (contains /O1)
On Tue, 03 May 2005 02:45:09 -0400, Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
I'm starting to think
it'd be worth setting up a mechanism to handle such changes
automatically.
I've been using this skeleton for quite some time now. Magnus'
psql ... | while read D
might be more robust than my
On Mon, 16 May 2005 20:54:15 -0400 (EDT), Bruce Momjian
pgman@candle.pha.pa.us wrote:
I have modifed the TODO HTML so the completed items are in italics.
Isn't it a bit misleading to have those items on the TODO list at all?
Shouldn't there be a separate list: DONE for the next release?
Servus
I am trying to compile PostgreSQL 8.0.3/tsearch2 contrib module on AIX 5.2 ML 3
gcc version 3.3.2
GNU Make 3.80
bash-2.05b# gmake
gcc -O2 -Wall -Wmissing-prototypes -Wpointer-arith -Wendif-labels
-fno-strict-aliasing -I./snowball -I./ispell -I./wordparser -I.
-I../../src/include -c -o
On 5/18/05, Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The Postgres project has been exceedingly successful while using email
lists as the primary means of communication/organization. I for one
am disinclined to tinker with such a fundamental aspect of the way that
the community operates. If we try
On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:45:00 -0300 (ADT), Marc G. Fournier
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Also, how many 'bugs' have we seen go through the lists that someone
hasn't jump'd on and fixed in a couple of days?
Just imagine our marketing crew being able to say: According to our
great bug tracking system
Manfred,
Just imagine our marketing crew being able to say: According to our
great bug tracking system NN serious bugs have been reported last year,
98% of which have been fixed within three days.
grin You're not going to win over many people on *this* list with marketing
arguments.
--
Brendan Jurd wrote:
In the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I would be
willing to enlist in the housekeeping effort for this hypothetical new
system.
It's a nice offer, but honestly, my experience in the commercial world
as well as in FOSS tells me that a bug tracking system
On Tue, 17 May 2005 14:29:49 -0700, Josh Berkus josh@agliodbs.com
wrote:
grin You're not going to win over many people on *this* list with marketing
arguments.
Yeah, that's the problem with *my* learning curve ...
Servus
Manfred
---(end of
* Brendan Jurd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
In the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I would be
willing to enlist in the housekeeping effort for this hypothetical new
system.
If you're willing to create it, host it, update it and keep it current,
and feel it'd be so worthwhile to
* Joshua D. Drake ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
One of the things which came out of the bugtracker discussion is that
anything we use must have the ability for developers to interact 100% by
e-mail, as some critical developers will not use a web interface.
Request Tracker (RT) can do that. We
On 5/18/05, Stephen Frost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
* Brendan Jurd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
In the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I would be
willing to enlist in the housekeeping effort for this hypothetical new
system.
If you're willing to create it, host it, update
On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 08:04:51AM +1000, Brendan Jurd wrote:
On 5/18/05, Stephen Frost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
* Brendan Jurd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
In the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I would be
willing to enlist in the housekeeping effort for this hypothetical
I don't think Stephen was being sarcastic. Such a system would need an
enormous bootstrap effort. Once it's in place, and having shown its
usefulness, maybe the community would start using it.
(Of course no one can make promises on that other than for himself.)
Well sorry but that is
* Brendan Jurd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
I'm detecting sarcasm here, but just in case you're being serious ...
Yeah, for the most part I *was* being quite serious.
For such a tool to serve its intended purpose, the postgres community
needs to be, to a certain extent, agreed on and aware of
Manfred Koizar wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2005 12:35:35 -0400, Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
Anyone want to try it with non-gcc compilers?
MS VC++ 6.0 with various predefined optimizer settings
2x3264
Default (without any /O) 0.828125 0.906250
On Tue, May 17, 2005 at 06:25:16PM -0400, Alvaro Herrera wrote:
On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 08:04:51AM +1000, Brendan Jurd wrote:
On 5/18/05, Stephen Frost [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
* Brendan Jurd ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) wrote:
In the interests of putting my money where my mouth is, I would be
On Tue, May 17, 2005 at 03:30:28PM -0700, Joshua D. Drake wrote:
I don't think Stephen was being sarcastic. Such a system would need an
enormous bootstrap effort. Once it's in place, and having shown its
usefulness, maybe the community would start using it.
(Of course no one can make
Manfred Koizar wrote:
On Mon, 16 May 2005 20:54:15 -0400 (EDT), Bruce Momjian
pgman@candle.pha.pa.us wrote:
I have modifed the TODO HTML so the completed items are in italics.
Isn't it a bit misleading to have those items on the TODO list at all?
Shouldn't there be a separate list: DONE
This isn't something that is going to serve the person who loose all the
sleep to configure and maintain it. It is something that is going to
help the PostgreSQL community has a whole, to grow in a reasonably
organized and hopefully less painful way.
Maybe I didn't express myself properly. I
On Wed, 18 May 2005 04:31 am, Josh Berkus wrote:
Andrew,
Last time it came up I thought the problem was that there was not a
consensus on *which* bugtracker to use.
Or whether to use one.Roughly 1/3 bugzilla, 1/3 something else, and 1/3
don't want a bugtracker. And, among the
On 5/18/05, Joshua D. Drake [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
O.k. then I misunderstood and apologize. I think the above is
reasonable. I wouldn't think that the main developers would stop
developing to create this system, nor would I want them to take time
away from development to implement it.
I
Russell Smith wrote:
One of the things which came out of the bugtracker discussion is that anything
we use must have the ability for developers to interact 100% by e-mail, as
some critical developers will not use a web interface.
Doesn't pgfoundry offer this? If not in 3.3, I'm sure it's
Dnia 13-05-2005, pi o godzinie 16:01 -0700, Sergey Ten napisa(a):
?xml version='1.0'?
table
row
col name='col1' null='n'Jackson, Sam/col
col name='col2' null='n'\h/col
/row
row
col name='col1' null='n'It is quot;perfectquot;./col
Brendan Jurd wrote:
What's the basis of this objection to a web-based dev management
system?
Beyond the core developers want to stick to email, I think there is a
good reason that we should stick primarily to email for project
management: Bugzilla and similar systems are point to point, whereas
discuss it, and contribute to resolving it. More often than not, a
web-based interface like Bugzilla leads to a single bug master, who
does most of this work by themselves. Besides the fact we don't have
such a person, it would also mean that knowledge of bugs/patches and the
discussion about
Joshua D. Drake wrote:
You can even respond to specific messages within the thread instead of
just a top down (one email after the other).
Well, that seems pretty fundamental...
But the point is that the current system works well;
Well does it though? I am not saying it is bad, well yes I am ;).
It also seems that, once you get it up and running, any worthwhile dev
management system is going to actually take less time / effort to
maintain than, say, maintaining manually concocted todo lists and
coordinating development via a mailing list.
Call me a normaliser, but even if the maintenance
Sergey Ten wrote:
After a careful consideration we decided to
- put XML implementation in the backend
What advantage does putting the XML output mode in the backend provide?
-Neil
---(end of broadcast)---
TIP 8: explain analyze is your friend
Bruce Momjian pgman@candle.pha.pa.us writes:
I don't understand why we are testing 64-bit CRC when I thought we
agreed that 32-bit was good enough for our purposes.
Well, we need to understand exactly what is going on here. I'd not
like to think that we dropped back from 64 to 32 bit because
Mag Gam [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
I am trying to compile PostgreSQL 8.0.3/tsearch2 contrib module on AIX 5.2 ML
3
/opt/freeware/lib/gcc-lib/powerpc-ibm-aix5.2.0.0/3.3.2/include/stdio.h:484:
error: conflicting types for `fgetpos64'
Neil Conway wrote:
Joshua D. Drake wrote:
You can even respond to specific messages within the thread instead of
just a top down (one email after the other).
Well, that seems pretty fundamental...
But the point is that the current system works well;
Well does it though? I am not
Tom Lane wrote:
Bruce Momjian pgman@candle.pha.pa.us writes:
I don't understand why we are testing 64-bit CRC when I thought we
agreed that 32-bit was good enough for our purposes.
Well, we need to understand exactly what is going on here. I'd not
like to think that we dropped back from
Neil Conway [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Beyond the core developers want to stick to email, I think there is a
good reason that we should stick primarily to email for project
management: Bugzilla and similar systems are point to point, whereas a
mailing list is multicast[1].
That seems to me
Steve Atkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
The useful bug tracking systems I've used have also included QA. Any
bug submitted doesn't get accepted without a standalone test case.
Side note: while test cases are certainly Good Things that make life
easier for developers, so we should encourage
Tom Lane wrote:
Neil Conway [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Beyond the core developers want to stick to email, I think there is a
good reason that we should stick primarily to email for project
management: Bugzilla and similar systems are point to point, whereas a
mailing list is
Bruce Momjian pgman@candle.pha.pa.us writes:
Tom Lane wrote:
Well, we need to understand exactly what is going on here. I'd not
like to think that we dropped back from 64 to 32 bit because of one
possibly-minor optimization bug in one compiler on one platform.
Even if that compiler+platform
On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 12:07:14AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
Steve Atkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
The useful bug tracking systems I've used have also included QA. Any
bug submitted doesn't get accepted without a standalone test case.
Side note: while test cases are certainly Good Things
I probably shouldn't jump in, because I do not know the nature of the
usage of the CRC values.
But if the birthday paradox can come into play, with a 32 bit CRC, you
will get one false mismatch every 78,643 items or so.
http://mathworld.wolfram.com/BirthdayProblem.html
Probably you already knew
Steve Atkins [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Wed, May 18, 2005 at 12:07:14AM -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
It's not all that easy to make a test case for bugs involving concurrent
behavior. I'd go so far as to say that most of the seriously
interesting bugs that I've dealt with in this project were
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Do we know that? The results I showed put at least one fundamentally
32bit platform (the PowerBook I'm typing this on) at dead par for 32bit
and 64bit CRCs.
Wait, par for 32-bit CRCs? Or for 64-bit CRCs calculated using 32-bit ints?
--
greg
Greg Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Do we know that? The results I showed put at least one fundamentally
32bit platform (the PowerBook I'm typing this on) at dead par for 32bit
and 64bit CRCs.
Wait, par for 32-bit CRCs? Or for 64-bit CRCs calculated
On Mon, 2005-05-16 at 14:35 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
Jeffrey W. Baker [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
On Mon, 2005-05-16 at 09:53 -0400, Tom Lane wrote:
This is a fallacy, and I think your concern is largely mistaken. Have
you experimented with the cases you are worried about?
Perhaps I have
Tom Lane wrote:
Greg Stark [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Tom Lane [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Do we know that? The results I showed put at least one fundamentally
32bit platform (the PowerBook I'm typing this on) at dead par for 32bit
and 64bit CRCs.
Wait, par for 32-bit CRCs? Or for
Dann Corbit [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Probably you already knew that, and probably the birthday paradox does
not apply.
I generally use 64 bit CRCs (UMAC) for just about anything that needs a
CRC.
http://www.cs.ucdavis.edu/~rogaway/umac/
The birthday paradox doesn't come up here. The CRC
79 matches
Mail list logo
