On 30Nov2018 1435, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
Sorry. I've been unfair and unduly antagonistic.
Apology is totally accepted and all is forgiven. Thank you.
Cheers,
Steve
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On Thu, 29 Nov 2018 10:46:23 -0800
Steve Dower wrote:
>
> I've previously volunteered to move certain modules to their own PyPI
> packages and bundle them (omitting package names to avoid upsetting
> people again), and I've done various analyses of which modules can be
> moved out. I've also
On Fri, Nov 30, 2018 at 01:45:17AM +, Oscar Benjamin wrote:
> They do include much more than we need so I'd agree that Anaconda is a
> nuclear reactor. The things I want from it are not though. Numpy is
> not a nuclear reactor: at it's core it's just providing a
> multidimensional array.
And
On Fri, 30 Nov 2018 11:14:47 +1100
Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
> There are plenty of other languages that come with a tiny stdlib and
> leave everything else to third parties. Outside of those like
> Javascript, which has a privileged position due to it being the standard
> browser scripting
On Fri, 30 Nov 2018 at 00:17, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
> Especially not *Paul's* problems, as I understand he personally is
> reasonably satisfied with the stdlib and doesn't use any of those
> third-party distros. (Paul, did I get that right?)
That's correct. And not just "reasonably satisfied" -
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 5:48 PM Oscar Benjamin
wrote:
> There have been significant improvements in pip, pypi and the whole
> packaging ecosystem in recent years thanks to the efforts of many
> including Paul. I've been pushing students and others to Anaconda
> simply because I knew that at
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 1:33 PM Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> > > https://anaconda.com/
> > > https://www.activestate.com/products/activepython/
> > > http://winpython.github.io/
> > > http://python-xy.github.io/
> > > https://www.enthought.com/product/canopy/
> > >
On Fri, 30 Nov 2018 at 00:17, Steven D'Aprano wrote:
>
> On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 01:30:28PM -0800, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
>
> [...]
> > > > https://anaconda.com/
> > > > https://www.activestate.com/products/activepython/
> > > > http://winpython.github.io/
> > > > http://python-xy.github.io/
> >
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 01:30:28PM -0800, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
[...]
> > > https://anaconda.com/
> > > https://www.activestate.com/products/activepython/
> > > http://winpython.github.io/
> > > http://python-xy.github.io/
> > > https://www.enthought.com/product/canopy/
> > >
On Thu, 29 Nov 2018 at 21:33, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
>
> On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:22 AM Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> >
> > Le 29/11/2018 à 19:07, Steve Dower a écrit :
> > > On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> > >> I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
> > >>
On 29/11/2018 22.08, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
> On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM Christian Heimes
> wrote:
>> You are assuming that you can convince or force upstream developers to
>> change their project and development style. Speaking from personal
>> experience, that is even unrealistic for
On 29Nov2018 1330, Nathaniel Smith wrote:
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:22 AM Antoine Pitrou wrote:
Le 29/11/2018 à 19:07, Steve Dower a écrit :
On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
inventing an extended distribution which
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:22 AM Antoine Pitrou wrote:
>
> Le 29/11/2018 à 19:07, Steve Dower a écrit :
> > On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> >> I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
> >> inventing an extended distribution which doesn't exist (except as
> >>
On 29Nov2018 1229, Paul Moore wrote:
On Thu, 29 Nov 2018 at 18:09, Steve Dower wrote:
Maintaining a list of "we recommend these so
strongly here's an installer that will give them to you" is a very
different kind of burden, and one that is significantly easier to bear.
OK, so that reduces
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 10:11 AM Christian Heimes wrote:
> You are assuming that you can convince or force upstream developers to
> change their project and development style. Speaking from personal
> experience, that is even unrealistic for projects that are already
> developed and promoted by
On Thu, 29 Nov 2018 at 18:09, Steve Dower wrote:
>
> On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> > I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
> > inventing an extended distribution which doesn't exist (except as
> > Anaconda) to justify that we shouldn't accept more modules
On 29Nov2018 1020, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
It's just _hard_
and an awful lot of work, and apparently you're not volunteering to
start it. So saying "we should make an extended distribution" if you're
just waiting for others to do the job doesn't sound convincing to me, it
just feels like you are
On Thu, 29 Nov 2018 19:08:56 +0100
Christian Heimes wrote:
>
> The owners and developers of these projects set their own terms and
> don't follow the same rigorous CI, backwards compatibility and security
> policies as Python core. You can't force projects to work differently.
Who's talking
Le 29/11/2018 à 19:07, Steve Dower a écrit :
> On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
>> I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
>> inventing an extended distribution which doesn't exist (except as
>> Anaconda) to justify that we shouldn't accept more modules in the
On 29/11/2018 18.23, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
>
> Le 29/11/2018 à 18:17, Christian Heimes a écrit :
>>
>> If we would keep the standard distribution of Python as it is and just
>> have a Python SIG offer an additional extended distribution on
>> python.org, then I don't have to care about the
On 29Nov2018 0923, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
I think the whole argument amounts to hand waving anyway. You are
inventing an extended distribution which doesn't exist (except as
Anaconda) to justify that we shouldn't accept more modules in the
stdlib. But obviously maintaining an extended
Le 29/11/2018 à 18:17, Christian Heimes a écrit :
>
> If we would keep the standard distribution of Python as it is and just
> have a Python SIG offer an additional extended distribution on
> python.org, then I don't have to care about the quality and security of
> additional code. The Python
meta: I'm not participating in this sub-thread. Just changing the subject
line.
On Thu, Nov 29, 2018 at 9:17 AM Christian Heimes
wrote:
> On 29/11/2018 17.32, Antoine Pitrou wrote:
> > We may ask ourselves if there is really a large difference between a
> > "standard distribution" and a
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