RE: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled
Jeff, Never heard that one. The term we use is fully suppressed. John Drucker Fire Protection Subcode Official Red Bank, New Jersey -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 11:47 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled
Yes, I have heard it many times here in Virginia, and always find it amusing. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 11:47 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled
How about Automatic Sprinklers vs. Fire Sprinklers? At 09:07 AM 1/15/2009, you wrote: Content-class: urn:content-classes:message Content-Type: text/plain; charset=utf-8 Yes, I have heard it many times here in Virginia, and always find it amusing. Paul Pinigis, P.E. Life Safety Department Head -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 11:47 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Dry Pipe System Dilemmas
Just in case you were wondering the kids and I were outside this morning playing with water (in a variety of forms). Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: chr...@sentryfiremn.com Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -Original Message- From: Chris Cahill [mailto:chr...@sentryfiremn.com] Sent: Wednesday, December 24, 2008 10:42 AM To: 'sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org' Subject: RE: Dry Pipe System Dilemmas I don't know all the science but it happens http://www.coolantarctica.com/gallery/scenic/weather/Antarctica_weather2.htm Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: chr...@sentryfiremn.com Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of cherokeefire...@aol.com Sent: Thursday, December 18, 2008 4:59 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Dry Pipe System Dilemmas How can the water evaporate at -22? It turns to steam at 200 + Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: Chris Cahill chr...@sentryfiremn.com Date: Wed, 17 Dec 2008 14:59:34 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Dry Pipe System Dilemmas First it's Craig that gets the credit (or blame). I agree with the negative publicity point but that's your public information officer's job. In this discussion including our offline what did anyone suggest that could be remedied by engineering or codes? Its simple, follow the existing code and (owner) do proper maintenance including other systems (heating) that are seemingly unrelated and these things don't happen. It'd be like passing a new gun law every time someone gets shot instead of enforcing the ones we have. Oops bad analogy our politicians already do that. Your (and Craig's) list - if it ain't sloped right to today's requirements what make us think more required slope will actually achieved. I haven't seen slopes change because of shifting buildings and if it's because of changes to the system that's sloppy work not a result anything else. If there is equipment touching the sprinkler system causing vibration that's already a violation. Perhaps hanging a compressor on the riser is not a great idea but these shouldn't be running for any amount of time to cause fatigue fractures. Just about all other types of compressors I see have something flexible already that isolates the vibrations coincidently. Don't pipe with a belly down, don't drop the fittings. I don't see a fix in codes, it's a human factors problem in my opinion. Craig said The ice blockage doesn't always grow in a logical manner. Just on the semantics, ice ALWAYS grows in a logical manner. We, especially the farther south one lives, may not understand the logic but it is logical once all the issues are known and UNDERSTOOD. For example at a temperature of -22 deg. F I can throw an 85 deg. F cup of water in the air and it will not fall to the ground. Now if you have never had the pleasure of -22 you might think that is illogical. The air is so dry it evaporates before it hits the ground. I'm sure someone will comment the illogical issue is those that live in places that get to -22 and that's fine. I define logical as predictable and repeatable given all the same conditions. If it were illogical then you are suggesting ice formation is by some intelligent design that has the ability to defy the laws of nature and we don't want to go there on this forum. Gee, guns, politics and God in the same post related to fire sprinklers. If I could have only worked in abortion I'd have hit the big one (subtle in the sex, gambling or drugs category). How much would I have won (hey yet another topic not to be discussed 8 for 8 today, not bad)? What'd I miss? Child rearing? Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: chr...@sentryfiremn.com Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Smith, Steven D. (CSFD) Sent: Wednesday, December 17, 2008 1:54 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Dry Pipe System Dilemmas Thanks for the reply Chris. Being that there tends to be negative publicity for these types of events, and given what you've stated below, has there been any consideration to improving the engineering or codes to further prevent this? I.e. increasing the slope, improving the construction of fittings, providing vibration dampers as specific
Adding an antifreeze loop
I looked at a school shop yesterday. The shop is used for instruction in woodworking, welding, auto repair and class room instruction. At sometime a green house has been added. The wet sprinkler system was extended into the greenhouse, using two 1.5 inch lines. The inspectors test port is at end of one of the branch lines. In the past, they have had problems with the piping protecting the greenhouse freezing breaking the pipes. At present, the branch lines have had ball valves installed and the water supply to the greenhouse is off. I am going to propose that we install an antifreeze loop to protect the greenhouse. I am thinking about a connecting the inlet of the antifreeze loop to only one of the branch lines and then connecting the outlet of the antifreeze loop to both of the branch lines going through the block wall to the greenhouse. I will install a separate inspectors test line so we can test the system w/o loosing the antifreeze. Any suggestions? Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: partial freeze damage
If the dry heads tripped because of the ice, your wet heads will probably do the same. Were they dry sidewalls or dry pendants? How did exposure to ice cause them to open? Did the heads actually have ice on them?' There are a lot of issues with anti-freeze loops and you need to check with the AHJ and possibly Health and Environmental Services departments to make sure what restrictions may be in place in your area. But dry barrel sprinklers if installed properly should not have been compromised by exposure to cold. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of douglas hicks Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:45 AM To: sprinkler board Subject: partial freeze damage We have had some cool weather lately. One of our accounts has a canopy at the front entry, protected by a wet system and dry heads. Two of the dry heads tripped because of the ice. I am proposing to replace the dry heads to standard heads and make that part of the wet pipe system into an antifreeze loop. I have included replacement of the upright heads in the canopy as an option. I have seen heads that leak after exposure to freezing. Not a failure, but seeping because the seat has started to leak because of the pressure of the ice. My first concern is that the seepage can cause water deposits that may prevent the head activating because of the water deposits. My second concern is that the head will fail because the seal at the seat is compromised. Am I right about my concerns, or am I wrong. Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
partial freeze damage
We have had some cool weather lately. One of our accounts has a canopy at the front entry, protected by a wet system and dry heads. Two of the dry heads tripped because of the ice. I am proposing to replace the dry heads to standard heads and make that part of the wet pipe system into an antifreeze loop. I have included replacement of the upright heads in the canopy as an option. I have seen heads that leak after exposure to freezing. Not a failure, but seeping because the seat has started to leak because of the pressure of the ice. My first concern is that the seepage can cause water deposits that may prevent the head activating because of the water deposits. My second concern is that the head will fail because the seal at the seat is compromised. Am I right about my concerns, or am I wrong. Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
You can add sprinklered to your dictionary and that should take care of that. My very first week in the trade, June of 1981, I referred to a building as sprinkled and my boss got right in my face and said, Your house plants get sprinkled, but buildings are sprinklered.I have never, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection
Ah! The bunker mentality without all the ammunition. A perfect place to store all of that pre packaged C-4. Thom McMahon, SET Firetech, Inc. 2560 Copper Ridge Dr P.O. Box 882136 Steamboat Springs, CO 80488 Tel: 970-879-7952 Fax: 970-879-7926 Ron Greenman Solid concrete buildings with no contents allowed and no entrance so nothing can be added. ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection
Thanks to all!! During discussion... I received a call informing me that they're requiring an OH II rating throughout the penthouse! So, either there's more than meets the eye in this penthouse... or someone on the other side of the pendulum is dictating the hazard. May need to edjumakate myself along with some others! :) -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 10:41 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection I lean toward LH if it is a matter of fuel loading, the rationale being I've seen far, far more combustibles in an office area than in any mechanical room I've ever been in. However, I lean toward OH if it is a matter of sprinkler spacing, the rationale being I can't figure out how you can design a system for a mechanical room and not have significant obstruction of the discharge by joists, lights, conduit, ducts, and equipment. More sprinklers mean more opportunity for the water to be distributed. Maybe a 130 sq ft light hazard design, using orifice size to adjust flow. Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell Original Message Subject: RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection From: Dave Sornsin dsorn...@nardinifire.com Date: Wed, January 14, 2009 9:23 pm To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org I don't know Chuck, but I do know this: If said mechanical room is in North Dakota, and if the room is in a health care facility, then the AHJ will MAKE you classify it as LH and if you installed 200 degree SSU's they'll MAKE you remove them and install QR 155's cause they say it's light hazard and how dare you install a sub-standard ordinary hazard system in a mechanical room! sigh Dave Sornsin General Manager Nardini Fire Equipment 303 20th St N Fargo, ND 58102 701.235.4224 fax 701.235.5089 cell 701.371.0643 dsorn...@nardinifire.com www.nardinifire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 3:51 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection Considering the range of what we've all encountered as Mechanical Rooms, from large to small, from clean and neat to high-piled rat-hole, its not surprising that appropriate hazard analysis probably DOES range from LH to EH. The joys of trying to write a code as all-encompassing as #13, I don't envy the Committee members. Especially reviewing thousands of proposed changes! glc -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Chris Cahill Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 12:12 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection We had a discussion about this back in Nov. '08. 11/18/08 to be more exact. I don't think we ever really established a final real code driven answer that applied. Some speculated about boxes and fluids others pointed out many have no such issues but had potential. Most opinions leaned toward OHI, some OHII, and an undeniable rational thought or two for LH. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: chr...@sentryfiremn.com Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of RFP Chuck Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:05 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Mechanical Penthouse Occupancy + Protection (I apologize if this comes through 3x - having email difficulties - and this hasn't shown back up on my screen) I think this has been brought up before. you have a 'standard' mechanical room - or a mechanical penthouse where the only thing(s) that's in the room is the HVAC / Plumbing / Electrical misc. - no storage - (in a perfect world). Looking in Chapter 5 of NFPA 13 - 2007 ed. It doesn't have a 'mechanical room' designation under any of the Hazard Occupancies. can one consider it Light? I've always designed w/ OH intent. and the smaller rooms 400 s.f. utilizing the L.H. exception. Any past experiences, insight would be appreciated. I just want to make sure that I'm not overlooking something. Thanks RFP Chuck unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email
RE: partial freeze damage
Could be that there was not enough length of dry sprinkler in the heated space, or the insulation between heated and unheated was inadequate or compromised such that the freeze-up occurred at the connection of the dry sprinklers to the wet pipe. That could damage the seal and cause leakage. I have seen a wide variety of damage due to freezing or partial freezing of sprinkler systems, included popped sprinklers, partially popped sprinklers, frames distorted and leaking at the seat, broken fittings, burst pipe, broken valves, etc. If the uprights were exposed to ice in the system, even if the fusible element appears intact, they should probably be replaced. Remember, 25 requires leaking sprinklers to be replaced, so if you can see evidence of seapage around the seat, replace the sprinkler. I agree with Craig, if you can configure the space to be protected with dry sprinklers, use them. Anti-freeze loops are a pain in the ... .You will probably have to add an RPZ either locally at the loop or back at the supply, an expansion tank, a means for draining and checking the level of anti-freeze, etc. It guarantees a higher level of ITM will be needed and that can mean a lower level of reliability. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com wrote: From: craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com Subject: RE: partial freeze damage To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:56 AM If the dry heads tripped because of the ice, your wet heads will probably do the same. Were they dry sidewalls or dry pendants? How did exposure to ice cause them to open? Did the heads actually have ice on them?' There are a lot of issues with anti-freeze loops and you need to check with the AHJ and possibly Health and Environmental Services departments to make sure what restrictions may be in place in your area. But dry barrel sprinklers if installed properly should not have been compromised by exposure to cold. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of douglas hicks Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:45 AM To: sprinkler board Subject: partial freeze damage We have had some cool weather lately. One of our accounts has a canopy at the front entry, protected by a wet system and dry heads. Two of the dry heads tripped because of the ice. I am proposing to replace the dry heads to standard heads and make that part of the wet pipe system into an antifreeze loop. I have included replacement of the upright heads in the canopy as an option. I have seen heads that leak after exposure to freezing. Not a failure, but seeping because the seat has started to leak because of the pressure of the ice. My first concern is that the seepage can cause water deposits that may prevent the head activating because of the water deposits. My second concern is that the head will fail because the seal at the seat is compromised. Am I right about my concerns, or am I wrong. Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
Sprinkler would be the noun, Sprinklered would be an adjective (describing the condition of the area) and sprinklering would be the verb. Sprinklering? I doubt that's even a word. (Geez why do I even remember that stuff?) Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of David de Vries Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 11:02 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled Yes indeed, a serious question. Althugh sprinkler is a noun and when used as sprinklered it is some form of a verb (its been a long long time since I've had to know what that form is called), if one wants to use a single word to describe the state of fire protection of a building, I think sprinklered and non-sprinklered are well enough recognized in the field to be appropriate. I agree with Steve and his old boss, sprinkled is not the appropriate term. I once corrected an attorney during a deposition about a burned-down warehouse when he asked me to describe the sprinkling system and told him that I had not looked at the landscaping equipment, only the fire protection equipment. That kinda set the tone for the rest of his questions -- he was not pleased. Lastly, echoing John, I think the formal and correct way to describe a building's state of fire protection would be fully (or partially, or not) protected with an automatic sprinkler system as the way to go. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com wrote: From: Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com Subject: RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:43 AM You can add sprinklered to your dictionary and that should take care of that. My very first week in the trade, June of 1981, I referred to a building as sprinkled and my boss got right in my face and said, Your house plants get sprinkled, but buildings are sprinklered.I have never, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Ron Greenman at home ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:43 AM You can add sprinklered to your dictionary and that should take care of that. My very first week in the trade, June of 1981, I referred to a building as sprinkled and my boss got right in my face and said, Your house plants get sprinkled, but buildings are sprinklered.I have never, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
about a burned-down warehouse when he asked me to describe the sprinkling system and told him that I had not looked at the landscaping equipment, only the fire protection equipment. That kinda set the tone for the rest of his questions -- he was not pleased. Lastly, echoing John, I think the formal and correct way to describe a building's state of fire protection would be fully (or partially, or not) protected with an automatic sprinkler system as the way to go. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com wrote: From: Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com Subject: RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:43 AM You can add sprinklered to your dictionary and that should take care of that. My very first week in the trade, June of 1981, I referred to a building as sprinkled and my boss got right in my face and said, Your house plants get sprinkled, but buildings are sprinklered.I have never, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email
UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding
Any suggestions on the level of training one needs in order to set loose a heretofore novice, at joining HDPE pipe? Should we use a factory trained technician to join this pipe or will a field class suffice, or something in betweeen? scot deal excelsior fire ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Ron Greenman at home ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Boat Storage
I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Intersting statistics on electricity fire fighters
Many of my electrical engineering buddies and some fire fighters always protest the presence of sprinklers in some form or fashion within electrical rooms or where electrical gear is located. I've challenged them to produce statistics on electrocutions or electrical shock related injuries where sprinklers have discharged in theses kinds of rooms and so far no one has ever been able to produce anything. Well in doing some research I did come across some fire fighter statistics related to on the job fatalities as compiled by the CDC/NIOSH. Between 1998 and 2005 there were a total of six recorded FF deaths due to electrocution. Two were wildfire related with downed power lines. The other four did not have detailed information. But other data indicated leading cases of electrocution were ladders in contact with power lines, and being struck by lightning. The leading cause of FF death is Motor Vehicle Accidents, #2 is Asphyxiation. Just some interesting info I intend to share with my sparky buds the next time they bring up the issue of sprinklers sprinklering the sprinklered rooms. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com wrote: From: Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com Subject: RE: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:43 AM You can add sprinklered to your dictionary and that should take care of that. My very first week in the trade, June of 1981, I referred to a building as sprinkled and my boss got right in my face and said, Your house plants get sprinkled, but buildings are sprinklered.I have never, ever, NEVER used the term sprinkled since then and I think of my old boss every time I hear someone say sprinkled. I'm tearing up just thinking about it ... Steve Leyton Protection Design Consulting San Diego, CA -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Justin Reid Sent: Wednesday, January 14, 2009 9:45 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Sprinklered vs Sprinkled I have heard sprinkled used, but I do not think it is regional more than just the person using the term. I prefer sprinklered because the other sounds too dainty. I picture a very small amount of water in a sprinkled building. Although, my spell check always tries to change my sprinklered to sprinkled. I just looked up sprinklered in the Merriam Webster online dictionary ( www.*merriam*-*webster*.com) and the definition is : to have a sprinkler system. Apparently this has been in the MW Dictionary since 1927 (so debate solved) Let's all try and stop the use of sprinkled. On Wed, Jan 14, 2009 at 8:47 PM, bill.bro...@brooksfpe.com wrote: Actually this is a serious question. Is there anywhere in the country where the term sprinkled is commonly used by sprinkler industry types to describe a building with a sprinkler system? Bill Brooks William N. Brooks, P.E. Brooks Fire Protection Engineering Inc. 372 Wilett Drive Severna Park, MD 21146 410-544-3620 Phone 410-544-3032 FAX 412-400-6528 Cell ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3ASprinklerforum-request@ firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) -- Justin Reid ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3767 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com __ Information from ESET NOD32 Antivirus, version of virus signature database 3768 (20090115) __ The message was checked by ESET NOD32 Antivirus. http://www.eset.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ
Re: Sprinklered vs. Sprinkled
Be judicious in your verbifications. You may find yourself in an untenable verbifunistic situation wherein verbaforms begin to talk on a nounistic rather than a solid verbistian aspect. Said like a true spec writer Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding
Scot, Although we all know there are some individuals that learn well, and quickly, in the field class I strongly recommend the factor trained technician. Scott Futrell (763) 425-1001 Office (612) 759-5556 Cell -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of å... Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 1:35 PM To: SprinklerFORUM@firesprinkler.org Subject: UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding Any suggestions on the level of training one needs in order to set loose a heretofore novice, at joining HDPE pipe? Should we use a factory trained technician to join this pipe or will a field class suffice, or something in betweeen? scot deal excelsior fire ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Boat Storage
Russell, I assume you mean rack storage of boats. I have a friend in that is involved with that business and according to him, no. (He asked to to do some consulting on this issue, but when I listed all of the problems and considerations, the offer mysteriously disappeared.) I haven't seen anything in this industry, but I'm usually the last to know. Fortunately, mine are stacked one high. At 02:56 PM 1/15/2009, you wrote: I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: partial freeze damage
Just a reminder though that dry sprinklers now have to be tested or replaced every ten years... That needs to be factored in. Scott (763) 425-1001 Office (612) 759-5556 Cell -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of David de Vries Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:16 AM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: partial freeze damage Could be that there was not enough length of dry sprinkler in the heated space, or the insulation between heated and unheated was inadequate or compromised such that the freeze-up occurred at the connection of the dry sprinklers to the wet pipe. That could damage the seal and cause leakage. I have seen a wide variety of damage due to freezing or partial freezing of sprinkler systems, included popped sprinklers, partially popped sprinklers, frames distorted and leaking at the seat, broken fittings, burst pipe, broken valves, etc. If the uprights were exposed to ice in the system, even if the fusible element appears intact, they should probably be replaced. Remember, 25 requires leaking sprinklers to be replaced, so if you can see evidence of seapage around the seat, replace the sprinkler. I agree with Craig, if you can configure the space to be protected with dry sprinklers, use them. Anti-freeze loops are a pain in the ... .You will probably have to add an RPZ either locally at the loop or back at the supply, an expansion tank, a means for draining and checking the level of anti-freeze, etc. It guarantees a higher level of ITM will be needed and that can mean a lower level of reliability. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com wrote: From: craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com Subject: RE: partial freeze damage To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:56 AM If the dry heads tripped because of the ice, your wet heads will probably do the same. Were they dry sidewalls or dry pendants? How did exposure to ice cause them to open? Did the heads actually have ice on them?' There are a lot of issues with anti-freeze loops and you need to check with the AHJ and possibly Health and Environmental Services departments to make sure what restrictions may be in place in your area. But dry barrel sprinklers if installed properly should not have been compromised by exposure to cold. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of douglas hicks Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:45 AM To: sprinkler board Subject: partial freeze damage We have had some cool weather lately. One of our accounts has a canopy at the front entry, protected by a wet system and dry heads. Two of the dry heads tripped because of the ice. I am proposing to replace the dry heads to standard heads and make that part of the wet pipe system into an antifreeze loop. I have included replacement of the upright heads in the canopy as an option. I have seen heads that leak after exposure to freezing. Not a failure, but seeping because the seat has started to leak because of the pressure of the ice. My first concern is that the seepage can cause water deposits that may prevent the head activating because of the water deposits. My second concern is that the head will fail because the seal at the seat is compromised. Am I right about my concerns, or am I wrong. Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Boat Storage
Russell, There was an interesting artical in summer 2004 Sprinkler Quarterly. Titled Storage of Boats. Written by Kenneth Isman PE --Original Message-- From: Russell Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org To: AFSA ReplyTo: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Boat Storage Sent: Jan 15, 2009 2:56 PM I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: partial freeze damage
Regarding the anti-freeze loop RPZ, you also now need a means of conducting forward flow test of the backflow. Forest Wilson Cherokee Fire Sent from my Verizon Wireless BlackBerry -Original Message- From: David de Vries ddevr...@firetecheng.net Date: Thu, 15 Jan 2009 08:15:59 To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: partial freeze damage Could be that there was not enough length of dry sprinkler in the heated space, or the insulation between heated and unheated was inadequate or compromised such that the freeze-up occurred at the connection of the dry sprinklers to the wet pipe. That could damage the seal and cause leakage. I have seen a wide variety of damage due to freezing or partial freezing of sprinkler systems, included popped sprinklers, partially popped sprinklers, frames distorted and leaking at the seat, broken fittings, burst pipe, broken valves, etc. If the uprights were exposed to ice in the system, even if the fusible element appears intact, they should probably be replaced. Remember, 25 requires leaking sprinklers to be replaced, so if you can see evidence of seapage around the seat, replace the sprinkler. I agree with Craig, if you can configure the space to be protected with dry sprinklers, use them. Anti-freeze loops are a pain in the ... .You will probably have to add an RPZ either locally at the loop or back at the supply, an expansion tank, a means for draining and checking the level of anti-freeze, etc. It guarantees a higher level of ITM will be needed and that can mean a lower level of reliability. Dave David A. de Vries, P.E., CSP Firetech Engineering Incorporated 2715 Harrison St. Evanston, IL 60201 Tel: 847-733-0944 Fax: 847-866-6255 --- On Thu, 1/15/09, craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com wrote: From: craig.pr...@ch2m.com craig.pr...@ch2m.com Subject: RE: partial freeze damage To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Date: Thursday, January 15, 2009, 9:56 AM If the dry heads tripped because of the ice, your wet heads will probably do the same. Were they dry sidewalls or dry pendants? How did exposure to ice cause them to open? Did the heads actually have ice on them?' There are a lot of issues with anti-freeze loops and you need to check with the AHJ and possibly Health and Environmental Services departments to make sure what restrictions may be in place in your area. But dry barrel sprinklers if installed properly should not have been compromised by exposure to cold. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of douglas hicks Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 10:45 AM To: sprinkler board Subject: partial freeze damage We have had some cool weather lately. One of our accounts has a canopy at the front entry, protected by a wet system and dry heads. Two of the dry heads tripped because of the ice. I am proposing to replace the dry heads to standard heads and make that part of the wet pipe system into an antifreeze loop. I have included replacement of the upright heads in the canopy as an option. I have seen heads that leak after exposure to freezing. Not a failure, but seeping because the seat has started to leak because of the pressure of the ice. My first concern is that the seepage can cause water deposits that may prevent the head activating because of the water deposits. My second concern is that the head will fail because the seal at the seat is compromised. Am I right about my concerns, or am I wrong. Douglas Hicks General Fire Equipment Co of Eastern Oregon, Inc ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list
UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding
then let us go to the next question... if we go DI and sleeve with polyethylene there still are some downsides...even though bell-joints may be simpler to install. 1. with the sun we have here, there is sure to be deterioration in the film, 2. pinhole perforations we lead to erosion of our iron. damned if we do, damned if we don't i suggest quality, even though the bosses wont. s On Fri, Jan 16, 2009 at 12:40 AM, å... eurekaig...@gmail.com wrote: the pipe is to be used for UG to a major civil structure with a 24-7 service to the public. The soil is hot, plenty of chlorides. Life expectancy for the building, like many government structures is over 50 years. We have heat, but not above eighty at depth of bury. I guess that answers my own question... scot deal excelsior fire Any suggestions on the level of training one needs in order to set loose a heretofore novice, at joining HDPE pipe? Should we use a factory trained technician to join this pipe or will a field class suffice, or something in betweeen? scot deal excelsior fire ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters
I've had quite a few local Fire Chief types (acting AHJ's) express their disdain for sprinklers in electrical rooms. Even had one who told a client within his jurisdiction to disable the sprinklers in their electrical rooms (even though it was now in violation of building codes). It's not a new or unique attitude. My son-in-law said that one of the first things they do when coming on scene is disconnect any power or fuel sources before entering any structure. So I do not know why some have the reservations they express. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 3:37 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters Why would FF's protest. Or more to the point what is their complaint? I know about the elec-pre Madonna-tricians. Does not said power get cut before entry? I guess not all the time. Will not the power circuit open once water meets conductor? (from the sprinkler not the FF, which occurs before their arrival). That is interesting... Be sure not to sprinkle(--?) it with sugar when you ask them. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:14 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Intersting statistics on electricity fire fighters Many of my electrical engineering buddies and some fire fighters always protest the presence of sprinklers in some form or fashion within electrical rooms or where electrical gear is located. I've challenged them to produce statistics on electrocutions or electrical shock related injuries where sprinklers have discharged in theses kinds of rooms and so far no one has ever been able to produce anything. Well in doing some research I did come across some fire fighter statistics related to on the job fatalities as compiled by the CDC/NIOSH. Between 1998 and 2005 there were a total of six recorded FF deaths due to electrocution. Two were wildfire related with downed power lines. The other four did not have detailed information. But other data indicated leading cases of electrocution were ladders in contact with power lines, and being struck by lightning. The leading cause of FF death is Motor Vehicle Accidents, #2 is Asphyxiation. Just some interesting info I intend to share with my sparky buds the next time they bring up the issue of sprinklers sprinklering the sprinklered rooms. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Boat Storage
hard to ignite but they burn all right. i would consider amidst your other options a zoned deluge. several small zones. detecto-wire to trip the system... they could probably take a false activation well. if it was not cold as hell scot deal excelsior On Thu, Jan 15, 2009 at 11:56 PM, Russell russ...@brownautomatic.comwrote: I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.orgto%3asprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding
We had a job in the past that required this. Our pipe supplier sent a rep. to field train our men, as part of this cost he stayed for a couple of days making sure the training was effective. Then after paying for the training we got to rent the machine. Hope you bid it accurately. Good Luck, it wasn't as bad as it seems as long as you were prepared when you bid it. The field training and installation went well. Bobby Gillett SR. Project Manager Key Fire Protection, Inc. (731) 424-0130 office (731) 424-9285 fax (731) 267-4853 cell bobby.gill...@keyfireprotection.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of å... Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 1:35 PM To: SprinklerFORUM@firesprinkler.org Subject: UG - HDPE - electrofusion welding Any suggestions on the level of training one needs in order to set loose a heretofore novice, at joining HDPE pipe? Should we use a factory trained technician to join this pipe or will a field class suffice, or something in betweeen? scot deal excelsior fire ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters
Why would FF's protest. Or more to the point what is their complaint? I know about the elec-pre Madonna-tricians. Does not said power get cut before entry? I guess not all the time. Will not the power circuit open once water meets conductor? (from the sprinkler not the FF, which occurs before their arrival). That is interesting... Be sure not to sprinkle(--?) it with sugar when you ask them. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:14 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Intersting statistics on electricity fire fighters Many of my electrical engineering buddies and some fire fighters always protest the presence of sprinklers in some form or fashion within electrical rooms or where electrical gear is located. I've challenged them to produce statistics on electrocutions or electrical shock related injuries where sprinklers have discharged in theses kinds of rooms and so far no one has ever been able to produce anything. Well in doing some research I did come across some fire fighter statistics related to on the job fatalities as compiled by the CDC/NIOSH. Between 1998 and 2005 there were a total of six recorded FF deaths due to electrocution. Two were wildfire related with downed power lines. The other four did not have detailed information. But other data indicated leading cases of electrocution were ladders in contact with power lines, and being struck by lightning. The leading cause of FF death is Motor Vehicle Accidents, #2 is Asphyxiation. Just some interesting info I intend to share with my sparky buds the next time they bring up the issue of sprinklers sprinklering the sprinklered rooms. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Boat Storage
http://www.mail-archive.com/sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org/msg04310.html Follow this thread. Thanks Mark. I could not remember where that article was. Russell, I spent alot of time on one of these. You really need to read that article by Mr. Isman. You also need to do online research and read ALL of the fire reports you can find. Look at all the pics. I have seen triple 1000gpm nozzles on a SINGLE Story structure, and it lost in minutes.. Very Very much thin ice on these... R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of m...@markeckard.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:41 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Boat Storage Russell, There was an interesting artical in summer 2004 Sprinkler Quarterly. Titled Storage of Boats. Written by Kenneth Isman PE --Original Message-- From: Russell Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org To: AFSA ReplyTo: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Boat Storage Sent: Jan 15, 2009 2:56 PM I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters
You might want to check with your SOL again. In 18 years I have yet to enter a building in the initial stages with the power or fuel off. I read a bunch of national info on FF'ing. I have never heard of cutting power or fuel before the initial entry for the run of the mill fires. You might want to inquire how they are doing this. If they are pulling the meter they are putting themselves at great risk. I saw a video once of a FF doing this and he basically blew himself up because there was a big arc as it came apart. If they are dealing with the transmission lines very dumb without being an experienced lineman. Maybe he is. If they are throwing the circuit breakers safer. IMHO there is no valid reason to waste time dealing with the electrical power before one enters initially. Like you already found out electricity is really a non-issue as a cause of FF injuries or deaths. I accept each run is unique and there are exceptions such as if you are entering a substation that is burning or the like. As far as AHJ they are people first. People tend to fear what they don't know. Take a Fire Chief add things most of them no nothing about like sprinklers, electricity and the law combine the public thinking they actually know what they are talking about and it's a disaster. Chris Cahill, P.E. Fire Protection Engineer Sentry Fire Protection, Inc. 763-658-4483 763-658-4921 fax Email: chr...@sentryfiremn.com Mail: P.O. Box 69 Waverly, MN 55390 Location: 4439 Hwy 12 SW Waverly, MN 55390 -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:46 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters I've had quite a few local Fire Chief types (acting AHJ's) express their disdain for sprinklers in electrical rooms. Even had one who told a client within his jurisdiction to disable the sprinklers in their electrical rooms (even though it was now in violation of building codes). It's not a new or unique attitude. My son-in-law said that one of the first things they do when coming on scene is disconnect any power or fuel sources before entering any structure. So I do not know why some have the reservations they express. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC 29304-0491 Direct - 864.599.4102 Fax - 864.599.8439 craig.pr...@ch2m.com http://www.ch2m.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Matthew J. Willis Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 3:37 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: RE: Interesting statistics on electricity fire fighters Why would FF's protest. Or more to the point what is their complaint? I know about the elec-pre Madonna-tricians. Does not said power get cut before entry? I guess not all the time. Will not the power circuit open once water meets conductor? (from the sprinkler not the FF, which occurs before their arrival). That is interesting... Be sure not to sprinkle(--?) it with sugar when you ask them. R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of craig.pr...@ch2m.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:14 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Intersting statistics on electricity fire fighters Many of my electrical engineering buddies and some fire fighters always protest the presence of sprinklers in some form or fashion within electrical rooms or where electrical gear is located. I've challenged them to produce statistics on electrocutions or electrical shock related injuries where sprinklers have discharged in theses kinds of rooms and so far no one has ever been able to produce anything. Well in doing some research I did come across some fire fighter statistics related to on the job fatalities as compiled by the CDC/NIOSH. Between 1998 and 2005 there were a total of six recorded FF deaths due to electrocution. Two were wildfire related with downed power lines. The other four did not have detailed information. But other data indicated leading cases of electrocution were ladders in contact with power lines, and being struck by lightning. The leading cause of FF death is Motor Vehicle Accidents, #2 is Asphyxiation. Just some interesting info I intend to share with my sparky buds the next time they bring up the issue of sprinklers sprinklering the sprinklered rooms. Craig L. Prahl, CET Fire Protection Specialist Mechanical Department CH2MHILL Lockwood Greene 1500 International Drive PO Box 491, Spartanburg, SC
RE: Boat Storage
Thanks all for the response. I read the article by Mr. Isman and found it to be very informative and in agreement with everyone else that the problem is a large one and very much still is unresolved. The Fire Protection and Research Foundation report I'll have to take home tonight to study over. And yes, what I'm looking at is rack. All the storage facilities I've ever been in had no fire protection system. I guess the proprietor paid dearly for insurance or the boat owners had good insurance themselves. I've noticed that to own a boat you need money to burn (no pun intended) so I'll just have to keep going to the boat shows and sitting in them pretending and wishing. For now I suppose I'll pass on this bid, give a copy of the articles and forum archives you guys offered up and wait for NFPA to cover my butt. Thanks again for your input. As always, very helpful. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
FW: [EPARADE] Link to final Charleston FD Report
Fire Chief Magazine has posted a copy of the Charleston Sofa Super Store Fatality Investigation Report, for those who are interested. http://firechief.com/images/charleston_report_0508.pdf Steve Leyton PROTECTION DESIGN CONSULTING 8849-B Complex Drive San Diego, CA 92123 - Ph: 858.751.2930 - ext. 102 Fax:858.751.2933 Cell: 619.972.5696 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Firematic
I was putting our Firetrol pump controller catalog back in its place on the shelf in our library, when I realized that it has been next to an old Firematic catalog forever.I've told several people over the past few years about how Firematic used to make a concealed cover plate with a pattern of pock-marks that looked like the surface of an acoustic ceiling tile. It was really trick - we used quite a few of them in the early 90's, which is about when they started making them, if I remember correctly. This particular data sheet is dated 1/94 - I can't remember when they folded. Has anyone ever seen another manufacturer's cover plate with this type of pattern? And if you'd like to see a scan of the tech data sheet for the Firematic Model A Concealed sprinkler, please e-mail me off-Forum. Steve Leyton PROTECTION DESIGN CONSULTING 8849-B Complex Drive San Diego, CA 92123 - Ph: 858.751.2930 - ext. 102 Fax:858.751.2933 Cell: 619.972.5696 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
Re: Firematic
I think that is the only Model A data sheet I don't have in my Firematic catalog. Good find. I didn't know that they got much play on the other coast. At 06:15 PM 1/15/2009, you wrote: I was putting our Firetrol pump controller catalog back in its place on the shelf in our library, when I realized that it has been next to an old Firematic catalog forever.I've told several people over the past few years about how Firematic used to make a concealed cover plate with a pattern of pock-marks that looked like the surface of an acoustic ceiling tile. It was really trick - we used quite a few of them in the early 90's, which is about when they started making them, if I remember correctly. This particular data sheet is dated 1/94 - I can't remember when they folded. Has anyone ever seen another manufacturer's cover plate with this type of pattern? And if you'd like to see a scan of the tech data sheet for the Firematic Model A Concealed sprinkler, please e-mail me off-Forum. Steve Leyton PROTECTION DESIGN CONSULTING 8849-B Complex Drive San Diego, CA 92123 - Ph: 858.751.2930 - ext. 102 Fax:858.751.2933 Cell: 619.972.5696 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: Boat Storage
Does anybody know where I could find a copy of Ken's article? I'd be interested. At 03:53 PM 1/15/2009, you wrote: http://www.mail-archive.com/sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org/msg04310.html Follow this thread. Thanks Mark. I could not remember where that article was. Russell, I spent alot of time on one of these. You really need to read that article by Mr. Isman. You also need to do online research and read ALL of the fire reports you can find. Look at all the pics. I have seen triple 1000gpm nozzles on a SINGLE Story structure, and it lost in minutes.. Very Very much thin ice on these... R/ Matt Matthew J. Willis Norred Fire Systems L.L.C. 318-387-1134 Voice 318-387-1163 Facsimile m...@norredfire.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of m...@markeckard.com Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 2:41 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Re: Boat Storage Russell, There was an interesting artical in summer 2004 Sprinkler Quarterly. Titled Storage of Boats. Written by Kenneth Isman PE --Original Message-- From: Russell Sender: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org To: AFSA ReplyTo: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: Boat Storage Sent: Jan 15, 2009 2:56 PM I remember that not long ago this forum discussed the protection for boat storage facilities and it proved to be quite a problem. Has anyone come up with a satisfactory design for this type commodity/storage arrangement? I'm looking to bid such. Russell Rewis Brown Automatic Sprinklers, Inc. 107C Hemlock Street Valdosta, Georgia 31601 229-244-8130 russ...@brownautomatic.com ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Sent from my BlackBerry Smartphone provided by Alltel ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) Todd G. Williams, PE Fire Protection Design/Consulting Stonington, Connecticut www.fpdc.com 860.535.2080 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
RE: [EPARADE] Link to final Charleston FD Report
Thanks Steve John Drucker Ex-Captain Station 8 (Combination Truck/Engine) Building Construction and Safety Instructor Middletown Township Fire Department, NJ www.middletownfire1.com -Original Message- From: sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org [mailto:sprinklerforum-boun...@firesprinkler.org] On Behalf Of Steve Leyton Sent: Thursday, January 15, 2009 5:11 PM To: sprinklerforum@firesprinkler.org Subject: FW: [EPARADE] Link to final Charleston FD Report Fire Chief Magazine has posted a copy of the Charleston Sofa Super Store Fatality Investigation Report, for those who are interested. http://firechief.com/images/charleston_report_0508.pdf Steve Leyton PROTECTION DESIGN CONSULTING 8849-B Complex Drive San Diego, CA 92123 - Ph: 858.751.2930 - ext. 102 Fax:858.751.2933 Cell: 619.972.5696 ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) ___ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: techsupp...@firesprinkler.org To Unsubscribe, send an email to:sprinklerforum-requ...@firesprinkler.org (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
