STINNER Victor added the comment:
I agree with what Nick wrote. It became easy to install a third-party module,
and we made progress on APIs to get random bytes from the system.
I'm not convinced neither that Mersenne Twister limitations are important
enough to replace it.
If you want to see
Nick Coghlan added the comment:
Since this issue was opened, a few relevant changes have been made:
* firstly the random.SystemRandom API and subsequently the "secrets" module
were added to provide ready access to the operating system's cryptographically
secure PRNG. This addresses the "At
STINNER Victor victor.stin...@haypocalc.com added the comment:
Before trying to find the best (CS)PRNG, can't we start with ssl.RAND_bytes()
and ssl.RAND_pseudo_bytes()? I would be nice to use ssl.RAND_pseudo_bytes() to
generate crypt.mksalt(): see issue #12858
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Changes by Mark Dickinson dicki...@gmail.com:
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nosy: +mark.dickinson
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douglas bagnall doug...@paradise.net.nz added the comment:
I am no kind of crypto expert, but from what I read, there are no known attacks
on chacha8 or salsa20/12 better than brute-forcing the key, and distinguishing
the stream from random or deducing state would be considered an attack.
douglas bagnall doug...@paradise.net.nz added the comment:
Earlier this year I wrote Python wrappers for a number of generators:
https://github.com/douglasbagnall/riffle
They are mostly cryptographic stream ciphers from the ESTREAM[1] project, but I
was also interested in dSFMT[2], which is a
douglas bagnall doug...@paradise.net.nz added the comment:
A bit more on the state size and period of the stream ciphers.
Chacha and Salsa use 64 bytes (512 bits) of state (vs ~2.5kB for MT19937).
Its counter is 64 bits, and its seed can be 320 bits (in cipher-speak, the seed
is split between
Raymond Hettinger raymond.hettin...@gmail.com added the comment:
Thanks Douglas. Can you say what the cryptographic guarantees are for Chacha
and Salsa (seeing a stream of randoms doesn't allow you to do deduce internal
state, previous randoms, or future randoms)? Is it suitably strong for
Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no added the comment:
The problem is that the Python API can only produce one number per call and a
function call in Python is really slow (it creates a Python frame). If you want
to speed it Python, it would be better to add methods to generate arrays to
limit the
STINNER Victor victor.stin...@haypocalc.com added the comment:
I don't know if it would help you, but I wrote a C library offering a simple
API and supporting various RNG (cryptographic, hardware, pseudo, ...). It
reuses existing libraries like GSL, OpenSSL, glib, gcrypt, etc. It supports
STINNER Victor victor.stin...@haypocalc.com added the comment:
On my laptop, KISS4691 could produce about 110 million random numbers per
second (148 millon if inlined), whereas MT19937 produced 118 million random
numbers per second.
The problem is that the Python API can only produce one
New submission from Raymond Hettinger raymond.hettin...@gmail.com:
While keeping the MT generator as the default, add new alternative random
number generators as drop-in replacements. Since MT was first introduced, PRNG
technology has continued to advance.
I'm opening this feature request to
Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no added the comment:
George Marsaglia's latest random number generator KISS4691 is worth
considering, though I am not sure the performance is that different from
MT19937.
Here is a link to Marsaglia's post on comp.lang.c. Marasglia passed away
shortly after
Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no added the comment:
I'm posting the code for comparison of KISS4691 and MT19937. I do realize
KISS4691 might not be sufficiently different from MT19937 in characteristics
for Raymond Hettinger to consider it. But at least here it is for reference
should it be of
Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no added the comment:
Another (bug fix) post by Marsaglia on KISS4691:
http://www.phwinfo.com/forum/comp-lang-c/460292-ensuring-long-period-kiss4691-rng.html
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Changes by Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no:
Removed file: http://bugs.python.org/file22905/prngtest.zip
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Changes by Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no:
Added file: http://bugs.python.org/file22906/prngtest.zip
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Sturla Molden stu...@molden.no added the comment:
Further suggestions to improve the random module:
** Object-oriented PRNG: Let it be an object which stores the random state
internally, so we can create independent PRNG objects. I.e. not just one global
generator.
** Generator for
Raymond Hettinger raymond.hettin...@gmail.com added the comment:
Please focus your thoughts.
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