eing
updated! No, the IETF situation is far worse.
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On Sun, 4 Sep 2011, Doug Schepers wrote:
> On 9/3/11 2:54 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Mon, 29 Aug 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> > >
> > > But, the WHATWG HTML links to the editor's drafts and does not link
> > > to the TR one. While docume
hould adjust XBL2 to take into account lessons we have
learnt over the past five years, such as dropping namespaces and merging
it into HTML instead of forcing an XML language on authors, but taking a
significantly less capable solution simply because XBL is di
the client could set binaryType accordingly, but that would
obviously just be the author working around an API limitation.
(If the protocol was still developed in tight coordination with the API, I
might propose that we have four frame types -- text, text blob, binary
arraybuffer, and binary blob.)
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from them. We would
provide basic bindings that they can reuse in their inheritance chain,
e.g. so that they can override just the look of the button but get all the
interactive behaviour (accessibility roles, keyboard navigation, mouse
click reactions, etc) for free.
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an use a with a list of
countries in elements in the markup, but then use CSS/XBL to bind
that to a "component" that instead makes the look like a
map, with all the interactivity that implies.
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the case of the HTML spec, they're obsolete _before_
they're published, since the publication process takes several days). So
it's not entirely true that they have no special status.
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y makes testing harder, since you have to try to work out how
the specification work together rather than having just one document that
defines the behaviour.
> * It's much easier to measure "done" when dealing with a smaller spec.
Specifications are never "done&quo
On Thu, 18 Aug 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> On Thu, Aug 18, 2011 at 1:16 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Wed, 17 Aug 2011, Chris Rogers wrote:
> >>
> >> Also, it would be good to get Ian's opinion about this since he's
> >> working on similar stuff
ationship to MediaStream, too; roc may
have an opinion on this topic, as he has spoken about it before.
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entIdArg, in WindowProxy? sourceArg, in sequence
> > transferablesArg);
>
> Can we still remove initMessageEvent in favor of event constructors?
That's still my plan actually. Been busy dealing with other bugs though.
--
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ent.ports array, so
there's no reason for the constructor to support that.
> Without this change, it is not possible for a JavaScript author to
> directly construct a MessageEvent with a dataArg that contains
> Transferable objects (other than MessagePorts).
On Fri, 5 Aug 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> On Fri, 2011-08-05 at 14:32 +0000, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Fri, 5 Aug 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> > >
> > > Again, what are the reasons to link to the WHATWG HTML version? What
> > > does it mean fo
ts entirety already, so
the reference would just be confusing. The only reason there's a reference
there in the first place is because the W3C copy is randomly split into
two unlike the WHATWG version.
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Element.create('x-foo-button').
One of the principles behind XB2L's design was graceful degradation, such
that sites would still mostly work without the bindings being applies. It
seems that if we're creating proprietary elements, that won't work. So I'm
no
ctors), and having it on the
interface object makes it pretty clear what it's a factory for.
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On Tue, 2 Aug 2011, João Eiras wrote:
>
> However, Nodes need a ownerDocument, and that needs to be supplied, even
> if optionally. Doing document.createElement implies the document,
> Element.create does not.
Just use the same document as new Image(), new Option(), or new Audio
On Mon, 1 Aug 2011, Ryosuke Niwa wrote:
> On Mon, Aug 1, 2011 at 6:33 PM, Maciej Stachowiak wrote:
> >
> > In an IRC discussion with Ian Hickson and Tab Atkins, we can up with
> > the following idea for convenient element creation:
> >
> > Element.creat
arameter, can include nodes, strings, or arrays.
> Strings are converted to text nodes. Arrays are unpacked and treated as
> lists of nodes/strings. Array support is for cases where you want to
> have a call-site that may take a veriable-length list, with possible
> prefix and suf
0's of pages are quickly
> downloaded by the App Cache software and thus can quickly cause a mini
> DDOS.
Yeah, that's a problem. Any suggestions for fixing this?
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standard non-compliant to seek the way to improve WebSocket.
I can't speak for the W3C, but yes, extensions to the standards are how we
evolve the technology stack. As extensions are developed and adopted by
browsers, the API spec will be updated accordingly. Updating the spec is a
tr
rs are to implement, we would
update the WebSockets spec to list it as a requirement.
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e adding notes, it'd also be good to add a note to the DOM2
HTML, HTML4.x and XHTML1.x specs saying that they've all been merged into
the contemporary HTML spec.
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On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> On Thursday, July 21, 2011 12:33 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Thu, 21 Jul 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> > >
> > > For platform features that directly affect web developers' pages
> > > that might someti
, then that's a bigger problem.
I don't mind if we turn specific extensions on or off. I just don't think
it should be optional. If UAs do not want to implement what the protocol
spec says, I'm equally happy for the API spec to just disallow that
extension.
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others not based on some dominant implementation.
Optional features in HTTP have caused no end of trouble and are amongst
the many reasons I avoid optional features so much.
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ht
requires that
this list of extensions be configurable by the consumer's user.
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On Wed, 20 Jul 2011, Cameron McCormack wrote:
> Ian Hickson:
> > Is this still something I should do, or did this get resolved using
> > another solution?
>
> http://www.w3.org/Bugs/Public/show_bug.cgi?id=8241
>
> The proposed solution I made in the bug was to have t
ing an
> > object into the prototype chain of the Window that handles these
> > property gets. This means that |var| (which defines a prop on the
> > Window itself) will always shadow the named props, which is the
> > behavior you observe.
>
> If we solve the proble
On Wed, 13 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 11:36 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Mon, 11 Jul 2011, Marcos Caceres wrote:
> >> On 7/11/11 8:23 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> >> > On Mon, 11 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> >> > >
t on the constructor.
We wouldn't put priority on the constructor because that would be a
per-message feature.
We wouldn't put encryption in the constructor because that's handled by
TLS already.
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On Mon, 11 Jul 2011, Marcos Caceres wrote:
> On 7/11/11 8:23 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Mon, 11 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> > > On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 11:04 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > > > On Fri, 8 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> > > > >
&g
On Mon, 11 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> On Mon, Jul 11, 2011 at 11:04 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Fri, 8 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> >>
> >> On the other hand, we should [not] do things now that are likely to
> >> create a more complicated or
would expect
the constructor to need extensions, especially extensions that would need
an object.
(I also don't really see what's special about this one in particular that
means it should have this but other constructors should not.)
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On Fri, 8 Jul 2011, Robin Berjon wrote:
> On Jul 8, 2011, at 21:56 , Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Fri, 8 Jul 2011, Robin Berjon wrote:
> >>
> >> Obviously we should coordinate, but coordination is time-consuming.
> >
> > Coordinating exceptions codes is jus
nting the protocol
> they won't be required to implement this extension.
Non-browser clients don't have the same dynamics, so it makes sense for
them to be allowed to not implement compression. Non-browser clients
aren't going to have the market impact of browser clients.
--
Ian Hic
require author to explicitly set an algorithm, which is in fact likely
better from a security perspective.
I'm not at all convinced that we are actually going to need to extend the
constructor at all, nor that if we ever actually have to extend the
constructor that doing so will be problematic.
amongst browser user
agents. Having some support compression and others not would lead to
authoring mistakes and will force us into either having or not having
compression based on how big sites first get this wrong.
> 13104 - 1) ping(msg); //allow client to send server ping as per webso
On Thu, 7 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> On Thu, Jul 7, 2011 at 12:47 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Thu, 7 Jul 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> >>
> >> It's a pain since it forces us to try to coordinate codes across
> >> multiple specifications, w
hatever.)
My concern is with having newer parts of the platform use entirely
different models (e.g. new exception interfaces) relative to older parts
of the platform (which e.g. use codes). It leads to the kind of problem
you describe with JS vs DOM, except that we'd have JS vs DOM
globals are involved. All you need is the exception to be thrown by
> something in an iframe for whatever reason.
I'm also skeptical of this. The platform uses DOMException almost
everywhere, and I really don't see what's wrong with that.
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; I'm asking that you
stop trying to prioritise my work based on it.
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about.
Merely checking things in to dev.w3.org will cause CVS conflicts when I
next run the post-processing scripts. I don't recommend it.
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s getting ridiculous.
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n't be Transferable. Only the buffer should be. The views
should continue to have the behaviour you had described before, where they
recurse to clone their buffer then just clone the view. Since the buffers
would already be transferred (the transfering happens before the cloning),
it&
On Tue, 21 Jun 2011, Ian Hickson wrote:
>
> How about we just make postMessage() take the object to clone in the first
> argument, an array of objects to transfer in the second; on the other
> side, the author receives the object cloned, with anything listed in the
> a
Could one of the IndexDB people help me convert this example to use the
IndexDB stuff instead of the WebSQL stuff?
http://www.whatwg.org/demos/workers/database-updater/worker.js
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On Tue, 21 Jun 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> On Tue, Jun 21, 2011 at 12:39 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Mon, 20 Jun 2011, Jonas Sicking wrote:
> >>
> >> If data appears both in the .ports array and the .data property, then
> >> people will be tempted to cre
sferred, but for the other you might want to sometimes transfer and
sometimes not).
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x27; would now be a
confusing misnomer). Alternatively, we can rename 'ports' to something
else and just have WebKit support 'ports' for legacy reasons. If we do
this I can also change the 'connect' event to make more sense.
Opinions?
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th it, AFAIU.
We could just publish it as a REC and say we're done with it, too.
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not content
> attributes.
Since the IDL attributes just reflect the content attributes, I don't know
how that could be separated.
The main reason I didn't put them on Element rather than HTMLElement is
that I didn't expect other vocabularies would appreciate it. My ideal
data.
I don't follow what you mean here, possibly because I don't understand
what you mean by "type".
> 3) Custom event types should be indicated by some unique mechanism
> (e.g., requiring unrecognized types to be preceded by "x-") so that if
> the specification were to be expanded upon in the future to support
> official protocols, they could do so without impacting existing code.
> However, when no type is supplied, this could also be assumed to be a
> custom event, but without any "namespace". This would allow the
> specification to be backwards-compatible.
Not sure what this means.
Cheers,
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3 then spans a worker (W4) to handle network synchronistion, and passes
it the network port. It can drop its direct connection to W4 because W4 is
just going to be monitoring the database and the network (via its port to
W1) and updating things.
W1 similarly offloads its low-level network dut
a cross-thread blocking API or a racy API,
depending on how it's implemented, both of which suck.)
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al.
>
> In my opinion, the only thing left to be done with localStorage is to
> write it off as an unfortunate failure, learn our lesson, and move on.
Yeah, that is also a pretty good point.
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On Sat, 11 Jun 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote:
> On Jun/10/2011 3:05 PM, ext Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Fri, 10 Jun 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote:
> > > >
> > > > My take on the comments is that most commentors prefer the spec to be
> > > > changed as
available offline when the UA cannot
hit the network. Beyond that, the main HTTP cache can do everything
appcache can, as far as I can tell.
> Why isn't there any DOM API allowing a fine-grained control of the
> application cache? applicationCache.cache.add( URI );
> applicationCa
ally used by the DOM in some browsers.
These should already be there as they are defined by ECMAScript itself.
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ould_
do if we had the array model.
I haven't gone through this thread in detail to study all the proposals
yet, but I am saving the e-mails on this thread to be able to do that when
I get to this particular topic (hopefully quite soon, since I've received
vendor feedba
>
> Can you explain (with maybe some javascript) how one would cause the
> SECURITY_ERR exception to be thrown by setItem() and getItem()?
var foo = localStorage;
foo.test = '';
document.domain = document.domain; // changes effective origin
foo.test; // throws
loca
On Fri, 10 Jun 2011, Marcos Caceres wrote:
> On Thu, Jun 9, 2011 at 6:07 PM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Thu, 9 Jun 2011, Marcos Caceres wrote:
> >>
> >> tiny quick editorial request, where the spec says:
> >>
> >> "When the localStorage attri
y in the Web platform stack at the moment.
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to link
> instead of copy/paste.
Done.
Just out of interest, what's the context for this? These steps are pretty
specific to localStorage (and are not the complete security story -- see
the later section on security), so I'm surprised to hear these particular
steps would be re
tion.
> If this happens, and just one EventSource object is collected (eg. a tab
> closed), the connection shouldn't be closed--it's still in use.
>
> Should this instead cancel the fetch algorithm for the EventSource, as
> with "aborting a document load" (HTML
On Wed, 8 Jun 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 07, 2011 10:36 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Tue, 7 Jun 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> > > This check-in [1] reintroduces the onerror handler that was removed
> > > previously [2]. Since, in general, WebSocke
On Tue, 7 Jun 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> On Tuesday, June 07, 2011 10:36 AM, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Tue, 7 Jun 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> > > We have removed onerror from our implementation since the previous
> > > change and it's frustrating tr
wait til someone else has implemented it and shipped it.
Being on the bleeding edge means you are providing the feedback that
affects the specification's development.
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On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> On Thu, 2011-06-02 at 18:51 +0000, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > > I don't believe that this new feature will get implemented. It's going
> > > to break too many pages on the Web,
> >
> > That's the kind
On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote:
> On Jun/2/2011 2:51 PM, ext Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> > > On Thu, 2011-06-02 at 18:38 +, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > > > On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote:
> > >
objects is unlikely to
> be possible in todays JS implementations.
The idea here was just to have WebIDL do the type-checking instead of me.
The behaviour is black-box indistinguishable.
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On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Philippe Le Hegaret wrote:
> On Thu, 2011-06-02 at 18:38 +0000, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Arthur Barstow wrote:
> > >
> > > Hixie, All - PLH proposed a fix for this bug in comment #5 (use
> > > DOMString instead of any i
e fixed. I don't mind where this lives though
(as an independent spec or in one of the existing specs).
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ated accordingly.
This isn't a bug, it's a new feature that just hasn't been implemented
yet.
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On Thu, 2 Jun 2011, Marcos Caceres wrote:
>
> Ian, if there is anything I can do to help with Web Storage, please let
> me know.
The main thing we need, I think, is a test suite.
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is approach I can work with Kenneth on getting the
wording right in the various specs.
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On Tue, 31 May 2011, Simon Pieters wrote:
> On Tue, 31 May 2011 22:03:49 +0200, Ian Hickson wrote:
> >
> > > We think this makes the design more future-proof because otherwise
> > > and new information required prior to establishing the connection
> > > will
contains meta data
> about subsequent binary messages that will be treated as Blobs. Your
> proposal would require extra complexity to read text from a Blob or
> switch back and forth.
Agreed.
On Sat, 28 May 2011, Adrian Bateman wrote:
> On Friday, May 27, 2011
In a world where the text messages might also go into blobs,
aren't we likely to end up seeing people miss a message and end up with
all their messages going to blobs and never getting out of it? It seems
rather brittle.
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On Sat, 28 May 2011, Cameron McCormack wrote:
> Ian Hickson:
> > Consistency is good when it makes sense. However, I don't think XHR is a
> > good parallel here. XHR has all kinds of additional complexities, for
> > example it lets you get a string, whereas here s
get a string, whereas here string vs binary is handled
at the protocol level and so can't ever be confused.
However, if we want consistency here anyway, then I'd suggest we change
XHR to use the actual type values just like WebSockets. It would IMHO lead
to much cleaner code.
ebIDL
> grammar is [A,B] in
> [Constructor(in DOMString url, in optional DOMString protocols)]
> [Constructor(in DOMString url, in optional DOMString[] protocols)]
Fixed. Thanks.
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e
selection, canceling 'copy' has no effect.)
> However, what about items.add() called during a paste event listener?
> Currently I do not allow paste event listeners to update the clipboard with
> setData(), it seems strange. Should we just disallow this too?
I'd model 'p
ow_bug.cgi?id=605997
> > >
> > > IE9 beta does not have it either.
> >
> > This means that we should also remove
> > dispatchFormInput/dispatchFormChange from the HTML5 spec, right?
>
> I agree, the events or at least the methods should be removed.
Just to
put into this kind of thing but in
this particular case IIRC the detail was added in response to some
questions from implementors about some relevant edge cases.
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tring&email2=&bugidtype=include&bug_id=&votes=&chfieldfrom=&chfieldto=Now&chfieldvalue=&cmdtype=doit&order=Last+Changed&field0-0-0=noop&type0-0-0=noop&value0-0-0=
In recent weeks I've been focusing on multitrack video and video
conferencing, but I
specs for
these technologies.
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n
a shared worker cross-origin (assuming the other origin agrees) directly,
without having to use iframes. There's a whole host of features that such
a mechanism would enable which currently have to be done using the
awkward iframe mechanism you describe.
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can't be damaged by the site.
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the API layer:
>
> http://lists.whatwg.org/htdig.cgi/whatwg-whatwg.org/2011-March/031070.html
Yeah, there's always the chance that the protocol will require further
changes, indeed.
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'll find out when the edits to the protocol spec are done
and I get to update the API spec for the new protocol spec.
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file the bug
directly in Bugzilla if you can work out which component to use.
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http://ln.hixie.ch/ U+263A/, _.. \ _\ ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
te is fixed in stone.
It would be incredibly rude of us to force an independent team of
developers to change development practices for our benefit.
--
Ian Hickson U+1047E)\._.,--,'``.fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/ U+263A/, _.. \ _\ ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
ever committing to creating the later.
Actually I did, multiple times. But nobody was interested in
reimplementing that dialect independently, so all the points Jonas raised
still apply.
--
Ian Hickson U+1047E)\._.,--,'``.fL
http://ln.hixie.ch/ U+263A/, _.. \ _\ ;`._ ,.
Things that are impossible just take longer. `._.-(,_..'--(,_..'`-.;.'
pying the chairs of the IETF hybi WG (Gabriel Montenegro and Salvatore
> Loreto), and Mark Nottingham (IETF liaison to the W3C).
I sent Ian a review from the API perspective relatively recently.
--
Ian Hickson U+1047E)\._.,--,'``.
On Sat, 12 Mar 2011, Anne van Kesteren wrote:
!
> On Thu, 10 Mar 2011 21:06:47 +0100, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > Can I ask you to create a "TODO" file in that directory that lists the
> > cases I suggested that aren't tested? That way at least my ideas don't get
&g
On Fri, 11 Mar 2011, Simon Pieters wrote:
> On Fri, 11 Mar 2011 01:02:25 +0100, Ian Hickson wrote:
>
> > On Fri, 11 Mar 2011, Cameron McCormack wrote:
> > > Anne van Kesteren:
> > > > > > Lets at least remove sequence from the draft then.
> >
On Fri, 11 Mar 2011, Cameron McCormack wrote:
> Ian Hickson:
> > Web Apps 1.0 will change if you need it to. Don't constrain on my account
> > here. I'll do whatever you think we should do. The only places I use it
> > are in an argument to a method because I w
List descendant where I just
wanted the user of the API to be able to get a JS Array of values. I don't
think there's much implementation compatibility constraint here.
(Are the other two implemented by any browsers?)
--
Ian Hickson U+1047E)\._.,--,&
On Thu, 10 Mar 2011, Anne van Kesteren wrote:
> On Mon, 07 Mar 2011 20:06:25 +0100, Ian Hickson wrote:
> > Zero, one or two BOMs before an event.
> >
> > Parsing of comments with zero, one, or 2049 bytes of content, on either
> > side of a real field.
> >
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