Re: [sage-devel] Re: Poll for issue G2 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Nicolas M. Thiery]

On Fri, May 19, 2017 at 06:23:04AM +, Simon King wrote:
> X
> 
> In some context, the technical term ``self`` might be easier to 
> understand (for someone who knows python...) than natural language,
> in other context it may be the other way around
> 
> Maybe +1 as a rule of thumb, but -1 as a strict rule.

Same here.
Nicolas
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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Poll for issue G1 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Nicolas M. Thiery]

On Wed, May 17, 2017 at 12:32:47PM -0700, Volker Braun wrote:
>I'd try to avoid the entire construct; Its the linguistic equivalent of
>if condition:
> return True
>else:
>return False
>Just say "Test condition" in the docstring.

Yes, I agree!!! If we want to stick to the "Return ..." idiom, an
alternative is to say "Return whether ".

I guess that's slightly off topic though; I imagine this sentence was
just meant as one example where ``True`` could appear in our doc.

For how to typeset True/False/None/... when we need to spell them out
explicitly, as already suggested, I would be in favor of :obj:`True`.

Cheers,
Nicolas
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Re: [sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Erik Bray]

On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 4:01 PM, Jori Mäntysalo  wrote:
> On Mon, 22 May 2017, Vincent Delecroix wrote:
>
>> 1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method in
>> Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:
>
>
> inplace is mentioned at
> http://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/developer/coding_basics.html#miscellanous-minor-things
>
> So yes, I think "inplace=True" should be preferred over "return_copy=False"
> or similar.
>
>> 2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()
>>
>> 3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()
>>
>> Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is
>> welcome!
>
>
> I think 1 would be most natural.

Though I'd also add that something like 2) makes perfect sense as an
*implementation* detail.

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Re: [sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Mon, 22 May 2017, Vincent Delecroix wrote:

1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method in 
Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:


inplace is mentioned at 
http://doc.sagemath.org/html/en/developer/coding_basics.html#miscellanous-minor-things


So yes, I think "inplace=True" should be preferred over 
"return_copy=False" or similar.



2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()

3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()

Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is 
welcome!


I think 1 would be most natural.

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Kwankyu Lee]

On Monday, May 22, 2017 at 2:41:17 PM UTC+2, vdelecroix wrote:
>
>
> Yes! A function in Python always return a unique object. This object 
> might be a tuple or a list with several components.


Ok. Now I understand how you view things. 

I always thought it is a common idiom in Python that when the output 
consists of several items, then the output is a tuple of those items (so 
Python supports this idiom by allowing "Return a,b,c" rather than "Return 
(a,b,c)"). If you think there is always a choice between a tuple or a list 
when you return several items, expressing this explicitly in the docstring 
is essential. 

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Re: [sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Thierry]

Hi,

On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 02:35:43PM +0200, Vincent Delecroix wrote:
> Dear all,
> 
> I would like to have inplace version of transpose for matrices. For the
> echelon form we have methods mat.echelonize vs mat.echelon_form. However I
> do not see how to deal with transpose in the same way. I see three
> reasonable possibilities
> 
>  1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method in
> Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:
> 
>   if inplace=True: returns a new graph
>   if inplace=False: modifies the graph inplace and does not return anything

Do you mean the converse ?

Ciao,
Thierry
 
> One can do the same with .transpose for matrices. However, this would be the
> first time in matrix code.
> 
> 2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()
> 
> 3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()
> 
> Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is
> welcome!
> 
> Vincent
> 
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Re: [sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Vincent Delecroix]

On 22/05/2017 14:43, Erik Bray wrote:

On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 2:35 PM, Vincent Delecroix
<20100.delecr...@gmail.com> wrote:

Dear all,

I would like to have inplace version of transpose for matrices. For the
echelon form we have methods mat.echelonize vs mat.echelon_form. However I
do not see how to deal with transpose in the same way. I see three
reasonable possibilities

  1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method in
Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:

   if inplace=True: returns a new graph
   if inplace=False: modifies the graph inplace and does not return anything


I like this, and there is some precedent for it elsewhere too.  But I
assume you meant this the other way around?


Indeed!


One can do the same with .transpose for matrices. However, this would be the
first time in matrix code.

2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()

3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()

Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is
welcome!

Vincent

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Re: [sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Erik Bray]

On Mon, May 22, 2017 at 2:35 PM, Vincent Delecroix
<20100.delecr...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear all,
>
> I would like to have inplace version of transpose for matrices. For the
> echelon form we have methods mat.echelonize vs mat.echelon_form. However I
> do not see how to deal with transpose in the same way. I see three
> reasonable possibilities
>
>  1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method in
> Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:
>
>   if inplace=True: returns a new graph
>   if inplace=False: modifies the graph inplace and does not return anything

I like this, and there is some precedent for it elsewhere too.  But I
assume you meant this the other way around?

> One can do the same with .transpose for matrices. However, this would be the
> first time in matrix code.
>
> 2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()
>
> 3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()
>
> Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is
> welcome!
>
> Vincent
>
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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Vincent Delecroix]

On 22/05/2017 14:35, Kwankyu Lee wrote:

It seems that some misunderstanding is going on here.

If a method returns an integer and a matrix by "Return n, m". I am saying
that the output block can be simply

OUTPUT:

- integer ...

- matrix ...

instead of

OUTPUT: a tuple of ``(n,m)`` where

- ``n`` is a integer ...

- ``m`` is a matrix ...

You may prefer the second style, but does the first style miss an essential
information?


Yes! A function in Python always return a unique object. This object 
might be a tuple or a list with several components. So I would say that 
it is mandatory to specify what the actually output is. In the above 
case a tuple. Compare


def f(): return 1,2
def g(): return [1,2]

The functions has essentially the same functionalities however these are 
different functions.


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[sage-devel] inplace transpose

[Vincent Delecroix]

Dear all,

I would like to have inplace version of transpose for matrices. For the 
echelon form we have methods mat.echelonize vs mat.echelon_form. However 
I do not see how to deal with transpose in the same way. I see three 
reasonable possibilities


 1) add an option inplace=True/False. There is at least one such method 
in Sage: the relabel method for graphs. The behavior is as follows:


  if inplace=True: returns a new graph
  if inplace=False: modifies the graph inplace and does not return anything

One can do the same with .transpose for matrices. However, this would be 
the first time in matrix code.


2) Make a private inplace method mat._transpose_inplace()

3) Make a public inplace method mat.transpose_inplace()

Any preference between 1), 2), 3) or a suggestion for something else is 
welcome!


Vincent

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Kwankyu Lee]

It seems that some misunderstanding is going on here.

If a method returns an integer and a matrix by "Return n, m". I am saying 
that the output block can be simply

OUTPUT:

- integer ...

- matrix ...

instead of

OUTPUT: a tuple of ``(n,m)`` where

- ``n`` is a integer ...

- ``m`` is a matrix ...

You may prefer the second style, but does the first style miss an essential 
information?

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[sage-devel] About a mem / cpu -treshold

[Jori Mäntysalo]

Let T = Posets.TamariLattice(7). Then for example

%timeit
T.is_simple()

gives 1,41 seconds, whereas

%timeit
_ = T.lequal_matrix()
T.is_simple()

says 0,67 seconds. (You must restart the worksheet between tests, 
because meet- and join-matrices are saved.)


Is it OK to add a call to lequal_matrix() at the beginning of 
congruence()? It will speed up most computations, as the result is cached, 
and then interval() is faster, so congruence() is faster, and so 
is_simple(), is_regular() etc. are faster. However, it will also eat 
memory, because LatticePoset inherits UniqueRepresentation, and every 
lattice ever created in a session is saved in memory.


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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Sébastien Labbé]

On Monday, May 22, 2017 at 10:27:28 AM UTC+2, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:
>
>
> > The only thing I want to see in the OUTPUT 
> > block is 
> > the *type* of the objects and how many of them. 
>
> Why that? What's wrong with being verbose in the OUTPUT block? 
>

The OUTPUT block appearing below other, I think we do not want to impose 
that OUTPUT block get so verbose that it just repeat information that 
appeared above it. Of course, if something needs to be verbosed at that 
point following the information that was/was'nt given before, then yes, I 
think being verbose to clarify something not explained before is okay.



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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Mon, 22 May 2017, Daniel Krenn wrote:


My opinion is that the phrase "a tuple `(a,b,c)` where ..." is just
redundant.


I think that "a tuple" is important non-redundant information.


+1 for "a tuple" in this case (and not skipping this information; it is
essential)


+1 from me too. Something printed (a, b, c) might actually be something 
more complicated that a plain tuple.


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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Daniel Krenn]

On 2017-05-22 12:08, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:
> On 2017-05-22 12:05, Kwankyu Lee wrote:
>> My opinion is that the phrase "a tuple `(a,b,c)` where ..." is just
>> redundant.
> 
> I think that "a tuple" is important non-redundant information.

+1 for "a tuple" in this case (and not skipping this information; it is
essential)

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2017-05-22 12:21, Kwankyu Lee wrote:

The non-redundant information will be implied by the list of hyphened
items, if we stick to the convention.


So, in order to understand the docstring, the user needs to read the 
docstring and the convention on how to read the docstring. Not good!


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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Kwankyu Lee]

On Monday, May 22, 2017 at 12:08:35 PM UTC+2, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:
>
> On 2017-05-22 12:05, Kwankyu Lee wrote: 
> > My opinion is that the phrase "a tuple `(a,b,c)` where ..." is just 
> > redundant. 
>
> I think that "a tuple" is important non-redundant information. 
>

The non-redundant information will be implied by the list of hyphened 
items, if we stick to the convention. 

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2017-05-22 12:05, Kwankyu Lee wrote:

My opinion is that the phrase "a tuple `(a,b,c)` where ..." is just
redundant.


I think that "a tuple" is important non-redundant information.

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2017-05-22 12:05, Kwankyu Lee wrote:

This is ugly. By your previous opinion, wouldn't you prefer this?

|
OUTPUT:a tuple of ``(a,b,c)``where

-``a``is...

-``b``is...

-``c``is...
|

I think that the guideline of this thread combined with your one-liner
style for OUTPUT allows this.


Of course, this is much better.

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2017-05-22 11:35, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:

Why that? What's wrong with being verbose in the OUTPUT block?


This is a misquote.


I meant to reply to Sébastien Labbé.

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Kwankyu Lee]

On Monday, May 22, 2017 at 10:24:32 AM UTC+2, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:
>
> I very much object to this: 
>
> > If the output consists 
> > of several items, add each starting with a hyphen. 
>
> If the output consists of several items, the OUTPUT string should 
> clearly mention that fact (and it should mention whether the output is a 
> tuple or list or some other structure with several items). 
>

To be clear, I meant the case that the output is by

 Return a, b, c

My opinion is that the phrase "a tuple `(a,b,c)` where ..." is just 
redundant. Anyway I guess that different people have different opinions 
about this as well. 
 

> So something like: 
>
> OUTPUT: 
>
> - a tuple `(a,b,c)` where 
>
>- ``a`` is ... 
>
>- ``b`` is ... 
>
>- ``c`` is ... 
>

This is ugly. By your previous opinion, wouldn't you prefer this?

OUTPUT: a tuple of ``(a,b,c)`` where

- ``a`` is ...

- ``b`` is ...

- ``c`` is ...

I think that the guideline of this thread combined with your one-liner 
style for OUTPUT allows this.
 

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jori Mäntysalo]

On Mon, 22 May 2017, Jeroen Demeyer wrote:


On 2017-05-19 14:16, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:


The only thing I want to see in the OUTPUT block is the *type* of the 
objects and how many of them.


Why that? What's wrong with being verbose in the OUTPUT block?


This is a misquote. I support something like you suggested in this mail.

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Re: [sage-devel] Re: Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

On 2017-05-19 14:16, Jori Mäntysalo wrote:

The only thing I want to see in the OUTPUT
block is
the *type* of the objects and how many of them.


Why that? What's wrong with being verbose in the OUTPUT block?

I would like something like

INPUT:

- ``certificate`` -- boolean; whether to output a certificate, see OUTPUT

OUTPUT:

- If ``certificate=False``: a boolean

- If ``certificate=True``: something more complicated

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Re: [sage-devel] Second round poll for H5 a specific guideline for writing docstrings

[Jeroen Demeyer]

I very much object to this:


If the output consists
of several items, add each starting with a hyphen.


If the output consists of several items, the OUTPUT string should 
clearly mention that fact (and it should mention whether the output is a 
tuple or list or some other structure with several items).


So something like:

OUTPUT:

- a tuple `(a,b,c)` where

  - ``a`` is ...

  - ``b`` is ...

  - ``c`` is ...

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[sage-devel] bug in calculus.limit reported in ask.sagemath

[David . Coudert]

reported in 
https://ask.sagemath.org/question/37660/why-is-sage-calling-1-a-variable/

===
sage: x = var('x')
sage: f = 1/(x-3) 
sage: limit(f,x=3,dir='below')
---
UnboundLocalError Traceback (most recent call last)
 in ()
> 1 limit(f,x=Integer(3),dir='below')

/Users/dcoudert/sage/local/lib/python2.7/site-packages/sage/calculus/calculus.pyc
 
in limit(ex, dir, taylor, algorithm, **argv)
   1349 
   1350 #return l.sage()
-> 1351 return ex.parent()(l)
   1352 
   1353 # lim is alias for limit

UnboundLocalError: local variable 'l' referenced before assignment
===

A quick look at the method shows that local variable `l` (small cap `L) 
used in the method is not assigned when `algorithm=maxima` and 
`dir='below'`.
The case `dir='below'` is possible when `algorithm == 'maxima_taylor'` but 
is not specified in the INPUT section.
Some clarification is needed.

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