On Sunday, 07 April, 2013 12:31:27 PM Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Saturday, April 6, 2013 22:01:54 Matthew McKeen wrote:
I was thinking of taking on the task of integrating Android into the
desktop. I don't know about all of you, but every time that I have to
look away from my computer screen
So that leaves akonadi google resource. Including the contacts and calendar in
KDE would be useful, this without google gadgets.
There is a kdroid program which will read the contacts via a phone and a
dataengine could be done based on this code, but I think getting the resource
working would
How does one get google gadgets to work in plasma. Trying to download them
crashes plasma in KDE4.7.
More important, I would like to see the Akonadi resource working. It is
certainly installed. How do I get to it?
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Why I had so many? My .kde was been through it all including crashes,
failures, loss of desktops, etc. Usually the thing healed itself after some
logins or, for example, I got my kmail, qjackctl and nut-monitor icons back
on my system tray after a plasma-desktop crash and restart.
The strip
Using 4.7 from Debian Experimental (emphasise that word).
There are a zillion activities available shown on a strip which is quite
large. I named my normal desktop main, gave the second activity a name. So
far, so good :-). I started placing widgets/icons on the second actiivity.
Going back to
On Wednesday 02 Tevet 5772 18:51:08 Ivan Čukić wrote:
Hi,
All the things you wrote sound like a setup issues. (or a 4.7 bug that
I forgot about - it was a long time ago).
You should only have (if you haven't created them before) one existing
activity and two-three templates shown in the
On Wednesday 02 Tevet 5772 19:36:29 Ivan Čukić wrote:
Can you please try to create a new user and see how many activities
does he have by default?
A new user failed to come up.
My other existing users started out with later-version kde4--I was playing
with it since the very start, keeping
On Monday 16 Kislev 5772 18:37:54 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Monday, December 12, 2011 17:47:42 David Baron wrote:
I have been experimenting with UI for my recollrunner. Actions work
despite some bugs in the icon placements
for others reading along: those bugs have been fixed in 4.8
On Monday 16 Kislev 5772 15:41:54 Mark wrote:
On Sun, Dec 11, 2011 at 9:38 PM, David Baron d_ba...@012.net.il wrote:
Run options as menus (shown at mouse position at right-icon) close when
an action is clicked.
Run options shown in the widge with buttons, fields, etc., appearing
below
Run options as menus (shown at mouse position at right-icon) close when an
action is clicked.
Run options shown in the widge with buttons, fields, etc., appearing below the
match, persist when clicked. This means several may be open at once which
might not be the best idea, side-effects if not
On Friday 13 Kislev 5772 11:38:36 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Thursday, December 08, 2011 19:52:36 David Baron wrote:
Is there a way, probably in the desktop file, to make a KCModule
sharable? Right now, the first plasma object to get it owns it.
I am not worried about syncronization
Is there a way, probably in the desktop file, to make a KCModule sharable?
Right now, the first plasma object to get it owns it.
I am not worried about syncronization between instances that modify data, but
would be interested in that eventually is this thing be possible at all.
Thanks in
On Wednesday 11 Kislev 5772 10:55:59 Andras Mantia wrote:
Hi,
I like a lot the KRunner plugins, but I find one issue with them: it is
not documented how you should use them. I discovered some of the features,
but probably not everything. And I see no place in the UI where the
documentation
On Thursday 20 Heshvan 5772 17:36:49 David Baron wrote:
On Thursday 20 Heshvan 5772 13:24:15 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday, November 16, 2011 21:38:20 David Baron wrote:
I have mentioned this before, possible bug?
Better fix or workaround?
the answer is always fix
On Monday 24 Heshvan 5772 23:02:13 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Monday, November 21, 2011 16:38:22 Luiz =?ISO-8859-1?Q?Rom=E1rio?=
Santana
Rios wrote:
I think it's because Plasma widgets are not QWidgets, but
QGraphicsWidgets.
you are correct.
I assume that yet-another-set-of-widgets was
How does one get them integrated here?
I have from KDE, Muse-Awt and clam (audio stuff), and various others, so wlhy
not the plasma set. If they were there, I would make use of them.
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On Thursday 20 Heshvan 5772 13:24:15 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday, November 16, 2011 21:38:20 David Baron wrote:
I have mentioned this before, possible bug?
Better fix or workaround?
the answer is always fix it. there is no point in working around bugs in
our own code :)
i went
In this case, the right-most (last) action icon overlays the runoptions icon.
Since they are not exactly the same positions, one can actually get to both
with a little skill. However, this is not the desired placement, obviously.
Workaround tried was a dummy action with no visible icon. Not
On Monday 17 Heshvan 5772 09:22:20 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Sunday, November 13, 2011 17:43:22 David Baron wrote:
How might these be accomplished?
by returning QueryMatch objects of type InformationalMatch with the data
set to whatever the subsequent match should be.
As said
There are two ways of getting actions into a runner: As a dropdown from the
configure icon on the right or as action-icons over the subtext area. Ne'er
the twain do meet.
As a drop down, the app remains visible, one has text available (tooltips do
not work!) but one does not have access to
KRun shoiuld be able to run an executable automatically without using the
overloaded KRun::run. How should this be done? With arguments on the data
string?
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On Wednesday 05 Heshvan 5772 20:01:54 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday, November 2, 2011 19:53:46 David Baron wrote:
KRun shoiuld be able to run an executable automatically without using the
overloaded KRun::run. How should this be done? With arguments on the data
string?
can you give
Should a runner flag it hits. Right now my recoll runner should them as
recoll-filename. Other runners show Mail to soandso or Run this-app.
However, many others just yield the file name with no hint of why the user is
seeing this one. Icons suggest the file's type or mime-type rather than
On Tuesday 04 Heshvan 5772 21:48:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Tuesday, November 1, 2011 19:06:12 David Baron wrote:
Should a runner flag it hits. Right now my recoll runner should them as
recoll-filename. Other runners show Mail to soandso or Run
this-app. However, many others just yield
It looks to me that krunner or possibly text read from start()ed applications
only displays ASCII. A path that had 8-bit or UTF8 encodings displays
incorrectly. None of the tr, trUtf8, QFile::encode or decode functions help.
How do I set display codepages for krunner, either in general or for a
When typing RTL text, i.e. Hebrew, the X button remains on the right and
covers the start of the text. Desired behavior would flip it to X and place
on the left.
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Now that this is up a running (4.6.3 Debian Sid), I want to make use of this.
Is there--will there be--a way of moving or copying widgets, icons from one
activity to another? For example, I have everything on my main general
activity. I want to move the music stuff to a separate activity. Would
On Wednesday 04 Tamuz 5771 17:00:07 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Wednesday, July 6, 2011 16:34:16 David Baron wrote:
Now that this is up a running (4.6.3 Debian Sid), I want to make use of
this.
Is there--will there be--a way of moving or copying widgets, icons from
one activity to another
On Tuesday 17 August 2010 02:13:44 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Monday 16 August 2010 12:13:10 David Baron wrote:
I have a krunner coded with run actions.
1. I add the actions. Their icons overwrite the wrench icon on the
right. I actually prefer the icons rather than a the dropdown
I have a krunner coded with run actions.
1. I add the actions. Their icons overwrite the wrench icon on the right. I
actually prefer the icons rather than a the dropdown usually shown when
clicking that icon. So I want to not have the wrench icon at all, just mine.
How?
2. The action I have
On Sunday 21 February 2010 18:31:53 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On February 21, 2010, Nikola Milenković wrote:
Hi,
i would like to join the Jam Session, and I have an idea for my plasmoid,
but I'm having a little trouble with it.
I would like to read output from console command, (eg. ps -e or
On Friday 20 November 2009 11:55:13 Gerhard Gappmeier wrote:
Hi all,
I've a little proposal for the plasmoid locking on the desktop.
Here is the problem:
I often stumble over the same usability problem.
Normally I have my plasmoids locked, because I don't like it when this
edit- bar
I have been reading or glancing this thread for a while (many longer posts are
unreadable because of all the variations of included text being answered).
If we are not talking about a one-to-one desktop-activity relationship which
might be the most straightforward to understand, in other words
On Tuesday 06 October 2009 19:09:02 Matteo Agostinelli wrote:
Hello,
as suggested by Aaron in a previous discussion, I am having a look at the
calculator runner with the purpose of extending the capabilities of the
runner by using libqalculate when it is available...
There already is such
On Tuesday 06 October 2009 22:36:52 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On October 6, 2009, David Baron wrote:
On Tuesday 06 October 2009 19:09:02 Matteo Agostinelli wrote:
Hello,
as suggested by Aaron in a previous discussion, I am having a look at
the calculator runner with the purpose
Apparently, plasma will wait until all of these are done before displaying
anything (correct me if I am wrong). So any applet that checks
unmounted/unmountable media, unconnected network connections, loads large data
sets, etc., will make plasma wait and wait unless ...
Do ALL of it in
On Wednesday 30 September 2009 19:36:28 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On September 30, 2009, David Baron wrote:
Do ALL of it in background threads.
Just start, set busy if need be, and exit init().
When threads needed for applet functionality are done, reset busy and let
it play.
threaded
No, I do not mean foul language or icons in an error box. I get consistantly
that the trash protocol has unexpectedly failed on each plasma startup.
I had this occasionally in previous versions, most always now in 4.3.1.
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Obviously. Which package?
For bugreports bugs.kde.org should be used.
thank you and have a nice day
Beat Wolf
Am Sonntag 06 September 2009 16.59:54 schrieb David Baron:
No, I do not mean foul language or icons in an error box. I get
consistantly that the trash protocol has
...last but not least, the bug I reported about this thing sitting on
hald/dbus. This too me is a showstopper. The original device notifier
certainly does not do this.
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How does one get that animation over the icon that some applets are now using?
Yes, we need some documentation.
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On Friday 28 August 2009 10:12:04 WuYongbo wrote:
Hi guys,
how are plasma-appletrc and plasmarc (in $HOME/.kde/share/config/) created
after .kde file are deleted manually ?
I am thinking how do make plamsa load some certain applets, at the very
first time, as I expected.
Mine gave me a
Is this the one that has been on kde-look for a while? Sounds like it.
This is a worthy revamp of the original device-notifier plasmoid and in 4.3
it
is actually readable. The last mounted tooltip is of questionable
usefulness.
This baby, at least the last kde-look.org version of it, is
On Friday 07 August 2009 14:23:26 Matteo Agostinelli wrote:
Maybe I understood what is the point of the OP. If you drag and drop a PDF
file to the Desktop, you get the choice between the Previewer and the Icon.
But if you choose the Preview it actually creates an empty previewer
plasmoid, i.e.
On Thursday 06 August 2009 17:31:58 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Thursday 06 August 2009 16:11:06 David Baron wrote:
The previewer is a plasmoid that I can use to view a file by dragging and
dropping on it. Why would I want to see this choice everytime I drag a
file to the desktop?
If I
Remember, the Plasma desktop is not just a file-dump ...
Misunderstood.
I have a pdf document that I want to place on the desktop to read it a
few times. So I drag the icon from dolphin to the desktop.
Now, in 4.3, when I drag this icon from dolphin to the desktop, I get the
On Thursday 06 August 2009 14:16:09 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 06 August 2009, sacha schutz wrote:
Maybe we can recreate Flags in Svg. This may be long, but drawings are
easy
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:SVG_flags
flag images are not copyrightable, so we could just
The previewer is a plasmoid that I can use to view a file by dragging and
dropping on it. Why would I want to see this choice everytime I drag a file to
the desktop?
If I want the previewer, I will place it once (and usually only once) and then
make use of it.
If I am dragging a file to the
and pardon my ignorance: What is ecma script?
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A similar problem has seemingly been solved, by Google. Since google's
browser is opensource, one might take a look.
Every one of those tabs, plugin processes, etc., is a separate process, shows
up on top as such. I have an upload going on now, apparently in a chrome
process initiated
On Sunday 26 July 2009 21:20:55 Chani wrote:
Example of their success: Clicking a link in kmail, for example, will
spawn that as a tab in an existing chrome browser if one is running.
Caveat--if one died and is still an existing process, one must kill it
before chrome will work correctly.
For us diehards that are resisting software over which we have little or no
control, i.e. nepomuk:
A runner to interface with recoll (I run its indexer at nice 19 and I do not
know it is even running) -- this can simply issue command lines to recoll and
parse their output quite simply (give
Is there one? In the works?
I am regularly using two kde3 apps: Guarddog and Ksensors. Ksensors would be
an ideal plasmoid (or panel app as now but off dbus instead of dcop).
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On Thursday 16 July 2009 18:03:03 Emdek wrote:
On 16-07-2009 at 16:50:21 David Baron d_ba...@012.net.il wrote:
Is there one? In the works?
Isn't systemmonitor engine enough? ;-)
Fired it up in the explorer. Has the few lmsensors items that my chipset
supports so apparently initializes
On Thursday 09 July 2009 23:58:02 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 09 July 2009, Edney Matias wrote:
I have some spare time then i went to Techbase page with the proposals to
GSoC 2009 and picked this:
http://techbase.kde.org/index.php?title=Projects/Summer_of_Code/2009/Idea
s# Pro
Is there a krunner skeleton/template like the plasmoid one I used to get
started. I want to write an interface for recoll (since I avoid nepomuk until
I have more control over its priorities, at least).
I would, to start, issue an appropriate recoll -t command and parse the
response (
On Friday 10 April 2009 18:35:20 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
Hi David,
Please keep replies on the list. In this case, you would most likely
already have received an answer. My personal mailbox is almost always
slower, and we tend to do stuff in the open.
On Friday 10 April 2009 09:52:47 you
On Thursday 09 April 2009 18:06:42 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
Hi,
I've just moved the akonadi dataengine into kdereview so we can release it
with KDE 4.3 -- if you guys deem it good enough.
Its current functionality includes fetching contacts, emails and
microblogging from Akonadi, including
On Tuesday 10 March 2009 20:30:01 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Monday 09 March 2009, David Baron wrote:
Alternative display ideas? Sort/scroll by plugin results? Etc.
you are more likely to receive responses if you provide mockups, patches
and/or other forms of concrete suggestions.
Yeah. Had
There is a lot of hidden functionality in this goody. Problem is that the
results, unless one only uses one or two plugins, outgrow the krunner window.
The thing does not scroll in anyway and one can tab through the results an
simply run out of icons. Chances are that the desired target is a
Any progress on the akonadi engine? (I have been offline a few days because I
l lost my geforce).
Last svn I took crashed the engine-explorer and my applet so I doubt it is my
code. Could it be that dataUpdated() was being exercised with invalid or null
data? Since the receives
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 17:41:38 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 14:13:10 David Baron wrote:
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 14:37:11 you wrote:
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 08:01:31 David Baron wrote:
2. At 1st timeout, I do the a query(ContactCollections
Latest from playground SVN.
After hand entering stuff like akonadi/monitor.h since I do not have the
Akonadi/Monitor files available, it build OK.
My applet's sequence no longer gets to 1st base. I do not get the query() that
gives me the ContactCollection-#.
In the explorer, I do get it.
Latest from playground SVN.
I re-downloaded and compared with the older code. The only real difference
besides the volume of diagnostic printout is that the ContactCollection-# list
is made at a completion event rather than immediately on
connectSource(ContactCollections).
Such could
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 22:01:18 David Baron wrote:
Latest from playground SVN.
I re-downloaded and compared with the older code. The only real difference
besides the volume of diagnostic printout is that the ContactCollection-#
list is made at a completion event rather than immediately
On Monday 16 February 2009 19:08:03 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Sunday 15 February 2009, David Baron wrote:
1. The ContactCollection-# loads all the contacts but they are not
necessarily accessible at this point. I might have to try
hm; this sounds rather inefficient for large address books
On Tuesday 17 February 2009 00:44:13 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Monday 16 February 2009 19:42:03 David Baron wrote:
On Monday 16 February 2009 19:08:03 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Sunday 15 February 2009, David Baron wrote:
1. The ContactCollection-# loads all the contacts
Got to try it.
connectSource to ContactCollections.
dataUpdated() is called and I connectSource to ContactConnection-# that it
gives me in the data.uniqueKeys()
dataUpdated() is never called again.
The console shows all the contacts being added int but the program never sees
them.
1. What do
On Monday 09 February 2009 22:52:58 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
On Monday 09 February 2009 21:28:17 David Baron wrote:
On Monday 09 February 2009 08:37:48 David Baron wrote:
Great.
I downloaded and compiled.
I still get no data sources in the explorer and in some test code
Great.
I downloaded and compiled.
I still get no data sources in the explorer and in some test code which
would simply show the sources() list.
SVN commit 923483 by sebas:
birthday, location and photo for the akonadi dataengine contacts part
In more general, the dataengine works as
I am bringing my configuration panes into the plasma applet standard
configDialog.
Is the create frunction called once, the first time, or is it called each time
the dialog is to be shown? This obviously makes a coding difference.
Code I've seen (and crashes I had in trying things out) implie
On Friday 30 January 2009 15:01:40 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Friday 30 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
For the same reason I might want to display the name(), i.e. in an about
box or other UI feature that would carry such information.
this should not be done per applet, otherwise we get
On Sunday 01 February 2009 03:36:30 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Saturday 31 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
OK, there is a whole pane in the config dialog just for a keyboard
shortcut that few, as of yet, even use.
all popupapplets along with show desktop and show dashboard do.
They need
On Friday 30 January 2009 10:35:47 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 29 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
I use formlayouts.
irrelevant.
I also have my own save,
reset, cancel buttons with icons and seem to have no options or control
over what is given in the KConfigDialog.
while i'm
On Friday 30 January 2009 10:37:20 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 29 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
Any way to retrieve that from the applet object?
a) why?
For the same reason I might want to display the name(), i.e. in an about box
or other UI feature that would carry
Referring to problems posted on my personal config dialog.
Alternate dialog disappearing problems were do to sizing. I was resizing
according to a QVerticalLayout height. Why the previous version did not have
this problem, I do not know. Fixing the size fixed that.
KDE compound-widgets such as
Any way to retrieve that from the applet object?
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On Tuesday 27 January 2009 15:48:02 Rob Scheepmaker wrote:
On Tuesday 27 January 2009 14:13:28 David Baron wrote:
Just put in on, looks good after re-configuring my wallpaper and a couple
of crashes.
All in all 4.2 looks great (except I cannot get rid of those
notifications which did
If you don't like the new plasma style notifications, you can revert to the
old ones. Edit you plasma-appletrc and add the following:
[AppletGlobals][plasma_applet_systemtray]
ShowNotifications=false
Either way, they are annoying.
How about:
1. The information (or fatal is appropriate) icon
I called dataEngine( akonadi );
The result is the dummy, unnamed, isEmpty() true;
How do I get this working so I can at least look at the sources() and see how
to proceed?
The following are running:
12113 david 20 0 42672 3960 3316 S 0.0 0.5 0:02.02 akonadi_control
12167 david 20
I would like to try the dataengine that interfaces to KDEPIM contacts. So how
do I:
Register the applet with it/for it?
What datasource do I get? Obviously this is not a polled item and
getDataSource should trigger the signal.
What is in the hash--do I get the datasource for one contact and
On Thursday 22 January 2009 18:31:16 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Thursday 22 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
Register the applet with it/for it?
applets don't register with the engine, really. they just ask for it:
dataEngine(akonadi)
So I say dataEngine(contacts) --or kdepim
More observations:
Drawing by svg::paint yields too large a view on the panel (where one cannot
adjust the plasmoid size). When I used that, I shrunk the rectangle to 80%.
When I used kicon.::paint for the same svgz, I did not need to adjust the
rect.
Some plasmoids available in repositories
On Sunday 18 January 2009 12:12:49 Toussis Manolis wrote:
On Sunday 18 January 2009 09:34:49 David Baron wrote:
void MyApplet::mousePressEvent ( QGraphicsSceneMouseEvent *ev ) {
if ( signalsBlocked() ) {
Plasma::Applet::mousePressEvent( ev );
return
On Monday 19 January 2009 19:04:56 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Monday 19 January 2009, David Baron wrote:
I notice that some applets/icons will change there color/birghtness a bit
on hover. The device-monitor applet does this as do any shortcuts or
folders I placed on the panel. How do I do
On Sunday 18 January 2009 12:12:49 Toussis Manolis wrote:
On Sunday 18 January 2009 09:34:49 David Baron wrote:
void MyApplet::mousePressEvent ( QGraphicsSceneMouseEvent *ev ) {
if ( signalsBlocked() ) {
Plasma::Applet::mousePressEvent( ev );
return
On Saturday 17 January 2009 09:48:55 Toussis Manolis wrote:
I want my plasma to react on left click on it.
What signal/object should I connect to my slot?
I tried MyApplet::clicked() , but there is no such signal...
I used a mouse click event, wrote my own implementation for that function.
On Wednesday 14 January 2009 20:04:10 Alex Merry wrote:
On Wednesday 14 January 2009 07:45:16 David Baron wrote:
3. KDE3 panel applets/services I STILL use because they have not been
ported: knemo, ksensors. There was also a system-monitor (four of them
posted on kde- look are not as nice
A few observations, queries:
1. Folks seem to be posting applets on kde-look. This is for eye-candy,
decorations, screen savers. Applets that treat useful information belong on
kde-apps, I would think.
2. What to show? Seems to be a trend of plaster large screen areas with the
whole
[test deleted, very long posting]
This is all very exciting, maybe even useful in all or in parts.
Main problem is screen real estate. The same reason I do not really like all
those lovely superkaramba thingies nor do I use the folder-view plasmoid.
Maybe is this could be on ONE of the several
While this is being discussed at length . . .
Are there stock data-engines that come with the distributions, things for
KDEPIM or even MySQL or pogreSQL? Or need on always roll one's own?
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I want to save/read configuration settings for the user (rather than global
settings).
The applet class provides two KConfigGroup functions:
config() and config( group)
Where do these store their data? Global? User?
The group name is best the applet name()? user's name?
Alternatively, there is
There are two problems when closing my applet .
1. The ioctl TIOCWAIT thread will not terminate. This may cause plasma not to
close correctly (stuck in gray screen until control/alt/backspace). When
closing in the viewer, get message: QThread: Destroyed while thread is still
running
2. If the
On Monday 08 December 2008 23:46:37 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008, David Baron wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008 21:33:21 David Baron wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008 19:04:17 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
Big outstanding issue is getting icons into the UI
On Wednesday 10 December 2008 19:04:12 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Tuesday 09 December 2008, David Baron wrote:
Sometime the thing works just fine.
Sometimes, it gets hung up and I get messages like:
link XMLID_34_ hasn't been detected!
link XMLID_34_ hasn't been detected!
link
On Monday 08 December 2008 21:33:21 David Baron wrote:
On Monday 08 December 2008 19:04:17 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
Big outstanding issue is getting icons into the UI.
use KIcon.
Get the same crashes. KIcon will give me more flexibility and less
restrictions tied
On Sunday 07 December 2008 12:03:24 Ben Cooksley wrote:
Hi,
I am developing the KuickQuiz plasmoid ( currently very alpha in
playground/base/plasma/applets/kuickquiz ) and use Plasma::RadioButton
to allow the user to choose the multi choice answer they want.
However, I have ran into the
On Monday 08 December 2008 02:43:44 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
On Sunday 07 December 2008, David Baron wrote:xperimental and backports.
While the code is not voluminous, it is longer than appropriate for
such a posting. If the list permits inclusions, I can do so.
some things that pop out
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