Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-15 Thread unruh
On 2012-03-14, Chris Albertson wrote: > On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 1:32 PM, unruh wrote: >> On 2012-02-24, unruh wrote: >>> I have a computer with a Sure GPS. Over the past week the unit has lost >>> all sattelite fixes a number of times. Recently I started saving the >>> GPGSV sentences, and caugh

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-15 Thread Chris Albertson
On Thu, Mar 15, 2012 at 6:26 AM, Ron Frazier (NTP) wrote: > Is that unit compatible with the Sure board?  Wouldn't you need some sort of > antenna connector adapter?  Will the Sure board provide power to it? If the Sure GPS gan provide 5 volts then it will work. You would need a cable between

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-15 Thread David J Taylor
Is that unit compatible with the Sure board? Wouldn't you need some sort of antenna connector adapter? Will the Sure board provide power to it? Sincerely, Ron - compatible, probably. Is +26 gain dB enough? It's the lower end of specifications for puck antennas. - adapter required, yes

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-15 Thread Ron Frazier (NTP)
On 3/15/2012 1:50 AM, Chris Albertson wrote: On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 10:21 PM, David J Taylor wrote: "unruh" wrote in message news:wf78r.33384$kv1.26...@newsfe03.iad... [] Just wanted to report here. I switched the antennae on the two Sure GPS I have. Both worked fine for about 4 d

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-14 Thread Chris Albertson
On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 10:21 PM, David J Taylor wrote: > "unruh" wrote in message > news:wf78r.33384$kv1.26...@newsfe03.iad... > [] >> >> Just wanted to report here. I switched the antennae on the two Sure GPS >> I have. Both worked fine for about 4 days, and suddenly the antenna that >> had fai

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-14 Thread David J Taylor
"unruh" wrote in message news:wf78r.33384$kv1.26...@newsfe03.iad... [] Just wanted to report here. I switched the antennae on the two Sure GPS I have. Both worked fine for about 4 days, and suddenly the antenna that had failed before failed again-- no sattelites found. So, I am sure it is the a

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-14 Thread Chris Albertson
On Wed, Mar 14, 2012 at 1:32 PM, unruh wrote: > On 2012-02-24, unruh wrote: >> I have a computer with a Sure GPS. Over the past week the unit has lost >> all sattelite fixes a number of times. Recently I started saving the >> GPGSV sentences, and caught at least one of those losses. The unit woul

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-03-14 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-24, unruh wrote: > I have a computer with a Sure GPS. Over the past week the unit has lost > all sattelite fixes a number of times. Recently I started saving the > GPGSV sentences, and caught at least one of those losses. The unit would > have 12 sattelites in view, but the S/N ratio dr

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-28 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-28, John Hasler wrote: > I wrote: >> It doesn't get location data from the satellite. It uses the >> ephemeris[1] to plot satellites that should be above the horizon. >> >> >> >> [1]Updated periodically, of course. > > unruh writes: >> Updated how? The only thing it could update the

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-28 Thread John Hasler
I wrote: > It doesn't get location data from the satellite. It uses the > ephemeris[1] to plot satellites that should be above the horizon. > > > > [1]Updated periodically, of course. unruh writes: > Updated how? The only thing it could update them from is the sattelites > themselves. So the s

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread A C
On 2/27/2012 22:13, unruh wrote: I assume that the receiver is still obtaining the orbital elements from the sattelites and that is how the receiver figures out where in the sky they are. Some say it remembers the orbital elements forever, until the sattelite changes them. Maybe, I do not know.

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread A C
On 2/27/2012 22:15, unruh wrote: As for age, it doesn't really matter. Copper corrodes easily, even tinned copper. It doesn't take much to create a rectifying junction They actually look like gold plated connectors, not copper or tinned copper. The connector is gold plated but the wire in

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-28, Chris Albertson wrote: > On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 4:29 PM, John Hasler wrote: > >>> I could imagine that the signal is too weak for timing but strong >>> enough to get location info from the sattelite. > > > It works the other way around. You need four satellites to get > location

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-28, Chris Albertson wrote: > Is the coax connection water proof? Water can wick down a coax > line. What kind of connections are they? BNC is not water proof. There is a bnc at the receiver end of the antenna wire. That is inside the building. The antenna and the junctionless

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-28, A C wrote: > On 2/27/2012 15:46, unruh wrote: >> On 2012-02-27, A C wrote: >>> On 2/27/2012 08:49, unruh wrote: >>> Ssure tracks with a S/N of between about 18 and 54. (higher is stonger) The Garmin trackes with S/N between about 35 and 54. What happens here is

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-28, John Hasler wrote: > unruh writes: >> Surely it does not report based on predicted orbits. > > Predicted orbits from the ephemeris is all it has. It has no way to > actually track anything: it just has a single omnidirectional antenna. > >> I could imagine that the signal is too we

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread Chris Albertson
On Mon, Feb 27, 2012 at 4:29 PM, John Hasler wrote: >> I could imagine that the signal is too weak for timing but strong >> enough to get location info from the sattelite. It works the other way around. You need four satellites to get location but once you know your location only one is needed

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread John Hasler
unruh writes: > Surely it does not report based on predicted orbits. Predicted orbits from the ephemeris is all it has. It has no way to actually track anything: it just has a single omnidirectional antenna. > I could imagine that the signal is too weak for timing but strong > enough to get loca

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread Chris Albertson
Is the coax connection water proof? Water can wick down a coax line. What kind of connections are they? BNC is not water proof. I think you said a plastic bag was used. Then you'd have humidity sealed in.When in the sun the water turns to vapor and can get inside then it cools and t

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread A C
On 2/27/2012 15:46, unruh wrote: On 2012-02-27, A C wrote: On 2/27/2012 08:49, unruh wrote: Ssure tracks with a S/N of between about 18 and 54. (higher is stonger) The Garmin trackes with S/N between about 35 and 54. What happens here is that the sattelites will be strong (S/N of 45-54) then

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-27, A C wrote: > On 2/27/2012 08:49, unruh wrote: > >> Ssure tracks with a S/N of between about 18 and 54. (higher is stonger) >> The Garmin trackes with S/N between about 35 and 54. >> >> What happens here is that the sattelites will be strong (S/N of 45-54) >> then suddenly over the t

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread A C
On 2/27/2012 08:49, unruh wrote: Ssure tracks with a S/N of between about 18 and 54. (higher is stonger) The Garmin trackes with S/N between about 35 and 54. What happens here is that the sattelites will be strong (S/N of 45-54) then suddenly over the time frame of seconds, all loose tracking (

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-27 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-27, Hal Murray wrote: > In article , > unruh writes: > >>Agreed. I have now managed to get the GPGSV from a Garmin 18 located >>about 5 m away on that same rooftop, and this morning I got a dropout >>from the Sure again for about 5 min. while I was also recording the >>messages from t

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-25 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-25, David J Taylor wrote: > "unruh" wrote in message > news:qfS1r.13334$pc2.3...@newsfe13.iad... >> On 2012-02-24, David J Taylor >> wrote: >>> "unruh" wrote in message >>> news:cmQ1r.3572$py5.2...@newsfe09.iad... >>> [] The graphs of the signal strengths at the edges of these

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-25 Thread David J Taylor
"unruh" wrote in message news:qfS1r.13334$pc2.3...@newsfe13.iad... On 2012-02-24, David J Taylor wrote: "unruh" wrote in message news:cmQ1r.3572$py5.2...@newsfe09.iad... [] The graphs of the signal strengths at the edges of these dropouts is in ftp://theory.physics.ubc.ca/outgoing/drop{out,

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread John Hasler
unruh writes: > ...there is a sattelite receiver on the roof, but it is blocked by a > row of offices on the roof between the puck and the sattelite > receiver. It could be broadcasting to the sattelite and increasing the > noise at the receiver.(That receiver communicates with the MOST > microsatt

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-24, Dave Hart wrote: > On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 18:52, Chris Albertson > wrote: >> On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 10:08 AM, unruh wrote: >> .. >>> Is it evidence of some outside noise source (jamming?) , microwave tower >>> emission? >> >> You would need to have a second GPS receiver set up to

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread unruh
On 2012-02-24, David J Taylor wrote: > "unruh" wrote in message > news:cmQ1r.3572$py5.2...@newsfe09.iad... > [] >> The graphs of the signal strengths at the edges of these dropouts is in >> ftp://theory.physics.ubc.ca/outgoing/drop{out,in}.pdf > > Could not access this page in Firefox. These pa

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread Dave Hart
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 18:52, Chris Albertson wrote: > On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 10:08 AM, unruh wrote: > .. >> Is it evidence of some outside noise source (jamming?) , microwave tower >> emission? > > You would need to have a second GPS receiver set up to know that. > It's a good idea to have two

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread Chris Albertson
On Fri, Feb 24, 2012 at 10:08 AM, unruh wrote: .. > Is it evidence of some outside noise source (jamming?) , microwave tower > emission? You would need to have a second GPS receiver set up to know that. It's a good idea to have two, hopefully different brand receivers. Does the antenna have a go

Re: [ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread David J Taylor
"unruh" wrote in message news:cmQ1r.3572$py5.2...@newsfe09.iad... [] The graphs of the signal strengths at the edges of these dropouts is in ftp://theory.physics.ubc.ca/outgoing/drop{out,in}.pdf Could not access this page in Firefox. [] Is this a flaw in the Sure unit (NOte that the sure un

[ntp:questions] Sure gps looses all sattelite fixes

2012-02-24 Thread unruh
I have a computer with a Sure GPS. Over the past week the unit has lost all sattelite fixes a number of times. Recently I started saving the GPGSV sentences, and caught at least one of those losses. The unit would have 12 sattelites in view, but the S/N ratio dropped suddenly over about 10 sec from