one global substitute
on my branch. Should we change it? To what?
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-the-world/>
he call. The main reason I'm
> considering these is that `Morsel` was updated back in 3.5 with `copy` and
> `update` overrides:
>
> https://bugs.python.org/issue2211
>
OK, that removes my objection.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronou
o duck the limit.)
> ---
>
> [1] - https://github.com/python/cpython/pull/18603
>
> [2] - The term "minimal" can be interchanged with "trivial" for the most
> part in the above context, but I tend to prefer the former. IMO, it comes
> across as more resp
;re welcome. Thanks for providing the initial impetus to make this
happen! And thanks a lot to Brandt for his implementation work.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015
se of this I think we should also not add `|=` to
MutableMapping, even though it does have an update() method. Adding it
(even with a default implementation) could cause discrepancies to virtual
subclasses registered with MutableMapping.register(C).
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pro
multiprocessing.pool._PoolCache
> - urllib.parse.Quoter
>
Yeah, let's stay away from these.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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_
ay want to update the implementations of defaultdict
and ordereddict. (are there others?)
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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___
han to Brandt's private
branch.)
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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Thank you, thank you! Hopefully we can pull this one over the finish line,
and it won't have to linger for another decade. :-)
On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 8:42 PM Zachary Ware wrote:
> On Tue, Feb 11, 2020 at 9:59 PM Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > The Pull Request title is "Fix
> Message archived at
> https://mail.python.org/archives/list/python-dev@python.org/message/32BFCXWK3SNCTFRGBHQEZW4RQKM2B4MQ/
> Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
>
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here
on the caller's side. The object being called is irrelevant.
>
That's true, but the function name may help the user find the right call in
the code if there are multiple calls on the line.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<ht
How did we move from [*a,...] to print(*a,...)? They are quite different.
On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 14:07 Serhiy Storchaka wrote:
> 06.02.20 08:28, Brandt Bucher пише:
> > Commits 13bc139 and 8a4cd70 introduced subtle changes in the evaluation
> logic of unpacking operations. Previously, all elemen
Then there’s nothing to do here right? Or just add it to whatsnew?
On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 13:20 Brandt Bucher wrote:
> > We should fix that (by reverting to 3.8.1 behaviour) before 3.8.2 gets
> released.
>
> The commits which changed the behavior were bytecode/compiler changes that
> only went t
I like Mark’s new semantics better, but agree with the point about this
being a “feature”.
On Thu, Feb 6, 2020 at 13:06 Paul Moore wrote:
> On Thu, 6 Feb 2020 at 20:17, Mark Shannon wrote:
> >
> > I recently unintentionally changed the semantics of this expression
> > `[print("a"), *None, print
ev.python.org/
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>
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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+1 on everything Raymond says here (and in his second message).
I don't see a need for more classes or ABCs.
On Mon, Feb 3, 2020 at 00:36 Raymond Hettinger
wrote:
> > PyObject_RichCompareBool(x, y, op) has a (valuable!) shortcut: if x and
> y are the same object, then equality comparison return
rg/message/7OMO4HM6KTY54VVF4HXYDMGZG5FUTTW5/
> Code of Conduct: http://python.org/psf/codeofconduct/
>
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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__
d not rush language or stdlib
changes for this purpose.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-the-world/>
___
Py
ints don't have NANs, so there's no harm in allowing the
> interpreter to skip the method call if it knows both operands are actual
> built-in ints.)
>
All this is always understood -- the interpreter can optimize things away
if there's no way for the user to tell (apart fr
er direct use of the `==` and
> `!=` operators are included as "implicit calls" to the dunders. I
> *think* I understand Guido's intention, but I'm not sure:
>
> * x == y MUST call `__eq__`
>
> * likewise x != y MUST call `__ne__`
>
> * but compound object
On Fri, Jan 24, 2020 at 12:36 AM Victor Stinner wrote:
> Le ven. 24 janv. 2020 à 03:37, Guido van Rossum a
> écrit :
> > I think this started with a valuable optimization for `x in `. I
> don't know if that was ever carefully documented, but I remember that it
> was dis
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> Code of Con
aultdict.get() doesn't add the key either.
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___
Python-Dev mai
pt the 2 facts that __missing__ is dict-only
> and .get() will stay somewhat quirky and unexpected but documented.
>
> On Wed, Jan 8, 2020 at 8:11 PM Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
>> Hum, it looks like the UserDict.get() behavior is an accident due to the
>> way Mapping.get() is
> method saying it doesn't call __missing__ for missing values.
> I can also modify UserDict to behave in a consistent manner.
>
> Does that make sense?
>
> On Wed, Jan 8, 2020 at 7:42 PM Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
>> (Note: We received your email twice.)
>>
ot.
>
> Looking forward for your inputs,
> Bar Harel
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while I lived in Amsterdam -- until mid April 1995. These are
accessible as hypertext, converted by Kevin Huges' excellent hypermail
program. (Except the last quarter of 1994, which was -- as an experiment --
maintained by Sam Leffler's MLA tools.)
Shame on me for using closed-source softw
projects) fails to
>> bear fruit, I suspect there is value in maintaining the history of the
>> Python language.
>> >
>> > Thx again...
>> >
>> > Skip
>> >
>>
>> ___
> Python-Dev m
fruit, I suspect there is value in maintaining the history of the
> Python language.
>
> Thx again...
>
> Skip
>
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>
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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To begin with, please compare performance of dict-with-None-values to that
of a set, for operations that can be expressed by both (e.g. both have
update()).
On Mon, Dec 23, 2019 at 18:08 Kyle Stanley wrote:
> Larry Hastings wrote:
> > a hypothetical collections.OrderedSet would probably work jus
On Mon, Dec 16, 2019 at 12:04 PM Serhiy Storchaka
wrote:
> 16.12.19 18:35, Guido van Rossum пише:
> > On Sun, Dec 15, 2019 at 6:09 AM Serhiy Storchaka > <mailto:storch...@gmail.com>> wrote:
> >
> > 1. Forbids calling str() without object if encoding or er
reading correctly, so far this thread has one piece of
> anectodal evidence for that.
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vert an object to a string using __str__.
>
I'm -0 on this. It seems that the presence of either errors= or encoding=
causes str() to switch to "decode bytes" semantics, and a default decoding
of UTF-8. That default makes sense: UTF-8 is our default source encoding,
and we are trending
Actually, for dicts the implementation came first.
On Sun, Dec 15, 2019 at 19:50 Larry Hastings wrote:
>
> That's not a reason why we shouldn't do it. Python is the language where
> speed, correctness, and readability trump performance every time. We
> should decide what semantics we want, the
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size)
and in several cases the implementation went through great lengths to avoid
limits (e.g. we could have avoided a lot of dynamic memory (re)allocation
if we'd limited line lengths or file sizes).
You have an extreme need to justify why we should change now. "An infinite
number of pote
x27;s just another Python object and has no
operating resources associated with it. Perhaps your definition of
coroutine is different, and you are thinking of OS threads?
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-us
Let's try to avoid having PEP discussions in the peps tracker, period. That
repo's tracker is only meant to handle markup and grammar.
But if you want to prevent a PR from being merged, in general you should
put [WIP] in the subject.
On Fri, Dec 6, 2019 at 06:21 Victor Stinner wrote:
> Hi,
>
>
ocesses from
runaway code and intentional attacks on resources. (And yet, fork bombs
exist, and it's easy to fill up a filesystem...) I take from this that
limits are useful, may have to be overridable, and should have values that
make sense given the resource they guard.
--
--Guido van Rossum
uses unicode at all; the kludges around it
were ugly and inefficient. That's why we brought them back.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-the-world/&g
ow do I find the refleak buildbots?
>
> In this page:
>
> https://buildbot.python.org/all/#/builders
>
> all the buildbots that have "Refleaks" in the name. You can click on the
> tags to filter only the "stable" and the ones in master "3.x".
>
-dev-le...@python.org
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>
--
--Guido van Rossum
I think it’s too soon to worry about this. I don’t see a reason to harass
people who maintain code based that were just recently migrated.
On Tue, Dec 3, 2019 at 09:21 Serhiy Storchaka wrote:
> The 'u" string literal prefix was removed in 3.0 and reintroduced in 3.3
> to help writing the code co
; compatibility in advance.
>
>
>>
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> Message arc
from me.
>
>
> Many Thanks,
> Peter.
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ithub.com/berkerpeksag/astor
>
Does that even have unparse() functionality? From the README it seems to
focus on a nicer ast.dump(), which is quite different (in behavior and how
it's used) from unparse().
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
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>
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> > Message archived at
> >
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> >
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>
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DJ7FCA/
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>
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*Pronouns: he/him **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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>
ple=PyTuple_Pack(2,self, param);
> // 2. Create Union with tuple
> PyObject* unionType = PyObject_GetAttrString(typing,"Union");
> PyObject *newUnion=PyObject_GetItem(unionType, tuple);
> // 3. Clean memory
> Py_DECREF(genericAlias);
> Py_DECREF(typing);
&
Pretty embarrassing, I agree. Can you submit a PR?
On Tue, Oct 8, 2019 at 17:38 Rob Cliffe via Python-Dev <
python-dev@python.org> wrote:
> The documentation at
> https://docs.python.org/3.2/library/profile.html
> contains the sentence
> For example, if your_integer_time_func() returns ti
That would mean that all of typing will be imported as part of startup, and
that module is too heavy for that. Also it might end up on recursion.
On Tue, Oct 8, 2019 at 09:06 Brandt Bucher wrote:
> I’m a bit confused. For my own understanding: what’s stopping
> PyObject_IsInstance/PyObject_IsSub
.@python.org
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>
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Regular expressions.
On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:12 Glenn Linderman wrote:
> On 8/10/2019 11:16 AM, Terry Reedy wrote:
>
> On 8/10/2019 4:33 AM, Paul Moore wrote:
>
> (Side issue)
>
>
> This deserves its own thread.
>
> As a Windows developer, who has seen far too many cases where use of
> slashe
On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 8:07 PM Chris Angelico wrote:
> On Sat, Aug 10, 2019 at 12:56 PM Guido van Rossum
> wrote:
> >
> > On Fri, Aug 9, 2019 at 11:06 AM Barry Warsaw wrote:
> >>
> >> Nick and I are now on the same page, so I don’t think we *have* to have
&
motion
passes. I hope Chris A (the third PEP author) can live with this -- in his
last post on the subject that I can find he was still in favor of a
subclass of SyntaxError (in any case he's outvoted by the other two PEP
authors :-).
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/h
This discussion looks like there's no end in sight. Maybe the Steering
Council should take a vote?
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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I don't see how this debate can avoid a vote in the Steering Council.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-using-they-as-a-singular-pronoun-can-change-t
ist.
>
> I'm not sure if that case exists in the ~25000 Qt5 functions, but in
> that case, I think to give that single field the name "unnamed"
> or maybe better "result".
>
> Thank you very much for pointing me to that example!
>
> Cheers -- Chris
>
l?
>
> Things get also a bit more complicated since struct sequence
> objects can contain unnamed fields.
>
> Any advice would be appreciated, I am no typing expert (yet :-)
>
> cheers -- Chris
>
>
> On 30.07.19 17:10, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > I think I have to a
ort lru_cache
> >>> cached_namedtuple = lru_cache(None)(namedtuple)
> >>> n1 = cached_namedtuple('f', ('a', 'b', 'c')) # A tuple rather than a
> list of field names, as lists aren't hashable
> >>> n2 = cached_namedtuple(&
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On Sun, Jul 28, 2019 at 1:25 PM Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> On Fri, 26 Jul 2019 19:09:35 -0700
> Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > See the thread 'The trouble with "Easy" issues' in
> > core-mentors...@python.org.
> > Essentially those "easy" issue
On Sat, Jul 27, 2019 at 8:46 PM Steve Dower wrote:
> On 26Jul.2019 1909, Guido van Rossum wrote:
> > See the thread 'The trouble with "Easy" issues' in
> > core-mentors...@python.org <mailto:core-mentors...@python.org>.
> > Essentially those "
this was already discussed
> in the initial thread, I don't have access to core-mentorship.
>
I don't know yet. You can watch updates to the devguide to find out.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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"easy" aimed at somewhat different targets?
>
> Skip
>
>
> Skip
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what this side should be.
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>
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--Guido van Rossum (python.o
ent
without a separate pass to make sure you don't try to assign to a call, and
it would allow a much more elegant approach to keyword arguments and the
walrus operator.)
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/0
There's a user on GitHub ('experimentalles') who has created random PRs on
several projects (e.g. https://github.com/python/peps/pull/1116). Can we
ban them? The PRs look the work of a vandal or a bot, not of a clueless
human.
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Prono
w should we
> do platform-specific conditions".
>
> Cheers,
> Steve
> ___________
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ight. And static analysis should also be able to detect most uses of
locals() in a frame. I believe I've heard of some alternate Python
implementations that detect usage of some functions to disable some
optimizations (IIRC IronPython did this to sys._getframe()).
--
--Guido van Rossum (python
-dev
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___
Indeed.
On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 11:07 PM Greg Ewing
wrote:
> Nick Coghlan wrote:
> > Having a single locals() call de-optimize an entire function would be
> > far from ideal.
>
> I don't see what would be so bad about that. The vast majority
> of functions have no need for locals().
>
> --
> Gre
So why is it “hellish” for JITs if locals() returns a proxy, while
frame.f_locals being a proxy is okay?
On Tue, May 28, 2019 at 9:12 PM Nick Coghlan wrote:
> (I'll likely write a more detailed reply once I'm back on an actual
> computer, but wanted to send an initial response while folks in the
? (There used
to be some relevant builtins that took dicts but not general
MutableMappings -- but that has been fixed long ago.)
--
--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03/how-usi
he code of conduct.) I'd be happy to know how I can improve.
>
>
> And now, I'm off to get the implementation reviewed!
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>
> > Consistency across contexts: it's surprising if locals() has acts
> > differently in module/class scope versus function scope. This argues
> > for [proxy].
>
> True as far as it goes, but its also true that for the longest time, in
> mo
May 27, 2019 at 9:16 AM Guido van Rossum wrote:
> >
> > I re-ran your examples and found that some of them fail.
> >
> > On Mon, May 27, 2019 at 8:17 AM Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> [...]
> >> The interaction between f_locals and and locals() is also subtle:
> &g
ng it.
>
>
> # Conclusion so far
>
> [PEP-minus-tracing] seems to strictly dominate [PEP]. It's equal or
> better on all criteria, and actually *more* compatible with all the
> legacy code I looked at, even though it's technically less consistent
> with what CP
he new version,
> otherwise you are just forcing the programmer to be making the copies
> explicitly.
>
> --
> Richard Damon
>
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functions), I don't
think that what you describe here is too worrisome a scenario.
On Sat, May 25, 2019 at 2:09 PM Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Sat, May 25, 2019, 07:38 Guido van Rossum wrote:
>
>> This looks great.
>>
>> I only have two nits with the text.
>>
e_LocalsToFast``,
> were
> removed in the migration to Python 3: ``exec`` is no longer a statement
> (and
> hence can no longer affect function local namespaces), and the compiler
> now
> disallows the use of ``from module import *`` operations at function
> scope
> * however,
/cpython/pull/9461 should fix most of the
> annoyances with test_nntplib. It uses a local server instead of an
> external one.
>
> --Berker
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oine.
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>&g
)
>
> -eric
>
>
> [1] https://www.python.org/dev/peps/pep-0544/#implementation-details
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odule still
has fans. Threatening to open a CVE is more likely to reduce support for
the PEP than it is to convince anyone.
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
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ython.org
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--Guido van Rossum (python.org/~guido)
*Pronouns: he/him/his **(why is my pronoun here?)*
<http://feministing.com/2015/02/03
OK, sounds like nntplib can stay — this time.
On Tue, May 21, 2019 at 08:33 Antoine Pitrou wrote:
>
> As I said, if the main annoyance with nntplib is the sporadic test
> failures, then the relevant tests can be disabled on CI.
>
> NNTP itself is still used, even if less and less.
>
> Regards
>
e documentation, if we want to endorse them. But just as
> we're not removing `array` in favor of `numpy`, we shouldn't remove
> colorsys either. Colorsys is not dead, it's just small.
>
> I assume one of the reasons colorspacio
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