Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Steve Dower
Ray Donnelly wrote: On Sat, Oct 25, 2014 at 11:44 PM, Paul Moore p.f.mo...@gmail.com wrote: On 25 October 2014 23:22, Chris Angelico ros...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 9:19 AM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: My point is that your Windows build would not have the same

Re: [Python-Dev] Cross compiling Python (for Android)

2014-10-26 Thread Stefan Krah
Frank, Matthew I matthew.i.frank at intel.com writes:   4. Module _decimal is failing to compile.  The problem is that it has    a header called memory.h.  Android's libc has the problem that    /usr/include/stdlib.h includes memory.h.  But the build system    puts -I. on the include path

Re: [Python-Dev] XP buildbot problem cloning from hg.python.org

2014-10-26 Thread M.-A. Lemburg
On 26.10.2014 00:14, Ned Deily wrote: In article m28uk4wxod@valheru.db3l.homeip.net, David Bolen db3l@gmail.com wrote: David Bolen db3l@gmail.com writes: which appears to die mid-stream while receiving the manifests. So I'm sort of hoping there might be some record

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Tony Kelman
Thanks all for the responses. Clearly this is a subject about which people feel strongly, so that's good at least. David Murray's guidance in particular points to the most likely path to get improvements to really happen. Steve Dower: Building CPython for Windows is not something that needs

Re: [Python-Dev] results of id() and weakref.getweakrefs() sometimes break on object resurrection

2014-10-26 Thread Stefan Richthofer
You shouldnt have to emulate that. The exact behavior of GC is allowed to vary between systems. Yes, of course. I am looking into this for JyNI, which in contrast should emulate CPython behavior as good as possible. And for such details, -one by one- I am currently weighting up whether its

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Ray Donnelly
On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Thanks all for the responses. Clearly this is a subject about which people feel strongly, so that's good at least. David Murray's guidance in particular points to the most likely path to get improvements to really happen.

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread R. David Murray
On Sun, 26 Oct 2014 06:12:45 -0700, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Steve Dower: Building CPython for Windows is not something that needs solving. Not in your opinion, but numerous packagers of MinGW-based native or cross-compiled package sets would love to include Python. The fact

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Ray Donnelly
On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 2:28 PM, Ray Donnelly mingw.andr...@gmail.com wrote: On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 1:12 PM, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Thanks all for the responses. Clearly this is a subject about which people feel strongly, so that's good at least. David Murray's guidance in

Re: [Python-Dev] results of id() and weakref.getweakrefs() sometimes break on object resurrection

2014-10-26 Thread Armin Rigo
Hi Stefan, On 26 October 2014 02:50, Stefan Richthofer stefan.richtho...@gmx.de wrote: It appears weakrefs are only cleared if this is done by gc (where no resurrection can happen anyway). If a resurrection-performing-__del__ is just called by ref-count-drop-to-0, weakrefs persist - How do

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Tony Kelman
If this includes (or would likely include) a significant portion of the Scientific Computing community, I would think that would be a compelling use case. I can't speak for any of the scientific computing community besides myself, but my thoughts: much of the development, as you know, happens

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Paul Moore
On 26 October 2014 13:12, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Only cross-compilation and the build system in the above list are relevant to CPython, but I hope I have convinced you, Paul Moore, etc. that there are real reasons for some groups of users and developers to prefer MinGW-w64 over

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Paul Moore
On 26 October 2014 17:59, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Ensuring compatibility with CPython's chosen msvcrt has made that work even more difficult for them. Ensuring compatibility with CPython's msvcrt is mandatory unless you want to create a split in the community over which

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Paul Moore
On 26 October 2014 14:28, Ray Donnelly mingw.andr...@gmail.com wrote: I like this idea. To reduce the workload, we should probably pick Python3 (at least initially)? Aren't the existing patches on the tracker already for Python 3.5+? They should be, as that's the only version that's likely to

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Ray Donnelly
On Sun, Oct 26, 2014 at 10:41 PM, Paul Moore p.f.mo...@gmail.com wrote: On 26 October 2014 13:12, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: Only cross-compilation and the build system in the above list are relevant to CPython, but I hope I have convinced you, Paul Moore, etc. that there are real

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Tony Kelman
Not really, to be honest. I still don't understand why anyone not directly involved in CPython development would need to build their own Python executable on Windows. Can you explain a single specific situation where installing and using the python.org executable is not possible I want, and in

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Paul Moore
On 26 October 2014 23:24, Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu wrote: I want, and in many places *need*, an all-MinGW stack. OK, I'm willing to accept that statement. But I don't understand it, and I don't think you've explained why you *need* your CPython interpreter to be compiled with mingw (as

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread Paul Moore
On 26 October 2014 23:11, Ray Donnelly mingw.andr...@gmail.com wrote: I don't know where this ABI compatible thing came into being; Simple. If a mingw-built CPython doesn't work with the same extensions as a MSVC-built CPython, then the community gets fragmented (because you can only use the

Re: [Python-Dev] Status of C compilers for Python on Windows

2014-10-26 Thread martin
Zitat von Tony Kelman kel...@berkeley.edu: A maintainer has volunteered. Others will help. Can any core developers please begin reviewing some of his patches? Unfortunately, every attempt to review these patches has failed for me, every time. In the last iteration of an attempt to add