Re: [silk] War on Science?
On Fri, Feb 1, 2019, 1:00 PM Srini RamaKrishnan You've got to keep an open mind about these things, listen to his talks, he's astonishingly bright. I have to add that he's ethical and noble in his quest to find the truth, something I'd never accuse drug companies of. >
Re: [silk] War on Science?
On Fri, Feb 1, 2019, 11:56 AM Suresh Ramasubramanian > BM Hegde is a full blown anti vaxxer Why is any credence at all > being paid to his claims? You've got to keep an open mind about these things, listen to his talks, he's astonishingly bright. I think the truth in these cases lies somewhere in the middle. No doubt vaccines have been beneficial but the for-profit medical system has tried to invent a vaccine for just about everything of late, and these latest vaccinations are often optional and not very effective. The Western medical profession has a great many sins to its credit, especially when it comes to wellness - they pushed infant formula as safer than mother's milk, fat as the cause of cholesterol, the infamous food pyramid, the 2000 calorie a day diet, the 8 hours of sleep myth, and many more. The basic test of a science is repeatability, and not a single drug exists out there that works the same on everyone. The control groups never control for DNA, diet, lifestyle, height, weight and so many other factors, because to do so would be too expensive. Modern medicine then is at best an informed art, but not science.
Re: [silk] War on Science?
BM Hegde is a full blown anti vaxxer Why is any credence at all being paid to his claims? --srs On Fri, Feb 1, 2019 at 9:35 AM +0530, "Srini RamaKrishnan" wrote: The respected medical journal Lancet is named after the knife used to lance boils - and this was the specific metaphor the journal founder intended to convey, to bring a modicum of scientific rigor to the work of medicine which he felt was a messy boil on the face of humanity, full of half truths and lies. This was 1823. Cut to the present, and we see that for the last ten or twenty years well respected Doctors, Professors and even editors of journals like Lancet have repeatedly sounded the warning bell and warned that more than half the studies they publish in their peer reviewed journals can't be trusted. Then we see Pharma companies like Pfizer and GSK alone have paid more than 8 billion dollars each in the last two decades as malpractice settlements in the US alone, but I don't see anyone calling them quacks. They literally budget 1-2% of their revenue for future legal settlements annually. When expecting to get caught pulling a con, and setting aside money for fines is part of the business model, we have come a long way from science. It's just business. Not service. Not science. They even continue to sell drugs that have been banned or declared harmful in gullible parts of the world where the law is yet to wake up. That is the very definition of a con artist, who moves to new markets where the marks are still stupid. The modern drug industry is clutching at straws - after billions of dollars in research they have been forced to admit that the placebo effect is the most effective drug in their arsenal, and they don't know how it works. There is a point at which some people wake up to the fact that the practice of institutional medicine is one of the biggest cons. For instance, Dr. B M Hegde, is a world renowned cardiologist and a Padma Bhushan awardee who has spoken out repeatedly against the modern medical business that pushes invasive bypass surgeries, angioplasties and stents, which he says shorten lives and reduce quality of life - he advocates instead calming the mind using meditation and relaxation to accept death, and to allow the heart to naturally route around blockages. There's a tendency among Nobel laureates to think out of the box because they finally have nothing to lose. Incidentally Dr. Rustum Roy is said to have been nominated several times. Science cannot be science when it is wedded to money and power - it doesn't matter how brilliant you are, if you don't please the people with the purse you may as well rot. To speak truth to power requires courage, which is impossible when you are a slave. When you ignore this reality you find out the hard way what it costs - as with Dr. C. V. Raman, the 1930 winner of the Nobel prize in Chemistry who antagonized the ruling elite, especially Nehru and was expelled from IISC for not being political enough. He reportedly smashed his Bharat Ratna repeatedly with a hammer and gave up Chemistry, instead he taught his neighbor's children Carnatic music in his last decades, and hung a board outside his house - "No politicians allowed" - which mainly fingered the politicians that filled the boards of research institutes, but also the actual politicians who were their puppet masters. Most scientists today spend more than half or 3/4ths of their time on non-research activities, such as grant applications, networking, administrative affairs, and teaching. What little time is left is spent on the cargo cult ritual of publishing papers only on topics that were funded for being normative, and that stand the best chance of not being rejected for being too brave. Medicine is about the whole human - not just the body, but also the mind and the spirit. I think too many are still addicted to the opiate of accepted wisdom.
Re: [silk] War on Science?
The respected medical journal Lancet is named after the knife used to lance boils - and this was the specific metaphor the journal founder intended to convey, to bring a modicum of scientific rigor to the work of medicine which he felt was a messy boil on the face of humanity, full of half truths and lies. This was 1823. Cut to the present, and we see that for the last ten or twenty years well respected Doctors, Professors and even editors of journals like Lancet have repeatedly sounded the warning bell and warned that more than half the studies they publish in their peer reviewed journals can't be trusted. Then we see Pharma companies like Pfizer and GSK alone have paid more than 8 billion dollars each in the last two decades as malpractice settlements in the US alone, but I don't see anyone calling them quacks. They literally budget 1-2% of their revenue for future legal settlements annually. When expecting to get caught pulling a con, and setting aside money for fines is part of the business model, we have come a long way from science. It's just business. Not service. Not science. They even continue to sell drugs that have been banned or declared harmful in gullible parts of the world where the law is yet to wake up. That is the very definition of a con artist, who moves to new markets where the marks are still stupid. The modern drug industry is clutching at straws - after billions of dollars in research they have been forced to admit that the placebo effect is the most effective drug in their arsenal, and they don't know how it works. There is a point at which some people wake up to the fact that the practice of institutional medicine is one of the biggest cons. For instance, Dr. B M Hegde, is a world renowned cardiologist and a Padma Bhushan awardee who has spoken out repeatedly against the modern medical business that pushes invasive bypass surgeries, angioplasties and stents, which he says shorten lives and reduce quality of life - he advocates instead calming the mind using meditation and relaxation to accept death, and to allow the heart to naturally route around blockages. There's a tendency among Nobel laureates to think out of the box because they finally have nothing to lose. Incidentally Dr. Rustum Roy is said to have been nominated several times. Science cannot be science when it is wedded to money and power - it doesn't matter how brilliant you are, if you don't please the people with the purse you may as well rot. To speak truth to power requires courage, which is impossible when you are a slave. When you ignore this reality you find out the hard way what it costs - as with Dr. C. V. Raman, the 1930 winner of the Nobel prize in Chemistry who antagonized the ruling elite, especially Nehru and was expelled from IISC for not being political enough. He reportedly smashed his Bharat Ratna repeatedly with a hammer and gave up Chemistry, instead he taught his neighbor's children Carnatic music in his last decades, and hung a board outside his house - "No politicians allowed" - which mainly fingered the politicians that filled the boards of research institutes, but also the actual politicians who were their puppet masters. Most scientists today spend more than half or 3/4ths of their time on non-research activities, such as grant applications, networking, administrative affairs, and teaching. What little time is left is spent on the cargo cult ritual of publishing papers only on topics that were funded for being normative, and that stand the best chance of not being rejected for being too brave. Medicine is about the whole human - not just the body, but also the mind and the spirit. I think too many are still addicted to the opiate of accepted wisdom.
Re: [silk] War on Science?
cf https://www.quackwatch.org/01QuackeryRelatedTopics/pauling.html And yet Oregon State's Pauling institute still publishes nonsense like this https://lpi.oregonstate.edu/mic/health-disease/common-cold --srs On Thu, Jan 31, 2019 at 9:11 PM +0530, "Charles Haynes" wrote: I was about to say that I'm very much reminded of Linus Pauling, when he mentioned that he's a disciple of Linus Pauling. It's quite sad when a respected intellect in one field thinks that makes them an expert in unrelated fields and then promulgates nonsense like Pauling did. -- Charles On Thu, 31 Jan 2019 at 10:55, Srini RamaKrishnan wrote: > On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:52 AM Vani Murarka > wrote: > > > Deeply appreciative of the discussion going on here at present, the muck > > in science and in religion being called out. > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es5lfOeobAs > > I came across this excellent talk by Dr. Rustum Roy today. He's a > celebrated materials researcher who tried to do real ground breaking > science, and not just please the funding agency. >
Re: [silk] War on Science?
I was about to say that I'm very much reminded of Linus Pauling, when he mentioned that he's a disciple of Linus Pauling. It's quite sad when a respected intellect in one field thinks that makes them an expert in unrelated fields and then promulgates nonsense like Pauling did. -- Charles On Thu, 31 Jan 2019 at 10:55, Srini RamaKrishnan wrote: > On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:52 AM Vani Murarka > wrote: > > > Deeply appreciative of the discussion going on here at present, the muck > > in science and in religion being called out. > > > > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es5lfOeobAs > > I came across this excellent talk by Dr. Rustum Roy today. He's a > celebrated materials researcher who tried to do real ground breaking > science, and not just please the funding agency. >
Re: [silk] War on Science?
On Fri, Feb 23, 2018 at 9:52 AM Vani Murarka wrote: > Deeply appreciative of the discussion going on here at present, the muck > in science and in religion being called out. > https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Es5lfOeobAs I came across this excellent talk by Dr. Rustum Roy today. He's a celebrated materials researcher who tried to do real ground breaking science, and not just please the funding agency.
