On Jun 10, 3:36 pm, Arnaud Delobelle arno...@gmail.com wrote:
On 10 June 2012 07:16, rusi rustompm...@gmail.com wrote:
This is worth a read in this
context:http://osteele.com/archives/2004/11/ides
Interesting! I definitely fall nicely at one extreme of this
dichotomy. Every time I've
It would not be difficult to convince me to commit homicide for
a Delphi-like Python gui machine that runs on a Linux box. I
have played with many - Boa, WxDes, Glade, Tk, Dabo, QtDesigner,
Card, etc.
Not sure whether you tried it enough on Linux, but Boa (which was
intended to be kind of
On 6/19/2012 6:07 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
And the lack of success of Python so far to replace, in your
application case, Labview, or, in my application case, all those
proprietary 4GL IDEs/frameworks/GUI builders (just check the success
that Realbasic has) proves imho that the Python
In article jr4pcc$fl3$1...@dont-email.me,
Kevin Walzer k...@codebykevin.com wrote:
On 6/11/12 8:01 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
Tkinter is imho honestly the very best argument if you want to make
potential new users turn their backs away from Python for good. Just
show them one GUI implemented
On 6/22/2012 11:53 AM, Albert van der Horst wrote:
In article jr4pcc$fl3$1...@dont-email.me,
Kevin Walzer k...@codebykevin.com wrote:
On 6/11/12 8:01 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
Tkinter is imho honestly the very best argument if you want to make
potential new users turn their backs away from
Albert van der Horst於 2012年6月22日星期五UTC+8下午11時53分01秒寫道：
In article jr4pcc$fl3$1...@dont-email.me,
Kevin Walzer k...@codebykevin.com wrote:
On 6/11/12 8:01 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
Tkinter is imho honestly the very best argument if you want to make
potential new users turn their backs away
No matter how cool it may seem to create simple GUIs manually or to
write business letters using LaTeX: just try to persuade people to
move from Word to LaTeX for business letters...
Good example.
I have done nearly exactly this* - but it was only possible thanks
to LyX.
*I
On Thu, 14 Jun 2012 12:59:23 -0700 (PDT)
CM cmpyt...@gmail.com wrote:
On Jun 14, 2:25 pm, Wolfgang Keller felip...@gmx.net wrote:
What is needed for domain specialists are frameworks and related
tools such as GUI builders that allow them to write exclusively the
domain-specific code
Am 15.06.2012 01:07, schrieb Dennis Lee Bieber:
Visual Basic was essentially developed as a unified whole (drop a
Sure. I prefer modular approaches. I don't see why this should not be
possible (e.g. an IDE like Wing integrates well with other tools and
frameworks; I'm sure it could also
Am 13.06.2012 18:30, schrieb rdst...@mac.com:
about Google's Blockly a drag and drop tool for building apps that
outputs Python or Javascript code (among others) and it might be
usable along these lines...I'm sure serious programmers would not use
it but maybe engineers looking to make web front
Dietmar quotes:
With Python not having an easy-to-use GUI builder,
The point is, that if you want to promote Python as replacement
for e.g. VB, Labview etc., then an easy-to-use GUI builder is required.
The typical GUI programs will just have an input mask, a button and one
or two output
None of these were such that I could propagate it as GUI development
tool for non-programmers / casual users.
Sure, some are good for designing the GUI, but at the point where
the user code is to be added, most people would be lost.
There was a time when that was a highly advertisable
object mainwindow=GTK2.Window(GTK2.WindowToplevel);
mainwindow-set_title(Timing)-set_default_size
(400,300)-signal_connect(destroy,window_destroy); GTK2.HbuttonBox
btns=GTK2.HbuttonBox()-set_layout(GTK2.BUTTONBOX_SPREAD); foreach
(labels,string lbl)
Danger: Flame ahead!
I think efforts to make a better, and more definitive, GUI builder
for Python should focus on makigng an easy to use IDE for creating
these kinds of Python-HTMl-Javascript front ends for applications.
The idea of so-called web applications is a cerebral flatulance
On Jun 14, 2:25 pm, Wolfgang Keller felip...@gmx.net wrote:
What is needed for domain specialists are frameworks and related tools
such as GUI builders that allow them to write exclusively the
domain-specific code (this is where a domain specialist will always be
better than any software
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:55:38 +0200, Dietmar Schwertberger wrote:
As long as there's no GUI
builder for Python, most people will stick to Excel / VBA / VB.
No GUI builder for Python? There are plenty.
I use wxGlade with wxPython and it works beautifully. It writes the code
for the GUI
Am 14.06.2012 22:06, schrieb Colin Higwell:
On Tue, 12 Jun 2012 00:55:38 +0200, Dietmar Schwertberger wrote:
As long as there's no GUI
builder for Python, most people will stick to Excel / VBA / VB.
No GUI builder for Python? There are plenty.
Yes, sorry. I posted that too late in the night.
Am 13.06.2012 14:49, schrieb Wolfgang Keller:
No matter how cool it may seem to create simple GUIs manually or to
write business letters using LaTeX: just try to persuade people to
move from Word to LaTeX for business letters...
Good example.
I have done nearly exactly this* - but it was only
* Domain experts in fact who would need to implement loads of
software to help them get their work done but can't. And since
there's no budget for external developers, nothing get's ever done
about this.
Well, typically or at least very often sooner or later something
gets done about
Tkinter is imho honestly the very best argument if you want to
make potential new users turn their backs away from Python for
good. Just show them one GUI implemented with it and, hey, wait,
where are you running to...
Yes, Tkinter GUI's are very ugly.
No matter how cool it may seem to create simple GUIs manually or to
write business letters using LaTeX: just try to persuade people to
move from Word to LaTeX for business letters...
Good example.
I have done nearly exactly this* - but it was only possible thanks to
LyX.
Sincerely,
Wolfgang
I think this is the wave of the furture for deploying simple programs
to many users. It is almost 100% cross platform (can be used on
desktop, smartphone, tablet, windows, linux, mac etc) and is very easy
to do, even for casual non-programmers who do a little programming
(such as many
On Jun 11, 6:55 pm, Dietmar Schwertberger n...@schwertberger.de
wrote:
But then we're back to the initial point: As long as there's no GUI
builder for Python, most people will stick to Excel / VBA / VB.
Then good thing there *are* GUI builder/IDEs for Python, one of which
was good enough for
On Jun 10, 12:37 pm, Dietmar Schwertberger maill...@schwertberger.de
wrote:
Personally, I prefer Python with console, wx or Qt for local
applications and Python/HTTP/HTML/Javascript for multi-user
database applications.
Regards,
Dietmar
+1
I think this is the wave of the furture for
What GUI designer would come the closest to the way that Cocoa's
Interface Builder works? I.e. is there any one (cross-platform) that
allows to actually connect the GUI created directly to the code
and make it available live in an IDE?
This whole cycle of design GUI-generate code-add
What GUI designer would come the closest to the way that Cocoa's
Interface Builder works? I.e. is there any one (cross-platform) that
allows to actually connect the GUI created directly to the code
and make it available live in an IDE?
If you're developing on the Mac, PyObjC allows you
On 6/11/12 8:01 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
Tkinter is imho honestly the very best argument if you want to make
potential new users turn their backs away from Python for good. Just
show them one GUI implemented with it and, hey, wait, where are you
running to...
Yes, Tkinter GUI's are very
On 11/06/2012 13:47, Kevin Walzer wrote:
Yes, Tkinter GUI's are very ugly.
http://www.codebykevin.com/phynchronicity-running.png
http://www.codebykevin.com/quickwho-main.png
At last we're getting to the crux of the matter. Provided that the GUI
is pretty who cares about picking
Wolfgang Keller felip...@gmx.net writes:
This whole cycle of design GUI-generate code-add own code to
generated code-run application with GUI has always seemed very
un-pythonic to me. A dynamic, interpreted language should allow to work
in a more lively, direct way to build a GUI.
What about
Am 11.06.2012 06:05, schrieb rusi:
If python is really a language maven's language then it does not do
very well:
- its not as object-oriented as Ruby (or other arcana like Eiffel)
- its not as functional as Haskell
- its not as integrable as Lua
- its not as close-to-bare-metal as C
- etc
Am 11.06.2012 14:01, schrieb Wolfgang Keller:
* Domain experts in fact who would need to implement loads of
software to help them get their work done but can't. And since there's
no budget for external developers, nothing get's ever done about this.
Well, typically or at least very often sooner
Am 11.06.2012 16:14, schrieb Anssi Saari:
Wolfgang Kellerfelip...@gmx.net writes:
This whole cycle of design GUI-generate code-add own code to
generated code-run application with GUI has always seemed very
un-pythonic to me. A dynamic, interpreted language should allow to work
in a more
Am 11.06.2012 16:09, schrieb Mark Roseman:
On the Tkinter front, I just want to reiterate two important points that
are not nearly as well known as they should be.
First, it is possible and in fact easy to do decent looking GUI's in
Tkinter, with the caveat that you do in fact have to do
Am 11.06.2012 01:15, schrieb Chris Angelico:
If you're a complete non-programmer, then of course that's an opaque
block of text. But to a programmer, it ought to be fairly readable -
Well, I can read the code.
But still I would not be able (or interested) to write C++/GTK code.
With my rusty
On Jun 10, 11:05 pm, rusi rustompm...@gmail.com wrote:
If python is really a language maven's language then it does not do
very well:
- its not as object-oriented as Ruby (or other arcana like Eiffel)
if it were object-oreiented as Ruby, then why not use Ruby?
- its not as functional as
On Jun 11, 9:09 am, Mark Roseman m...@markroseman.com wrote:
Second, there does exist at least one fairly good source of
documentation for new users wishing to do exactly this (according to
many, many comments I have received), though that documentation is
admittedly buried in a sea of
On Jun 9, 10:07 pm, Dietmar Schwertberger n...@schwertberger.de
wrote:
And you can than go in the code editor to that function and change the
code to do whatever you want.
Having to go there is already more work than I would expect.
I would expect to go there e.g. by a double-click.
This
On 10 June 2012 07:16, rusi rustompm...@gmail.com wrote:
This is worth a read in this context: http://osteele.com/archives/2004/11/ides
Interesting! I definitely fall nicely at one extreme of this
dichotomy. Every time I've tried to use an IDE, it's made me feel
inadequate and I've quickly
Am 10.06.2012 08:16, schrieb rusi:
This is worth a read in this context: http://osteele.com/archives/2004/11/ides
So which language would you suggest to use next? ;-)
I've read the article. It presents some nice ideas, but probably the
author has not used Python before.
Otherwise he would have
On 6/8/12 8:27 AM, Wolfgang Keller wrote:
What GUI designer would come the closest to the way that Cocoa's
Interface Builder works? I.e. is there any one (cross-platform) that
allows to actually connect the GUI created directly to the code and
make it available live in an IDE?
If you're
On Jun 8, 7:27 am, Wolfgang Keller felip...@gmx.net wrote:
This whole cycle of design GUI-generate code-add own code to
generated code-run application with GUI has always seemed very
un-pythonic to me. A dynamic, interpreted language should allow to work
in a more lively, direct way to build
On Jun 9, 8:25 am, Dietmar Schwertberger n...@schwertberger.de
wrote:
Before anyone now writes Good GUIs are coded by hand:
I agree, but for many purposes only simple GUIs are required
and it should be possible to create these without studying manuals
(on toolkit and GUI editor).
It is
(Sorry for posting without references to the previous messages, but it
seems that many messages don't get through to the nntp server that I'm
using.)
Chris Angelico wrote (in two posts):
There was a time when that was a highly advertisable feature - build
XYZ applications without writing a
Am 10.06.2012 21:36, schrieb Rick Johnson:
It is possible. Try Tkinter for the get-you-from-a-to-b solution,
or, wxPython if you like fog lamps, heated seats, and navigation
systems.
I prefer wx or Qt. The look and feel is one reason.
But the fact that Tkinter is still the standard GUI toolkit
On Jun 10, 2:36 pm, Rick Johnson rantingrickjohn...@gmail.com wrote:
#
# Or become a pro and create reusable objects!
#
class LE(tk.Frame):
def __init__(self, master, **kw):
tk.Frame.__init__(self, master)
self.l = tk.Label(self, **kw)
self.l.pack(side=LEFT)
On Mon, Jun 11, 2012 at 5:37 AM, Dietmar Schwertberger
maill...@schwertberger.de wrote:
Chris Angelico wrote (in two posts):
There was a time when that was a highly advertisable feature - build
XYZ applications without writing a single line of code!. I've seen it
in database front-end
On Jun 10, 4:52 pm, Dietmar Schwertberger n...@schwertberger.de
wrote:
Am 10.06.2012 08:16, schrieb rusi: This is worth a read in this
context:http://osteele.com/archives/2004/11/ides
I've read the article. It presents some nice ideas, but probably the
author has not used Python before.
Am 08.06.2012 17:11, schrieb CM:
I'm curious about your point but I don't really understand it. Could
you try again without using any scare-quoted words? Maybe given an
example of creating a small text editor application with a GUI builder/
IDE in this Pythonic way you are hoping for.
Before
I think that something in the style of Visual BASIC (version 6) is required
for either wxPython or PyQt/PySide (or both).
In the Visual BASIC editor you can e.g. add a GUI element
and directly go to the code editor to fill methods (e.g. an OnClick
method).
You can do this for wxPython with
On Sat, Jun 9, 2012 at 11:25 PM, Dietmar Schwertberger
n...@schwertberger.de wrote:
... for many purposes only simple GUIs are required
and it should be possible to create these without studying manuals
(on toolkit and GUI editor).
A typical simple GUI would e.g. be for a measurement / data
Am 09.06.2012 17:34, schrieb CM:
You can do this for wxPython with Boa Constructor easily. You can
bind an event handler for a wx.EVT_BUTTON to, e.g., Button1 with Boa
and it will add this code for you to the bottom of your code:
def OnButton1Button(self,evt):
evt.Skip()
And you can
On Sun, Jun 10, 2012 at 3:07 AM, Dietmar Schwertberger
n...@schwertberger.de wrote:
None of these were such that I could propagate it as GUI development
tool for non-programmers / casual users.
Sure, some are good for designing the GUI, but at the point where
the user code is to be added, most
On Jun 8, 8:27 am, Wolfgang Keller felip...@gmx.net wrote:
I want a gui designer that writes the gui code for me. I don't want to
write gui code. what is the gui designer that is most popular?
I tried boa-constructor, and it works, but I am concerned about how
dated it seems to be with no
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