RE: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time.

2013-05-17 Thread Morey, Mike
From NFPA 22 2012: 14.4.1 A permanent pipe connected to a water supply shall be provided to fill the tank, except as provided in 14.4.1.1. 14.4.1.1 Where a permanent water supply is not available to refill the tank, an approved plan shall be permitted for manually refilling the tank. 14.4.1.2

Re: NFPA 22 Minimum tank size for a Break-Tank

2013-05-17 Thread Roland Huggins
NFPA 20 has the guidance on break tanks. Wouldn't immediately think of looking in the pump standard for tanks but since they are an integral part of the pump system it makes sense (well it does now anyways - lol). Roland Roland Huggins, PE - VP Engineering American Fire Sprinkler Assn.

RE: NFPA 22 Minimum tank size for a Break-Tank

2013-05-17 Thread Steve Leyton
As Roland says, sizing and other break tank prescriptives are now pretty clearly stated in 20. I think it ended up there because the only practical application for a break tank is in tandem with a pump, unless it's for use as a means of backflow prevention at the top of a hill well above the

Re: NFPA 22 Minimum tank size for a Break-Tank

2013-05-17 Thread Ron Greenman
There's a couple of other backflow issues where break tanks are important besides elevation, specifically all incoming water for sewage treatment plants and nuclear power plants, but that's deviating far from the topic so On Fri, May 17, 2013 at 8:58 AM, Steve Leyton

Re: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time.

2013-05-17 Thread George Church
Owner can have an agreement with one (or more) local tanker company to respond with x number of trucks to fill in 8. Heckuva lot cheaper than redundant or double sized tank. This should qualify as a means to fill in 8. Sent from my iPhone On May 17, 2013, at 9:50 AM, Morey, Mike

Re: FM data sheet 8-34 Automated storage and retrieval systems

2013-05-17 Thread Roland Huggins
I haven't heard of any and doubt it will happen (even after all the full scale fire testing). Joe Hankins fought that fight for a while before retiring from FM with NO success. His reception was exemplified by one guy saying upon his arrival - Here's the guy trying to kill firefighters. Hard

Smoke Vent Elimination

2013-05-17 Thread Gregg Fontes
Is anyone aware of any proposals to allow the elimination of smoke vents when using quick-response storage sprinklers that maybe accepted by CBC or IBC? (As is allowed for ESFR'S.) Thanks, Gregg Fontes Cen-Cal Fire Systems, Inc. 209-334-9119 ___

RE: NFPA 22 2013 Water storage re-fill time.

2013-05-17 Thread Brad Casterline
Excellent idea also George, especially in this case, which is oil tanker trucks transferring oil to rail tank cars! Thank you. -Original Message- From: George Church [mailto:g...@rowesprinkler.com] Sent: Friday, May 17, 2013 11:36 AM To: sprinklerforum@lists.firesprinkler.org Subject:

RE: Smoke Vent Elimination

2013-05-17 Thread Pete Schwab
Not sure what transpired at the hearings. http://www.iccsafe.org/cs/CTC/Documents/0413-meeting/BFP-RoofVents.pdf Peter Schwab VP of Purchasing Engineering Technologies Wayne Automatic Fire Sprinklers Inc. 222 Capitol Court Ocoee, Fl 34761 Mobile: (407) 468-8248 Direct: (407) 877-5570 Fax:

Re: NFPA 22 Minimum tank size for a Break-Tank

2013-05-17 Thread bverhei
As well as paying attention to anti-vortex concerns I'd also pay close attention to extra large overflow. Pressurizing the tank due to failure of sensor to shut off some line would not be a good thing. bv - Original Message - From: Steve Leyton st...@protectiondesign.com To: