Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Georg Brandl
Am 23.09.2010 22:51, schrieb Éric Araujo: Le 23/09/2010 19:22, Terry Reedy a écrit : As of just now, if you were to wonder What (security) bugs are open for 2.5 and search on open 2.5 issues, you would get a list of 44 issues. It is only 44 instead of hundreds because of the work I and Mark

Re: [Python-Dev] Python wiki

2010-09-24 Thread Georg Brandl
Am 23.09.2010 22:25, schrieb anatoly techtonik: On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 6:57 PM, Barry Warsaw ba...@python.org wrote: I certainly agree with that. So, how can we solve those problems? Radomir has shell access now so perhaps we can ask him to make the Python wiki theme more visually

[Python-Dev] wiki/docs enhancement idea

2010-09-24 Thread Gerard Flanagan
I didn't know who to reply to in the previous thread. (Moving the Developer docs/ Python wiki). scraperwiki.org is a 'site scraper automater'. I threw together a script just now which scrapes certain specified pages from the python wiki and converts to something rest-like. It runs every 24hrs

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Éric Araujo
How about revamping the type/versions fields? Issue type () Feature request (blocked by moratorium: () yes () no) () Bug (found in: [] 2.7 [] 3.1 [] py3k) () Security bug (found in: [] 2.5 [] 2.6 [] 2.7 [] 3.1 [] py3k) I’m getting tired of explaining the meaning of the versions field again and

[Python-Dev] url shortening services (was Re: standards for distribution names)

2010-09-24 Thread Chris Withers
On 17/09/2010 12:54, Dan Buch wrote: You may also find this thread from the packaging google group useful, although it may not be quite what you're looking for: http://bit.ly/96SMuM To echo a please from the main python list, please can we all stop using url shortening services? This

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Chris Withers
On 18/09/2010 23:36, Guido van Rossum wrote: course, exists() and isdir() etc. do, and so does realpath(), but the pure parsing functions don't. Yes, but: H:\echo foo TeSt.txt ... import os.path os.path.realpath('test.txt') 'H:\\test.txt' os.path.normcase('TeSt.txt') 'test.txt' Both feel

Re: [Python-Dev] Some changes to logging for 3.2

2010-09-24 Thread Chris Withers
On 22/09/2010 16:54, Vinay Sajip wrote: I'm planning to make some smallish changes to logging in Python 3.2, please see http://plumberjack.blogspot.com/2010/09/improved-queuehandler-queuelistener.html If you're interested, I'd be grateful for any feedback you can give. Cool, how can I use it

Re: [Python-Dev] Python wiki

2010-09-24 Thread Michael Foord
On 24/09/2010 06:46, Martin v. Löwis wrote: Am 24.09.2010 00:39, schrieb Guido van Rossum: On Thu, Sep 23, 2010 at 3:35 PM, Martin v. Löwismar...@v.loewis.de wrote: With an admin team behind it, you can also make more use of ACLs to flag certain parts of the wiki as official by making them

[Python-Dev] Version fields [was Re: Goodbye]

2010-09-24 Thread Ned Deily
In article 4c9c6a6f.6010...@netwok.org, Éric Araujo mer...@netwok.org wrote: How about revamping the type/versions fields? Issue type () Feature request (blocked by moratorium: () yes () no) () Bug (found in: [] 2.7 [] 3.1 [] py3k) () Security bug (found in: [] 2.5 [] 2.6 [] 2.7 [] 3.1 []

Re: [Python-Dev] r84983 - in python/branches/py3k: Doc/library/os.rst Lib/test/test_os.py Misc/NEWS Modules/posixmodule.c

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
The getlogin test fails on many Unix buildbots, either with errno 2 (ENOENT) or 22 (EINVAL) or OSError: unable to determine login name: == ERROR: test_getlogin (test.test_os.LoginTests)

Re: [Python-Dev] r84983 - in python/branches/py3k: Doc/library/os.rst Lib/test/test_os.py Misc/NEWS Modules/posixmodule.c

2010-09-24 Thread Amaury Forgeot d'Arc
2010/9/24 Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net: The getlogin test fails on many Unix buildbots, either with errno 2 (ENOENT) or 22 (EINVAL) or OSError: unable to determine login name: Do these buildbots run in a Windows service, i.e. with no user logged in? -- Amaury Forgeot d'Arc

Re: [Python-Dev] r84983 - in python/branches/py3k: Doc/library/os.rst Lib/test/test_os.py Misc/NEWS Modules/posixmodule.c

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 13:38:44 +0200 Amaury Forgeot d'Arc amaur...@gmail.com wrote: 2010/9/24 Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net: The getlogin test fails on many Unix buildbots, either with errno 2 (ENOENT) or 22 (EINVAL) or OSError: unable to determine login name: Do these buildbots run

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Ned Batchelder
On 9/24/2010 6:13 AM, Chris Withers wrote: On 18/09/2010 23:36, Guido van Rossum wrote: course, exists() and isdir() etc. do, and so does realpath(), but the pure parsing functions don't. Yes, but: H:\echo foo TeSt.txt ... import os.path os.path.realpath('test.txt') 'H:\\test.txt'

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread R. David Murray
On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 11:13:46 +0100, Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: On 18/09/2010 23:36, Guido van Rossum wrote: course, exists() and isdir() etc. do, and so does realpath(), but the pure parsing functions don't. Yes, but: H:\echo foo TeSt.txt ... import os.path

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 11:07:59 +0200 Éric Araujo mer...@netwok.org wrote: How about revamping the type/versions fields? Issue type () Feature request (blocked by moratorium: () yes () no) () Bug (found in: [] 2.7 [] 3.1 [] py3k) () Security bug (found in: [] 2.5 [] 2.6 [] 2.7 [] 3.1 [] py3k)

Re: [Python-Dev] Python wiki

2010-09-24 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 8:31 PM, Michael Foord fuzzy...@voidspace.org.uk wrote: Wiki maintenance is discussed, along with other python.org maintenance topics, on the pydotorg-www mailing list: http://mail.python.org/mailman/listinfo/pydotorg-www More wiki and website maintainers needed! We

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 10:26 PM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 11:07:59 +0200 Éric Araujo mer...@netwok.org wrote: How about revamping the type/versions fields? Issue type () Feature request (blocked by moratorium: () yes () no) () Bug (found in: [] 2.7 []

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Guido van Rossum
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 5:17 AM, R. David Murray rdmur...@bitdance.com wrote: On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 11:13:46 +0100, Chris Withers ch...@simplistix.co.uk wrote: On 18/09/2010 23:36, Guido van Rossum wrote: course, exists() and isdir() etc. do, and so does realpath(), but the pure parsing

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
But we also have performance, crash, resource usage... Are we suggesting we devise a separate list box for each of these issue types? I must admit, I've never actually found much use for those additional options. If I'm flagging a bug I'll nearly always mark it behaviour, otherwise I'll

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 12:31 AM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: But we also have performance, crash, resource usage... Are we suggesting we devise a separate list box for each of these issue types? I must admit, I've never actually found much use for those additional options.

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
Le samedi 25 septembre 2010 à 00:42 +1000, Nick Coghlan a écrit : I have often used searches on performance or resource usage to find what was needing a review or a patch. I think it would be a mistake to remove those two categories. That purpose would be served just as well by keywords

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Paul Moore
On 24 September 2010 15:29, Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org wrote: I don't think we should try to reimplement what the filesystem does. I think we should just ask the filesystem (how exactly I haven't figured out yet but I expect it will be more OS-specific than filesystem-specific). It will

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Nick Coghlan
On Sat, Sep 25, 2010 at 12:50 AM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: Le samedi 25 septembre 2010 à 00:42 +1000, Nick Coghlan a écrit : I have often used searches on performance or resource usage to find what was needing a review or a patch. I think it would be a mistake to remove

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
But how should a performance improvement be filed? Bug? Feature request? Or should feature request be renamed improvement? It's a feature request (since we won't backport it unless there is a genuine performance problem being addressed as a bug fix). Whether that warrants changing the

[Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Python tracker
ACTIVITY SUMMARY (2010-09-17 - 2010-09-24) Python tracker at http://bugs.python.org/ To view or respond to any of the issues listed below, click on the issue. Do NOT respond to this message. Issues stats: open2533 (+42) closed 19189 (+57) total 21722 (+53) Open issues with patches:

Re: [Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Brett Cannon
I think every week where more bugs are closed than opened should be celebrated! =) Thanks to everyone who closed something this week (and to those that filed good bug reports). On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 09:14, Python tracker sta...@bugs.python.org wrote: ACTIVITY SUMMARY (2010-09-17 - 2010-09-24)

[Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Tim Peters
Looks like 2.7 changes introduced to exempt dicts and tuples from cyclic gc if they obviously can't be in cycles has some unintended consequences. Specifically, if an extension module calls PyObject_GC_UnTrack() on a dict it _does not want tracked_, Python can start tracking the dict again. I

Re: [Python-Dev] Some changes to logging for 3.2

2010-09-24 Thread Vinay Sajip
Chris Withers chris at simplistix.co.uk writes: Cool, how can I use it in Python 2.6? Chris Hi Chris, 1. Copy the top part (imports, QueueHandler and QueueListener classes) from the Gist linked to in the article - http://gist.github.com/591699 - into a utility module you can use again

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Antoine Pitrou
On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 15:14:32 -0400 Tim Peters tim.pet...@gmail.com wrote: Looks like 2.7 changes introduced to exempt dicts and tuples from cyclic gc if they obviously can't be in cycles has some unintended consequences. Specifically, if an extension module calls PyObject_GC_UnTrack() on a

Re: [Python-Dev] Goodbye

2010-09-24 Thread Terry Reedy
On 9/24/2010 1:41 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote: Yes, and we'd all like more people to do more real work. But not everybody has the time or skills. I think this is a case where agreeing to disagree is the best we can do. There is also the matter of letting people start with something they

Re: [Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Georg Brandl
Is it me, or is the open and closed count confusing to anyone else? I.e., shouldn't the total delta equal the sum of the open delta and the closed delta? Georg Am 24.09.2010 20:00, schrieb Brett Cannon: I think every week where more bugs are closed than opened should be celebrated! =) Thanks

Re: [Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 12:57, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: Is it me, or is the open and closed count confusing to anyone else? I.e., shouldn't the total delta equal the sum of the open delta and the closed delta? The total delta is a complete count of bugs, while the open and closed

Re: [Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Georg Brandl
So by opening and closing a bug 5 times within a week, the open and close counters both go up by 5? That would be stupid. Issues can't be open and closed at the same time. There is a count of open issues at the start of the week, and one at the end of the week. There's a difference between

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Jim Fulton
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 3:36 PM, Antoine Pitrou solip...@pitrou.net wrote: On Fri, 24 Sep 2010 15:14:32 -0400 Tim Peters tim.pet...@gmail.com wrote: Looks like 2.7 changes introduced to exempt dicts and tuples from cyclic gc if they obviously can't be in cycles has some unintended

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Martin v. Löwis
I assume this is unintended because (a) the docs weren't changed to warn about this; and, (b) it's wrong ;-) It seems Jim is happy with (or has at least accepted) the behavior change. Would you still like to see it fixed (or, rather, have the 2.6 state restored)? I think it would be possible

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Daniel Stutzbach
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 4:09 PM, Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.dewrote: I think it would be possible to have two versions of _PyGC_REFS_UNTRACKED, one being, say, -5. _PyGC_REFS_UNTRACKED_AND_KEEP_IT_THAT_WAY would be what you get when you call PyObject_GC_UnTrack; the code to do automatic

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Greg Ewing
Paul Moore wrote: I dug into this once, and as far as I could tell, it's possible to get the information on Windows, but there's no way on Linux to ask the filesystem. Maybe we could use a heuristic such as: 1) Search the directory for an exact match to the name given, return it if found.

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Martin v. Löwis
Am 24.09.2010 23:22, schrieb Daniel Stutzbach: On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 4:09 PM, Martin v. Löwis mar...@v.loewis.de mailto:mar...@v.loewis.de wrote: I think it would be possible to have two versions of _PyGC_REFS_UNTRACKED, one being, say, -5.

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Glenn Linderman
On 9/24/2010 3:10 PM, Greg Ewing wrote: Paul Moore wrote: I dug into this once, and as far as I could tell, it's possible to get the information on Windows, but there's no way on Linux to ask the filesystem. Maybe we could use a heuristic such as: 1) Search the directory for an exact match

[Python-Dev] os.path function for “get the re al filename” (was: os.path.normcase rationale ?)

2010-09-24 Thread Ben Finney
Greg Ewing greg.ew...@canterbury.ac.nz writes: Maybe we could use a heuristic such as: Your heuristics seem to assume there will only ever be a maximum of one match, which is false. I present the following example: $ ls foo/ bAr.dat BaR.dat bar.DAT 1) Search the directory for

Re: [Python-Dev] PyObject_GC_UnTrack() no longer reliable in 2.7?

2010-09-24 Thread Tim Peters
[Tim] I assume this is unintended because (a) the docs weren't changed to warn about this; and, (b) it's wrong ;-) [Martin v. Löwis] It seems Jim is happy with (or has at least accepted) the behavior change. Would you still like to see it fixed (or, rather, have the 2.6 state restored)?

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Guido van Rossum
I think that, like os.path.realpath(), it should not fail if the file does not exist. Maybe the API could be called os.path.unnormpath(), since it is in a sense the opposite of normpath() (which removes case) ? But I would want to write it so that even on Unix it scans the filesystem, in case the

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path function for “get the r eal filename” (was: os.path.normcase ra tionale?)

2010-09-24 Thread Guido van Rossum
I think searching a case-sensitive filename for a case-insensitive match should not be offered as part of os.path. Apps that really want to do things like There is no file named README, do you want to use Readme instead? can write their own inefficient code, thank you. --Guido On Fri, Sep 24,

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread James Y Knight
On Sep 24, 2010, at 10:53 AM, Paul Moore wrote: On 24 September 2010 15:29, Guido van Rossum gu...@python.org wrote: I don't think we should try to reimplement what the filesystem does. I think we should just ask the filesystem (how exactly I haven't figured out yet but I expect it will be

Re: [Python-Dev] Summary of Python tracker Issues

2010-09-24 Thread Brett Cannon
On Fri, Sep 24, 2010 at 13:04, Georg Brandl g.bra...@gmx.net wrote: So by opening and closing a bug 5 times within a week, the open and close counters both go up by 5?  That would be stupid. No, as in a bug was re-opened last week and then closed again this week. Issues can't be open and

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path function for “get the re al filename”

2010-09-24 Thread Greg Ewing
Ben Finney wrote: Your heuristics seem to assume there will only ever be a maximum of one match, which is false. I present the following example: $ ls foo/ bAr.dat BaR.dat bar.DAT There should perhaps be an extra step at the beginning: 0) Test whether the specified path refers

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Greg Ewing
Guido van Rossum wrote: Maybe the API could be called os.path.unnormpath(), since it is in a sense the opposite of normpath() (which removes case) ? Cute, but not very intuitive. Something like actualpath() might be better -- although that's somewhat arbitrarily different from realpath(). --

Re: [Python-Dev] os.path.normcase rationale?

2010-09-24 Thread Steven D'Aprano
On Sat, 25 Sep 2010 09:22:47 am Guido van Rossum wrote: I think that, like os.path.realpath(), it should not fail if the file does not exist. Maybe the API could be called os.path.unnormpath(), since it is in a sense the opposite of normpath() (which removes case) ? But I would want to