Re: QuadDoubler

[the pickle]

At 20:23 -0500 on 27/12/02, Dan Knight wrote:

>Dan Palka writes:
>
>>Well I'll tell you all it was NOT worth the incredible price I paid for all
>>of this stuff.
>>
>>I did not buy it on ebay because I hate ebay.  Instead I bought them from a
>>reseller.  This QuadDoubler with warrantee in a Centris 650 board and 128
>>megs of RAM cost me about $200.  And the damn thing doesnt even work in the
>>Q800.
>
>The Sonnet QuadDoubler was a very clever hack with one significant
>drawback: It had to be specifically designed for a single computer. There
>was a 40/80 MHz model for the Centris 610, a 50/100 for the Quadra 610,
>and a different 50/100 for the Centris 650. Other ones for the Quadra
>610, 660av, 700, and 900 have been discontinued.

There isn't any good reason that a model designed for a 25 MHz Mac can't run in
*any* 25 MHz Mac, except for physical fit reasons (like why the cache modules
for the 700 won't work in a 605 with LC PDS cards installed), unless Sonnet
specifically designed them *not* to work...

Thus the one that works in the C650 ought to work in the 610s, 660avs, 700, and
900, but nothing is ever gonna work in the 800 and 950.
-- 

the pickle

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Re: QuadDoubler

[Dan Knight]

Dan Palka writes:

>Well I'll tell you all it was NOT worth the incredible price I paid for all
>of this stuff.
>
>I did not buy it on ebay because I hate ebay.  Instead I bought them from a
>reseller.  This QuadDoubler with warrantee in a Centris 650 board and 128
>megs of RAM cost me about $200.  And the damn thing doesnt even work in the
>Q800.

The Sonnet QuadDoubler was a very clever hack with one significant 
drawback: It had to be specifically designed for a single computer. There 
was a 40/80 MHz model for the Centris 610, a 50/100 for the Quadra 610, 
and a different 50/100 for the Centris 650. Other ones for the Quadra 
610, 660av, 700, and 900 have been discontinued.

The clever thing is the way it doubled the normal clock speed and 
provided about 80-90% more horsepower. The sad thing is that Motorola 
never got the '040 to the point where they could revise the QuadDoubler 
for a 33 MHz Quadra 650 or 800 -- let alone the stunningly cool 840av.

Before spending $200 on a computer upgrade, do enough research to make 
sure it will work in your computer. Worse yet, you could have bought one 
for $99.95 direct from Sonnet





-- 
Dan Knight, president, Cobweb Publishing, Inc.
  
  
   

I like nonsense, it wakes up the brain cells. Fantasy is a necessary
ingredient in living, it's a way of looking at life through the wrong
end of a telescope and that enables you to laugh at life's realities.
  -- Dr. Seuss


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Re: QuadDoubler

[the pickle]

At 12:16 -0600 on 24/12/02, Dan Palka wrote:

>I still don't know what I'm going to do about MicroMac.  Should I call them?
>Complain?

Well, it *was* guaranteed to work in *yours*, which it didn't, so you have a
legitimate reason to send it back and request your $200 back...

I still want to see a scan of that board.  If your benchmark results are
correct, that 650 board is running about 50% faster than it's "supposed" to be.
-- 

the pickle

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Re: QuadDoubler

[Damond Walker]

> In my opinion, the QuadDoubler is not much more than
> a curiosity


It amazes me that they still insist on selling these things for as much as
they do.  They ought to be giving them away these days...

Damond


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Re: QuadDoubler

[Dan Palka]

Well I'll tell you all it was NOT worth the incredible price I paid for all
of this stuff.

I did not buy it on ebay because I hate ebay.  Instead I bought them from a
reseller.  This QuadDoubler with warrantee in a Centris 650 board and 128
megs of RAM cost me about $200.  And the damn thing doesnt even work in the
Q800.

No it was not worth it all.  Thank god I have money to waste.

I still don't know what I'm going to do about MicroMac.  Should I call them?
Complain?

DONT BUY FROM MICROMAC

on 12/24/02 11:28 AM, Robert J. Johansen at [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:

> I was glad to read of Dan's success with his 'doubler. I share his mixed
> feelings, though. It seems to me that the performance bump you get from these
> things is not worth the trouble or expense of dealing with them. If you can
> get one cheap (under $30-40) and don't expect miracles, go ahead. But the fact
> is that you can get a PPC upgrade for most Quads for $60-80 on eBay and really
> get a performance boost. In my opinion, the QuadDoubler is not much more than
> a curiosity


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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[PsycoPunkn]

It is DEFINITELY a Centris 650 board.  You dont need to double check, it will be a 
waste of time, because it is DEFINITELY a Centris 650.
Anyway, Im interested in this accelerator that will work in a Quadra 950.  Does it 
plug into the processor slot or the PDS slot?

Chris

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Re: QuadDoubler

[Robert J. Johansen]

Dear Quadraphiles:

Sorry I'm coming late to this party, but this time of year is pretty busy for
us clergy-types, so I've been behind on my e-mail. 

The pickle alluded to my experience with QuadDoublers yesterday when he wrote:

> If it has its own clock generator (where's Rob Johanssen when you need him?)
> then it should work just fine.

The Pickle and I had a look over a QuadDoubler-type gadget (see below) last
summer. 

QuadDoublers DO NOT have their own clock chips. They do exactly what the name
implies, double the clock speed (bus speed) of the main oscillator. They have
a little chip on them which effects this. 

The only gadget I'm aware of with it's own clock generator is something made
by Newer Tech in the early 90's for the Q950, which will run that machine at
50 mHz. It has its own Motorola clock generator chip which is programmable to
1.33, 1.5, and 2.0 times the oscillator frequency. It also has what appears to
be its own on-board cache. The CPU has an integral cooling fan on its
heatsink. I have tried that in my 950, and it did boot and report a speed of
50mHz. However, I could not get it to run stably under OS 7.6.1. It brought up
all kinds of strange errors, bombs and hangs. Furthermore, the software that
came with it did not appear to function. I have always meant to experiment
with backing the OS down to 7.5 or 7.1, and putting scrupulously tested 60 ns
RAM in it, but this 950 is heavily used and I just haven't gotten around to
that project yet. 

I've tried QuadDoublers in several different machines, with mixed results. I
have tried running one in my Q950, and it's not a matter of overheating: the
thing won't even start up. You just can't get that thing to run at 66 mHz. It
will work in a Q700. I even put it into a Q605 for grins, and it worked OK
there, though you couldn't close the case back up. It was kind of neat playing
Doom II for an hour or so on that 605 cooking along at 50 mHz. 

I was glad to read of Dan's success with his 'doubler. I share his mixed
feelings, though. It seems to me that the performance bump you get from these
things is not worth the trouble or expense of dealing with them. If you can
get one cheap (under $30-40) and don't expect miracles, go ahead. But the fact
is that you can get a PPC upgrade for most Quads for $60-80 on eBay and really
get a performance boost. In my opinion, the QuadDoubler is not much more than
a curiosity. 

Pax,

Fr. Rob Johansen

-- 

A computer without Windows is like a dog without bricks tied to its head.


Fr. Rob Johansen
St. Joseph, Michigan

Check out my Blog at: http://www.ThrownBack.blogspot.com

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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[John Laughlin]

>They both had Ethernet on-board, and neither would benchmark faster in
>Speedometer.

Er, not necessarily.  Remember, the 4MB Centris 650 doesn't have ethernet,
or a full '040.  So, there's a GOOD chance that the board Dan has is the
base Centris 650 board.
>--
>
>the pickle
>
-J



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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[P . F . Grenier]

On Monday, Dec 23, 2002, at 22:32 US/Eastern, the pickle wrote:

> At 22:28 -0500 on 23/12/02, P.F.Grenier wrote:
>
>> On Monday, Dec 23, 2002, at 22:03 US/Eastern, the pickle wrote:
>>
>>> At 13:52 -0600 on 23/12/02, Dan Palka wrote:
>>>
 On close inspection, I was rather surpirsed that whatever 
 motherboard
 MicroMac
 sent me is an exact replica of the Quadra 800 motherboard, EXCEPT 
 for
 a couple
 of chips missing...
>>>
>>> Got a scanner?
>>> --
>>>
>>> the pickle
>>>
>>
>> The Quadra 800=Quadra 650 and very similar to the Centris 650, could
>> that be what you have?
>
> They both had Ethernet on-board, and neither would benchmark faster in
> Speedometer.
> -- 

Early Centris 650's didn't have the AAUI and only had 4MB ram on board.


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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[the pickle]

At 22:28 -0500 on 23/12/02, P.F.Grenier wrote:

>On Monday, Dec 23, 2002, at 22:03 US/Eastern, the pickle wrote:
>
>> At 13:52 -0600 on 23/12/02, Dan Palka wrote:
>>
>>> On close inspection, I was rather surpirsed that whatever motherboard
>>> MicroMac
>>> sent me is an exact replica of the Quadra 800 motherboard, EXCEPT for
>>> a couple
>>> of chips missing...
>>
>> Got a scanner?
>> --
>>
>> the pickle
>>
>
>The Quadra 800=Quadra 650 and very similar to the Centris 650, could
>that be what you have?

They both had Ethernet on-board, and neither would benchmark faster in
Speedometer.
-- 

the pickle

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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[P . F . Grenier]

On Monday, Dec 23, 2002, at 22:03 US/Eastern, the pickle wrote:

> At 13:52 -0600 on 23/12/02, Dan Palka wrote:
>
>> On close inspection, I was rather surpirsed that whatever motherboard 
>> MicroMac
>> sent me is an exact replica of the Quadra 800 motherboard, EXCEPT for 
>> a couple
>> of chips missing...
>
> Got a scanner?
> -- 
>
> the pickle
>

The Quadra 800=Quadra 650 and very similar to the Centris 650, could 
that be what you have?


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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[the pickle]

At 13:52 -0600 on 23/12/02, Dan Palka wrote:

>On close inspection, I was rather surpirsed that whatever motherboard MicroMac
>sent me is an exact replica of the Quadra 800 motherboard, EXCEPT for a couple
>of chips missing...

Got a scanner?
-- 

the pickle

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Re: QuadDoubler results are in!!!

[PsycoPunkn]

Yes, the Centris 650 board with 50MHz 68040 you have seems to outperform 
a Quadra 800.  However, a Quadra 800 can be clock chipped to 44MHz, or 48MHz 
if you dont need the serial ports.  That processor speed combined with an 
equivelant bus speed, however, may outperform a 50MHz 68040 on a 25MHz bus.  
And though it would take some soldering, if you have the correct solder and a 
soldering iron, would only cost $5.  That being said, you may be able to bumb 
the speed of the MicroMac to 55MHz, give or take.

Chris

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Re: Quaddoubler Problem

[the pickle]

At 16:46 -0400 on 26/06/02, Haroon wrote:

>which doesn't seem to be cooling it effectively.  Anyone think replacing
>the fan on the Quaddoubler with the original Quadra heatsink would yield
>better results?

How about a heatsink/fan combo?

the pickle

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Re: Quaddoubler Problem

[the pickle]

At 16:46 -0400 on 26/06/02, Haroon wrote:

>which doesn't seem to be cooling it effectively.  Anyone think replacing
>the fan on the Quaddoubler with the original Quadra heatsink would yield
>better results?

How about a heatsink/fan combo?

the pickle

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Re: Quaddoubler Problem

[Michael Emery]

Haroon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>:

I noticed the Quaddoubler pictured on Sonnet's web site 
does not have a fan, but a heatsink. For some reason my 
Quaddoubler has a fan attached, which doesn't seem to be 
cooling it effectively. Anyone think replacing the fan 
on the Quaddoubler with the original Quadra heatsink 
would yield better results?

I am of the belief that Sonnett originally engineered the QuadDoubler 
with the groovy heatsink, but re-engineered and attempted to improve the 
design with the substitution of the Peltier (?) fan. I would expect that 
the fan cools better than the plain old heatsink.

I sold you that QuadDoubler, as we both remember. It was never a 
completely reliable improvement for my Q660av either, but tended to 
skitter off after awhile. Methinks that it's doing the best that it can, 
and one shouldn't expect perfection from it.

It sounds like you're getting some good usage out of it.
--
Michael Emery

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Re: Quaddoubler Problem

[Stefan Daehler]

ORIGINAL MESSAGE:

>Anyone on the list have experience with Quaddoublers?  I have a Quadra 
>700 I leave on for months at a time as an OpenBSD box doing some minor 
>tasks, and I noticed when it's given very intense tasks (like for 
>instance, today when I was compiling OpenSSH), it tends to have 
>stability issues.
>
>
>I noticed the Quaddoubler pictured on Sonnet's web site does not have a 
>fan, but a heatsink.  For some reason my Quaddoubler has a fan attached, 
>which doesn't seem to be cooling it effectively.  Anyone think replacing 
>the fan on the Quaddoubler with the original Quadra heatsink would yield 
>better results?



How about combining heatsink AND fan? This should, at least 
theoretically, increase the cooling.

Let us know the results in case you try. Steff


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Re: Quaddoubler

[Mark Benson]

On Wednesday, March 27, 2002, at 05:45 PM, Haroon wrote:

>> Which Quadra are you using it in?
>
> Quadra 700.

Should be OK, It is not recommended on a 660av, which is why I asked, as 
someone recently suggested it wasn't worth the time and was unstable. 
The same person also said it would be much better in a Q700. Are you 
buying it new or used?

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Re: Quaddoubler

[Haroon]

> Which Quadra are you using it in?

Quadra 700.



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Re: Quaddoubler

[Mark Benson]

On Wednesday, March 27, 2002, at 05:35 AM, Haroon wrote:

> Just closed a deal on one of these used.  Anyone had experience with 
> them?
> Do they generally perform well?  I'll be using it on a machine that's
> running OpenBSD 3.0.
>
> Also, I ordered some memory from SA Tech, but they didn't include the
> shipping costs in the totals.  Do they just add it on later?  Send it
> postage due?

Which Quadra are you using it in?

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