[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Given my Hunq has a dig or two in the middle of the tubes, I'm thankful for Grant's bucking of the market on this one! With abandon, Patrick -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Tuesday, March 17, 2015 at 4:42:55 PM UTC-4, Mike Schiller wrote: > > The difference is about 7 oz for a 60 cm bike ( the .8 mm straight tube > weighs more). But the bike will also be stiffer riding as a butted tube is > more flexible. But since the diameter is smaller the increase in stiffne

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

In regards to tubing of any bike , focusing on tube sizes/dimensions and quality of the steel is okay to putter around, but it overlooks the fact that a bike frame is One Whole "unit" , Complete . It's not just the tubes, but every detail of it from design, material, shape and bending of tube

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

thanks joe, awesome reference. exactly the kind of stated reasoning i was hoping for. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsub

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Regarding butted tubing, here's an interesting old pre-Blug blog post I saved long ago. Not sure if it exists still (it does !). Some earlier thoughts from Riv/Grant on straight gauge tubing. Best, joe broach pdx or The T:T Faqtor?March 23, 2010 It’s the Tu

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

The difference is about 7 oz for a 60 cm bike ( the .8 mm straight tube weighs more). But the bike will also be stiffer riding as a butted tube is more flexible. But since the diameter is smaller the increase in stiffness is less than similar diameter tubes. ~mike On Tuesday, March 17, 2015 a

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

im thinking it helps with stiffness under weight and dent resistance? it would be interesting to hear the impetus or thought process behind the change. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and st

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Would the straight tubing be stronger if you're going to add the diagonal tubing? John -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+uns

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

agreed. those are the current specs and i think the weight difference is probably minimal as well. what i'm more curious about is what the benefit of straight 8 vs 9/6/9 is. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe f

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Monday, March 16, 2015 at 10:19:21 PM UTC-4, Mike Schiller wrote: > > I would be shocked if they are really straight gauge tubing. That would > add unnecessary weight without benefit and totally change the riding > characteristics. He has to be kidding! > Why? They told me straight 8, th

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I've got a feeling the butting is all external... On Mon, Mar 16, 2015 at 7:19 PM, Mike Schiller wrote: > I would be shocked if they are really straight gauge tubing. That would > add unnecessary weight without benefit and totally change the riding > characteristics. He has to be kidding! > > ~

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I would be shocked if they are really straight gauge tubing. That would add unnecessary weight without benefit and totally change the riding characteristics. He has to be kidding! ~mike Carlsbad Ca. On Monday, March 16, 2015 at 5:38:48 AM UTC-7, Leslie wrote: > > It does say "subject to chang

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

It does say "subject to change without notice" on those; and we know they changed from Toyo to W'ford anyway FWIW... As far as to why, I'll leave it to Grant to improve, not hurt, the design...not that earlier would be 'inferior', but, over time, he's increased clearances on bikes, an

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

That was an interesting comment from Will. I guess Sheldon Brown had outdated data : Top Tube: True Temper .9-.6-.9, 28.6 (1-1/8") Down Tube: True Temper Heat Treated .9-.6-.9, 31.8 (1-1.4") Seat Tube: True Temper .9-.6 Heat Treated Head Tube: Tru

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 10:04:45 AM UTC-7, Leslie wrote: > > > Interesting! So the Bomba, Hunq, and Atlantis are all three straight 8 OX > Plat in the main triangle makes sense, but, there it is.. > > -L > > I don't know about the Bomba production run, but the prototypes were

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Wed, Mar 11, 2015 at 10:14 AM, 'clayton bailey' via RBW Owners Bunch < rbw-owners-bunch@googlegroups.com> wrote: > Straight gauge is usually used in lugged construction, as the lugs provide > the "butting". > ​Clayton, that statement seems a bit broad. I'd say the great majority of mid to high

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Good point: I was asking about *my* Bomba, and the reply was about mine, being straight-8 OX Plat. And, mine is one of the later diagonal-tube Bombadils, not the earlier top-tube... the later ones also had a different crown than earlier ones, a new lug was introdiced, etc. SO, Maybe not

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

It sounds like it's very important to add an "At this time..." to all replies you get regarding tubing, etc from the folks at Riv. I remember as each of those new-er models was introduced that the changes were more than just geometry and chain stays. I think Riv does running changes within thei

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Yes , that's the photo I recall Jim :)It was always my understanding of the Bombadil frames was only the second TT was straight gauge , the rest were butted . On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 1:16:31 PM UTC-4, Jim M. wrote: > > > > On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 10:04:45 AM UTC-7, Les

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Straight gauge is usually used in lugged construction, as the lugs provide the "butting".  Clayton (Bend) On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 10:04 AM, Leslie wrote: On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 3:35:41 AM UTC-4, drew beckmeyer wrote: well i just went ahead and asked, since i was askin

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Wednesday, March 11, 2015 at 3:35:41 AM UTC-4, drew beckmeyer wrote: > > well i just went ahead and asked, since i was asking other questions > anyway. > > via Will > "Atlantis and Hunqapillar are both straight gauge (not a bad thing!) os x > platinum .8mm in the main triangle. The fork is to

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

well i just went ahead and asked, since i was asking other questions anyway. via Will "Atlantis and Hunqapillar are both straight gauge (not a bad thing!) os x platinum .8mm in the main triangle. The fork is tougher on the Hunqa and the chainstays are thicker... The geometries are different, b

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I was going to say that it might be considered a bit 'weird' to borrow the Atlantis color for a Hunq, since it's not an Atlantis, but. I did get my Bombadil in Rambouillet orange, so, I really don't have room to talk I'm sure you can get a different bike in a whichever color there's t

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I think, it was that their fancy paint is a $500 paint job, but that to have a bike painted in a non-standard color is $300... https://www.rivbike.com/kb_results.asp?ID=66 (At least, if the prices haven't shifted) -L On Tuesday, February 24, 2015 at 1:14:57 PM UTC-5, Jim Bronson wrote: >

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Custom paint is expensive...I would be more likely to take the Rivendell standard colors if I was buying a stock model. IIRC, Grant has written somewhere that you can get frames painted any color you want...for $500 extra. On Tue, Feb 24, 2015 at 11:29 AM, 'doc' via RBW Owners Bunch < rbw-owners-

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

It seems a lot of Atlantis owners get their frames painted/re-painted a nice mix of attractive colors, but I don't know of one Hunq painted Seafoam Green. On Wednesday, February 11, 2015 at 4:50:21 PM UTC-5, Mark Reimer wrote: > I've had my Atlantis for about half a year now and am loving it. I

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

the angles make sense. i did a bit of digging and the hillborne and atlantis have the same tube dimensions, or at least that was true in 2010. i didnt think the sams were quite that stout, but that's cool. still curious about the hunq tubing. ive heard ox and kaisei. kaisei was named in the ve

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

>From looking at the geo charts it looks like the Hunqapillar is built with more off road downhill capabilities. With 3-4cm longer in the top tubes, slacker HT angle, 1-2 cm longer chain stays, it will have a longer wheel base and feel more stable in downhill descents. On Wednesday, February 1

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

My second-hand red and gray 48cm Hunqapillar was made at Waterford. The original intent was to have them all made in Taiwan (+ Toyo), but apparently a long wait made Riv reconsider and at least some were made at Waterford. (This is what I was told by the original purchaser.) BTW: the most impor

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

the original Hunq frame was made in Taiwan and the fork made by Toyo in Japan. ~mike On Friday, February 13, 2015 at 9:14:55 AM UTC-8, Braxton Colagross wrote: > > Hunqapillar frames are made by Waterford. The $300 savings comes from the > fork being made in Taiwan. > > On Thursday, February

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Speaking of Hunqa tubing: 2 1/2 years ago I bought a 58cm kidney and dolphin Hunqa from Riv. This was after they changed the color to green, so I felt lucky to pick it up. Well, the seat tube will not fit the 26.8 seat post like it should. I had to find a cheapy 26.2 to fit which means I can't u

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Hunqapillar frames are made by Waterford. The $300 savings comes from the fork being made in Taiwan. On Thursday, February 12, 2015 at 8:45:39 PM UTC-8, Mike Schiller wrote: > > I recall reading that the Hunq used Kaisei heat treated tubing in 9-6-9 > OS. This tubing has a higher tensile stren

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Very interesting! Thanks for adding specific details that came from RBW. On Friday, February 13, 2015 at 8:11:27 AM UTC-6, Leslie wrote: > > On Wednesday, February 11, 2015 at 7:26:43 PM UTC-5, Chris Lampe 2 wrote: >> >> All of these numbers and facts are being pulled from my memory of readi

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

On Wednesday, February 11, 2015 at 7:26:43 PM UTC-5, Chris Lampe 2 wrote: > > All of these numbers and facts are being pulled from my memory of reading > about Rivendells for several years so they may not be 100% accurate but > they are probably close. > > I remember the Atlantis having .9/.6./.9

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

i believe that's the same info that was floating around in the back of my head as well, Mike. but now im wondering if i gained it from a reputable source. pretty sure about the kaisei heat treated part. not so sure about the specs. and hunqapillars moved to waterford a while back. i guess it d

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I recall reading that the Hunq used Kaisei heat treated tubing in 9-6-9 OS. This tubing has a higher tensile strength than Ox Plat which is what the Atlantis uses. Which only means it's more resistant to denting and not any stiffer. I also thought that the Hunq's were made in Taiwan and not

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

hi, mark. i got a chance to ride both bikes before making my choice on what to buy. i rode a 2001 atlantis with 26 inch wheels in a 54/55 and the first generation hunq in 58 that was too big. the changes to the 2nd generation hunq won me over as did the chance to run 700c/29'er tires in my siz

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I have a memory of reading some specs on the AHH and at most, it was 8/5/8. It was something like Roadeo = 7/4/7, AHH = 8/5/8, Atlantis = 9/6/9. I don't remember a mention of butted tubes but I suspect the Roadeo and AHH have them and maybe the Atlantis. On Thursday, February 12, 2015 at

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Meh. I'm not sure when my Atlantis is from, but I'm thinking early 2000's or so. If it's heavier than others, I'd never know with all the crap I've got bolted/strapped/hanging off of it. I am, however, jealous of the Atlantis' (Atlanti?) with the fancier lugs and mid-fork braze-ons. Very jealous.

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I met an ex-employee of Rivendell, and we talked a bit. I bought my Atlantis in '98 or so. He said, "You have one of the good ones. The newer Atlantis is made from heavier, cheaper tube sets." I love my Atlantis. Would I love a new one as much? Probably. Would I buy a new Atlantis? Maybe. --

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

Maybe quantity? complexity of paint and lugs? I think the tubing would be very marginal in the total scheme of things. Visit Nova Cycle's website. You can see the pricing of a ton of different tube-sets and lugs. The pricing is all fairly comparable. On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 12:22 PM, drew beckmey

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

i guess what im wondering is, if the hilsen has proprietary tubes, the atlantis has thick yet standard dbl butted tubes and the hunq has straight gauge, why are they all roughly the same price? obviously, tubing is far from the most expensive part of building a bike, but i assume that the labor

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

When he was repairing my 57 AHH, my friend remarked that the tubing was surprisingly light, maybe 8 5 8 or something like that. So yeah, there be differences! On Thu, Feb 12, 2015 at 10:02 AM, Surlyprof wrote: > This from the Hillborne catalog: > > "*Silver Tubes. They look normal from the outsi

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

This from the Hillborne catalog: "*Silver Tubes. They look normal from the outside, but* *Silver tubes are our own design and are better for it.* *Rather than using industry-standard double-butted tubing* *picked stock from a catalogue, we shifted the wall* *thickness around to better address

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

I think that may be one of the misconceptions about Rivendells and Grant has even made comments that support this. Rivendell's use expensive tube sets because who would buy a $2000 frame knowing it had plain ole' 4130 cro-mo? People expect fancy steel in a frame that expensive. However, sinc

Re: [RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

That's what I was told re bombadil tubing too. 1 straight gauge. On Feb 12, 2015 1:24 AM, "drew beckmeyer" wrote: > really? straight gauge? > > -- > You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups > "RBW Owners Bunch" group. > To unsubscribe from this group and stop rece

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

really? straight gauge? -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "RBW Owners Bunch" group. To unsubscribe from this group and stop receiving emails from it, send an email to rbw-owners-bunch+unsubscr...@googlegroups.com. To post to this group, send email to r

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

All of these numbers and facts are being pulled from my memory of reading about Rivendells for several years so they may not be 100% accurate but they are probably close. I remember the Atlantis having .9/.6./.9 tubing, which isn't really that stout. I don't know if I've seen the tubing stats

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

First, what you can't see and what is not published, *the tube selection* , as well as the obvious extra tube :-) Also, the* TT* and *front-center *is longer on the Hunq. , as well as longer* chaninstays *and more* fork rake* . -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the G

[RBW] Re: Atlantis or Hunq - what's the real difference?

as a hunq owner, ive wondered this from the opposite (yet 100% satisfied) side. my impression is that there are a couple geometry tweaks and slightly thicker tubing? ive also wondered what makes the atlantis frames slightly more expensive. -- You received this message because you are subscr