> I don't think the downstream dependencies will let that work without
> rebuilding them as well. The drop fails (without a cascade), and the other
> views and matviews that are built off of this all simply point to x_old.
Wow, ouch. Yeah, I'd neglected to consider dependent objects. Your
only
> I'm curious if I'm overlooking other possible architectures or tools that
> might make this simpler to manage.
One of the issues with materialized views is that they are based on
views... For a concurrent update, it essentially performs a looped
merge, which can be pretty ugly. That's the
hin a
database, for example, you might be getting 100x less throughput than
you could otherwise attain. If it's not proprietary in some way, or
you can obfuscate it into a test case, we can probably help then. As
it stands, there isn't enough to go on.
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h
, because this seems incredibly
wrong. I'll keep digging.
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t they're not exceptionally
useful anymore. :)
As a side note, using INSERT instead scales almost exactly linearly.
This would be useful, except that INSERT is already at least a
magnitude slower than COPY. Hah.
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of locking improvements, so it might not be
relevant. I just haven't gotten a chance to repeat my tests with 9.5 just
yet.
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ot; &>/dev/null &
psql -c "COPY test_copy2 FROM '/tmp/loadtest1.csv'" &>/dev/null &
psql -c "COPY test_copy3 FROM '/tmp/loadtest1.csv'" &>/dev/null &
psql -c "COPY test_copy4 FROM '/tmp/loadtest1.csv'" &>/dev/null &
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Alexey,
The issue is that the 1/4 memory suggestion hasn't been a recommendation in
quite a while. Now that much larger amounts of RAM are readily available, tests
have been finding out that more than 8GB of RAM in shared_buffers has
diminishing or even worse returns. This is true for any
Alexey,
The issue is not that 8GB is the maximum. You *can* set it higher. What I'm
saying, and I'm not alone in this, is that setting it higher can actually
decrease performance for various reasons. Setting it to 25% of memory on a
system with 512GB of RAM for instance, would be tantamount to
Yeah, pgTune is pretty badly out of date. It's been on my TODO list, as
I'm sure it has been on Greg's.
Yeah. And unfortunately the recommendations it gives have been spreading. Take
a look at the online version:
http://pgtune.leopard.in.ua/
I entered a pretty typical 92GB system, and it
+, but the worst
of the behavior was solved before that.
Bugs in kernel cache page aging algorithms are bad, m'kay?
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of results in a few milliseconds.
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-9.2 systems
encountered high CPU counts. I somehow doubt Intel would allow their HT
architecture to regress so badly from Nehalem, which is almost
3-generations old at this point. This smells like something in the
software stack, up to and including the Linux kernel.
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to disable power saving features.
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/docs/9.0/static/sql-explain.html
You should still consider upgrading to the latest release of 9.0 too.
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to dig deeper.
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in that case, depending on how high
random_page_cost is.
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clause and see if the planner still goes for the
terrible plan. If it does, that would seem like an obvious planner tweak
to me.
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are performing badly, and so on.
Please refer to this page to ask performance related questions:
https://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Slow_Query_Questions
Without much of this information, we'd only be speculating.
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312
are throwing off your performance. Of
course, I can't confirm that without EXPLAIN output.
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the 3.11 instead. The 3.2 kernel is pants-on-head
retarded; we've had a lot more luck with 3.8 and above.
Cheers!
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of the table. I highly recommend reading
up on cardinality and selectivity before creating more indexes. This
page in the documentation does a really good job:
http://www.postgresql.org/docs/9.3/static/row-estimation-examples.html
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). It can
be kinda safe-ish if mounted in sync mode with caching disabled, but I'd
never use it on any of our systems.
We also have this in the Wiki:
http://wiki.postgresql.org/wiki/Shared_Storage
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issue on Linux systems with large amounts of RAM.
Most VM servers fit that profile, so I'm not surprised it's hurting you.
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. This will
pretty much never be fast, especially with 2M rows involved.
I could be wrong about this, and the back-end folks might have a different
answer, but I wouldn't hold my breath.
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stho
On most machines the limit is higher than you'd ever want to set it. I
have a set of servers with 1TB RAM and shared buffers on them is set
to 10G and even that is probably higher than it needs to be. The old
1/4 of memory advice comes from the days when db server memory
was in the 1 to 16GB
. Optimization fences are truly
forever. Unless of course they're removed. In which case, a bunch of
queries that exploited them will suddenly perform a whole lot worse,
causing organizations to delay upgrading PostgreSQL.
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What are your thoughts on the right way to use SSDs in a RAID to
enhance postgres I/O performance? In an earlier reply, you
indicated one of a RAID1+0 consisting of several spindles,
NVRAM-based solution (SSD or PCIe card), or a SAN
Well, it's a tiered approach. If you can identify your
theoretically, you might actually see some benefit there. If it were me
and I had spindles available, I would just increase the overall size of
the pool. It's a lot easier than managing multiple tablespaces.
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. There are also a ton of considerations regarding new
Linux kernel settings.
Greg, go tell Packt they need to pay you to write the second edition. ;)
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of disks for a workload of this volume. The amount of
writes here will constantly degrade read IO and further increase fetch
times.
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with 240GB.
Of course, don't forget to buy modules in multiples of four, otherwise
you're not taking advantage of all the CPU's memory channels. :)
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of the insert.
WITH saved AS (
INSERT INTO dst
SELECT * FROM src WHERE ...
RETURNING *
)
DELETE FROM src
WHERE ...;
I'll admit yours is cleaner, though. :)
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was probably running mostly from memory, while the '-s
4000' did not.
What you're seeing is the speed your records are being supplied from
disk, plus whatever cache effects are there when records are read before
they are flushed in favor of more recent data.
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, including associated article content.
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meaningful feedback if you follow the herd. :)
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that the dead tuples are still in the table, but reusable.
The free_space column and free_percent is a better description of table
bloat from data turnover cleaned up by autovacuum.
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stho
) of our ancient gen-1 cards.
Too many variables. -_-
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into all of your
queries from now on.
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detrimental to query execution.
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provolatile = 'i'
WHERE proname = 'date_in';
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on the tables we're partitioning without too much work and QA.
Thanks, Tom!
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not zero. With about a dozen of them, query times
increase from 0.130ms to 0.280ms for my test case. Not a lot in the long
run, but in a OLTP system, it can be fairly noticeable.
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stho
, but I need to see the limits of how
badly I can abuse the database.
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* 1.29PB written
* 1.75PB read
The load on our system right now is 3.7 on a 24 CPU box while serving
4100 TPS after active trading hours. The FusionIO drive is basically the
only reason we can do all of that without a lot of excessive contortions.
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, and we were getting some really bad query plans unless we
*strongly* suggested RPC was cheap. I was afraid I'd have to go lower,
but 1 seemed to do the trick.
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between in a
heavy transactional setting. Having used NVRAM/SSDs, I could never go
back so long as the budget allows us to procure them.
A data warehouse? Maybe spindles still have a place there. Heavy
transactional system? Not a chance.
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, which
suggests a firmware issue.
Often this is because the device was optimized for sequential reads and
post lower IOPS than is theoretically possible so they can advertise
higher numbers alongside consumer-grade disks. They're Greg's disks
though. :)
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into performance problems with a (relatively inexpensive) setup like this.
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by a factor of 1000, which is the actual problem.
The other reason I tried the combined index was that there was some
noise a while back about having the planner check for possible column
correlations on composite indexes. Clearly that ended up not being the
case, but it was worth examination.
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to comment?
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this with functional indexes. It would
definitely be nice to override the stats with known correlations when
possible.
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work and you want a quick, but ugly fix
for this, you can create the following index:
CREATE INDEX event_20130406_id_desc_tstamp_utc_idx
ON event_20130406 (id DESC, tstamp_utc);
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stho
that are new, and could assist in setting up streaming or backups:
wal_level
max_wal_senders
People are getting more and more vocal about increasing cpu_tuple_cost,
as the default is apparently too low in practice.
Everything else? Salt to taste.
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autogrouping and increasing sched_migration_cost. If the completely fair
scheduler has less locking contention with this patch-set, those tweaks
may not even be necessary. I need to see if I can find a system to test on.
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to work
without major adverse effects. Apparently the tiny table really will be
tiny in actual use, so impact should be minimal.
I just really don't like using subselects that way. :)
Thanks, Tom!
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stho
into this, too. You settled on
a much higher setting than we did, but the end result was the same. I
wonder how prevalent this will become as more servers are switched over
to newer kernels in the next couple of years. Hopefully more people
start complaining so they fix it. :)
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with the
Completely Fair Scheduler, as opposed to the O(1) scheduler. For all
intents and purposes, this means 3.0 kernels and above.
With a 2.6 kernel, you're fine.
Effectively these changes fix what is basically a performance regression
compared to older kernels.
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or combined with Linux terms is tremendously unhelpful.
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actually *isn't* talking out of his ass is free to interject. :)
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.
I just figured I'd share, since we found this info so beneficial.
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frankly, I find it difficult to believe.
If legit, high-connection systems would benefit greatly.
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performance and
inflated CPU usage are quite another.
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100
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. I haven't checked 3.0, but other threads
I've read suggest it had less problems. Sorry if I wasn't clear.
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still curious why only recent 3.2's cause it, but 3.4 don't. That's
mighty odd.
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. Increase that to a few hundred, and my TPS drops down to
30k. Simply having the clients there kills performance.
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should have added:
sudo chown -R postgres:postgres /ssd/pg_xlog/*
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write stream happening we're not privy to.
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of info on what the CPU is doing. You want that
%iowait column to be as low as possible.
Keep us updated.
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by reducing shared_buffers to 4GB.
Without as many reads, your writes should be much less disruptive.
You'll need to restart PG to adopt that change.
But I encourage you to keep iostat running in a terminal window so you
can watch it for a while. It's very revealing.
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, or that nailing down load calculations went
awry since the NOHZ stuff started, or both. At this point, I wish we'd
stayed on CentOS.
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prove beneficial.
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RAID.
Is the only way out of this really a SSD disk?
No. There are many, many steps you can and should take before going this
route. You need to know the problem you're solving before making
potentially expensive hardware decisions.
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to commit in some cases, which basically stops all write traffic
to your database entirely.
That should get you going, anyway. You still need more/better disks so
you can move your pg_xlog directory. With your write load, that will
make a huge difference.
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of the master does it?
Only if you're using synchronous replication. From what I saw in the
config, that isn't the case.
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they work.
But I'd be more than willing to modify my syntax one way or the other to
adopt non-materialized CTEs, provided there's some way to get the
current behavior.
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perform about 40-50% better with HT
enabled. Not the 2x you might expect by doubling the amount of
processors, but it definitely didn't make things worse.
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indexes, though. They're not WAL
logged, so they can't be replicated, and they're also not crash safe.
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helpful to also see the actual CREATE TABLE, and CREATE
INDEX statements for those tables.
We can't help you with this limited information. Sorry.
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in their own private pool or something.
I mean... a pool is basically a proxy server. I don't have 12 individual
proxy servers for 12 webservers.
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until
EnterpriseDB sent us a patch. From browsing the threads, didn't someone
say a similar problem existed in PG core?
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if this particular tweak isn't more of a
regression than initially thought.
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preference for freeing memory from proc 0. It seems to only do it
on this node, so we're going to switch nodes soon and see if the problem
reappears. We may have to perform a node hardware audit if this persists.
Thanks for your input, though. :)
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to retirement. You're *six* major versions
behind the main release.
At the very least, you need to upgrade PostgreSQL from 8.1.17 to 8.1.23.
You're still on a version of PG that's almost 7-years old, but at least
you'd have the most recent patch level.
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to figure this out, so I figured I'd share.
Thanks, everyone!
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EDB server is doing the same thing on much beefier hardware and
correspondingly increased settings, which is what prompted me to test it
in plain PG.
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.
Or is there some embedded magic in streaming replication that requires
start/stop backup? I've never had problems starting slaves built from an
rsync before.
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so ridiculously optimistic with functional
indexes, even in the case of much higher selectivity as reported by
pg_stats on the named columns?
Thanks!
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) =
'2012-10-24 00:00:00'::timestamp without time zone)
Filter: (((col1)::text = 'S:96'::text) AND (col2 = 657::numeric))
Total runtime: 77.091 ms
All I have to say about that is: wat.
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On 10/24/2012 02:31 PM, Shaun Thomas wrote:
The main flaw with my example is that it's random. But I swear I'm not
making it up! :)
And then I find a way to make it non-random. Hooray:
CREATE TABLE date_test (
id SERIAL,
col1 varchar,
col2 numeric,
action_date TIMESTAMP WITHOUT TIME
this.
Yes, even if that answer is reboot. :)
Thanks again!
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: 24449 48036
So, I've got 14GB of RAM that the OS is just refusing to use for disk or
page cache. Does anyone know what might cause that?
Our uname -sir, for reference:
Linux 3.2.0-31-generic x86_64
--
Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444
-60% disk utilization that's mostly reads.
It's pretty aggressively keeping that 14GB free, and it's driving me
nuts. :)
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444-8534
stho...@optionshouse.com
__
See
18 20 22
node 0 size: 36853 MB
node 0 free: 13816 MB
node 1 cpus: 1 3 5 7 9 11 13 15 17 19 21 23
node 1 size: 36863 MB
node 1 free: 751 MB
node distances:
node 0 1
0: 10 20
1: 20 10
Looks like CPU 0 is hoarding memory. :(
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite
directly to any large block. With MySQL, it's not
uncommon to dedicate over 50% of RAM to the MySQL process itself, but I
don't often see PG systems with more than 8GB in shared_buffers.
All the rest should be available for random allocation in general. At
least, in theory.
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Shaun Thomas
if the
unallocated chunk shrinks.
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444-8534
stho...@optionshouse.com
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!
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444-8534
stho...@optionshouse.com
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Sent via pgsql-performance mailing list
On 10/19/2012 09:51 AM, Tom Lane wrote:
We've had tablespace-specific settings for those for some time.
Ah, my apologies. I didn't see any in the CREATE TABLESPACE page, and
didn't think to check ALTER TABLESPACE.
I withdraw my question. :)
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson
forgetting Postgres prefers a CREATE + ALTER style than
overloading every CREATE with all ALTER options. Though in my opinion
that just adds extra unnecessary steps.
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444-8534
stho...@optionshouse.com
upgrade, we've kept using our home-grown backup
system. :(
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Shaun Thomas
OptionsHouse | 141 W. Jackson Blvd. | Suite 500 | Chicago IL, 60604
312-444-8534
stho...@optionshouse.com
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