[RBW] 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 07:39 -0500, Larry Powers wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. The Rambouillet does indeed have a low bottom bracket -- and it was designed for 28mm tires. No matter which 650B you put in there, even the Hetre, there'd be additional drop; and I'm not at all certain there's clearance for a Hetre. On the other hand, it's not just bottom bracket drop, it's the combination of bottom bracket drop + crank length that causes the pedal strike problem. If you used shorter cranks, you could compensate to some extent. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
It has less BB drop than an Atlantis or a Hilsen. As mentioned by others, crank length matters too. I assume you refer to the 700 size wheels. The 26 wheel Ram will not accommodate a 650B wheel. I tried it :) From: Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Sent: Wed, January 13, 2010 6:39:15 AM Subject: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service. Get it now. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
The last issue of Bicycle Quarterly reviewed a bike (name??) that has, if I remember correctly, a bottom bracket height of only 235mm. Jan Heine reported that he had no real problem with pedal strike, but could hit the rings taking it over curbs. I doubt if a Ram or Rom would be that low. I'm still looking forward to taking possesion of my new, custom Bilenky tandem this spring, but not too far down the road I want to convert my 25 1984 Trek 620 to 650B, with couplers. My Rambouillet still remains my favorite ride, but it's great to be able to have a variety of rides to choose from. Michael H 1983 SpecializedSequoia (My Wife's ride) 1984 Trek 620 1988 Custom Marinoni Stage Racing Bike 2000 Soma Dbl Cross 2004 Rambouillet 2007 Ebisu All Purpose 2010 Bilenkey Touring, Travel Tandem On Jan 13, 8:22 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 07:39 -0500, Larry Powers wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. The Rambouillet does indeed have a low bottom bracket -- and it was designed for 28mm tires. No matter which 650B you put in there, even the Hetre, there'd be additional drop; and I'm not at all certain there's clearance for a Hetre. On the other hand, it's not just bottom bracket drop, it's the combination of bottom bracket drop + crank length that causes the pedal strike problem. If you used shorter cranks, you could compensate to some extent. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Step-in Frames
Ouch! Hope you are feeling better. How often should a tubular tire be reglued? I have a pair on a bike for two years. I've never needed to remove them so have never reglued them. The bike hangs up when not in use. Michael On Jan 12, 5:06 pm, Don Genovese dgen...@gmail.com wrote: ...check the glue. Yep, that's what I didn't do. I mounted a new tubular without glue just to stretch the new tire. A couple of weeks later I took the bike for a ride, forgetting about the glue. Three weeks after that, at home from the hospital, I noticed the tire was off the rim. I don't remember the accident or that day or the next ten days or the operation. My helmet was cracked and I sustained a head injury. Surgeons couldn't operate on the hip until the bleeding in the brain abated. That's enough. Check the glue. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
Congrats on the tandem. I had a custom Bilenky tandem built two summers ago. Very nice bike and they wer great to work with. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2010 07:18:56 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned From: mhech...@gmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com The last issue of Bicycle Quarterly reviewed a bike (name??) that has, if I remember correctly, a bottom bracket height of only 235mm. Jan Heine reported that he had no real problem with pedal strike, but could hit the rings taking it over curbs. I doubt if a Ram or Rom would be that low. I'm still looking forward to taking possesion of my new, custom Bilenky tandem this spring, but not too far down the road I want to convert my 25 1984 Trek 620 to 650B, with couplers. My Rambouillet still remains my favorite ride, but it's great to be able to have a variety of rides to choose from. Michael H 1983 SpecializedSequoia (My Wife's ride) 1984 Trek 620 1988 Custom Marinoni Stage Racing Bike 2000 Soma Dbl Cross 2004 Rambouillet 2007 Ebisu All Purpose 2010 Bilenkey Touring, Travel Tandem On Jan 13, 8:22 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 07:39 -0500, Larry Powers wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. The Rambouillet does indeed have a low bottom bracket -- and it was designed for 28mm tires. No matter which 650B you put in there, even the Hetre, there'd be additional drop; and I'm not at all certain there's clearance for a Hetre. On the other hand, it's not just bottom bracket drop, it's the combination of bottom bracket drop + crank length that causes the pedal strike problem. If you used shorter cranks, you could compensate to some extent. _ Hotmail: Powerful Free email with security by Microsoft. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390710/direct/01/-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
On Tue, Jan 12, 2010 at 11:22 AM, Ethan ethan.bickf...@gmail.com wrote: I'd be happy to as well. But I'm in Massachusetts. Which means there is relatively easy access to a few Rivs at Harris Cyclery. That being said I have a Riv I'd be happy to show off. 66CM Atlantis It's nice to see so many folks on the east coast with riv's. If anyone comes on the list looking for help or wanting to test out a riv I hope everyone speaks up. :) -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
I hope it has a seat tube angle of 73 degrees or so--the gradually slackening(!) of Riv's bikes has put them outside my fit zone. (since I don't use Brooks saddles, I don't need so much setback) Oh, and I hope my size comes with 650b wheels! Steve Frederick, East Lansing, MI -Original Message- From: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com [mailto:rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com]on Behalf Of Aaron Thomas Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 2:08 AM To: RBW Owners Bunch Subject: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos Interesting write up and photos. I really like the blue color, the fairly simple lugs, and the clean font used on the SOMA decal (as opposed to the font SOMA usually uses). As per the San Marcos decal query in the photo captions, it isn't a town in Italy; over on the SOMA blog they say it is the name of the town in Guatemala where their warehouse guy was born. I see that they're contemplating a kickstand plate, a.k.a. mud shelf (see: http://www.flickr.com/photos/gzahnd/3285145851/in/photostream). Not sure if that's well-advised, but it seems to be a Riv trend to use them on recent frames. Otherwise, It sounds like a versatile road frame and a fruitful collaborative project. Aaron On Jan 12, 10:38 pm, CycloFiend cyclofi...@earthlink.net wrote: A new addition to the bicycle listings this evening - http://www.rivbike.com/products/show/amos/70-999 May it be wildly successful! - Jim -- Jim Edgar cyclofi...@earthlink.net Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries -http://www.cyclofiend.com Current Classics - Cross Bikes Singlespeed - Working Bikes -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
I've seen 650b Rambouillets: my question is why? You can already fender a 700x32ish, which is ample for most road riding. If running bigger tires is a priority, there are bikes designed to do that with a lot less hassle. On Jan 13, 6:39 am, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
Not exactly east coast, but the country bike shop in ohio is also something to keep in mind. I am not connected with them in any way, but they look to be an interesting spot, I have talked to them and they are well versed in Riv fitting, etc As a plus if you look at their website they still have a number of saluki's, if anyone is looking for one. http://countrybikeshop.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 10:30 -0500, Frederick, Steve wrote: I hope it has a seat tube angle of 73 degrees or so--the gradually slackening(!) of Riv's bikes has put them outside my fit zone. (since I don't use Brooks saddles, I don't need so much setback) The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. --mike On Jan 13, 7:42 am, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: I've seen 650b Rambouillets: my question is why? You can already fender a 700x32ish, which is ample for most road riding. If running bigger tires is a priority, there are bikes designed to do that with a lot less hassle. On Jan 13, 6:39 am, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
My vote is for the slacker seatpost ... 71.5d works great for me and brooks saddles. Kinda cool that GP is going to re-lable and sell as a Rivendell. I guess they call that good marketing. As much as I love that Romulus blue others may prefer a sage green or orange ( hint, hint) I think the expanded top tube angle is going to take some time to get used to. On my Hillborne it allows me to use the shorter length Nitto Pearl stem which I think is a nicer stem. Mike SoCal On Jan 13, 8:01 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 10:30 -0500, Frederick, Steve wrote: I hope it has a seat tube angle of 73 degrees or so--the gradually slackening(!) of Riv's bikes has put them outside my fit zone. (since I don't use Brooks saddles, I don't need so much setback) The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] for sale riv catalogs and readers
have a huge pile of older readers and catalogs if anyone has a hole in their collection shoot me an email off-list thanks peace well behaved women rarely make history _ride yr friggin bicycle_ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
Steve Palincsar wrote: The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube? I am--my ideal, seat tube angle with the saddle I typically use is 73.5. That assumes a zero-setback post with the saddle rails centered. So I'm on the steep side for a Riv rider! Steve short thighs, Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
I remember the article that Mike mentioned. I think the point was that Riv bikes already have good clearances, so why bother (not to mention BB height issues...) In the early days of RBW's promotion of 650B, a lot of people were converting 27/700 bikes for no clear reason, since many of the conversions already had ample tire-space (many 1970s bikes had loads of room). Of course, if you have an early 80s Italian racing bike or something else with minimal clearance, then there are clear benefits to the conversion. We did many of these, which were well received by their owners, and made the bikes much more useful and interesting. On Jan 13, 10:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. --mike On Jan 13, 7:42 am, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: I've seen 650b Rambouillets: my question is why? You can already fender a 700x32ish, which is ample for most road riding. If running bigger tires is a priority, there are bikes designed to do that with a lot less hassle. On Jan 13, 6:39 am, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
The answer to why is toeclip overlap. My 54cm Rambouillet has a terrible problem with this and it really is a problem when I'm trying to negotiate traffic with a heavy load of groceries On Jan 13, 7:42 am, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: I've seen 650b Rambouillets: my question is why? You can already fender a 700x32ish, which is ample for most road riding. If running bigger tires is a priority, there are bikes designed to do that with a lot less hassle. On Jan 13, 6:39 am, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
A few ideas: 1. RCR - Right Coast Rivers, or Right Coast Rivies 2. RRC - Rivendell Right Coasters 3. EMRA - East of the Mississippi Rivendell Aficionados 4. NERDS - NutinwrongwithlivinoutEast Rivendell DreamerS Can't contribute a Riv ride at the moment. FYI - I'm in South-Central PA. Marty ( I vote for #3) On Jan 13, 10:58 am, jpp paste...@notes.udayton.edu wrote: Not exactly east coast, but the country bike shop in ohio is also something to keep in mind. I am not connected with them in any way, but they look to be an interesting spot, I have talked to them and they are well versed in Riv fitting, etc As a plus if you look at their website they still have a number of saluki's, if anyone is looking for one. http://countrybikeshop.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 08:52 -0800, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery wrote: I remember the article that Mike mentioned. I think the point was that Riv bikes already have good clearances, so why bother (not to mention BB height issues...) In the early days of RBW's promotion of 650B, a lot of people were converting 27/700 bikes for no clear reason, since many of the conversions already had ample tire-space (many 1970s bikes had loads of room). Of course, if you have an early 80s Italian racing bike or something else with minimal clearance, then there are clear benefits to the conversion. We did many of these, which were well received by their owners, and made the bikes much more useful and interesting. On Jan 13, 10:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. On the other hand, if you can fit it, there is a WORLD of difference between a 650Bx40 Hetre and any 32mm tire. There's even a world of difference between a 38mm CdlV and any 32mm tire. I have all these sizes, and I speak from experience. Also, I've used 35 and 38mm 700C tires in the past (although not the current gen. Pasela 37mm, which by all accounts is the best wide 700C). In my opinion, based on my experiences, there is simply no comparison between the plush, velvety ride of the wide 650Bs and the harsh, unpleasant, heavy-feeling ride of the wide 700Cs I've tried. And the best of the wide 700C lot, the now-defunct Bruce Gordon Rock 'n Road knobby, had other issues: very fast wear, and a wicked rebound. Hit a good sized bump with it, and it was like slamming a basketball on the ground: BOING! Hang on to the handlebar, lest you lose it. In my experience, the wide 700Cs just aren't the same as the wide 650Bs. They're generally much higher pressure (in some cases, labeled inflate to 90 or 100 psi) than the corresponding width 650Bs, which often are labeled 50psi max pressure, with much stiffer sidewalls and beefier construction all around. Supple, they're not. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
Having it posted on the site gives me hope this is frame will come to fruition. It will be nice to have a choice between a sporty road bike AMOS, and a country bike SamH. Love the blue, hope they keep it On Jan 13, 8:25 am, Michael_S mikeybi...@rocketmail.com wrote: My vote is for the slacker seatpost ... 71.5d works great for me and brooks saddles. Kinda cool that GP is going to re-lable and sell as a Rivendell. I guess they call that good marketing. As much as I love that Romulus blue others may prefer a sage green or orange ( hint, hint) I think the expanded top tube angle is going to take some time to get used to. On my Hillborne it allows me to use the shorter length Nitto Pearl stem which I think is a nicer stem. Mike SoCal On Jan 13, 8:01 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 10:30 -0500, Frederick, Steve wrote: I hope it has a seat tube angle of 73 degrees or so--the gradually slackening(!) of Riv's bikes has put them outside my fit zone. (since I don't use Brooks saddles, I don't need so much setback) The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube?- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
You may be right Steve. My 650B-riding experience is limited to some Fatty Rumpkins, which were fine, but not magical. Interesting that no tire makers have shown interest in a wider 700C that rides like the fat 650Bs reportedly ride. You'd think that just once some tire company would say, ya know, we don't need to add the 1,000th 700x23 to the marketplace - let's try something new! I have to think that such a tire is forthcoming, with the proliferation of randonneuring, gravel riding, and bikes that can handle that size. On Jan 13, 11:05 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 08:52 -0800, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery wrote: I remember the article that Mike mentioned. I think the point was that Riv bikes already have good clearances, so why bother (not to mention BB height issues...) In the early days of RBW's promotion of 650B, a lot of people were converting 27/700 bikes for no clear reason, since many of the conversions already had ample tire-space (many 1970s bikes had loads of room). Of course, if you have an early 80s Italian racing bike or something else with minimal clearance, then there are clear benefits to the conversion. We did many of these, which were well received by their owners, and made the bikes much more useful and interesting. On Jan 13, 10:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. On the other hand, if you can fit it, there is a WORLD of difference between a 650Bx40 Hetre and any 32mm tire. There's even a world of difference between a 38mm CdlV and any 32mm tire. I have all these sizes, and I speak from experience. Also, I've used 35 and 38mm 700C tires in the past (although not the current gen. Pasela 37mm, which by all accounts is the best wide 700C). In my opinion, based on my experiences, there is simply no comparison between the plush, velvety ride of the wide 650Bs and the harsh, unpleasant, heavy-feeling ride of the wide 700Cs I've tried. And the best of the wide 700C lot, the now-defunct Bruce Gordon Rock 'n Road knobby, had other issues: very fast wear, and a wicked rebound. Hit a good sized bump with it, and it was like slamming a basketball on the ground: BOING! Hang on to the handlebar, lest you lose it. In my experience, the wide 700Cs just aren't the same as the wide 650Bs. They're generally much higher pressure (in some cases, labeled inflate to 90 or 100 psi) than the corresponding width 650Bs, which often are labeled 50psi max pressure, with much stiffer sidewalls and beefier construction all around. Supple, they're not. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 12:22 PM, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: You may be right Steve. My 650B-riding experience is limited to some Fatty Rumpkins, which were fine, but not magical. Interesting that no tire makers have shown interest in a wider 700C that rides like the fat 650Bs reportedly ride. You'd think that just once some tire company would say, ya know, we don't need to add the 1,000th 700x23 to the marketplace - let's try something new! I have to think that such a tire is forthcoming, with the proliferation of randonneuring, gravel riding, and bikes that can handle that size. I'd like to think that, too. I've asked grand bois but they don't seem interested. Maybe I should try the 37mm paselas. I know the 35s are nice - so maybe the 37s are the bees knees. -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 09:22 -0800, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery wrote: You may be right Steve. My 650B-riding experience is limited to some Fatty Rumpkins, which were fine, but not magical. Interesting that no tire makers have shown interest in a wider 700C that rides like the fat 650Bs reportedly ride. You'd think that just once some tire company would say, ya know, we don't need to add the 1,000th 700x23 to the marketplace - let's try something new! Nah, they're too busy making 700x23s in every color that matches bicycle paint. Can't afford those extra SKUs... I have to think that such a tire is forthcoming, with the proliferation of randonneuring, gravel riding, and bikes that can handle that size. I'll bet only if 'I' decides Grand Bois needs such a thing. After all, being market driven means you need more of those colored 700x23s... -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 08:56 -0800, clevewh...@gmail.com wrote: The answer to why is toeclip overlap. My 54cm Rambouillet has a terrible problem with this and it really is a problem when I'm trying to negotiate traffic with a heavy load of groceries That's certainly an excellent reason! -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 12:28 -0500, Seth Vidal wrote: Maybe I should try the 37mm paselas. I know the 35s are nice - so maybe the 37s are the bees knees. They are supposed to be the bees knees in wide 700Cs. I've never heard anybody say they're the equals of Hetres, though -- and, they've been very hard to find in the past year. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
What about ROBE, pronounced Robby. Riv Owners Bunch East -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
On Wed, Jan 13, 2010 at 1:05 PM, Esteban proto...@gmail.com wrote: I think this will work out quite nicely for Rivendell. Remember the pain of managing the QBP partnership with the Bleriot? Soma will manage the bike, and Riv gets to see more people on a more sensible road bike. If someone walks into a Soma dealer and sees the SOMA/AMOS in the shop, the upslope on the top tub will seem much less dramatic than on other bikes, especially the less-sensible and much more expensive crabon fibré bikes next to it. For me, I like a horizontal (or near- horizontal) TT, but I'm not shopping for a SOMA/AMOS - perhaps not the target market. I agree with you about the TT. I like the look of horizontal or nearly horizontal TT but I get the point of the sloping TT. -sv -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] 650b Rambouillet
If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers [lots of replies, mostly that it's not possible, or not desirable...] Larry: I did this with my 68cm Redwood (functionally identical to the Rambouillet), because I found that 40-42 mm Hetres would fit. This makes the drop equivalent to a 21-23 mm tire -- not that different from the 28mm tire around which the Ram was built. I also ride 175mm cranks on this bike, and sometimes pedal through corners. Not a big deal, no problems with pedal strike. I did the conversion because 32mm tires with fenders simply aren't big enough for my 190lbs and commuting load and the terrible, terrible streets here. The Hetres make a huge difference. I also find that I like the handling of the bike better with these much wider tires, and that it's more comfortable, although the bike is so comfortable with narrower tires to begin with that for this reason alone the change wasn't necessary. There's also a lot more fender clearance with the Hetres on this bike -- I kept having to readjust my anonymous old Japanese metal fenders when I was running 700C/32s. So I think the change might be quite helpful for anyone who needs much wider tires, and probably not necessary for others. It just depends on your weight and local road conditions. One caveat: I do find that the greater diameter of 700C/37mm Paselas causes them to handle gaps in the pavement and potholes (the ones one can't avoid) better than the 650Bs, even with Hetres - this even while the Hetres are otherwise more comfortable. (I say I find.. because this is simply an impression -- others undoubtedly have other impressions) Somehow the larger diameter wheels feel more proportional to me, at 6'6/190, and to the height of my bike. Art Tacoma -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet
Art, I'd paypal you a dollar to see pics of your 650b Redwood! Steve Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
Marty had: A few ideas: 1. RCR - Right Coast Rivers, or Right Coast Rivies 2. RRC - Rivendell Right Coasters 3. EMRA - East of the Mississippi Rivendell Aficionados 4. NERDS - NutinwrongwithlivinoutEast Rivendell DreamerS Can't contribute a Riv ride at the moment. FYI - I'm in South-Central PA. Marty ( I vote for #3) Brilliant! Make the first one RCRR (RivRiders) but I vote for #3, too. Steve 52 and 54cm Rivs available for fitting, Frederick, East Lansing, MI On Jan 13, 10:58 am, jpp paste...@notes.udayton.edu wrote: Not exactly east coast, but the country bike shop in ohio is also something to keep in mind. I am not connected with them in any way, but they look to be an interesting spot, I have talked to them and they are well versed in Riv fitting, etc As a plus if you look at their website they still have a number of saluki's, if anyone is looking for one. http://countrybikeshop.com/ -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
RE: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet
I think my spring project is to get 32 mm tires working on my Rambouillet by changing the current Shimano brakes for Tektro R538's. If I can get this to work then the Rambouillet would be everything I need in a bike. I currently run 32mm Pasellas on my Quickbeam and for general purpose use they are great. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Subject: [RBW] 650b Rambouillet From: rthrstrum...@gmail.com Date: Wed, 13 Jan 2010 10:17:29 -0800 To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers [lots of replies, mostly that it's not possible, or not desirable...] Larry: I did this with my 68cm Redwood (functionally identical to the Rambouillet), because I found that 40-42 mm Hetres would fit. This makes the drop equivalent to a 21-23 mm tire -- not that different from the 28mm tire around which the Ram was built. I also ride 175mm cranks on this bike, and sometimes pedal through corners. Not a big deal, no problems with pedal strike. I did the conversion because 32mm tires with fenders simply aren't big enough for my 190lbs and commuting load and the terrible, terrible streets here. The Hetres make a huge difference. I also find that I like the handling of the bike better with these much wider tires, and that it's more comfortable, although the bike is so comfortable with narrower tires to begin with that for this reason alone the change wasn't necessary. There's also a lot more fender clearance with the Hetres on this bike -- I kept having to readjust my anonymous old Japanese metal fenders when I was running 700C/32s. So I think the change might be quite helpful for anyone who needs much wider tires, and probably not necessary for others. It just depends on your weight and local road conditions. One caveat: I do find that the greater diameter of 700C/37mm Paselas causes them to handle gaps in the pavement and potholes (the ones one can't avoid) better than the 650Bs, even with Hetres - this even while the Hetres are otherwise more comfortable. (I say I find.. because this is simply an impression -- others undoubtedly have other impressions) Somehow the larger diameter wheels feel more proportional to me, at 6'6/190, and to the height of my bike. Art Tacoma _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection. http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/-- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: New Riv Custom
Just found out the bike will arrive on Friday. A little evening shake- out cruise and then off for a proper ramble on Saturday morning. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
I am not able to get a 32mm (actual) tire under my Honjo fenders on my Rambouillet. Perhaps I could get a 30, but my sense is, despite the promotional claims, that the Ram. is designed to be optimized with 28 mm tires. I didn't see any point in trying to make that frame into something it wasn't intended to be. I had a '83 Trek 620 which could handle 35 mm tires, SKS fenders and a Campy Grand Sport brake. When I sold it and bought the 84 on ebay I was disappointed to find that a 32mm tire really squeezed the clearance. I bought an Ebisu All Purpose, which is a frame much like the AHH, to use for those times I want beefier tires. But I consider the Trek an excellent candidate for the conversion. I expect it to be great with the Grand Bois 42mm tires. I would suggest that there are lots of good '80s vintage frames around that would make good, inexpensive conversion candidates. Let your Ram be the 700c Rondonee style bike it was intended to be. Have fun. Michael On Jan 13, 11:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. --mike On Jan 13, 7:42 am, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery thill@gmail.com wrote: I've seen 650b Rambouillets: my question is why? You can already fender a 700x32ish, which is ample for most road riding. If running bigger tires is a priority, there are bikes designed to do that with a lot less hassle. On Jan 13, 6:39 am, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: If I recall correctly the Rambo is not a could candidate for a 650b conversion becuase it has low bottom bracket to start with. Someone let me know if this is not true. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain Date: Tue, 12 Jan 2010 20:29:41 -0800 Subject: [RBW] Re: Feeling Abondoned From: charles_v...@hotmail.com To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Couldn't you just convert to 650B wheels on the Ram and use longer reach brakes? You would get more clearance and a wide tire selection. Not sure on the bottom bracket height however. On Jan 12, 3:40 pm, Larry Powers lapower...@hotmail.com wrote: I took a nice tour on my Atlantis this past summer, I commute daily on my QB, my wife and I toured France on our Rambouillet and Bleriot (I also completed PBP on my Rambo) and my wife likes to tool around our neighborhood on her Glorius. We like Riv bikes and have bought our share. I know things change and can understand moving production to Taiwan because of the exchange rate. I guess the thing that pushed my buttons was to read that the Ruffy Tuffy/Rolly Polly tires will be discontinued. When I bought my Rambouillet it was touted as unique because it could use a large 28mm tire with fenders. Ruffy Tuffy tires have been my tire of choice for this bike and now Riv has abandoned both the bike and the tire. I believe that the Homer Hilson is the bike that Grant really intended to build when the developed the Rambouillet. But the parts available at the time placed limits on the design. The availability of longer and wider brakes finally allowed the Hilson to be built. I like the Hilson but having a Rambo and an Atlantis it is hard to justify the purchase of a bike in the middle. Change is inevitable and I hope that Riv continues to sell Lugged steel bike for a long time. I am very glad that I have my bikes because the new Riv's with limited sizes and sloping top tubes are not as close to my vision of what a bike should be. Hopefully they will maintain a few frames like the Hilson for those of us who appreciate a more classic shaped frame. If the economy improves maybe I will buy a Hilson or a Roadeo because I would really like to ride Brevets on a 32mm tire. I also hope that they do not completely forget those of us who supported them in the early years. I think I will pour a nice glass of wine, sit in the garage and admire my bikes. Larry Powers Get a bicycle. You will not regret it if you live. - Mark Twain _ Hotmail: Trusted email with Microsoft’s powerful SPAM protection.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390706/direct/01/ _ Hotmail: Free, trusted and rich email service.http://clk.atdmt.com/GBL/go/196390708/direct/01/- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to
[RBW] Avocet Shoes
Just noticed a bunch of NOS Avocet touring shoes on the 'bay - alas nothing my size, but maybe you or your spouse/SO have normal feet, unlike my yeti-sized paws. I've always liked Avocet stuff; saddles, components, computers, etc, but they are hard to find anymore in good shape. (I bought an Avocet 50 years ago just for the cool package - anyone remember the plastic mountain?) The Touring 1 saddle is still my first pick. Just search under avocet touring and see if the shoe fits. Marty -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
Interesting. As I just inflate the Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 700x40 to whatever the mood is. Usually about 45 front and 60 rear. And after about 2,400 miles on them last year, do perfer them to the CdlV in 650B. Those were good tires, but I didn't find them in the same quality league as the Schwable. At least for my riding preferences. Again, that's probably just my preference and my weight. If I were to lose a lot more weight, things might be different. No matter, right now, 40 is about the narrowest tire in the lineup. Although maybe my 700C studded on the Hillborne are not so wide. But that bike hasn't been out yet this year. Weather too crummy. The differences in folks getting tires to fit in the Ram make me wonder if there are either rim issues involved or - and this is highly unlikely - one batch might be slightly narrower in the stays? Eric Platt (who has cabin fever and the Atlantis on the road to nowhere trainer isn't helping) On Jan 13, 11:05�am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 08:52 -0800, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery wrote: I remember the article that Mike mentioned. I think the point was that Riv bikes already have good clearances, so why bother (not to mention BB height issues...) In the early days of RBW's promotion of 650B, a lot of people were converting 27/700 bikes for no clear reason, since many of the conversions already had ample tire-space (many 1970s bikes had loads of room). Of course, if you have an early 80s Italian racing bike or something else with minimal clearance, then there are clear benefits to the conversion. We did many of these, which were well received by their owners, and made the bikes much more useful and interesting. On Jan 13, 10:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. On the other hand, if you can fit it, there is a WORLD of difference between a 650Bx40 Hetre and any 32mm tire. �There's even a world of difference between a 38mm CdlV and any 32mm tire. �I have all these sizes, and I speak from experience. � Also, I've used 35 and 38mm 700C tires in the past (although not the current gen. Pasela 37mm, which by all accounts is the best wide 700C). In my opinion, based on my experiences, there is simply no comparison between the plush, velvety ride of the wide 650Bs and the harsh, unpleasant, heavy-feeling ride of the wide 700Cs I've tried. � And the best of the wide 700C lot, the now-defunct Bruce Gordon Rock 'n Road knobby, had other issues: very fast wear, and a wicked rebound. Hit a good sized bump with it, and it was like slamming a basketball on the ground: BOING! �Hang on to the handlebar, lest you lose it. In my experience, the wide 700Cs just aren't the same as the wide 650Bs. They're generally much higher pressure (in some cases, labeled inflate to 90 or 100 psi) than the corresponding width 650Bs, which often are labeled 50psi max pressure, with much stiffer sidewalls and beefier construction all around. �Supple, they're not.- Hide quoted text - - Show quoted text - -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] bike-0, mud-4
I just learned that mud can get stuck in your fenders and make an good ride into an adventure! Pictures can be founded here. http://www.flickr.com/photos/mannyacosta/sets/72157623081384461/ -Manny -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Was San Marcos - Now Seats Forward on Rivendells
I'm a seat-forward Rivendell rider person, and I just recently found out. It freaked me out a bit, because I have a few of them with setback Nitto seatposts, and so far, I've only switched to the Thomson on the Ram with good results. I want a good silver seatpost for the other bikes too, so do I need to spring for Thomsons on those? I'm thinking about just flipping the Nittos around backwards. Will this cause problems? -Jim W. -Original Message- From: Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu Sent: Jan 13, 2010 11:50 AM To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos Steve Palincsar wrote: The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube? I am--my ideal, seat tube angle with the saddle I typically use is 73.5. That assumes a zero-setback post with the saddle rails centered. So I'm on the steep side for a Riv rider! Steve short thighs, Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Was San Marcos - Now Seats Forward on Rivendells
Usually it's hard to get the correct angle adjustment with a backwards seatpost. On Jan 13, 8:22 pm, James Warren jimcwar...@earthlink.net wrote: I'm a seat-forward Rivendell rider person, and I just recently found out. It freaked me out a bit, because I have a few of them with setback Nitto seatposts, and so far, I've only switched to the Thomson on the Ram with good results. I want a good silver seatpost for the other bikes too, so do I need to spring for Thomsons on those? I'm thinking about just flipping the Nittos around backwards. Will this cause problems? -Jim W. -Original Message- From: Frederick, Steve frede...@mail.lib.msu.edu Sent: Jan 13, 2010 11:50 AM To: rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com Subject: RE: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos Steve Palincsar wrote: The difference between 72 and 73 degrees should easily be accommodated with a zero-setback post. Are you saying you are already using one of those with a 73 degree seat tube? I am--my ideal, seat tube angle with the saddle I typically use is 73.5. That assumes a zero-setback post with the saddle rails centered. So I'm on the steep side for a Riv rider! Steve short thighs, Frederick, East Lansing, MI -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: East Coast Riv
On Jan 13, 10:58 am, jpp paste...@notes.udayton.edu wrote: Not exactly east coast, but the country bike shop in ohio is also something to keep in mind. I am not connected with them in any way, but they look to be an interesting spot, I have talked to them and they are well versed in Riv fitting, etc As a plus if you look at their website they still have a number of saluki's, if anyone is looking for one. http://countrybikeshop.com/ JPP: Thanks for mentioning The Country Bike Shop. We do have a good number of Rivendells available for test rides (currently 12) but we're about as far from the East Coast as you can get in Ohio. We're actually just 15 minutes form the Indiana border. Cincinnati, Columbus, Oh., Toledo, Ft. Wayne, In. Indianapolis are all about 2 - 2 1/4 hours away. Detroit is 3 hours. And I need to update the picture section of our website as we're down to a 50cm Butterscotch Saluki and a Fawn (Champagne) 54 Saluki. Dick -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: 650b Rambouillet was: Feeling Abondoned
MichaelH wrote, the Ram. is designed to be optimized with 28 mm tires. I didn't see any point in trying to make that frame into something it wasn't intended to be. I agree with that. When I think of my Romulus, I know it was designed around the Shimano medium reach brakes and for 28mm tires with fenders or up to 37mm without. That determined the design details of the whole bike. As it is, that's pretty darn versatile! It is a road bike, afterall. I run mine with 28s and fenders, and I've been riding 35mm Paselas, and those are a dream - I would say almost equal to a CdlV. One can always get another bike built around 650B - and the producers mentioned earlier are not the only ones - seems like younger Rando riders and custom builders are really going after the classic 650B rando bike. All this being said, I just did my first long-ish ride on the Hetres now on my 650B Custom Protovelo (kinda like a Saluki). Wow. Those are some fast, smooth tires. Its like they're not even there like you're floating along -- and fast! And with the 38mm Grand Bois and the Pari-Motos coming down the pipe, they should offer some very nice 650B performance options for distance events and general distance/ camping riding. I really do wish Rivendell offered 650B in the larger sizes, up to 62cm. I don't know whay I like 650B so much - it doesn't make much sense. True, there's nothing in 700c that can equal the Hetre, and the same will probably be the case for the new 650B tires. One can always go Riv custom for that Grant magic! I heard a rumor that there is a 650B Pasela in the pipe... Esteban San Diego, Calif. On Jan 13, 6:01 pm, EricP ericpl...@aol.com wrote: Interesting. As I just inflate the Schwalbe Marathon Supreme 700x40 to whatever the mood is. Usually about 45 front and 60 rear. And after about 2,400 miles on them last year, do perfer them to the CdlV in 650B. Those were good tires, but I didn't find them in the same quality league as the Schwable. At least for my riding preferences. Again, that's probably just my preference and my weight. If I were to lose a lot more weight, things might be different. No matter, right now, 40 is about the narrowest tire in the lineup. Although maybe my 700C studded on the Hillborne are not so wide. But that bike hasn't been out yet this year. Weather too crummy. The differences in folks getting tires to fit in the Ram make me wonder if there are either rim issues involved or - and this is highly unlikely - one batch might be slightly narrower in the stays? Eric Platt (who has cabin fever and the Atlantis on the road to nowhere trainer isn't helping) On Jan 13, 11:05 am, Steve Palincsar palin...@his.com wrote: On Wed, 2010-01-13 at 08:52 -0800, Jim Thill - Hiawatha Cyclery wrote: I remember the article that Mike mentioned. I think the point was that Riv bikes already have good clearances, so why bother (not to mention BB height issues...) In the early days of RBW's promotion of 650B, a lot of people were converting 27/700 bikes for no clear reason, since many of the conversions already had ample tire-space (many 1970s bikes had loads of room). Of course, if you have an early 80s Italian racing bike or something else with minimal clearance, then there are clear benefits to the conversion. We did many of these, which were well received by their owners, and made the bikes much more useful and interesting. On Jan 13, 10:17 am, Mike mjawn...@gmail.com wrote: Jim makes a really good point here. The Rambouillet works fine with fenders and 32s so why bother with 650b. If you don't use fenders you can fit a tire up to 37mm. There was an article or note in one of the RR, I can't remember which one, where Grant mentioned that their bikes weren't good for 650b conversion. On the other hand, if you can fit it, there is a WORLD of difference between a 650Bx40 Hetre and any 32mm tire. There's even a world of difference between a 38mm CdlV and any 32mm tire. I have all these sizes, and I speak from experience. Also, I've used 35 and 38mm 700C tires in the past (although not the current gen. Pasela 37mm, which by all accounts is the best wide 700C). In my opinion, based on my experiences, there is simply no comparison between the plush, velvety ride of the wide 650Bs and the harsh, unpleasant, heavy-feeling ride of the wide 700Cs I've tried. And the best of the wide 700C lot, the now-defunct Bruce Gordon Rock 'n Road knobby, had other issues: very fast wear, and a wicked rebound. Hit a good sized bump with it, and it was like slamming a basketball on the ground: BOING! Hang on to the handlebar, lest you lose it. In my experience, the wide 700Cs just aren't the same as the wide 650Bs. They're generally much higher pressure (in some cases, labeled inflate to 90 or 100 psi) than the corresponding width 650Bs, which often are labeled 50psi max pressure, with much
[RBW] Video: How to apply bike decals
Jay Ritchey at Rivendell has just posted a YouTube video on how to apply bike decals. It should be a great help to anyone trying this at home. My first attempt to apply the decals on my Quickbeam ended in abject failure (the darned things are super sticky and brittle). The second try, with Jay's helpful email advice, was a success. Maybe I should have waited for the video. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z-6Jya6H4lY -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: Video: How to apply bike decals
i miss the cardboard instructions. but still a good video -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
[RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
Why not clearance for JBs and fenders, wonders I? On Jan 13, 10:20 am, rperks perks@gmail.com wrote: From following Rivendell/Grant for a while I would imagine that these types of projects really are the fruits of their labors. It takes the intelectual property and designs for a deeper penatration into the masses. The next stop would be packaging them as completes and getting them into the corner bikestore. I look forward to hunting these down on Craigs list as Vintage in 20 or 30 years. Rob On Jan 13, 10:05 am, Esteban proto...@gmail.com wrote: I think this will work out quite nicely for Rivendell. Remember the pain of managing the QBP partnership with the Bleriot? Soma will manage the bike, and Riv gets to see more people on a more sensible road bike. If someone walks into a Soma dealer and sees the SOMA/AMOS in the shop, the upslope on the top tub will seem much less dramatic than on other bikes, especially the less-sensible and much more expensive crabon fibré bikes next to it. For me, I like a horizontal (or near- horizontal) TT, but I'm not shopping for a SOMA/AMOS - perhaps not the target market. This bike will do well, and will really stand out against the other steel bikes newly released by Specialized, etc. Esteban San Diego, Calif. On Jan 13, 9:20 am, RoadieRyan rya...@hotmail.com wrote: snip -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
Re: [RBW] Re: A Bit More on the RBW/SOMA San Marcos/Amos
on 1/13/10 9:25 PM, rcnute at rcn...@hotmail.com wrote: Why not clearance for JBs and fenders, wonders I? I think GP is being a little careful with the description at this point. There are a whole heckuvalotta variables between now and when the finished production frames show up - things could change slightly, they may be slightly off-spec in the production models - and it's probably better to have someone happier than expected rather than mad because some early statements didn't quite end up correct. His comment about fender mounting gives hope - It's versatile because it fits tires up to 38mm, or 30mm with a fender. How fenderable any bike is depends partly on how good you are with mounting fenders, but I've built in as much fenderability as standard (not short) reach brakes allow, and if you're halfway decent with fenders, you can probably go up to 32mm, or even 33.333. That combined with the not-quite-Hilsen brake spec (57, vs 73) would probably lead one to be a bit conservative at this point. - Jim -- -- Jim Edgar cyclofi...@earthlink.net Cyclofiend Bicycle Photo Galleries - http://www.cyclofiend.com Current Classics - Cross Bikes Singlespeed - Working Bikes Send In Your Photos! - Here's how: http://www.cyclofiend.com/guidelines That which is overdesigned, too highly specific, anticipates outcome; the anticipation of outcome guarantees, if not failure, the absence of grace. William Gibson - All Tomorrow's Parties -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups RBW Owners Bunch group. To post to this group, send email to rbw-owners-bu...@googlegroups.com. To unsubscribe from this group, send email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. For more options, visit this group at http://groups.google.com/group/rbw-owners-bunch?hl=en.
